From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug  1 12:38:27 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: 292 Worth Hot-Rodding?      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 01 1994 08:22:05
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>From tomh@cv.hp.com (Tom Huffman)      


I have the opportunity to purchase a nice 1955 Merc Monterrey hardtop with
the original 292 & 3-spd/OD for $3,500.  It needs paint, but the interior
is recently redone and the body is nice.  The owner claims it runs great
(don't they all?), but I'm wondering if there are mild hot-rod parts
available for them, and is a 292 worth it?  I've heard ugly rumors about
an oiling problem (nothing specific).
Is there an easy conversion to a newer motor, such as 298/302/351C?  I'd
appreciate any input!

toemoss



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug  1 12:40:21 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Amazing Factoids #1      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 01 1994 09:22:03
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


1) the first breaker point ignitions put the points *inside* the
.  combustion chamber.  The points were usually operated by a pushrod,
.  with the wiring going through ceramic posts.  As no condenser was
.  used, the points sparked when opening.  This was a vast improvement
.  over earlier hot-tube systems.
                        


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug  3 20:31:47 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: 292 Worth Hot-Rodding?     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 02 1994 16:22:03
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>From Dave Tartaglia       

> 
> I have the opportunity to purchase a nice 1955 Merc Monterrey hardtop with
> the original 292 & 3-spd/OD for $3,500.  It needs paint, but the interior
> is recently redone and the body is nice.  The owner claims it runs great
> (don't they all?), but I'm wondering if there are mild hot-rod parts
> available for them, and is a 292 worth it?  I've heard ugly rumors about
> an oiling problem (nothing specific).
> Is there an easy conversion to a newer motor, such as 298/302/351C?  I'd
> appreciate any input!
> 
> toemoss
Wow, sounds like a winner to me!  My interests run to fifties style rods
and customs. The 55-56 Merc is a popular car with customizers.  The big
problem is usually body rust.  If yours is solid it could be a worthwhile
project.

I saw quite a few at this summer's KKOA meet in Gettysburg, PA.  Most
ran the original 292.  You can still get hop-up and dress-up parts from
Offenhauser. Try Moon Eyes (the new name for Dean Moon's old operation)
and maybe Speedway, too.  If memory serves, the old Thunderbird logo 
valve covers was a popular switch in the old days.

I did see a few with later model V8s, 302 etc.  Most of these started
as good body cars with no engines.  The later model V8s are just more
plentiful, cheaper, and easier to dump into a non-resto project.

If the 292 is running well, I'd leave it be, at least until you can
evaluate what you want to do with the car: daily driver, show car,
weekend cruiser, vintage racer?




From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug  4 16:31:46 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: NSRA Nats       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 04 1994 10:22:05
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>From Jeffrey S Armfield      


Anyone headed to the NSRA Nats in Louisville this coming weekend? I have a 
room reservation that I don't need as I will be making a day trip to the Nats
this year. If you need a hotel room or know someone who does, e-mail me and
I will fill in the details.

Jeff Armfield
armfield@mn.ecn.purdue.edu



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug  4 19:11:02 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: corvette mailing list and hotrod mailing list  

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 04 1994 10:28:04
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>From sravet@bangate.compaq.com (Steve Ravet)      


Anyone know where the corvette mailing list is?  (I'm assuming there is one).
Also, how do you subscribe to the hotrod mailing list that used to be here?

--steve

Steve Ravet	sravet@bangate.compaq.com
"Baby you're a genius when it comes to cooking up some chili sauce...."



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug  4 21:30:20 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: spring madness       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 04 1994 10:34:01
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


 Normally when you figure spring rates you use a ballpark modulus of
30,000,000 or so.  I guess my calculations came out OK - none of the
cars sat up like four wheel drives or squatted in the driveway.

 A friend of mine was looking for a rear bar for his Mitsubishi.  HKS is
trying to sell him a GAB bar imported from Japan.  Only $400.  They
claim it is the same OD as the original bar, length and lever arms are
identical to the original, it's tubular instead of solid, and it's 3.7
times stiffer than the original "because of better steel and heat
treat."

 Most of my texts are pretty old, but they show a modulus of aroung 29M
to 31M across the range from plain old mild steel to fancier chrome-
vanadium alloys and specialty stuff like music wire.  Most of the texts
with specific sections on springs just say "spring steel", which seems
to be any of a variety of 1xxx alloys with varying heat treats.

 Can this place *really* make a bar 3.7x stiffer just by fiddling with
the alloy and heat treat, and not have the thing break like glass at the
first big bump?  I don't mind slogging through the references until I
find out exactly how, but I'd like to know if I'm chasing will'o'the
wisps before I start.
                   


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug  4 23:08:08 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: shot peening       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 04 1994 10:39:55
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


 Are there any standard references for shot peening?  For that matter,
who actually *does* shot peening?  Carroll Smith blandly refers me to my
local airport, the denizens of which claim to have never heard of the
process.

[ Not sure if there are standard references.  The closest I can think of
is an article in HRM about two years ago that covered all sorts of
blasting methods from baking soda to shot peening.  Not that good
really.

As I understand it, shot peening is shooting small hard spheres of steel
at a varitey of surfaces in order to do a few things.  I suppose that
it cleans the surface.  As I understand it, the peaning is done to 
give a uniform, hard, slightly compressed surface that can reduce 
some forms of cracking.  Also shot peaning has been done to promote
oil retention ( probably for same reasons knurling is sometimes
done on pistons ) on surfaces.  The peen produces a surface with
more area and holds oil better ( in theory ).

About the only practical experince I have with it was when my dad had
some motor parts shot peened while rebuilding his blazer in about 1976.
I am sure others will comment.   -FEP ]



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug  5 00:13:00 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: 292 Worth Hot-Rodding?     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 04 1994 10:45:54
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>From "Joe B. McGlynn (415) 354-2728"    

> 
> I have the opportunity to purchase a nice 1955 Merc Monterrey hardtop with
> the original 292 & 3-spd/OD for $3,500.  It needs paint, but the interior
> is recently redone and the body is nice.  The owner claims it runs great
> (don't they all?), but I'm wondering if there are mild hot-rod parts
> available for them, and is a 292 worth it?  I've heard ugly rumors about
> an oiling problem (nothing specific).
> Is there an easy conversion to a newer motor, such as 298/302/351C?  I'd
> appreciate any input!
> 
> toemoss

I would concur with the guy who recommended you drive the car a while with the 
'as-is' 292 to see how you like it.  Any motor can be fixed up to go fast, just 
look at the Ford Flathead as a 'fer instance!  I've mmade the mistake of buying 
a running car to fix up and tearing into it too quickly.  My last project was a 
chopped '49 chevy and my buddy Pat & I kept it driveable so we could keep 
having fun.  Good Luck!



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug  5 00:18:58 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: TV: *Televised Events #94-31*     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 04 1994 14:22:02
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>From stoffel@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Bill Stoffel)      

        dans%rehab1@canal.org, andrew.marold@analog.com, cjs@phy.duke.edu,
        trujillo@mers17.me.utexas.edu, Louis@usl.edu, cmorken@ua.d.umn.edu,
        mark.mccrimmon@drd.com, gwalker@rtfm.mlb.fl.us, m1cms01@FRB.GOV,
        geoff@softy.softwords.bc.ca, cagan@sca.com,
        Howard.Ledford@f69.n110.z1.fidonet.org, GeorgeB@mhv.net,
        jstone@iglou.com, ktk@enterprise.bih.harvard.edu,
        D.SOREL@GENIE.GEIS.COM, sastzh@vm.sas.com, jparrish@ssl.umd.edu,
        jerryp@halcyon.com, barlow-cj@clavin.med.ge.com,
        gloria-aagaard@cornell.edu, usga@pool.info.sunyit.edu,
        ademsey@ocnext.drg.nih.gov, tom_weaver@vos.stratus.com,
        rtener@netcom.netcom.com, georgios@utpapa.ph.utexas.edu,
        jfuerstenberg@zz-link.dcmdc.dla.mil, Tim.Bailer@aplmail.jhuapl.edu,
        patrick_kenney@cc.chiron.com, bherrick@aol.com,
        cs.arizona.edu!modular!chan, krichmon@dgbat02.er.usgs.gov

Hi all,

I'm afraid I'm going to drop off line for a couple weeks.  I plan to 
attend a little ol' stock car race they're running out in Indianapolis 
this Saturday, and from there I'm heading up to Wisconsin to catch some 
REAL racin' ;-)  I hope this doesn't inconvenience anyone too much.

Also, please remember that when the rest of the baseball season goes 
down the crapper ESPN and many of the regional sports channels will have 
a LOT of scheduling holes to fill.  With any luck some of these holes 
may get filled with racing, so keep an eye out for changes.

Cheers - Bill

----------------------------------------------------------------------
			       TV Events

Now in its third year of weekly publication, TVE is a compilation of 
info. gleaned from TV listings, auto mags., newspapers, tea leaves, my 
favorite bartender, and the nice folks at TNN.  A special thanks also to 
Curt Swinehart for providing me with info. on the many regional sports 
networks.  PLEASE confirm dates and times with your local listings 
before setting your VCRs.

TVE will USUALLY be updated no later than every Friday morning and will 
be most accurate (or least inaccurate) for the following 7 days. If your 
favorite event is "tba'd", please don't panic unless it's in the 7 day 
window.

As mentioned previously, this listing is now being submitted to the new 
group rec.autos.sport.info.  Assuming the moderators approve, this list 
will be available in the r.a.s.i group from now on.  In an attempt to 
get the word to as many r.a.s readers as possible, I will continue to 
cross-post to r.a.s for a short time. (This again assumes the moderators 
of r.a.s.i do not object to my doing so.)

Thanks to EMI Communications, TVE listings are available from
http://www.emi.com/tve.html where they will be archived for an 
indeterminate period of time.

If you are having trouble with this list arriving at your site in
a timely fashion, please let me know via e-mail and I will also start
mailing you a copy.

Comments, suggestions, additions, extra pit passes, etc. to:
					  stoffel@oasys.dt.navy.mil

		   ---------------------------------

(T)=Taped  (L)=Live  (SD)=Same Day  (?)=dunno

12:00AM = 0000 hours = start of day

    EVENT                             DATE  TIME(Eastern, USA) NETWORK*

Brickyard 400 Preview                 08/04    12:00PM          SCNY
IMSA, WSC, MONTEREY (T)               08/04    1:00-2:00PM      ESPN
PORSCHE SUPERCUP, MAGNY-COURS (T)     08/04    2:00-2:30PM      ESPN
AMA ROAD RACING (T)                   08/04    2:00PM           HSE,
					HTS,MSG,PASS,PRTK,PSN,SCNE,SCP
SAAB PRO SERIES, WATKINS GLEN (T)     08/04    2:30-3:00PM      ESPN
Motor Sports Hour                     08/04    3:00-4:00PM      HTS,
						 MSG,PASS,PSN,SCP,SCNE
Brickyard 400 Preview                 08/04    3:00PM           HSE
BRICKYARD 400 QUALIFYING, 1ST DAY (L) 08/04    3:30-5:00PM      ESPN
MotoWorld                             08/04    6:30-7:00PM      ESPN2
SpeedWeek                             08/04    7:30-8:00PM      ESPN
Race Line                             08/04    7:30-8:00PM      HTS
SHELBY PRO SERIES, CHARLOTTE (T)      08/04    8:00PM           SCP
Brickyard 400 Preview                 08/04    8:00PM         SCNY,SPTS
AMA ROAD RACING (T)                   08/04    8:00PM    KBL,PSN,PSN2
Auto Shop                             08/04    8:00-9:00PM      QVC
USAC, SILVER CROWN SERIES,INDY (L)    08/04    8:30-10:30PM     ESPN
MotorWeek (Saab 900 Coupe)            08/04    8:30-9:00PM      MPT
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (L)    08/04    9:00-10:00PM     EMPS,
						      HTS,PSN,PSN2,SPTS
MOTORCYCLE RACING (T)                 08/04    9:00PM         PSNW,SCP
Craftsman Workshop Anniversary        08/04   9:00PM-12:00AM    QVC
Motor Sports Hour                     08/04    9:30-10:30PM     PRTK
Motor Sports Hour                     08/04    10:00-11:00PM    EMPS,
					    HTS,PASS,PSN,PSN2,PSNW,SCOH
AMA ROAD RACING (T)                   08/04    10:00PM          KBL,
							       SPTS,SUN
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (SD)   08/04    10:30-11:30PM    SCNE
Motor Sports Hour                     08/04   11:OOPM-12:00AM   KBL
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (SD)   08/04   11:00PM-12:00AM   EMPS,
				   HTS,PASS,PRTK,PSN,PSN2,PSNW,SCOH,SUN
AMA ROAD RACING (T)                   08/04    11:00PM          HSE
AMA ROAD RACING (T)                   08/04    11:15PM          MSG
Motor Sports Hour                     08/05    12:00-1:00AM    SCP,SUN
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (T)    08/05    12:00-1:00AM     HSE
Brickyard 400 Preview                 08/05    12:00AM          MSC
AMA ROAD RACING (T)                   08/05    12:00AM          PRTK
AMA ROAD RACING (T)                   08/05    12:30AM          SCC
WORLD MOTORCYCLE GRAND PRIX, FRANCE (T08/05    1:00-2:00AM      ESPN
FORMULA II SUPERCUP (T)               08/05    1:00AM           MSC
Motor Sports Hour                     08/05    1:00-2:00AM      HSE
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (T)    08/05    1:00-2:00AM      SCP
Brickyard 400 Preview                 08/05    1:00AM           SCNY
AMA ROAD RACING (T)                   08/05    1:00AM           EMPS,
						     KBL,PSN,PSN2,SCOH
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (T)    08/05    1:30-2:30AM      SCC
Motor Sports Hour                     08/05    2:00-3:00AM      SCNY
Motor Sports Hour                     08/05    3:00-4:00AM      SCNE
SAAB PRO SERIES, WATKINS GLEN (T)     08/05    3:30-4:00AM      ESPN
BRICKYARD 400 QUALIFYING, 1ST DAY (T) 08/05    4:00-5:30AM      ESPN
Brickyard 400 Preview                 08/05    10:00AM        SCNE,SCNY
For Race Fans Only, Brickyard 400     08/05    9:00-11:00PM     QVC
FORMULA II SUPERCUP (T)               08/05    12:00PM          SUN
IOGP POWERBOATS, BAY CITY (T)         08/05    2:00-2:30PM      HTS
AMA ROAD RACING (T)                   08/05    3:00PM           NESN
BRICKYARD 400 QUALIFYING, 2ND DAY (L) 08/05    4:00-5:00PM      ESPN
In The Driver's Seat                  08/05    6:30-7:00PM      ESPN2
AMA ROAD RACING (T)                   08/05    7:00PM           PASS
Brickyard 400 Preview                 08/05    8:00-9:00PM      ESPN
NASCAR, KROGER 200, INDIANAPOLIS (L)  08/05    9:00-11:00PM     ESPN
TOYOTA ATLANTIC, TORONTO (T)          08/06    1:30-2:00AM      ESPN
MotoWorld                             08/06    2:30-3:00AM      ESPN2
BRICKYARD 400 QUALIFYING, 2ND DAY (T) 08/06    3:30-4:30AM      ESPN
IHRA, SPORTSMAN SERIES, MOROCCO (T)   08/06    4:30-5:00AM      ESPN
This Week On Pit Road                 08/06    6:00-6:30AM      PASS
This Week On DIRT                     08/06    6:30-7:00AM      PASS
This Week On Pit Road                 08/06    8:30-9:00AM      MSC
Elko Speedway Fast Track              08/06    9:00-9:30AM      MSC
Shadetree Mechanic (paint prep.)      08/06    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
SHELBY PRO SERIES, CHARLOTTE (T)      08/06    9:30AM           MSC
MotorWeek                             08/06    10:00-10:30AM    WGN
Hot Rod 2                             08/06    10:00-10:30AM    ESPN2
NHRA, PRO BIKE CHALLENGE (T)          08/06    10:30-11;00AM    ESPN2
FORMULA II SUPERCUP (T)               08/06    10:30AM          MSC
Brickyard 400 Pre-race                08/06    12:00-1:00PM     ESPN
I'd Rather Be Racing                  08/06    11:30AM          MSC
AMA ROAD RACE (T)                     08/06    12:30PM          SCOH
BRICKYARD 400 (L)                     08/06    1:00-4:30PM      ABC
       (I'll wave to y'all from the Paddock Penthouse :-)
In The Driver's Seat                  08/06    1:30-2:00PM      ESPN2
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              08/06    2:00-2:30PM      TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      08/06    2:30-3:00PM      TNN
Motor Sports Hour                     08/06    3:00-4:00PM      SCNY
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               08/06    3:00-3:30PM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              08/06    3:30-4:00PM      TNN
NASCAR, TGIF/COOCA-COLA 150, POCONO (T08/06    4:00-5:30PM      TNN
This Week On Pit Road                 08/06    4:30-5:00PM      SCNY
MotorWeek                             08/06    5:00-5:30PM      MPT
MotoWorld                             08/06    7:30-8:00PM      ESPN2
AMA ROAD RACE (T)                     08/06    9:00PM           SCP
IHRA, EMPIRE NATIONALS (T)            08/06    9:30PM           ESPN2
Die-Cast Muscle Cars                  08/06    9:00-11:00PM     QVC
AMA MOTOCROSS (T)                     08/06    10:30-11:30PM    ESPN2
In The Driver's Seat                  08/06   11:30PM-12:00AM   ESPN2
SAAB PRO SERIES, LAGUNA SECA (T)      08/07    1:30-2:00AM      ESPN
MotoWorld                             08/07    2:30-3:00AM      ESPN
SpeedWeek                             08/07    3:00-3:30AM      ESPN
BUSCH GN, INDIANAPOLIS (T)            08/07    3:30-5:30AM      ESPN
MotoWorld                             08/07    7:30-8:00AM      ESPN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               08/07    9:00-9:30AM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              08/07    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
Neil Bonnett's Winners (Darrell Gwynn)08/07    10:00-10:30AM    TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              08/07    10:30-11:00AM    TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      08/07    11:00-11:30AM    TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           08/07   11:30AM-12:00PM   TNN
This Week On Pit Road                 08/07   11:30AM-12:00PM  SCNY,SUN
FORMULA II SUPERCUP (T)               08/07    12:00PM          SCOH
Motor Sports Hour                     08/07    12:00-1:00PM     SUN
AMA ROAD RACE (T)                     08/07    1:00PM           SUN
SODA, CHEVY SPRING RUN, CRANDON (T)   08/07    1:30-2:30PM      ESPN
IHRA, SUMMER NATIONALS, MOROCCO (T)   08/07    2:30-3:30PM      ESPN
Neil Bonnett's Winners (Darrell Gwynn)08/07    2:30-3:00PM      TNN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               08/07    3:00-3:30PM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              08/07    3:30-4:00PM      TNN
Motor Sports Hour                     08/07    4:00-5:00PM      EMPS,
						    HSE,PSN,PSNW,SCOH
Race Line                             08/07    4:30-5:00PM      HTS
SCCA, GRAND PRIX DE TROIS-RIVIERES(SD)08/07    5:00-7:00PM      EMPS,
			      HSE,HTS,KBL,MSG,NESN,PASS,PSN,SCOH,SPTS
NHRA, TOPEKA (T)                      08/07    5:00-6:25PM      TNN
RaceDay Update w/Pat Patterson (L)    08/07    6:25-6:30PM      TNN
Shadetree Mechanic (paint prep.)      08/07    7:00-7:30PM      TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              08/07    7:30-8:00PM      TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      08/07    8:00-8:30PM      TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           08/07    8:30-9:00PM      TNN
SCCA, GRAND PRIX DE TROIS-RIVIERES(SD)08/07    9:00-11:00PM  PRTK,SUN
Road Test Magazine w/Don Garlits      08/07    11:00-11:30PM    TNN
RaceDay Update w/Pat Patterson (L)    08/08    12:00-12:05AM    TNN
AMA ROAD RACE (T)                     08/08    12:00AM          SPTS
DAYTONA (MOTORCYCLE) 200 (T)          08/08    12:05-1:30AM     TNN
Motor Sports Hour                     08/08    1:00-2:00AM      SPTS
Trucks And Tractor Power              08/08    1:30-2:00AM      TNN
SCCA, GRAND PRIX DE TROIS-RIVIERES (T)08/08    1:30-3:30AM      NESN
Hot Rod 2                             08/08    3:00-3:30AM      ESPN2
NHRA, PRO BIKE CHALLENGE (T)          08/08    3:30-4:00AM      ESPN2
Motor Sports Hour                     08/08    3:30-4:30AM      NESN
Wheel Power                           08/08    4:30AM           NESN
SCCA, GRAND PRIX DE TROIS-RIVIERES (T)08/08   10:00AM-12:00PM   HSE
SCCA, GRAND PRIX DE TROIS-RIVIERES (T)08/08    1:00-3:00PM      SCNE
This Week On Pit Road                 08/08    6:30-7:00PM      HSE
SCCA, GRAND PRIX DE TROIS-RIVIERES (T)08/09    12:00-2:00AM     EMPS,
							  KBL,PSN,PSN2
Checkered Flag (F1 @ Hockenheim)      08/09    2:00-2:30AM      ESPN
In The Driver's Seat                  08/09    2:30-3:00AM      ESPN2
USAC SILVER CROWN, INDIANAPOLIS (T)   08/09    3:30-5:30AM      ESPN
SATURDAY NIGHT LIGHTNING (T)          08/09    1:00PM           ESPN2
FORMULA II SUPERCUP (T)               08/09    2:00PM           HTS
SUMMER LEGENDS SERIES (L)             08/09    8:00PM           SPTS
SCCA, GRAND PRIX DE TROIS-RIVIERES (T)08/09    9:00-11:00PM     SCC
ARCA Supercar Hour                    08/09    10:00-11:00PM    SPTS
SHELBY PRO SERIES, CHARLOTTE (T)      08/10    12:00AM          SCOH
SPORTSMAN 150 (T)                     08/10    1:30AM           SCC
SCCA, GRAND PRIX DE TROIS-RIVIERES (T)08/10    3:00-5:00AM      SCC
Texas Speed                           08/10    7:00PM           HSE
Auto Shop                             08/10   11:00PM-12:00AM   QVC
SAAB PRO, MONTEREY (T)                08/11    4:30-5:00AM      ESPN
Checkered Flag (F1 @ Hockenheim)      08/11    5:00-5:30AM      ESPN
Motor Sports Hour (German Touring Cars08/11    3:00-4:00PM      EMPS,
					     HTS,PASS,PSN,SCNE,SCP,SUN
Wheel Power                           08/11    5:30-6:00PM      NESN
This Week On Pit Road                 08/11    6:00-6:30PM      NESN
Elko Speedway Fast Track              08/11    6:30PM           MSC
ARCA Supercar Hour                    08/11    7:00PM           SPTS
SCCA, GRAND PRIX DE TROIS-RIVIERES (T)08/11    7:00-9:00PM    NESN,PSNW
SHELBY PRO SERIES, CHARLOTTE (T)      08/11    7:30PM           MSC
Motor Sports Hour (German Touring Cars08/11    7:30-9:30PM      SCP
This Week On Pit Road                 08/11    7:30-8:00PM      SUN
SpeedWeek                             08/11    7:30-8:00PM      ESPN
USAC SPRINT CARS, WINCHESTER (L)      08/11    8:00-10:00PM     ESPN
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (L)    08/11    8:00-9:00PM      HSE,
					   KBL,PASS,PSN2,SCNE,SCOH,SUN
FORMULA II SUPERCUP (T)               08/11    8:00PM           PRTK
Pros In Motorsports                   08/11    8:30PM           SPTS
This Week On DIRT                     08/11    8:30PM           EMPS
Chase To The Checkered                08/11    9:00PM           KBL
This Week On DIRT                     08/11    9:00PM           PRTK
Motor Sports Hour (German Touring Cars08/11    9:30-10:30PM     PRTK
Motoworld                             08/11    10:00-10:30PM    ESPN
Motor Sports Hour (German Touring Cars08/11    10:00-11:00PM    EMPS,
			     HSE,NESN,PASS,PSN,PSN2,PSNW,SCOH,SPTS,SUN
Gettin' Sideways                      08/11    10:30PM          PRTK
Motor Sports Hour (German Touring Cars08/11   11:00PM-12:00AM   KBL
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (SD)   08/11   11:00PM-12:00AM   EMPS,
				  HTS,NESN,PRTK,PSN,PSN2,PSNW,SPTS,SUN
This Week On DIRT                     08/11    11:00PM          PASS
Elko Speedway Fast Track              08/11    11:30PM          MSC
Motor Sports Hour (German Touring Cars08/11   11:30PM-12:30AM   SCC
This Week On Pit Road                 08/11   11:30PM-12:00AM   PASS
SUMMER LEGENDS SERIES (T)             08/12    12:00AM          SUN
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (T)    08/12    1:00-2:00AM      SCP
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (T)    08/12    1:30-2:30AM      SCC
This Week On Pit Road                 08/12    2:00-2:30AM      PRTK
Wheel Power                           08/12    2:30AM           PRTK
IHRA, SUMMER NATIONALS, MOROCCO (T)   08/12    3:30-4:30AM      ESPN
SODA, CHEVY SPRING RUN, CRANDON (T)   08/12    4:30-5:30AM      ESPN
SHELBY PRO SERIES, CHARLOTTE (T)      08/12    12:00PM          SUN
MotoWorld                             08/12    6:30-7:00PM      ESPN2
SODA, CHEVY SPRING RUN, CRANDON (T)   08/13    1:00-2:00AM      ESPN
SHELBY PRO SERIES, CHARLOTTE (T)      08/13    6:00AM           PASS

		  ----------COMING EVENTS----------

Shadetree Mechanic (clutch adjustment)08/13    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
FORMULA II SUPERCUP (T)               08/13    9:30AM           MSC
Hot Rod 2                             08/13    10:00AM          ESPN2
NHRA, PRO BIKE CHALLENGE (T)          08/13    10:30AM          ESPN2
FORMULA II SUPERCUP (T)               08/13    11:00AM          SCOH
INDY LIGHTS (T)                       08/13    1:30PM           ESPN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              08/13    2:00-2:30PM      TNN
AMA SUPERBIKE SERIES (T)              08/13    2:00PM           SCP
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      08/13    2:30-3:00PM      TNN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               08/13    3:00-3:30PM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              08/13    3:30-4:00PM      TNN
BUSCH GN, MYRTLE BEACH (T)            08/13    4:00-5:30PM      TNN
AMA SUPERBIKE SERIES (T)              08/13    4:00PM           MSG
AMA SUPERBIKE SERIES (T)              08/13    5:00PM           PSNW
MotoWorld                             08/13    7:00-7:30PM      ESPN2
SATURDAY NIGHT LIGHTNING (?)          08/13    7:30PM           ESPN2
AMA MOTOCROSS (T)                     08/13    11:00PM          ESPN2
In The Driver's Seat                  08/14    12:00-12:30AM    ESPN2
MotoWorld                             08/14    2:30-3:00AM      ESPN
SpeedWeek                             08/14    3:00-3:30AM      ESPN
MotoWorld                             08/14    7:30-7:50AM      ESPN
FORMULA 1, HUNGARY (L)                08/14    7:50-10:00AM ESPN,TSN,
								 RDS [1]
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               08/14    9:00-9:30AM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              08/14    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
Neil Bonnett's Winners (Joe Gibbs)    08/14    10:00-10:30AM    TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              08/14    10:30-11:00AM    TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      08/14    11:00-11:30AM    TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           08/14   11:30AM-12:00PM   TNN
WINSTON CUP, WATKINS GLEN (L)         08/14    1:00PM           ESPN
SCCA, GRAND PRIX DE TROIS-RIVIERES (T)08/14    1:00PM           PSNW
AMA SUPERBIKE SERIES (T)              08/14    1:30PM           SPTS
AMA SUPERBIKE SERIES (T)              08/14    2:00PM           EMPS,
						    KBL,PSN,SCNE,SCOH
Neil Bonnett's Winners (Joe Gibbs)    08/14    2:30-3:00PM      TNN
INDYCAR, LEXINGTON, OH (L)            08/14    3:00-5:00PM      ABC [1]
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               08/14    3:00-3:30PM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              08/14    3:30-4:00PM      TNN
NHRA, SEARS POINT (T)                 08/14    4:00PM           ESPN
Le Mans Highlights                    08/14    4:00PM           KBL
EXXON SUPREME, PORTLAND (T)           08/14    4:00-5:00PM      ESPN2
AMA SUPERBIKE SERIES (T)              08/14    4:00PM           HTS
IROC #4, MICHIGAN (T)                 08/14    5:00PM           ABC
AMA, LOUDON CAMEL CLASSIC II (T)      08/14    5:00-6:25PM      TNN
RaceDay Update w/Pat Patterson (L)    08/14    6:25-6:30PM      TNN
IMSA, WSC SERIES, PORTLAND (T)        08/14    7:00-9:00PM      ESPN2
FORMULA II SUPERCUP (T)               08/14    7:00PM           SPTS
Shadetree Mechanic (clutch adjustment)08/14    7:00-7:30PM      TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              08/14    7:30-8:00PM      TNN
SCCA, GRAND PRIX DE TROIS-RIVIERES (T)08/14    8:00PM           SCP
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      08/14    8:00-8:30PM      TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           08/14    8:30-9:00PM      TNN
Road Test Magazine w/Don Garlits      08/14    11:00-11:30PM    TNN
RaceDay Update w/Pat Patterson (L)    08/15    12:00-12:05AM    TNN
NHRA, MILE-HIGH NATIONALS, DENVER (T) 08/15    12:05-1:30AM     TNN
FORMULA 1, HUNGARY (T)                08/15    12:30AM          ESPN
Trucks And Tractor Power              08/15    1:30-2:00AM      TNN
Hot Rod 2                             08/15    3:00AM           ESPN2
WINSTON CUP, WATKINS GLEN (T)         08/15    3:30AM           ESPN
NHRA, PRO BIKE CHALLENGE (T)          08/15    3:30AM           ESPN2
AMA SUPERBIKE SERIES (T)              08/15    4:00AM           EMPS,
					    KBL,MSG,PASS,PSN,SCNE,SCP
NHRA, MILE-HIGH NATIONALS, DENVER (T) 08/19    3:30-5:00AM      TNN
NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         08/19    4:00PM           ESPN
BUSCH GN, MICHIGAN (?)                08/20    tba              tba
PORSCHE SUPERCUP, GREAT BRITAIN (T)   08/20    3:00PM           ESPN
INDYCAR, LOUDON (SD)                  08/21    8:30-10:30PM     ESPN [1]
WINSTON CUP, MICHIGAN (L)             08/21    12:30PM          CBS
NHRA, NATIONALS, BRAINERD (?)         08/21    tba              tba
SAAB PRO SERIES, MID-OHIO (T)         08/23    1:00-1:30AM      ESPN
BUSCH GN, BRISTOL (?)                 08/26    tba              tba
PORSCHE SUPERCUP, GERMANY (T)         08/27    3:00PM           ESPN
WINSTON CUP, BRISTOL (L)              08/27    7:40PM           ESPN
FORMULA 1, BELGIUM (L)                08/28    7:50-10:00AM ESPN,TSN,
								 RDS [1]
ASA, BADGERLAND 150, MILWAUKEE (L)    08/28    3:00PM           TNN
NHRA, MN (T)                          08/28    6:00PM           ESPN
BUSCH GN, DARLINGTON (?)              09/03    tba              tba
SAAB PRO SERIES, NHIS (T)             09/04    1:30-2:00AM      ESPN
WINSTON CUP, DARLINGTON (L)           09/04    1:00PM           ESPN
INDYCAR, VANCOUVER (SD)               09/04    9:00-11:00PM     ESPN [1]
NHRA, US NATIONALS, CLERMONT (?)      09/05    tba              tba
BUSCH GN, RICHMOND (?)                09/09    tba              tba
WINSTON CUP, RICHMOND (L)             09/10    7:30PM           TBS
FORMULA 1, ITALY (L)                  09/11    8:50-11:00AM ESPN,TSN,
								 RDS [1]
INDYCAR, ELKART LAKE (L)              09/11    1:30-4:00PM      ESPN [1]
ASA, MICHIGAN (L)                     09/11    tba              TNN

[1] CBC also carries all F1 and most IndyCar races.  The races are 
usually broadcast on a tape-delayed basis at 11:37PM ET on the evening 
following the race.  I understand that it is not uncommon for CBC to 
delay the broadcast as much as an hour beyond the 11:37PM start, so 
please use extra caution if you plan to tape the race.  If you have 
access to it, and your French isn't too rusty, you may also want to 
check out RDS.  RDS broadcasts every F1 race and most IndyCar races, and 
their F1 coverage usually also includes a 30 minute prerace show.  RDS 
and TSN generally use the ESPN feed, while CBC generally uses the BBC 
feed.  The exception to these rules is the Canadian Grand Prix.  Only 
CBC and SRC have the rights to the Canadian GP.  Thanks to Pierre 
Mailhot and Tak Ariga for info. on coverage in Canada.

* Network Designations

A&E      Arts & Entertainment Network
AMC      American Movie Classics
CBC      Canadian Broadcasting Corporation
EMPS     Regional Sports Network (New York)
ESPN     ESPN Sports Network
ESPN2    ESPN Sports Network 2
HBO      Home Box Office
HSE      Regional Sports Network (Houston)
HTS      Regional Sports Network (Baltimore & DC)
KBL      Regional Sports Network (Pittsburg)
MAX      Cinemax
MPT      Maryland Public TV
MSC      Midwest Sports Channel
MSG      Madison Square Garden
MTV      Music(?) Television
PASS     Regional Sports Network (Detroit)
PRTK     Regional Sports Network (LA)
PSN      Prime Sports Network
PSN2     Prime Sports Network (Midwest & Mountains)
PSNW     Prime Sports Network (Northwest)
QVC      home shopping
RDS      Radio Des Sports (Canada - French)
SCC      Sports Channel Chicago
SCNE     Sports Channel New England
SCNY     Sports Channel New York
SCOH     Sports Channel Ohio
SCP      Sports Channel Pacific
SHOW     Showtime
SPTS     Sport South Network
SRC      Societe Radio-Canada (French)
SUN      Sunshine Network (Regional Sports Network, SE USA)
TBS      Atlanta "Super Station"
TNN      The Nashville Network
TSN      The Sports Network (Canada - English)
USA      USA Network
WBFF     Baltimore
WDCA     Washington, DC
WGN      Chicago "Super Station"
WJZ      Baltimore
WOR      New York "Super Station"
WRC      Washington, DC
-------


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug  5 02:46:16 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: spring madness      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 04 1994 14:28:08
X-Sequence: 111
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>From lacey@dsea.com (Dan Lacey)      

I am NOT an expert, but...

A tubular bar is stiffer than a solid bar regardless of material.

>
> Normally when you figure spring rates you use a ballpark modulus of
>30,000,000 or so.  I guess my calculations came out OK - none of the
>cars sat up like four wheel drives or squatted in the driveway.
>
> A friend of mine was looking for a rear bar for his Mitsubishi.  HKS is
>trying to sell him a GAB bar imported from Japan.  Only $400.  They
>claim it is the same OD as the original bar, length and lever arms are
>identical to the original, it's tubular instead of solid, and it's 3.7
>times stiffer than the original "because of better steel and heat
>treat."
>

*************************************************************************
* THIS SPACE INTENTIONALLY  *       Dan Lacey ( lacey@dsea.com )        *
*                           *       Dainippon Screen Eng. of America    *
* LEFT BLANK                *       3700 W. Segerstrom Ave.             *
*                           *       Santa Ana, CA. 92704                *
*************************************************************************




From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug  5 23:25:16 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: 292 Worth Hot-Rodding?     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 05 1994 18:22:05
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>From maz@cray.com (Mark A Zimmerman)     



: I have the opportunity to purchase a nice 1955 Merc Monterrey hardtop with
: the original 292 & 3-spd/OD for $3,500.  It needs paint, but the interior
: is recently redone and the body is nice.  The owner claims it runs great
: (don't they all?), but I'm wondering if there are mild hot-rod parts
: available for them, and is a 292 worth it?  I've heard ugly rumors about
: an oiling problem (nothing specific).

     If the car isn't all that bad, why not keep it original?  It'd be
worth more especially since it's survived 39 years without getting
messed with.  But if you're going to hotrod it, stick in a 428.  It
seems to me that putting in a 302 or 351 wouldn't get you much of a
performance increase due to the weight of that car.  And... You could
keep the 428/390 pretty much stock to boot.
     But again, if it isn't in too bad of shape, I'd keep it original
except for maybe duals, 4-bbl. and glasspacks (to keep in the spirit
of that era).

Mark Zimmerman '69 Mach I

P.S.  Wish I had one.....



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Sat Aug  6 00:05:37 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: shot peening      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 05 1994 18:28:10
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>From lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu (Jonathan R. Lusky)     

>  Are there any standard references for shot peening?  For that matter,
> who actually *does* shot peening?  Carroll Smith blandly refers me to my
> local airport, the denizens of which claim to have never heard of the
> process.
> 
> [ As I understand it, shot peening is shooting small hard spheres of steel
> at a varitey of surfaces in order to do a few things.  I suppose that
> it cleans the surface.  As I understand it, the peaning is done to 
> give a uniform, hard, slightly compressed surface that can reduce 
> some forms of cracking.  Also shot peaning has been done to promote
> oil retention ( probably for same reasons knurling is sometimes
> done on pistons ) on surfaces.  The peen produces a surface with
> more area and holds oil better ( in theory ).
> 
> About the only practical experince I have with it was when my dad had
> some motor parts shot peened while rebuilding his blazer in about 1976.
> I am sure others will comment.   -FEP ]

I've heard it used in referrence to connecting rods, but I've never had
it done or actually seen a place the does it.  I wonder if glass beading
would work as well?  

-- 
Jonathan R. Lusky  --  lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu
 "Turbos are nice but I'd rather be blown!"
    68 Camaro Convertible - 350 / TH350
       80 Toyota Celica - 20R / 5spd


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Sat Aug  6 00:44:57 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: shot peening      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 05 1994 18:34:14
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>From jws@mlb.semi.harris.com (James W. Swonger)     

 I guess the idea is that a zillion small impacts will sort of smear out any
localized surface stresses. Every few years a new and oh, so much better
idea comes around; now it's the vibrating table that you strap the piece 
down on, sort of a 25c/5min motel bed. 

 One low-rent machine shop nearby uses their bead blasting booth with 
steel beads, shot, for both general cleaning (they bake the glop
solid, then blast it off) and sort-of-shot-peening. If you had your
own booth and a recovery system, you could do the same. Thing I find
a little scary is the idea of filling oil passages with lots of 
little pieces of steel (or sand). I don't think I'd be doing this to
any engine I cared about. Rather just use a "seasoned" one; a hundred
Kmiles might be presumed to have imparted sufficient vibrational 
stress relief....


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Sat Aug  6 01:55:17 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: where am I going to race?   

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 05 1994 18:46:19
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


 The new issue of Circle Quack has an ad for a booklet called the
National Speedway Directory, $8, PO Box 448, Comstock Park MI 49321,
616-361-6229.

 The directory supposedly lists phone numbers, addresses, directions,
nights of operation and types of racing for 72 road courses, 289 drag
strips, and 1025 oval tracks in the US and Canada.
                                                                                                                   


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Sat Aug  6 02:45:35 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: spring madness      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 05 1994 18:52:20
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>From hale@brooktree.com (bob hale)      

A tubular bar _of the same weight_ is stiffer than a solid bar.
But a tubular bar of the same diameter is not quite as stiff as
a solid bar.

[ This is exactly what I thought, too.  But, Dan does sit near
me, and I did not want to be the first to blast him...  -FEP ]

Bob Hale   hale@brooktree.com



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Sat Aug  6 03:07:43 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Shotpeening       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 05 1994 18:40:14
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>From OADDAB@STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV (DIRK BROER)      


> Are there any standard references for shot peening?  For that matter,
>who actually *does* shot peening?  Carroll Smith blandly refers me to my
>local airport, the denizens of which claim to have never heard of the
>process.
>
>[ Not sure if there are standard references.  The closest I can think of
>is an article in HRM about two years ago that covered all sorts of
>blasting methods from baking soda to shot peening.  Not that good
>really. ]

I have a set of Pink Rods (LT-1 heat treated rods) and a set of steel chevy 
rods that have been shot peened.  Shot peening definitly smooths the 
surface and cleans it.  Shot peening used to be standard practice on stock 
connecting rods when trying to get them up to racing strength.
With rods you:

1) Magnafluxed
2) Shot peened
3) Polished the beams (this is optional - some years the trick is to polish 
the beams - other years the same place says it removes to much material
4) High strength rod bolts
5) Resize and true both ends

By the time your done you'll have spent almost $50 a rod - now-a-days you 
can by a billit rod for less - unless the rules require it go aftermarket.

I can't help but think that if your running the motor so hard that 
shotpeening makes a difference in survivability of the rod - your pushing 
it too hard and it better be for class racing.

As for where to get shot peening done - try your local high performance 
machine shop.

For aluminum parts (manifolds etc.) try glass beading for cleaning and 
looks.

Dirk


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Sat Aug  6 03:55:01 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Administrative stuff       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 05 1994 18:58:23
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>From frank@rebel (Frank Evan Perdicaro)     


Two items.

    First, I have just re-commenced alt.hotrod.  For a short time
I will be limiting it to our domain ( dsea.com ), but expect to let
it out in the next week or two.

    Second, I have made a thing I call "hotrod ftpmail".  I have a 
directory set aside to store anything you folks want to have available.
The "hotrod ftpmail" program is a subset of ftpmail, but I would like
to add functionallity until we get something useful.
    Currently, the most useful thing is "hotrod ftpmail help"....
But everything listed there works.  

    To use, send mail to hotrod@dsea.com, with the 
    Subject: 
line being something like "hotrod ftpmail help".

    I intend to put all the past articles from this list, plus all the
past articles from the Honda Hawk GT mailing list ( hawkgt@dsea.com )
in as a start.

Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug  8 18:44:02 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: spring madness      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 08 1994 12:22:03
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>From lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu (Jonathan R. Lusky)     

Hotrod List writes:
> I am NOT an expert, but...
> 
> A tubular bar is stiffer than a solid bar regardless of material.

Uh, wrong.  The torsional rigidity of a round bar is G * Ip, where G is the
shear modulus of elasticity which is constant for a given material, and
Ip is the polar moment of intertia.  Ip for a solid bar is pi*d^4/32.
Ip for a hollow bar is (pi/32)*(do^4 - di^4).

-- 
Jonathan R. Lusky  --  lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu
 "Turbos are nice but I'd rather be blown!"
    68 Camaro Convertible - 350 / TH350
       80 Toyota Celica - 20R / 5spd


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug  8 20:50:29 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: NSRA Nats in Louisville     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 08 1994 12:28:00
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>From "Ray A. Bradbury Jr."     

Hi guys did any of you attend the NSRA Nats in Louisville this weekend?
I did (but i live here) and it was great.  Huge turn out.  The Nats would 
make a great trip for anyone to make and this years was the 25th 
anniversiary of the event.  If you plan to come in to the Nats in the 
next two days of the event or plan on going next year send me an email, i 
would gladly meet any one who is going to the event.  

Well keep those wrenches turnin' and those wheels a rollin' and remember 
to try and keep it between the lines.
IBCNU L8R. -:>= 

************************************
* Ray A. Bradbury Jr * The Rooster *
************************************
*    email to: magnum@iglou.com    *
************************************
*    1971 Mach I Mustang &         *
*   1976 Monte Carlo Landau        *
*   (not a classic but fast)       *
************************************




From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug  8 21:04:29 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: your mail      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 08 1994 12:33:58
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>From gt0035b@prism.gatech.edu        


	About springs my mechanic of material bock just says steel they
don't list a sperate High strength or spring steel as far as moduls of
elastisity (E). The give difrent valus for things like utimate strength
ect.  I don't know if you could get 3.7 times stiffer with the same
diameter it souds high but could be posable. The equation for torsional
stiffnes is

 Torque * Length / G * Ip.  

	Since the diameter hasn't changed the Ip or polar moment of
inertia is the same and we'll assume the length is the same so get to 3.7
times stiffer you would have to have a G that was 3.7 times stiffer. (G is
propersional to E by a factor of ~.3) So E would have to 90kpsi which is
higher than anything in my tables. The closest thing is Tungstun at
55kpsi. 

	Now for hollow vrs. solid. Solid is stiffer. Tubular is stiffer
per weight.  The Ip above is equal to 

	pi * D^4 /32

	Since diameter (D) is raised to the 4th power doubling the
diameter increases the stiffness by 2^4=16 times. For a given amount of
material the farther out your put it the stiffer it is.  This also means
that for a given diamter the thicker the wall of the tube is the stiffer
the bar will be. You simply subtract the Ip of the material that is
missing fromthe center and put that in to the formula.

Sorry if this neads editing my terminal sucks.

Henry Sommer | gt0035b@prism.gatech.edu | Georgia Institute of Technology
_________________________________________________________________________
Formula SAE Mailing list      | send mail to fsae-request@list.gatech.edu
xfsae@list.gatech.edu          | with the subject of subscribe and no body



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug  8 21:44:08 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: shot peening      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 08 1994 12:39:52
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> I've heard it used in referrence to connecting rods, but I've never
-> had it done or actually seen a place the does it.  I wonder if glass
-> beading would work as well?

 Shot peening actually a cold-works the metal surface.  Glass beading is
a cleaning process.
                                                                     


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug  8 21:55:28 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: CLUNKER BILL INFO (fwd)     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 08 1994 12:45:49
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>From Mark Levorson       

Thought this might be of general interest.

[ This sort of is general interest, but at the edge of what I 
want to put in this list.  --FEP ]

Subject: CLUNKER BILL INFO

HOW GOVERNMENT REGULATIONS THREATEN AUTOMOTIVE HOBBIES
... and what you can do about it!

Getting the facts on:
* Clunker Programs

An exclusive Service presented by the Specialty Equipment Market
Association and The American Auto Barn Ltd (SEMA Member)

Posted to internet by info@autobarn.demon.co.uk in three sections
(Clunker Bills, New Vehicle Warranties and On Board Diagnostics).

Reproduced from information provided by SEMA for public distribution

CLUNKER PROGRAMS
----------------

THE LIE:
All old cars are "clunkers" - poorly maintained polluters 
that must be crushed

THE TRUTH:
The 10 - 20 percent of vehicles considered high polluters appear -
consistently - in each and every model year category, not just in the
pre-1981 model years which have been targeted.  Most are actually newer
than the 1980 models.

THE DANGERS:
Be very wary of the following problems facing you, the hobbyist, with
the establishment of these "clunker" programs, also referred to as
"old-car buyback" programs and "accelerated vehicle scrappage
programs". They are widespread and could forecast the end of your
hobby.

The destruction of pre-1981 vehicles eliminates the availability 
of many engines and other components to the hobbyists and collectors.

Big oil companies and utilities get "mobile source 
emission-reduction credits" for every vehicle scrapped under these 
"clunker programs" (for which they pay $800 or so each); they are 
allowed to postpone cleaning up their facilities to reduce their own
stationary source emissions, continuing to pollute at current levels 
for as long as three years.

Voluntary "clunker programs" may become mandatory, a government tactic
not unheard of.

THE OPTIONS:
Alternatives to crushing, melting or scrapping "old" cars and light
duty trucks already exist, such as recycling and rebuilding parts.

RECYCLING is possible for virtually every piece on the vehicle. For
example, many subframes can be recycled to build other vehicles;
intake and exhaust manifolds can be recycled to later model year 
vehicles; and many of the engine components can be rebuilt, giving 
you the opportunity to restore engines to their original configurations.

REBUILDING or reconditioning parts saves a variety of precious 
engine parts- you name it - it's been reused

WHAT YOU CAN DO:
Make your position clear to those with the power to fight for your
rights:

Write letters to your states elected representatives-the governor,
the state senator, the state assembly representative. It's their
responsibility to listen to you and act on your behalf.

Write letters to editors of local newspapers, car magazines and 
local Television stations.

Get your friends, fellow car enthusiasts and car club members to do
the same!

Tell them that, as an auto enthusiast, you strongly oppose any 
old car buyback legislation that will send our hobbyist cars to the 
crusher and fuel the pollution habits of oil & utility industries,
especially when other options are available.

[ In general, write your Congrescritters and tell them what you 
think of this, and other, dumb legislation.  -- FEP ]



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug  8 22:25:10 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: On Board Diagnostics (fwd)     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 08 1994 12:51:47
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>From Mark Levorson       

[ This message is similarly at the edge of what I'd like to see
sent here.  --FEP ]

From:info@autobarn.demon.co.uk

HOW GOVERNMENT REGULATIONS THREATEN AUTOMOTIVE HOBBIES
... and what you can do about it!

Getting the facts on:
* On Board Diagnostic Systems

An exclusive Service presented by the Specialty Equipment Market
Association and The American Auto Barn Ltd (SEMA Member)

Posted to internet by info@autobarn.demon.co.uk 
in three sections (Clunker Bills, New Vehicle Warranties and 
On Board Diagnostics). 

Reproduced from information supplied by SEMA for public distribution.

On Board Diagnostic Systems
----------------------------

THE FIRST LIE:
On-board diagnostics (OBD) should prevent aftermarket access to 
computer reprogramming and information thus prohibiting the manufacture
and installation of aftermarket parts; the EPA has the authority to 
prevent aftermarket access.

THE TRUTH:
The intent of the Clean Air Act is indisputable: to preserve the 
automotive aftermarket by providing information access to OBD
systems and allowing independent reprogramming/recallibration to
properly service and repair motor vehicles or engines.  This
preserves the public's freedom to choose between original equipment
and aftermarket parts, service and repairs.

THE SECOND LIE:
Because federal law requires extended warranties of up to 8 years
on a fiew pieces of emissions equipment, consumers must go to the
new vehicle dealer for service, rather than to an independent
service provider.

THE TRUTH:
Currently approximately 70 percent of parts, service and repair volume
belongs to the automotive aftermarket. This indicates that consumer 
preference is for independent service providers and not the new 
vehicle manufacturer's franchise dealer. The law specifically supports 
consumers using parts and service of their choice.

THE RULES:
On-board diagnostic systems - referred to as "OBD" or "OBD-II" are
sophisticated computer controlled monitoring systems in new cars and 
light duty trucks, designed to monitor vehicle compliance with 
emission standards.

OEM's are required to phase in OBD-II systems on 1994 
and 1995 model year vehicles with full compliance on 1996 and later 
model year vehicles.

OBD features may include an electronic lock on the vehicle's electronic
control module and other write protected features.

THE DANGERS:
OBD-II may eliminate your ability to install performance products
certain wheels & tires, suspension components and ground effect kits due 
to additional engine loading, vibration or aerodynamic effects.

Overly broad anti-tampering features may make legitimate reprogramming
by you or an independent repair facility impossible.

You will lose the freedom to purchase parts where you choose, independent
service providers will be severely limited in their ability to
properly repair and service motor vehicles, forcing you to return your
vehicle to the dealer.

WHAT YOU CAN DO:

Make your position clear to those with the power to fight for your rights

Write letters to your states elected representatives-the governor,
the state senator, the state assembly representative. It's their
responsibility to listen to you and act on your behalf.

Write letters to editors of local newspapers, car magazines and 
local Television stations.

Get your friends, fellow car enthusiasts and car club members to do
the same!

Tell them that, as a car owner and a hobbyist, you strongly oppose 
any regulations that will cripple an entire industry sector and
eliminate a consumers freedom to choose.

DON'T PUSH THIS ISSUE ASIDE FOR ANOTHER DAY....ACT NOW!



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug  8 22:52:54 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Engine computer programs ?     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 08 1994 12:57:43
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>From "M. Leitch"       


Does anybody know of any engine computer programs that are available to 
buy or on internet?.  The sort that will predict output for a given 
configuration or give advice on cam selection etc. anything would be a 
start.  

Many thanks

Mel Leitch                                      M.M.Leitch@Newcastle.ac.uk



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug  9 15:00:03 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Olds rods for Chevys     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 09 1994 09:22:02
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


 Back in 1992 I figured up the swap for putting Olds 350 or 403 rods
into the small block Chevy.  I might not have been the first, but nobody
on the hotrod list admitted having heard of it before either.  I was
pretty happy with the idea.  Last month there was a place in Circle
Track advertising kits for it, and this month's Car Craft has a brief
description of it.  I just love it when a plan comes together...
                                              


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug  9 16:07:19 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: On Board Diagnostics (fwd)     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 09 1994 09:28:07
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> Getting the facts on:
-> * On Board Diagnostic Systems

 Last month's Hot Rod reported that OBD-II had been canceled.
                                                                


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug  9 17:49:04 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: On Board Diagnostics (fwd)    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 09 1994 09:34:12
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>From lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu (Jonathan R. Lusky)     

Hotrod List writes:
> >From Mark Levorson       
> 
> [ This message is similarly at the edge of what I'd like to see
> sent here.  --FEP ]
 
Amen, dude...

> THE DANGERS:
> OBD-II may eliminate your ability to install performance products
> certain wheels & tires, suspension components and ground effect kits due 
> to additional engine loading, vibration or aerodynamic effects.
 
Thats a complete crock.  There is nothing inherent in OBD-II that
would justify that statement...  I imagine people were saying the same
thing when cars first got electronic ignition.

> Overly broad anti-tampering features may make legitimate reprogramming
> by you or an independent repair facility impossible.

I don't know about other implementations, but at least the current LT-1
ECM has already been hacked. 

-- 
Jonathan R. Lusky  --  lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu
 "Turbos are nice but I'd rather be blown!"
    68 Camaro Convertible - 350 / TH350
       80 Toyota Celica - 20R / 5spd


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug  9 19:07:01 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Venturi refrigeration vacuum pump     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 09 1994 09:40:16
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Approved: frank@dsea.com
>From jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond)     

This is going to both the Z-car and the Hotrod list because there have
been recent air conditioning discussions in both. 

I got a Harbor Freight (800 423 2567) catalog today and lo and behold,
on page 35 there is a venturi A/C vacuum pump for the lofty price of
$19.99.  This is item number 03952-1RGA.  Picture looks pretty nice.
Air consumption is listed at 4.2 SCFM @ 90 psi.  Max vacuum is specified
at 29.5" Hg.  Get 'em while they last.

John



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 10 02:23:27 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Olds rods in a small block chevy 

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 09 1994 20:22:03
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>From OADDAB@STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV (DIRK BROER)      


> Back in 1992 I figured up the swap for putting Olds 350 or 403 rods
>into the small block Chevy.  I might not have been the first, but nobody
>on the hotrod list admitted having heard of it before either.  I was
>pretty happy with the idea.  Last month there was a place in Circle
>Track advertising kits for it, and this month's Car Craft has a brief
>description of it.  I just love it when a plan comes together...
 
I saw both of those - may I suggest old diesel rods?  They should be very 
heavy duty and steel.  Whatch for different sized ends in 1981 olds severly 
beefed up their diesels.  From what I understand the diesels where the 
strongest short blocks olds ever made.

[ This is my understaning, too.  There was a HRM article a while back
about sending an Olds block to some guy in Wisconsin, where he would
cut and stroke it to make a 468 CID ( ?? really big ) Olds small
block from the diesel components.  I opted for a replacement 
Rocket 350 in my '82.   -FEP ]

Dirk


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 10 03:15:10 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Falcon with special equip FOR SALE   

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 09 1994 20:28:13
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>From phile@stpaul.gov (Philip J Ethier)     

Date: Tue, 9 Aug 1994 13:39:08 -0500 (CDT)
Cc: mustangs@cup.hp.com, classic-mustangs@hpfctjc.fc.hp.com, hotrod@dixie.com
X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL22]
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Length: 997       

FOR SALE:  1962 Falcon. 302 and suspension changes make it essentially a
GT-350 in a Falcon shell.  Owner moving from Nashville to Phoenix. 
Air-conditioning equipment is in trunk, owner does not want to bother with
installation and does not want a non-A/C car in Phoenix.  Car has been
returned to the builder in Minneapolis for sale.  Builder has paperwork on
all of the extensive parts and mods.  Car has been recently painted gold.

Refer all questions to the builder, Juan Nazario, at (612) 729-3792 in
Minneapolis, MN

I have seen this car autocrossed on several occasions in the Twin Cities. 
It looks like a lot of fun.  I have not seen it since the new paint.  I
would be willing to inspect the car for netters who have contacted Juan and
are seriously interested in the car.  Don't quote me on this, but I think
the seller would take $3500.  Juan has been authorized to sell the car.

I have absolutely no financial interest in this offering.

Please do not clog this list with replies.



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 10 03:59:57 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: radar gun for sale     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 09 1994 20:34:22
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>From billp@cerfnet.com (Bill Power)      

portable x-band radar gun for sale...12 volt runs off cigarette lighter or 
battery.. great for filtering Bull Shi.....works great includes tuning forks 
for speed spec accuracy. $200.00

billp@cerfnet.com



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 10 04:55:52 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: On Board Diagnostics     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 09 1994 20:40:28
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>From jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond)     

>
>> THE DANGERS:
>> OBD-II may eliminate your ability to install performance products
>> certain wheels & tires, suspension components and ground effect kits due 
>> to additional engine loading, vibration or aerodynamic effects.
> 
>Thats a complete crock.  There is nothing inherent in OBD-II that
>would justify that statement...  I imagine people were saying the same
>thing when cars first got electronic ignition.

Not true, at least as of a year ago when I was still paying for a
clipping service to keep me alerted on such stuff.  Part of the
proposal was for the data stream to be encrypted so that access
would be limited to only "authorized" devices.  The specific intent
of this provision WAS to prevent field hacking.  IF OBD-II is dead,
this is moot but it certainly bears watching.  These kinds of ogres
tend to have many lives.

John



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 10 05:35:08 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: call for cam grinding data    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 09 1994 20:46:37
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>From rsiatl!emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)      


 Last week one of the local engine shops acquired a used Storm Vulcan
cam grinder.  It's approximately large by huge; if anyone needed a cam
six feet long and a foot in diameter, this thing will do it.  I thought
it was an extra crank grinder until I looked closely.

 Right now it's in place, but not all the way together yet.  It does
work; the shop foreman had used it at another place.  Along with the
various pieces-parts was a cardboard box full of master cams,
approximately saucer-sized disks stamped "429 Ford intake" and the like.

 To make a long story short, I now have access to this thing in exchange
for a time, sort of a barter deal.  So I can now regrind old cams, grind
billets I make on my lathe, etc.

 The problem is generating the master cams.  Mechanically it's no big
deal, but it involves not only figuring the corrections for the final
cam and follower, but for the master cam and follower, and the grinding
wheel and workpiece.  Looks like I will have to build a spreadsheet to
do the figures.

 Pete Paraska has come up with some stuff, but we're looking for any
other data we can get.  I've never dealt with cams at this level before,
so every little bit helps.


 Oh, uh... I'm not exactly sure what I'm gonna *do* with this stuff yet.
There's no point in grinding Ford or Chevy cams; just open a catalog and
take your pick.  There's a racing motorcycle shop in town that might be
interested in trying something experimental.  "Jeez, sorry the valve got
tangled in the piston, I must've dropped a decimal on the opening
rate..."  

 Hey, if nothing else I could grind some specials to turn VW engines
into air compressors...
                                                                        



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 10 14:00:34 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Questions about hot roddign     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 10 1994 09:22:05
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>From farooq%dt3.UUCP@mathcs.emory.edu        


Anybody know anything about after market fuel injection systems and if they
are available in TPI or SFI other than just throttle body.  I am trying to 
build a 350hp or more smog legal 350cid.

					If you're gonna do something
					Do it right or
					Not at all.

[ JGD has explained the problems with the Holley system in this forum.
We all know that the late-model GM system works.  HRM has noted that
the ACCEL system works.

JGD may publish the EFI-from-Nintendo article some time...

One guy in this forum has the setup I want.  A ZZ3 with the ACCEL
kit.  That is about $7000 in motor parts.  :(((  He mentioned 
something like 450 hp and 470 ft-lbs after a few days of assembly.

For about half that you can buy the very complete kit from GM to 
make a 350/350/350 F-body with a carb, with the correct stickers,
too.

--FEP ]


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 10 16:36:24 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Wanted: performance equations (mathematical)     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 10 1994 09:28:15
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>From Ken Tice       

Message-Id: <9408101157.AA00618@isdn.ncsl.nist.gov>
To: hotrod@dsea.com
Subject: Wanted: performance equations (mathematical)



   I am looking for the equations behind the "dream wheel" car magazines
talk about.  Basically, I'd like to plug in things like tire diameter,
gear ratio, weight, hp, aeorodynamic drag, etc. etc. and arrive at an
approximation of 1/4 mile performance.

   If anyone can point out a good reference, I'd appreciate it.

-Ken


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 10 18:31:57 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: On Board Diagnostics (fwd)    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 10 1994 09:34:24
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>From Matt Beaker Graham      

I flipped through some Hot Rods and didn't see where they reported that 
OBD-II had been cancelled.  I'd be really surprised to see it, since I just
came back from some interviews with the automotive industry in Michigan,
and it was very much a part of the conversations.

Which issue is it in?

In addition, aren't these supposed to be adaptive networks, meaning that the
fuel management system constantly adjusts operation in order to maintain
strict emission standards?  That would suggest that some aftermarket parts
could be added, as long as the existing sensors remain.  As far as the
reprogramming of the actual software, I can't say that I'm familiar with
the topic, so I won't start in on that.

Matt


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug 11 17:05:21 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: RE: Wanted: performance equations (mathematical)    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 11 1994 09:22:03
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>From "Joe B. McGlynn (415) 354-2728"    

>   I am looking for the equations behind the "dream wheel" car
> magazines talk about.  Basically, I'd like to plug in things
> like tire diameter, gear ratio, weight, hp, aeorodynamic
> drag, etc. etc. and arrive at an approximation of 1/4 mile
> performance.
>
>   If anyone can point out a good reference, I'd appreciate it.
>
>-Ken


Me too!  How about top speed for those of us headed to b'vile next week? 
 Maybe a formula for tire ratio given tire/wheeel size and aspect ratio? 
 Ways to approximate rolling resitance?

Any physics majors out there?

Joe



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug 11 20:00:47 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Olds rods in a small block chevy 

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 11 1994 09:28:18
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> I saw both of those - may I suggest old diesel rods?  They should be
-> very heavy duty and steel.

 Oh, they are.  But they're 5.886 inches long, while the gas engine rods
are 6.0 inches long.


-> about sending an Olds block to some guy in Wisconsin, where he would
-> cut and stroke it to make a 468 CID ( ?? really big ) Olds small

 You can use the Diesel block, bore it to 4.25", and use the 425 crank
for an easy 461 cubes.  You can also use the 403 block and a 455 crank
for 505 cubes, but you have to do quite a bit of grinding and
clearancing to get everything to clear.

 The nice thing about either one is, you still have the short deck
block, easy to pass off as a Rocket 350....
                                                                                                                       


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug 11 23:25:32 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: fuel ratings       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 11 1994 09:34:31
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


 Someone just asked me what scheme the Australians use to rate octane.
He said last time he was there, premium was 97, regular 95.

 Britain uses the RON only, as does most of Europe.  From the high
figures it sounds like that's what Australia is doing - does anyone know
if they use RON only, or (R+M)/2 like the USA, or some oddball Aussie
scheme?
                                                                                                                       


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug 12 00:59:32 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Is anyone working on 37 ford pickup?  

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 11 1994 09:40:46
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>From willie_figueroa@rainbow.mentorg.com (Willie Figueroa)      

Answer to newsgroup or my email, either way.

--
+----------------------------------------------------+
|  willie_figueroa@mentorg.com (503) 685-7000 x3517  | 
+----------------------------------------------------+



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug 12 14:05:37 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Wanted: performance equations (mathematical)    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 12 1994 09:22:02
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>From Kelly Murray       

Date: Thu, 11 Aug 1994 11:32:10 -0400
From: Kelly Murray 


This should be of some help.  Done up by Rusty Atkins for the
Dragnet mailing list. -Kelly

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
 I have written a small drag racing calculator program.  Feel free to compile
Status: O

and use it. Please do not modify the source in any manner without my permission. 
 It will currently calculate Gear ratio, horsepower, mph, and rpm. I would
like to add a function for ET, but no one has been able to supply me with
the formula for it.

 **** Insert every disclaimer ever written here ****

 If you have any questions, feel free to ask. If you have some functionality
you would like added, send me the formula and I'll add it.

 This program has compiled cleanly on Sun, SGI, IBM, HP, DEC, Linux, OS/2 (gcc),
and DOS (gcc and turbo c).

  To compile, do the following:

 Save the code to a program named "calc.c"
type: cc calc.c -o calc 
to use: type: "calc"
 That's all there is to it.

********************************  CUT HERE  ************************************

/* calc.c -- a program to calculate different drag racing formulas */


/* Preprocessor directives */

#include 
#include 
#include 
#define CONSTANT 336.13524



/* Global Variables */

float gr;  		/* Gear Ratio      */
float hp;               /* Horsepower      */
float mph;              /* Miles Per Hour  */
float rpm;              /* Revs Per Minute */
float td;               /* Tire Diameter   */
float temp, temp2;	/* Temp Storage    */
float wt;    		/* Vehicle Weight  */
double constant=.3333;  /* Constant for ET */



/* Function prototypes */

int horsepower();
float gear_ratio();
float miles_per_hour();
int revs_per_minute();
void copyright();



/* Begin main */

main()
{

 int choice=0;  /* Number Selected       */


 do
 {
	copyright();
	printf("\n\n\t\t\t Select Desired Function:\n\n");
	printf("\t\t\t 1) Gear Ratio\n");
	printf("\t\t\t 2) Horsepower\n");
	printf("\t\t\t 3) M.P.H.\n");
	printf("\t\t\t 4) R.P.M.\n");
	printf("\t\t\t 9) Quit\n");
	four_lines(1);
	printf("\t\t\t Your Choice: _\b\n\n\n");
	scanf("%d", &choice); 
	switch (choice)
	{
		case 1 :
   			gear_ratio();
			break;
		case 2 :
			horsepower();
			break;
		case 3 :
			miles_per_hour();
			break;
		case 4 :
			revs_per_minute();
			break;
		case 9 :
		    copyright();	
            four_lines(1);
			printf("\n\t     Thank-you for using the Drag
Racing Calculator!!!");
			four_lines(3);
			break; 
		default :
		{
			four_lines(6);
			printf("\n");
			four_lines(2);
			printf("\t    You have made an invalid
selection, please try again.");
			printf("\n\n\n");
			four_lines(2);
			ouch();
		} /* End 'default:' block */

	} /* End Switch */

 }while(choice != 9); /* End Do-While */
 
 return 0;
}

float gear_ratio() /* GR */
{
 header("Gear Ratio", 3);
 printf(" What speed are you traveling at? (in mph): ");
 scanf("%f", &mph);
 header("Gear Ratio", 3);
 printf(" What is your rpm at %.2f mph?: ", mph);
 scanf("%f", &rpm);
 header("Gear Ratio",3);
 printf(" What is your tire diameter in inches?: ");
 scanf("%f", &td);
 gr=((td*rpm) / (mph*CONSTANT));
 header("Gear Ratio", 1);
 printf("\t\t\t\t Given:\n\n");
 printf("  MPH=%2.2f\t\t\tRPM=%4.0f\t\tTire Diameter=%2.2f", mph, rpm, td);
 printf("\n\n\n\t\t\t Your gear ratio is: %1.2f.\n", gr);
 pause();
}


int horsepower() /* HP */
{
 header("Horsepower",3);
 printf(" What is your gear ratio? (example: 4.56): ");
 scanf("%f", &gr);
 header("Horsepower",3);
 printf(" What is your engine speed through the traps?: ");
 scanf("%f", &rpm);
 header("Horsepower",3);
 printf(" What is your tire diameter?: ");
 scanf("%f", &td);
 header("Horsepower",3);
printf(" What is the weight of your vehicle (in pounds)?: ");
 scanf("%f", &wt);
 temp=((78655.65*gr) /td/rpm);
 temp2=(temp * temp * temp);
 hp=(wt / temp2);
 header("Horsepower", 1);
  printf("\t\t\t\t Given:\n\n");
 printf("  Gear Ratio=%1.2f\tRPM=%.0f\tTire
Dia.=%.2f\t\tWeight=%.0f",gr, rpm, td, wt);
 printf("\n\n\n\t\t  Your car is making about %.0f horsepower.\n", hp);
 pause();
}


float miles_per_hour() /* MPH */
{
 header("  M.P.H.", 3);
 printf(" What is your gear ratio? (example: 3.55): ");
 scanf("%f", &gr);
 header("  M.P.H.", 3);
 printf(" What is your rpm?: ");
 scanf("%f", &rpm);
 header("  M.P.H.", 3);
 printf(" What is your tire diameter in inches?: ");
 scanf("%f", &td);
 mph=((td * rpm) / (gr * 336.13524));
 header("  M.P.H.", 1);
 printf("\t\t\t\t Given:\n\n");
 printf("    Gear Ratio=%1.2f\t\tRPM=%.0f\t\tTire Diameter=%2.2f", gr, rpm, td);
 printf("\n\n\n\t\t\tYou will be going %.2f mph.\n", mph);
 pause();
}


int revs_per_minute() /* RPM */
{
 header("  R.P.M.", 3);
 printf(" What is your gear ratio? (example: 3.55): ");
 scanf("%f", &gr);
 header("  R.P.M.", 3);
 printf(" What speed are you traveling at? (in mph): ");
 scanf("%f", &mph);
 header("  R.P.M.", 3);
 printf(" What is your tire diameter in inches?: ");
 scanf("%f", &td);
 rpm=(336.13524 * mph * gr / td);
 header("  R.P.M.", 1);
 printf("\t\t\t\t Given:\n\n");
 printf(" Gear Ratio=%1.2f\t\tSpeed=%.2f\t\tTire Diameter=%.2f", gr, mph, td);
 printf("\n\n\n\t\t At %.2f mph, you are turning %.0f rpm\n",mph,rpm);
 pause();
}


pause()
{
 char junk[81];
 do
 {
    gets(junk);
    printf("\n\nSlam the Enter key to continue...");
 }while(getchar() != '\n');
}


four_lines(int x)
{
 int i;
 for(i=0; i < x ;i++)
 printf("\n\n\n\n");
}


ouch()
{
 char junk[81];
 do
 {
    gets(junk);
    printf("\n\nSlam the Enter key to continue...");
 }while(getchar() != '\n');
 four_lines(6);
 printf("\t\t\t\t  Ouch!!!\n");
 four_lines(3);
 sleep(1);
}


void copyright()
{
 four_lines(6);
 printf("   Racing Formula Calculator - (c) 1994 Rusty Atkins - All
Rights Reserved");
 printf("\t                Freely distributable for non-commercial purposes\n");
 printf("\t   Modification not permitted without author's permission\n");
 printf("\n\n");
}


header(char heading[], int x)
{
 copyright();
 printf("\n\n\t\t\t %s Calculation:\n\n\n", heading);
 four_lines(x);
}


/* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * End Of Program  * * * * * * * * * * * * * * */


********************************  CUT HERE  ************************************



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
* Rusty Atkins                                                  Ford Motor Co. *
* atkins@cadcam.pms.ford.com                                    CAD/CAM Dept.  *
* (313) 33-78189                                                Dearborn, MI.  *
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug 12 15:34:52 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Pontiac cylinder heads      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 12 1994 09:28:20
X-Sequence: 143
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>From OADDAB@STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV (DIRK BROER)      

I was wondering - for mid '70's Pontiacs what is a good cylinder head for 
the 455.

I have a 455 that came with the "6H" heads.  These are very large 
combustion chamber (7.9:1 compression) heads for the '76 trans Am.  When 
trying to sell it I thought I remembered some people asking if I had "6X" 
heads.  Well I just picked up a set of "6X" heads - off of a 400 with 
cracked main web.  The heads look O.K.  They were free.  But are they worth 
anything - does anyone have that kind of Pontiac info?

Dirk


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug 12 16:29:25 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: ODB quote       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 12 1994 09:34:33
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


 The blurb about OBD being defeated was on page 19 of the September
issue of Hot Rod.
  


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug 12 18:24:01 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Venturi refrigeration vacuum pump    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 12 1994 09:40:43
X-Sequence: 145
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>From met@pine.cse.nau.edu (MTN-KAT)       

X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92)
To: hotrod (Hotrod List)
Subject: Re: Venturi refrigeration vacuum pump

Just what is a Venturi Reefer pump good for?


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug 12 22:00:33 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: RE: Wanted: performance equations (mathematical)    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 12 1994 17:22:03
X-Sequence: 146
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>From Barry Freese       

There is a "Car Math" book out there which has LOTS of equations of the 
sort you all are mentioning.

I have it...at home, of course.  I got it through a catalog.  I think it 
was Classic Motorbooks, or something like that, although I've seen it in 
more than one location.

Happy hunting.

Barry


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug 12 23:57:25 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Oldish Olds, et Chevelle     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 12 1994 17:28:20
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>From frank@rebel (Frank Evan Perdicaro)     

I have a chance to get ahold of another nice CA car, but am unsure 
if I really should.  

Not too far from here there is a 1965 Cutlass F85 that looks new.  It
has recent tires, brakes, new interior, new paint, new starter, 
radiator, hoses and water pump.

Supposedly it has the "big" engine, the guy said "over 400 cid".  Does 
this mean something like a 403 or a 430 Wildcat?  Hmmm.  A bit of an
oddball anyway.  The only thing wrong I can find is that there is one 
broken emblem.  Other than that, it looks like a six month old car.  

Oh yeah, there are 112,000 miles on the original motor and Powerglide.
If I did not have a Chevelle, Saturn, Hawk and three bicycles in a 1.5
car garage, I'd buy it for $2500.  Still runs strong.  Seems like a 
steal.  Any body got an idea of the market price for these things?

Got any advice?  Have a member of my family buy it, and drive it east?  
Ignore it and drive my Chevelle?


Unrelated Chevelle project notes:  
Leaking exhaust gives wicked headaches!  New pipes are on the way from 
Summit -- cheaper than having anything made locally.  I'll let you 
know how 2.5" tri-y + crossover + dual Flowmasters sounds and feels.
Likely will require a few sessions with the O2 meter, jets and 
rods.

Hold on to your wallets.  If you are intending to buy some of those 12"
FBody brakes for your GM older car, and will be buying wheels too, there
is a cheaper way.  The Caprice 12" rotors are the same as the 1LE 
rotors, with a differnt stud pattern and price.  Buy dual pattern wheels
( 4.75 on 5 and 5 on 5 ) and save about $100 each next time you change
rotors.  

Global West has gone wholesale only, except for existing customers.

I spent two months researching GM 55-75 body side molding clips.  If
you have any questions, I may be able to answer them.  All the
molding is back on my Chevelle, and I started with two clips.

Anybody know about steering boxes?  I have vertical play through
my Pittman arm producing steering slop on braking.  I'd like to
try to shim it out if possible.  What should I look for in
the box?  Manual steering.

Each of the replacement boxes ( 4.5 turn and 3.5 turn ) is about $150.
I'd hate to waste that money.

The Global West "fast ratio ( 2.75 turn )" box is $450 and is
constructed from the '84 and up 'vette and IROC internals on an old
GM core.  Too much money.  

Any idea what the practical limit is for mid sized V8 car is with
manual steering?  3 turn?  I like manual steering, but need to get 
the car in and out of the garage.

Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug 15 15:14:10 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Oldish Olds, et Chevelle     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 15 1994 10:22:03
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> Global West has gone wholesale only, except for existing customers.

 Must be nice to have so much business you can pick and choose who
you'll sell to.
                      


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug 15 18:03:58 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Pontiac cylinder heads      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 15 1994 10:28:25
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> anything - does anyone have that kind of Pontiac info?

 ASCII and ye shall receive...

1973    455     290     8.4     SD      1.77     111cc   16(6H)
1974    455     290     8.4     SD      1.77     111cc   16(6H)
1975    455     215     7.6     4bbl    1.66     116cc   6H(1)
1979    400             high CR 4bbl             88cc    6X
1979    400             low CR  4bbl             98cc    6X

there were both large and small chamber 6X heads
                                                                                                                         


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug 15 21:15:35 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: O rings II      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 15 1994 10:34:50
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


 Most O-ringed engines use soft iron or copper wire for the rings.
The old BOSS 429 track motors used a ring with a C shape, with the open
edge of the C facing the chamber.  These rings were much bulkier than
wire, looked sort of like fat piston rings.  They used the the
combustion pressure to provide a seal.

 Is there a specific name for these?  Where can they be obtained,
particularly in the 4.0, 4.03, 4.04 sizes?
                                                 


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug 15 23:04:32 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: O rings I      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 15 1994 10:41:11
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


 I know how to O-ring a block - you use what looks like a mutant ridge
reamer, available from Isky and other places.  But lots of engine
builders O-ring heads.

 How do you cut a head for O-rings?
                  


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug 15 23:34:48 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Pls mail me RPM program    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 15 1994 13:22:03
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>From Kevin Fultz       


I accidentally blew away the last hot-rod posting before I got a copy
of the C program that was posted recently.  If someone could mail it
to me I'd appreciate it.

Kevin Fultz
kevinf@sequent.com


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug 15 23:55:38 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: WANTED: Metal working tools     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 15 1994 17:22:03
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>From "Joe B. McGlynn (415) 354-2728"    

I'm into coachbuilt cars and customs.  If anyone has any old 
metalshaping/bodywork tools for sale I would be interested in talking to 
you.  Examples of things I'm looking for include: 

  pneumatic plannishing hammers (AKA 'fender irons')
  Yoder hammers (really huge 'power hammers' used to shape metal)
  4'-6' box and pan brake
  foot operated shrinker ('kick shrinker', Erco or Merschant)
  most any fabricating tools like vertical bandsaw, flame cutter,etc.

you can respond to me directly at: joseph.mcglynn@syntex.com



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug 16 00:44:14 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: more cooling stuff      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 15 1994 10:47:36
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


 Back a few years ago Callaway was talking about using one of the
varieties of Freon as the coolant in their twin turbo Corvette.  As far
as I know nothing came of it.

 Going through an old Automotive Industries magazine (Dec 92) I found an
article titled "So Cool", about a similar design by Nissan.

 The text of the article follows:

"Nissan's electronically controlled latent heat type cooling system
monitors and controls the engine cooling system to control the engine
temperature to suit its operating conditions.
 At high speed, the engine's temperature is kept low to ensure high
output power.
  At low speed around town, the temperature is raised to reduce the
energy losses associated with the cooling system, and to save fuel.  The
system also enables a speeding up of engine warm-up and improves heater
performance.
  Other peripheral benefits include a smaller radiator core and greater
engine wall temperature uniformity for reduced heat distortion and
superior resistance to knocking.
  Unlike a conventional cooling system which circulates large quantities
of water continuously in the cooling system, this cooling system employs
electronically controlled valves that control the greatly reduced
coolant flow (approximately 1/100 conventional flow) to achieve the
desired conditions.
  In addition, the system causes the coolant to boil, allowing heat
energy to be dispensed in the form of latent head for greatly enhanced
cooling effectiveness.
  The vaporized coolant is then recooled into liquid form for
recirculation in the closed system."

    You can tell these guys aren't exactly technoids.


 There is a crude drawing of a V engine showing what looks like a
conventional cooling system, less thermostat.  A fluid level sensor near
the top is wired to the "control unit".  I don't see how Nissan is going
to have much control over temperature once the coolant starts to boil,
particularly with only 1/100 of normal coolant flow.  I suspect Nissan
didn't figure it out either, since I don't see them producing a similar
system.


 Back to the Callaway, what would be the advantage of Freon over plain
old water?  If pressures were like normal AC systems, it'd be
interesting to convert the engine from 15 psi liquid cooling to several
hundred PSI of gas.
                                                                                      


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug 16 20:55:27 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: October Circle Track      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 16 1994 16:22:03
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


 Smokey Yunick has an entire feature article to show off his xenophobia,
raving about how "the green carders" have destroyed American racing.
Apparently when Ilmor and Penske et.al. didn't jump through hoops to
kiss his ass when he came schmoozing he got his knickers in a knot.  He
claims he was "stonewalled" when he tried to find information on the
engines; information Racecar Engineering doesn't seem to have trouble
getting.  And even though Yunick actually built some Buick V6 Indy cars
once upon a time he chose to virtually ignore them, and, of the lone
American-designed specialty contender, the Greenfield V8, he says, "I'm
afraid it is better off sitting on the porch.  It better let them big
dogs alone."  *Greenfield* wouldn't talk to Yunick?  Or anyone fielding
a Buick?  I guess it's their fault for not winning, and lettin' dem damn
furriners take over...

 Yunick has a second article trying to credit Weld with inventing the
CNC-ported head, when the California shops started doing that back in
the '70s.  Every few years someone else "invents" the CNC ported head,
and the magazines are all agog once again.


 Yunick also reiterates his stand about how computers are ruining
racing.    I'm surprised he hasn't come out in favor of the
flathead too.
                                                                                 


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug 16 22:26:02 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: O rings I     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 16 1994 16:28:24
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>From lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu (Jonathan R. Lusky)     

Hotrod List writes:
> >From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      
> 
>  I know how to O-ring a block - you use what looks like a mutant ridge
> reamer, available from Isky and other places.  But lots of engine
> builders O-ring heads.
> 
>  How do you cut a head for O-rings?

something like a flycutter?

-- 
Jonathan R. Lusky  --  lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu
 "Turbos are nice but I'd rather be blown!"
    68 Camaro Convertible - 350 / TH350
       80 Toyota Celica - 20R / 5spd


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 17 00:14:49 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: more cooling stuff      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 16 1994 16:34:42
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>From jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond)     

> Back to the Callaway, what would be the advantage of Freon over plain
>old water?  If pressures were like normal AC systems, it'd be
>interesting to convert the engine from 15 psi liquid cooling to several
>hundred PSI of gas.

I suspect they're talking about one of the FluroInerts, freons with
boiling points up in the hundreds of degrees.  One past use of
FluroInert was vapor reflow soldering, where vaporized freon condensed
on PCBs and melted the solder, and reflowed it to a uniformly smooth
surface.  We used to use the stuff at the nuclear plant for thermocouple
and high temperature thermometer calibrations.  That was back when the
stuff was "only" about $400/gal.  Now that the econazis are getting
their ozone tax, the stuff is out of sight.

The benefit would obviously be that there would be no localized boiling
even without pressurization.  The great negative (other than cost) is
that the specific heat is much lower than water so a higher flowrate
would be necessary.  I really couldn't see it being worth the money.

John



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 17 01:25:34 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: coil ratings       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 16 1994 16:41:03
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


 I just saw an article on the Orbital two stroke Ford has been tinkering
with.  The article mentioned one of the latest tweaks was an upgrade to
90 millijoule ignition coils.

 I've never seen a coil rated in joules, though it sounds reasonable.
So, how much juice is 90 millijoules, and how does it compare to
flicking a BIC in a dark hangar, or bolts of lightning?

[ A joule is a watt-second.  Note the relation to kilowatt-hour; 
I have always wondered why electric meters do not read joules.  History
likely.

Lightening might be 100,000 amps at 1000 volts per inch for 0.1 second.
Lightening might be 5000 inches long, for a nice 5,000,000 volts.  
That is 5,000,000,000,000 watts for 0.1 second, or about 500,000,000,000
joules.  A calorie is about 5 joules, and a BTU is about 250 calories.
I forget the relationship to Mev and grams.  A BIC flick might 
be in the neighborhood of a BTU if you have a tough thumb.  -- FEP ]



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 17 12:50:55 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: coil ratings      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 17 1994 09:22:02
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>From lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu (Jonathan R. Lusky)     

Hotrod List writes:
>  I just saw an article on the Orbital two stroke Ford has been tinkering
> with.  The article mentioned one of the latest tweaks was an upgrade to
> 90 millijoule ignition coils.
>  I've never seen a coil rated in joules, though it sounds reasonable.
> So, how much juice is 90 millijoules, and how does it compare to
> flicking a BIC in a dark hangar, or bolts of lightning?

For comparison, I think a 6 series MSD dumps somehwere around 140
millijoules. 

Also I think theyve gotten a couple of joules out of a plasma rail plug.

-- 
Jonathan R. Lusky  --  lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu
 "Turbos are nice but I'd rather be blown!"
    68 Camaro Convertible - 350 / TH350
       80 Toyota Celica - 20R / 5spd


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 17 15:54:30 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: O rings I     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 17 1994 09:28:24
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> >  How do you cut a head for O-rings?
->
-> something like a flycutter?

 Best as I can tell, that'd be it.  The problem is, it'd be a bitch to
make sure you're properly centered over the bore.  I was just hoping
there was an easier way I wasn't smart enough to see offhand.
                                      


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 17 17:39:37 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: more cooling stuff      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 17 1994 09:34:45
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> The benefit would obviously be that there would be no localized
-> boiling even without pressurization.  The great negative (other than
-> cost) is that the specific heat is much lower than water so a higher
-> flowrate would be necessary.  I really couldn't see it being worth
-> the money.

 Looks like it's pretty hard to beat plain old water, maybe with some
propylene glycol.
                                                       


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 17 19:57:43 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: coil ratings       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 17 1994 09:41:03
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> [ A joule is a watt-second.  Note the relation to kilowatt-hour; I
-> have always wondered why electric meters do not read joules.  History

 Hell, now I know what a joule is.  I only had metric in school, but it
was the old style where you said "kg/cm^3" instead of "kiloPascals."
"Watt-second" is an obvious unit, "joule" is just jerking people around.
I'm terrified I'm going to wake up someday and find that cubic
centimeters are now deGaulles and kilometers per hour are now Marceaus
or something.


-> I forget the relationship to Mev and grams.  A BIC flick might
-> be in the neighborhood of a BTU if you have a tough thumb.  -- FEP ]

 So is 90 mj a hot coil or a wimpy one?
              


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug 18 19:20:58 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Ignition Energy       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 18 1994 14:22:02
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>From Jeffrey S Armfield      


Your typical factory ignition dumps about 20 - 30 millijoules into a spark. I
assume the 140 millijoules value from MSD is the summation of multiple sparks.
If not, 140 millijoules in a single spark sounds suspiciously high. Auto
manufacturers (at least the ones I'm working with) are aiming at the 200
millijoule level for future ignition systems. 

Jeff Armfield


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug 18 19:59:26 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: O-rings       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 18 1994 14:28:18
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>From OADDAB@STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV (DIRK BROER)      


>-> >  How do you cut a head for O-rings?
>->
>-> something like a flycutter?
>
> Best as I can tell, that'd be it.  The problem is, it'd be a bitch to
>make sure you're properly centered over the bore.  I was just hoping
>there was an easier way I wasn't smart enough to see offhand.

Well how close to properly centered do you have to be.  In the real world 
the bore is not perfectly round (assuming it was honed with torque plates) 
or if it is the moment you bolt on the heads you'll twist it slightly.  So 
I would say that O-rings would have to have a good deal of tolerance.  The 
accuracy of a cylinder honing machine would be good enough.  There are also 
boring machines that are recomended when using new blocks with rough finish 
- these boring machines will put the holes where they should be - not where 
the casting thinks they should be.

Accuracy to within a few .001 is easy to achieve.

I haven't heard much about 0-ringed engines anymore.  I have heard about o-
ring gaskets.  The question is:  When would you need an o-ringed block?  I 
assume you'd have to do the head as well.  I wonder if top fuel dragsters 
do this - If they don't I can't image anyone needing to.

Dirk


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug 18 20:54:14 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: O rings I     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 18 1994 14:34:32
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>From lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu (Jonathan R. Lusky)     

Hotrod List writes:
> >From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      
> -> >  How do you cut a head for O-rings?
> -> something like a flycutter?
>  Best as I can tell, that'd be it.  The problem is, it'd be a bitch to
> make sure you're properly centered over the bore.  I was just hoping
> there was an easier way I wasn't smart enough to see offhand.

Nah, shouldn't be that bad.  How critical is the centering?  You
ought to be able to get within a couple thousandths off a good
headgasket I'd think (I don't know how accurate headgaskets are
though).  Or how about a jig?

-- 
Jonathan R. Lusky  --  lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu
 "Turbos are nice but I'd rather be blown!"
    68 Camaro Convertible - 350 / TH350
       80 Toyota Celica - 20R / 5spd


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug 18 21:32:14 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: O rings I     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 18 1994 14:40:48
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>From met@pine.cse.nau.edu (MTN-KAT)       

X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.5 10/14/92)
To: hotrod (Hotrod List)
Subject: Re: O rings I

Dave its pretty easy to setup for O-ringing.
Square the head up on the bed by lining up the centering dowels with an
edge detector.
Center on one of the dowels.
It is 2.120" to the center of the bore on the width.
It is 2.190" to the center of bore #1 on the long axis.
The second bore will be at 6.570",
The third at 10.950"
And the fourth at 15.330.
The dowel pins are 17.520" apart.
Use a flycutter with a custom ground tool set for a 4.299" diameter.
This will work for all windsors.

Millam




From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug 18 22:28:41 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: coil ratings      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 18 1994 14:47:04
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> For comparison, I think a 6 series MSD dumps somehwere around 140
-> millijoules.

 I just found a listing for an ignition controller chip that can handle
up to 150 mJ to the primary side of a coil.  What's the efficiency of
the coil?  If it gets 150 in, will it be close to 150 out?

- Dave "Electrical Ignoramus" Williams
                                                                                                                  


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug 19 00:58:55 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: O rings I     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Thursday, Aug 18 1994 14:53:17
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>From jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond)     

>>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      
>
>
>-> >  How do you cut a head for O-rings?
>->
>-> something like a flycutter?
>
> Best as I can tell, that'd be it.  The problem is, it'd be a bitch to
>make sure you're properly centered over the bore.  I was just hoping
>there was an easier way I wasn't smart enough to see offhand.

Jigs for doing heads are available from the usual sources but I 
do not recommend doing the head unless you like to re-do it every time
you have the deck resurfaced to re-true it.  For aluminum heads,
that would be every removal.  Since the deck rarely has to be trued,
one grooving job lasts a long time.

John



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug 19 20:11:37 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: New GM reverse cooling stuff?    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 19 1994 11:28:20
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>From khamar@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu (Kyle Hamar)      

The LT1 is cooled (by water of course) but in a reverse direction from
normal. This is claimed to reduce pre-ignition and increase the allowed
performance of a given fuel.

Other than being a nightmare to bleed air from, is this the cooling scheme
of the future for 350 cu in GM engines? If this a worth while adventure in
cooling hotrods? 

Or, is this just new to me?

[ "Reverse flow" has been around for a while, and does provide the
coolest water where it is needed -- the heads.  As far as I know, the 
LT1 is the first of the "GEN II" smallblocks, and is expected to be
the way things will be in the future.  -- FEP ]

---
Kyle Hamar
khamar@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Fri Aug 19 23:03:46 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Ignition Energy      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 19 1994 11:34:37
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>From lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu (Jonathan R. Lusky)     

Hotrod List writes:
> >From Jeffrey S Armfield      
> 
> 
> Your typical factory ignition dumps about 20 - 30 millijoules into a spark. I
> assume the 140 millijoules value from MSD is the summation of multiple sparks.
> If not, 140 millijoules in a single spark sounds suspiciously high. Auto
> manufacturers (at least the ones I'm working with) are aiming at the 200
> millijoule level for future ignition systems. 

Yes, that is the summation of the multiple sparks.  Actually, I didn't
get that number from MSD, I got it from Adrenalyne (sp?) who was trying
to sell me one of their $300 single-spark CDI boxes.  I stayed with my
MSD-6AL.

-- 
Jonathan R. Lusky  --  lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu
 "Turbos are nice but I'd rather be blown!"
    68 Camaro Convertible - 350 / TH350
       80 Toyota Celica - 20R / 5spd


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Sat Aug 20 00:46:07 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: O rings I     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 19 1994 11:40:50
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> headgasket I'd think (I don't know how accurate headgaskets are
-> though).

 Not very, at least the ones I've looked at.


->  Or how about a jig?

 A dedicated fixture would probably be the way to go.

 It was more a question of curiosity than anything else.  It's so easy
to O-ring a block, and you don't have to glue the rings down to put the
heads on.  I can't see any advantages to O-ringing the heads as opposed
to the block, and it looks like doing the heads would be a ripping pain
in the ass.
                                                                  


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Sat Aug 20 01:47:55 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: O-rings       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 19 1994 11:47:05
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> Well how close to properly centered do you have to be.

 Probably within .005 TIR.


-> accuracy of a cylinder honing machine would be good enough.

 How are you going to cut an O-ring groove in a cylinder head with a
honing machine?


->  The question is:  When would you need an o-ringed block?

 Whenever you're blowing gaskets.


->  I assume you'd have to do the head as well.

 I've never come across mention of anyone who'd O-ringed both the head
and the block.


-> I wonder if top fuel
-> dragsters do this - If they don't I can't image anyone needing to.

 As far as I know there's nobody who *isn't* running O-ringed blocks in
that class.
                                                 


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Sat Aug 20 02:29:15 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: coil ratings      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 19 1994 11:53:20
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>From hale@brooktree.com (bob hale)      


Dave Williams writes:

> I just found a listing for an ignition controller chip that can handle
>up to 150 mJ to the primary side of a coil.  What's the efficiency of
>the coil?  If it gets 150 in, will it be close to 150 out?


It is straightforward to compute the efficiency:

eff = energy out / energy in

The coil will store energy = 0.5 * L * i^2 in its inductance; note that
in a conventional Kettering ignition the i is the maximum current reached
before the points open.  A CD ignition, an MSD, or other such ignitions
will complicate the computation since the ignition system produces a voltage
and the resulting current varies in a complicated way with time.

The coil will waste energy accoring to i^2 * R * t but we have to be careful
here because i varies with time so what is needed is the integral of
i^2 * R with respect to time.  Note that both the primary and secondary are
responsible for losses so they both must be computed and added together.
The sum of this lost energy and the stored energy becomes the energy
input for the equation above.

Measuring the R of the coil's primary and secondary is easy; an ohmmeter
will do.  Be careful when disconnecting it - short the coil terminals
together before disconnecting the meter to prevent zapping the meter.

Measuring the L of the coil is not so easy but it can be done.  Secondaries
usually resonate with their own distributed capacitance at roughly 2 kHz
so the test frequency should be much lower than 2 kHz.  Since there is a
significant resistive component it would be wise to use a vector impedance
meter of some sort to keep the real and imaginary components separate.
The primary and secondary will interact; you will need to make several
measurements with the other port open, terminated, and shorted and then
plug the results into a simultaneous equation to separate the components.

Having the parameters of the coil allows us to plug numbers into the
equation and compute efficiency.  I don't know what typical coil
inductance is; if I did then I could produce a reasonably accurate
guess to the efficiency.  Offhand I would suspect that the efficiency
is roughly half.

Bob Hale   hale@brooktree.com


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Sat Aug 20 03:26:17 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: WANTED: Cheap/Obsolete laptops for ECM monitoring   

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Friday, Aug 19 1994 11:59:38
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>From ken_mosher@sterling.com (Ken Mosher)      

Lines: 30
Message-Id: <332hnt$mgs@sparky.sterling.com>
Nntp-Posting-Host: mac-119.itd.sterling.com
X-Posted-From: InterNews 1.0.1@mac-119.itd.sterling.com
Xdisclaimer: No attempt was made to authenticate the sender's name.

About a week ago, I asked for anyone who wants to sell their
obsolete/cheap laptop/notebook computer in the comp.sys.laptops forum. 
I figure that the automotive groups might also be appropriate.

The use will be to run an automotive monitor hardware/software package
that we developed (TurboLink) that hooks up to the ECM on the Buick
turbo cars.  It doesn't have to be anything fancy ... just a basic
compatible.

At a minimum we need:

XT or accelerated 8086/8088, ,80286, AT, V20/30 machine, etc.
512K memory
100% compatible parallel port
2 floppy drives or (preferably a small harddrive)
Standard BIOS

Prefer DOS V3.0 or higher.

I've already purchased a nice little Toshiba 10 MHZ 8086 T1200 with 1
Mb memory and 20 Mb HD that works great for ~$250 in response to my
first request ... I turned it over to the new owner last night and he's
very happy.

I'm looking for computers in the $150-$300 price range (I'm not marking
them up, just passing them on to the people for what I buy them for). 
Thanks!

[ I have a friend that runs Dataterm in Woburn, MA.  They have
all sorts of obsolete stuff, cheap.  Want a brand new Teletype Model 33?
How about some full height 5 Mb drives? Somebody might, and occasionall
does.  You might call him at 617 938 1010.  --FEP ]


Ken Mosher (ken_mosher@sterling.com)
Buick Grand National: "... A *BOOST* of Buick Performance! ..."



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug 22 05:52:22 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: No Subject Line

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 22 1994 01:22:03
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>From hotrod@dsea.com

This is what will become a periodic posting of the charter of the hotrod
mailing list.  With all the new participants  we are picking up from
the alt.hotrod group, many have probably not seen this.  It is automatically
posted twice a month, on the 1st and on the 15th.

I wrote the charter in consultation with several people who helped get the
list going.  It has changed several times over the about 2 years the list
has been going.  If you think there needs to be another change, then
by all means bring it up for discussion.  My experience has been that 
most people don't seem to care a whole lot about the charter so 
I try to seek a consensus among those who do.

John
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From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug 22 14:11:41 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: New GM reverse cooling stuff?   

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 22 1994 09:22:03
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>From lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu (Jonathan R. Lusky)     

Hotrod List writes:
> >From khamar@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu (Kyle Hamar)      
> 
> The LT1 is cooled (by water of course) but in a reverse direction from
> normal. This is claimed to reduce pre-ignition and increase the allowed
> performance of a given fuel.
 
Yep, keep those combustion chambers cool and you can run more
compression.

> Other than being a nightmare to bleed air from, is this the cooling scheme
> of the future for 350 cu in GM engines? If this a worth while adventure in
> cooling hotrods? 

I don't know how well it'd work as a retrofit.  I think Brodix sells a
package to do it with some of their heads using a tradition block.

-- 
Jonathan R. Lusky  --  lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu
 "Turbos are nice but I'd rather be blown!"
    68 Camaro Convertible - 350 / TH350
       80 Toyota Celica - 20R / 5spd


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug 22 15:54:30 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Joule Notations      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 22 1994 09:28:25
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> We do not know how FAST the coil dumps its charge, so we cannot
-> answer your question:

-> > So is 90 mj a hot coil or a wimpy one?

 I don't know how fast the coil works.  Obviously in less time than it
takes to complete a power stroke at redline.  Isn't the coil's output
also related to how long the primary side is energized?  I thought that
was why spark energy fell off at higher RPM.
                                          


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Mon Aug 22 17:41:31 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Electric Hotrods (part 2)     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Monday, Aug 22 1994 09:34:44
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>From Luis Maclean       


As a follow up to the postings a six weeks ago I would like to briefly say the
following.

If you like midget racing and were watching TV on Thursday night on ESPN you
probably saw the OSU Electric race car WIN the electric race car event. Yes we
beat "The team to beat", Notre Dame. Contrary to what ESPN reported, We (#2
qualifier) lead the race from flag to flag!

Bob Hale, it felt GREAT!!! After such a miserable time in Cleveland in early
July with all those problems and failures, (ie. snapped half shaft at start of
race) it was great to be ready enough to go in and fine tune and make other
last minute changes that made it possible to win.

Gloating mode off:
Technical mode on:

The race was 15 laps around a 5/8 mile oval track. It lasted less than eight
minutes with an average speed of about 85 mph and a top speed of about 102mph.
The car weighed in at 2748 pounds. (HEAVY) 1000+ which is attributable to
batteries.


(Frank and fellow netters,
Although this is an electric 'hotrod' I feel that Electric Vehicles do not
generate sufficient interest to warrant many postings here, at least for the
moment. I don't expect to report much else here unless there is a greater
interest in EV's)

Thanks for the opportunity to gloat ;-).

Luis
lmaclean@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug 23 18:10:49 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Reverse cooling      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 23 1994 12:22:03
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>From OADDAB@STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV (DIRK BROER)      


>Other than being a nightmare to bleed air from, is this the cooling scheme
>of the future for 350 cu in GM engines? If this a worth while adventure in
>cooling hotrods? 
>
>Or, is this just new to me?
>
>[ "Reverse flow" has been around for a while, and does provide the
>coolest water where it is needed -- the heads.  As far as I know, the 
>LT1 is the first of the "GEN II" smallblocks, and is expected to be
>the way things will be in the future.  -- FEP ]

I noticed that Brodix makes a reverese cooling system.  I saw it in one of 
their ads in Cricle Track.  Looks like it comes with a "manifold" that 
attaches to each of the heads.  I guess watter is pumped into this 
"manifold" into the heads - then into the block - I guess out the front.

No indication on price.  I suspect aluminum heads would be easier to modify 
than cast iron.  Hmmm, good reason?  "But honey, I need aluminum, $1000 
cylinder heads so that the engine cooling works better..."

Dirk


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug 23 21:06:27 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: RE: O-ringing       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 23 1994 12:28:25
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>From derek_deeter@MENTORG.COM (Derek Deeter)      



>>It was more a question of curiosity than anything else.  It's so easy
>>to O-ring a block, and you don't have to glue the rings down to put the
>>heads on.  I can't see any advantages to O-ringing the heads as opposed
>>to the block, and it looks like doing the heads would be a ripping pain
>>in the ass.

From one who has had this done (to a head for a turbocharged application):

I don't know how the machine shop did it, but they didn't seem to have
any problem centering the O-ring groove on the head.  Having this done
to the head is much easier than removing the block if you don't have to.
The groove they made was square in cross-section, and was just a hair less
wide than 16 guage (or was it 18? I can't remember exactly). Basically, 
you got some 16 guage copper wire, and gently tapped it into the groove 
with a small hammer.  This would keep it in place on the head, no problem.  
Worked like a charm, and it was very easy to replace the wire when the 
head came off for any reason.

-- 
Derek Deeter                           derekd@wv.mentorg.com
                               


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug 23 22:34:22 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Joule Notations      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 23 1994 12:34:49
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>From khamar@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu (Kyle Hamar)      


>-> We do not know how FAST the coil dumps its charge, so we cannot
>-> answer your question:
>
>-> > So is 90 mj a hot coil or a wimpy one?
>
> I don't know how fast the coil works.  Obviously in less time than it
>takes to complete a power stroke at redline.  Isn't the coil's output
>also related to how long the primary side is energized?  I thought that
>was why spark energy fell off at higher RPM.

We are trying to find a simple answer to a complicated question. The
detailed and more exact answer will be found by accurate measurement of many
things; electrical characteristics of the coil, wires, and plugs are very
important.

This "joule rating" of coils may be misleading. I propose that a better
rating for coils is efficiency. 

For instance, let us assume that a given coil is perfectly %100 efficient at
converting a 12V input to 20,000V over some charge/discharge time. If the
energy delivered is 1 watt over a time of 1 second, the coil has delivered 1
joule of energy. So, it is obvious that the joule rating is directly related
to the time the coil takes to expend the charge. If the coil dumps all of
its charge in 0.001s, a 90 mJ coil has delivered 90 Watts, assuming that the
coil can deliver all of its charge in this time. If the coil is a perfect
conductor (!) it will deliver a hotter spark with a faster delivery time...
which leads to my question.

How do you most accurately measure the optimal spark delivery time? It is
NOT desirable for the coil to dump all of its charge in 1 ns, just before
TDC but to do so in a length of time near TDC. 

Any comments?

---
Kyle Hamar
khamar@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 24 00:47:12 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: yet more electric hotrods     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 23 1994 12:41:13
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>From Jeff Deifik       

My friend alan coconni, has a new motor and controller available.
The old one was 100kw (~134hp). The new one is 150kw (~200hp). His testbed
vehicle does 0-60 in 6 seconds, and has performance otherwise the same as his
100kw motor and controller (100 mile + range, 110 mph top speed, $ 40k for a
motor and controller). With traction control enabled he can still leave
rubber from 0-40 mph, and under certain conditions to 60 mph. Production
vehicles will have more weight on the front wheels...

	Jeff turbo Deifik	turbo@isi.edu


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 24 01:57:23 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Electric Hotrods (part 2)    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 23 1994 12:47:36
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>From Ron Rader aka PTM     

>Although this is an electric 'hotrod' I feel that Electric Vehicles do not
>generate sufficient interest to warrant many postings here

  Horse pucky.  I haven't ever messed with electric vehicles, yet find
your posts very interesting.  I move to allow EV threads, just so long
as there is some 'high performance' angle.

  Ron "Lead Acid" Rader


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 24 21:09:56 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Joule Notations      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 24 1994 17:22:03
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>From yarvin-norman@CS.YALE.EDU (Norman Yarvin)      

Kyle Hamar writes:
>We are trying to find a simple answer to a complicated question. The
>detailed and more exact answer will be found by accurate measurement of many
>things; electrical characteristics of the coil, wires, and plugs are very
>important.

Hmm, an academic.  :-)

Coils act more or less like ideal inductors until the core saturates,
the wiring burns out, or whatever.  At that limiting current the coil
is storing some fixed amount of energy.  Just about all of this energy
is delivered into the spark gap.  Delivery time and such may be somewhat
important but just knowing the total energy gets you a huge way toward
knowing what the coil will do, i.e. how well it will ignite the fuel.


>This "joule rating" of coils may be misleading. I propose that a better
>rating for coils is efficiency. 

The energy expenditure involved is trivial compared to the energy the
engine generates.  Let's run some numbers:

The power the coil provides is

	90 millijoules * 4000 rpm * 8 cylinders / 2 rev per spark
		= 1440 joules/minute / 60 minutes/sec
		= 24 joules/sec = 24 watts.

compared with the engine power at

	200 hp * 1492/2 hp/watt = 149200 watts

So even if that coil took four times as much energy to charge as the 90
mj it provides on discharge, the energy waste would still be
insignificant.


--
Norman Yarvin						yarvin@cs.yale.edu
 "There's no sense in being precise when you don't even know
  what you're talking about." -- John von Neumann


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Thu Aug 25 01:08:47 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: On vacation for a few    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 24 1994 17:28:30
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>From frank@rebel (Frank Evan Perdicaro)     



I'll be climbing the eastern face of the highest peak in the lower 48
this Friday, Saturday, Sunday, and Monday.  The list will be on automatic,
and will likely be slow.

We have a signed PO for a direct, full-time Internet connection, so
within the next few months this list should go "live".  Stay tuned.

Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug 30 18:00:55 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Joule Notations      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 30 1994 12:28:41
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>From dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams)      


-> We are trying to find a simple answer to a complicated question. The
-> detailed and more exact answer will be found by accurate measurement
-> of many things; electrical characteristics of the coil, wires, and
-> plugs are very important.

 I can probably come up with these values, given a little time.
Howevever, shouldn't they be relatively constant between cars?


-> This "joule rating" of coils may be misleading. I propose that a
-> better rating for coils is efficiency.

 The normal rating for coils is volts.  20 Kv, 30 Kv, or 40 Kv seem to
be the most common.  The joule rating was new to me, and is apparently
not often used.


-> How do you most accurately measure the optimal spark delivery time?
-> It is NOT desirable for the coil to dump all of its charge in 1 ns,

 I know, as general information, that it takes a finite time for the
field to collapse, and that it's possible to run ordinary coils up
against the limit with one coil servicing eight cylinders.  Back when a
coil was just a coil, Roto-Faze, Mallory, etc. made dual coil
distributors.  Then someone figured out how to wind a coil that would
collapse faster, and everyone went back to one coil in the late '60s,
except for F1 and some other stuff, which went to one coil per
cylinder or pair of cylinders.

 Back twenty years ago or so Gordon Jennings did a multi-part coil and
ignition system article for Cycle Magazine.  Jennings is a mechanical
engineer, formerly editor of Road & Track, at that time technical editor
for Cycle.  I need to dig those articles up, but he had rigged up a
bunch of equipment to measure voltage, rise time, waveform, and that
sort of stuff.  His conclusion was that rise time and waveform had
detectable effects on the ignition process, but the primary requirement
was for *power.*  His comment was, more or less, "sparks that strike
like bolts of lightning are good; sparks like flipping a BIC in a dark
hangar are bad."  Now, this must be qualified as being with relation to
old-style motorcycle ignition systems, which were notoriously weak.


-> NOT desirable for the coil to dump all of its charge in 1 ns, just
-> before TDC but to do so in a length of time near TDC.

 I wouldn't mind a continuous spark from the initiation of the spark
through about 90 degrees of crankshaft rotation.  Practically, this
would probably burn out the spark plug in a short period of time.
                                                                                           


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug 30 19:11:16 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Electric Hotrods (part 2)    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 30 1994 12:35:26
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>From Luis Maclean       

> >From Ron Rader aka PTM 
>
> >Although this is an electric 'hotrod' I feel that Electric Vehicles do not
> >generate sufficient interest to warrant many postings here
>
>   Horse pucky.  I haven't ever messed with electric vehicles, yet find
> your posts very interesting.  I move to allow EV threads, just so long
> as there is some 'high performance' angle.
>
>   Ron "Lead Acid" Rader

Thanks for the support. I may post some performance data if we ever get an
opportunity to determine our 0-60 0-100 and maybe 1/4 mile times. The 0-60 is
quite good for this car, depending on which gears we have installed. But we
believe it is somewhere around 4.5 - 5 seconds based on some simulations we ran
and seat of the pants driving.

Thanks again

Luis
lmaclean@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug 30 19:49:31 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Welding a cast iron manifold   

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 30 1994 12:22:04
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>From hgoalie@aol.com (HGoalie)       

In article , hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List) writes:

I saw in one of the major hotrod magazines, a new style of torch head that
allows for the welding of cast iron.  It uses a squeeze bulb type device
to inject a powdered silver solder like material into the area being
heated.  This device is intended for do it yourself use as well as pros.
Sorry I don't have any specifics at this time.


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug 30 20:26:03 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Joule Notations      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 30 1994 13:22:03
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>From khamar@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu (Kyle Hamar)      

>
>The energy expenditure involved is trivial compared to the energy the
>engine generates.  Let's run some numbers:
>
>

I was trying to compare type of coils! Not coil vs. total engine output...
or whatever apples and oranges...

Does anyone have enough EE background to calculate the saturation time for a
typical coil with 12V? What I mean is how much time is required to saturate
a typical coil with 12V after each spark?

This should give us an upper limit for RPM if nothing else...

Do the higher RPM range of motorcycle engines (and racing engines in
general) require a different type of ignition? 12,000 - 15,000 RPM is not
uncommon.
---
Kyle Hamar
khamar@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Tue Aug 30 21:19:52 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Returned mail: Service unavailable     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 30 1994 16:22:02
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>From MAILER-DAEMON (Mail Delivery Subsystem)     

   ----- Transcript of session follows -----
While talking to dsea.dsea.com:
>>> RCPT To:<@dsea.dsea.com:chris.clark@hightech>
<<< 554 <@dsea.dsea.com:chris.clark@hightech>... Never heard of hightech in domain dsea . com
554 chris.clark@hightech... Service unavailable

   ----- Unsent message follows -----
Received: by challenge.dsea.com (931110.SGI/930416.SGI)
	for @dsea.dsea.com:chris.clark@hightech id AA10022; Tue, 30 Aug 94 12:41:52 -0700
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 94 12:41:52 -0700
From: hotrod (Hotrod List)
Message-Id: <9408301941.AA10022@challenge.dsea.com>
To: chris.clark@hightech
Subject: Re: Electric Hotrods (part 2)    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 30 1994 12:35:26
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>From Luis Maclean       

> >From Ron Rader aka PTM 
>
> >Although this is an electric 'hotrod' I feel that Electric Vehicles do not
> >generate sufficient interest to warrant many postings here
>
>   Horse pucky.  I haven't ever messed with electric vehicles, yet find
> your posts very interesting.  I move to allow EV threads, just so long
> as there is some 'high performance' angle.
>
>   Ron "Lead Acid" Rader

Thanks for the support. I may post some performance data if we ever get an
opportunity to determine our 0-60 0-100 and maybe 1/4 mile times. The 0-60 is
quite good for this car, depending on which gears we have installed. But we
believe it is somewhere around 4.5 - 5 seconds based on some simulations we ran
and seat of the pants driving.

Thanks again

Luis
lmaclean@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 31 15:48:24 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Re: Joule Notations      

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 31 1994 09:22:03
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>From khamar@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu (Kyle Hamar)      

>-> NOT desirable for the coil to dump all of its charge in 1 ns, just
>-> before TDC but to do so in a length of time near TDC.
>
> I wouldn't mind a continuous spark from the initiation of the spark
>through about 90 degrees of crankshaft rotation.  Practically, this
>would probably burn out the spark plug in a short period of time.
>


This is EXACTLY my point! A massive amount of energy in the shortest
possible time is not the perfect system.

Perhaps we are suggesting that someone test *long* spark ignition times to
determine effect on performance. Hopefully someone has done this.

---
Kyle Hamar
khamar@mailhost.tcs.tulane.edu



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 31 16:21:16 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Bolt/Stud Removal Via Vibrating Wire?    

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 31 1994 09:29:02
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>From sdarcy@gigli.medicine.rochester.edu (Sean J. Roc D'Arcy)    

Hi All,

I just recently got one of my manifolds back from the 
machine shop and they could not remove one of the broken
studs (it has an extractor broken off in it therefore 
eliminating the possibility of drilling it out).  

They suggested going to a place that uses a vibrating
wire (or something akin to this) that will supposedly
break up the iron stud and leave the aluminum part
unharmed.  Can anyone comment on this technology or
suggest anywhere to reference such a beastie?

[ This sounds vaguly like EDM, Electric Discharge Machining. 
EDM is effective in situations like this, but slow and somewhat
expensive.  An electrode is positioned and repeatedly makes 
contact with what is to be removed.  Eventually the stud is 
worn away.  You might look in the yellow pages for a shop
to do this.   --FEP ]

Thanks again,

SJRD



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 31 17:08:25 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: TV: *Televised Events #94-32*     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 31 1994 09:36:03
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>From stoffel@oasys.dt.navy.mil (Bill Stoffel)      

        dans%rehab1@canal.org, andrew.marold@analog.com, cjs@phy.duke.edu,
        trujillo@mers17.me.utexas.edu, Louis@usl.edu, cmorken@ua.d.umn.edu,
        mark.mccrimmon@drd.com, gwalker@rtfm.mlb.fl.us, m1cms01@FRB.GOV,
        geoff@softy.softwords.bc.ca, cagan@sca.com, rose@delmarva.com,
        Howard.Ledford@f69.n110.z1.fidonet.org, GeorgeB@mhv.net,
        jstone@iglou.com, ktk@enterprise.bih.harvard.edu,
        D.SOREL@GENIE.GEIS.COM, sastzh@vm.sas.com, jparrish@ssl.umd.edu,
        jerryp@halcyon.com, barlow-cj@clavin.med.ge.com,
        gloria-aagaard@cornell.edu, usga@pool.info.sunyit.edu,
        ademsey@ocnext.drg.nih.gov, tom_weaver@vos.stratus.com,
        rtener@netcom.netcom.com, georgios@utpapa.ph.utexas.edu,
        jfuerstenberg@zz-link.dcmdc.dla.mil, Tim.Bailer@aplmail.jhuapl.edu,
        kenneyp@aol.com, jimw@microsoft.com, bherrick@aol.com,
        cs.arizona.edu!modular!chan, krichmon@dgbat02.er.usgs.gov

----------------------------------------------------------------------
			       TV Events

Now in its third year of weekly publication, TVE is a compilation of 
info. gleaned from TV listings, auto mags., newspapers, tea leaves, my 
favorite bartender, and the nice folks at TNN.  A special thanks also to 
Curt Swinehart for providing me with info. on the many regional sports 
networks.  PLEASE confirm dates and times with your local listings 
before setting your VCRs.

TVE will USUALLY be updated no later than every Friday morning and will 
be most accurate (or least inaccurate) for the following 7 days. If your 
favorite event is "tba'd", please don't panic unless it's in the 7 day 
window.

As mentioned previously, this listing is now being submitted to the new 
group rec.autos.sport.info.  Assuming the moderators approve, this list 
will be available in the r.a.s.i group from now on.  In an attempt to 
get the word to as many r.a.s readers as possible, I will continue to 
cross-post to r.a.s for a short time. (This again assumes the moderators 
of r.a.s.i do not object to my doing so.)

Thanks to EMI Communications, TVE listings are available from
http://www.emi.com/tve.html where they will be archived for an 
indeterminate period of time.

If you are having trouble with this list arriving at your site in
a timely fashion, please let me know via e-mail and I will also start
mailing you a copy.

Comments, suggestions, additions, extra pit passes, etc. to:
					  stoffel@oasys.dt.navy.mil

		   ---------------------------------

(T)=Taped  (L)=Live  (SD)=Same Day  (?)=dunno

12:00AM = 0000 hours = start of day

    EVENT                             DATE  TIME(Eastern, USA) NETWORK*

NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         08/26    12:00PM          EMPS,
				HSE,HTS,KBL,MSG,PASS,PRTK,PSN,SCP,SUN
NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         08/26    2:00PM           SCNE
AMA SUPERBIKES (T)                    08/26    3:00PM           NESN
MotoWorld                             08/26    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN2
AMA SUPERBIKES (T)                    08/26    7:00PM           MSG
BUSCH GN, BRISTOL (L)                 08/26    7:30-9:30PM      ESPN
AMA SUPERBIKES (T)                    08/26    9:30PM         PASS,SUN
NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         08/26    10:00PM         KBL,SCC
MotoWorld                             08/27    2:30-3:00AM      ESPN2
Best Of 1994 AMA Supercross           08/27    9:00AM           ESPN2
Shadetree Mechanic (AC systems)       08/27    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
MotorWeek                             08/27    10:00-10:30AM    WGN
Hot Rod 2                             08/27    10:00-10:30AM    ESPN2
NHRA, PRO BIKE CHALLENGE (T)          08/27    10:30AM          ESPN2
NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         08/27    12:00PM          EMPS,
						    PASS,PSN,SCNE,SCOH
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              08/27    2:00-2:30PM      TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      08/27    2:30-3:00PM      TNN
PORSCHE SUPERCUP, GERMANY (T)         08/27    3:00PM           ESPN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               08/27    3:00-3:30PM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              08/27    3:30-4:00PM      TNN
HYDROPLANE RACING, SEATTLE (T)        08/27    3:30-4:30PM      ESPN
NASCAR, FAYS 150, WATKINS GLEN (T)    08/27    4:00-5:30PM      TNN
NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         08/27    4:00PM           ESPN2
MotorWeek                             08/27    5:00-5:30PM      MPT
SATURDAY NIGHT LIGHTNING (T)          08/27    5:00PM           ESPN2
SpeedWeek                             08/27    6:30-7:00PM      ESPN
Hot Rod 2                             08/27    7:00-7:30PM      ESPN2
WINSTON CUP, BRISTOL (L)              08/27    7:30-11:00PM     ESPN
NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         08/27    8:30PM           PSNW
AMA MOTOCROSS (T)                     08/27    10:30PM          ESPN2
NASCAR Shop Talk                      08/27    11:00-11:30PM    ESPN
NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         08/27    11:00PM          PSN2
In The Driver's Seat                  08/27   11:30PM-12:00AM   ESPN2
IHRA, SPORTSMAN SERIES (T)            08/28    12:00AM          ESPN2
MotorWeek                             08/28    12:35-1:05AM     WJZ
IHRA,MID-AMERICA NATIONALS,SCRIBNER(T)08/28    1:00-2:00AM      ESPN
MotoWorld                             08/28    2:30-3:00AM      ESPN
BLUBLOCKER 100 (T)                    08/28    3:00AM           ESPN2
NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         08/28    3:00-4:00AM      ESPN
NASCAR, FOOD CITY 250, BRISTOL (T)    08/28    4:00-6:00AM      ESPN
SpeedWeek                             08/28    7:30-7:50AM      ESPN
FORMULA 1, BELGIUM (L)                08/28    7:50-10:00AM ESPN,TSN,
								 RDS [1]
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               08/28    9:00-9:30AM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              08/28    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
Neil Bonnett's Winners (Rusty & Harry)08/28    10:00-10:30AM    TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              08/28    10:30-11:00AM    TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      08/28    11:00-11:30AM    TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           08/28   11:30AM-12:00PM   TNN
NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         08/28    2:30PM           SUN
Neil Bonnett's Winners (Rusty & Harry)08/28    2:30-3:00PM      TNN
ASA, BADGERLAND 150, MILWAUKEE (L)    08/28    3:00-5:30PM      TNN
NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         08/28    4:00PM         HSE,SPTS
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               08/28    5:30-6:00PM      TNN
NHRA, CHAMPION NATIONALS, BRAINERD (T)08/28    6:00-7:00PM      ESPN
Trucks And Tractor Power              08/28    6:00-6:30PM      TNN
Shadetree Mechanic (AC systems)       08/28    7:00-7:30PM      TNN
AMA SUPERBIKES (T)                    08/28    7:00PM           SCP
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (SD)        08/28    7:30-9:30PM      EMPS,
			    HTS,PASS,PSN,PSN2,PSNW,SCNE,SCOH,SPTS,SUN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              08/28    7:30-8:00PM      TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      08/28    8:00-8:30PM      TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           08/28    8:30-9:00PM      TNN
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (SD)        08/28    10:30PM          HSE
Road Test Magazine w/Don Garlits      08/28    11:00-11:30PM    TNN
RaceDay Update w/Pat Patterson (L)    08/29    12:00-12:05AM    TNN
American Sports Cavalcade             08/29    12:05-1:30AM     TNN
FORMULA 1, BELGIUM (T)                08/29    12:30-2:00AM     ESPN
Trucks And Tractor Power              08/29    1:30-2:00AM      TNN
WINSTON CUP, BRISTOL (T)              08/29    3:00-5:00AM      ESPN
Hot Rod 2                             08/29    3:00-3:30AM      ESPN2
NHRA, PRO BIKE CHALLENGE (T)          08/29    3:30AM           ESPN2
AMA SUPERBIKES, SONOMA (T)            08/29    4:00-5:00AM      EMPS,
					HTS,KBL,MSG,PASS,PSN,SCNE,SCP
IHRA, SPORTSMAN SERIES, STEELE (T)    08/29    5:00-5:30AM      ESPN
WINSTON CUP, BRISTOL (T)              08/29    1:00-3:00PM      ESPN
IOGP POWERBOATS, PITTSBURG (T)        08/29    4:30-5:00PM      HTS
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (T)         08/30    12:30AM          SCC
AMA SUPERCROSS, BUDDS CREEK (T)       08/30    1:00-2:00AM      ESPN
IOGP POWERBOATS, PITTSBURG (T)        08/30    1:00-1:30AM      HTS
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (T)         08/30    1:30AM           PRTK
INDY LIGHTS, LOUDON (T)               08/30    2:00-2:30AM      ESPN
Speed Racer (cartoon)                 08/30    3:30-4:00AM      MTV
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (T)         08/30    4:00AM           HSE
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (T)         08/30    1:00PM           PRTK
SATURDAY NIGHT LIGHTNING (T)          08/30    1:00PM           ESPN2
IHRA,MID-AMERICA NATIONALS,SCRIBNER(T)08/30    1:00-2:00PM      ESPN
HYDROPLANE RACING, TRI-CITIES (T)     08/30    2:00-3:00PM      ESPN
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (T)         08/30    2:00PM           SUN
Movie: Grand Prix                     08/30    6:00-9:00PM      ENC
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (T)         08/30    7:30PM           SCNY
SUMMER LEGENDS SERIES (L)             08/30    8:00PM           SPTS
1994 AMA Supercross Highlights        08/30    10:00-10:30PM    ESPN
SHELBY PRO SERIES, CHARLOTTE (T)      08/30    10:00PM          SPTS
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (T)         08/30    11:00PM        SCP,SPTS
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (T)         08/31    12:00AM          SCNY
IOGP POWERBOATS, PITTSBURG (T)        08/31    2:30-3:00AM      HTS
NHRA, CHAMPION NATIONALS, BRAINERD (T)08/31    3:30-4:30AM      ESPN
Speed Racer (cartoon)                 08/31    3:30-4:00AM      MTV
SCCA, WATKINS GLEN INTERNATIONAL (T)  08/31    4:30-5:30AM      ESPN
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (T)         08/31    9:00AM           SCNY
Phoenix 500 Air Races & Fly-In        08/31    1:00-2:00PM      ESPN
IHRA, SPRING NATIONALS (T)            08/31    3:00-3:30PM      ESPN2
In The Driver's Seat                  08/31    3:30-4:00PM      ESPN2
MotoWorld                             08/31    5:00-5:30PM      ESPN
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (T)         08/31    10:00PM          KBL
IOGP POWERBOATS, PITTSBURG (T)        09/01    12:30-1:00AM     HTS
Speed Racer (cartoon)                 09/01    3:30-4:00AM      MTV
HYDROPLANE RACING, SEATTLE (T)        09/01    4:00-5:00AM      ESPN
NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         09/01    7:30-8:30PM      HTS
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (L)    09/01    8:00-9:00PM      EMPS,
			  KBL,PASS,PSN,PSN2,SCC,SCNE,SCOH,SCP,SPTS,SUN
MotorWeek (GMC Yukon)                 09/01    8:30-9:00PM      MPT
Race Line                             09/01    8:30PM           HTS
Motorcycle Madness                    09/01    10:00-11:00PM    QVC
NHRA, NORTHWEST NATIONALS (T)         09/01    11:30PM          SPTS
Speed Racer (cartoon)                 09/02    3:30-4:00AM      MTV
GREAT AMERICAN RACE (T)               09/02    1:00-2:00PM      ESPN
SCCA, TRANS AM, BRASELTON (T)         09/03    3:00AM           EMPS,
					     KBL,MSG,PASS,PSN,SCNE,SCP

		  ----------COMING EVENTS----------

BUSCH GN, DARLINGTON (?)              09/03    tba              tba
SAAB PRO SERIES, NHIS (T)             09/04    1:30-2:00AM      ESPN
WINSTON CUP, DARLINGTON (L)           09/04    1:00PM           ESPN
INDYCAR, VANCOUVER (SD)               09/04    9:00-11:00PM     ESPN [1]
NHRA, US NATIONALS, CLERMONT (?)      09/05    tba              tba
BUSCH GN, RICHMOND (?)                09/09    tba              tba
WINSTON CUP, RICHMOND (L)             09/10    7:30PM           TBS
FORMULA 1, ITALY (L)                  09/11    8:50-11:00AM ESPN,TSN,
								 RDS [1]
INDYCAR, ELKART LAKE (L)              09/11    1:30-4:00PM      ESPN [1]
ASA, MICHIGAN (L)                     09/11    tba              TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      09/14   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      09/15   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      09/16   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
BUSCH GN, DOVER (?)                   09/17    tba              tba
BRIDGESTONE SUPERCAR, SEBRING (T)     09/17    4:30PM           ESPN2
NHRA, US NATIONALS, INDIANAPOLIS (T)  09/17    5:00PM           NBC
PORSCHE CUP, HUNGARY (T)              09/18    1:00AM           ESPN
WINSTON CUP, DOVER (L)                09/18    12:10PM          TNN
INDYCAR, NAZARETH (L)                 09/18    1:00-3:00PM      ESPN [1]
NHRA, KEYSTONE NATIONALS MOHNTON (?)  09/18    tba              tba
SAAB PRO SERIES, ELKHART LAKE (T)     09/24    1:30-2:00AM      ESPN
BRIDGESTONE SUPERCAR, LONG BEACH (T)  09/24    4:30-5:00PM      ESPN2
FIRESTONE FIREHAWK, SEBRING (T)       09/24    5:00-5:30PM      ESPN2
FORMULA 1, PORTUGAL (L)               09/25    8:50-11:00AM  TSN,RDS [1]
WINSTON CUP, MARTINSVILLE (L)         09/25    12:30PM          ESPN
FORMULA 1, PORTUGAL (T)               09/26    12:00-2:00AM     ESPN
PORSCHE CUP, BELGIUM (T)              09/28    1:00AM           ESPN
FIRESTONE FIREHAWK, ATLANTA (T)       10/01    5:00-5:30PM      ESPN2
WINSTON CUP, N. WILKESBORO (L)        10/02    1:00PM           ESPN
NHRA, NATIONALS, TOPEKA (?)           10/02    tba              tba
IMSA, WSC SERIES, PHOENIX (T)         10/02    9:00-11:00PM     ESPN

[1] CBC also carries all F1 and most IndyCar races.  The races are 
usually broadcast on a tape-delayed basis at 11:37PM ET on the evening 
following the race.  I understand that it is not uncommon for CBC to 
delay the broadcast as much as an hour beyond the 11:37PM start, so 
please use extra caution if you plan to tape the race.  If you have 
access to it, and your French isn't too rusty, you may also want to 
check out RDS.  RDS broadcasts every F1 race and most IndyCar races, and 
their F1 coverage usually also includes a 30 minute prerace show.  RDS 
and TSN generally use the ESPN feed, while CBC generally uses the BBC 
feed.  The exception to these rules is the Canadian Grand Prix.  Only 
CBC and SRC have the rights to the Canadian GP.  Thanks to Pierre 
Mailhot and Tak Ariga for info. on coverage in Canada.

* Network Designations

A&E      Arts & Entertainment Network
AMC      American Movie Classics
CBC      Canadian Broadcasting Corporation
EMPS     Regional Sports Network (New York)
ENC      Encore
ESPN     ESPN Sports Network
ESPN2    ESPN Sports Network 2
HBO      Home Box Office
HSE      Regional Sports Network (Houston)
HTS      Regional Sports Network (Baltimore & DC)
KBL      Regional Sports Network (Pittsburg)
MAX      Cinemax
MPT      Maryland Public TV
MSC      Midwest Sports Channel
MSG      Madison Square Garden
MTV      Music(?) Television
PASS     Regional Sports Network (Detroit)
PRTK     Regional Sports Network (LA)
PSN      Prime Sports Network
PSN2     Prime Sports Network (Midwest & Mountains)
PSNW     Prime Sports Network (Northwest)
QVC      home shopping
RDS      Radio Des Sports (Canada - French)
SCC      Sports Channel Chicago
SCNE     Sports Channel New England
SCNY     Sports Channel New York
SCOH     Sports Channel Ohio
SCP      Sports Channel Pacific
SHOW     Showtime
SPTS     Sport South Network
SRC      Societe Radio-Canada (French)
SUN      Sunshine Network (Regional Sports Network, SE USA)
TBS      Atlanta "Super Station"
TNN      The Nashville Network
TSN      The Sports Network (Canada - English)
USA      USA Network
WBFF     Baltimore
WDCA     Washington, DC
WGN      Chicago "Super Station"
WJZ      Baltimore
WOR      New York "Super Station"
WRC      Washington, DC
-------


From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 31 17:59:38 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Bye y'all       

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 31 1994 09:43:09
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Approved: frank@dsea.com
>From jgd@dixie.com (John De Armond)     

Well guys, I'm out of here.  Dixie.com is about the only thing left in
my house.  It goes in a few minutes.  Everything else is in Cleveand,
TN in our new temporary quarters (until we get our school house).
I'll occasionally poll for my email but only irregularly since it is 
long distance.  

So I guess this is goodby for awhile.  If any of you are stroking
by cleveland on I-75, stop in and say hi.  I'm only a block off the 
Cleveland bypass (exits 20 or 25).  The BBQ and iced tea are always
fresh and the conversation scintillating :-)  My new address is:

2108 Blue Springs Road
Cleveland, TN 37311
615 479 7885

73 John



From challenge.dsea.com!hotrod@dsea.dsea.com Wed Aug 31 18:29:25 1994
From: hotrod@challenge.dsea.com (Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@ece.rutgers.edu
Subject: Returned mail: Service unavailable     

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Wednesday, Aug 31 1994 09:50:08
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>From MAILER-DAEMON (Mail Delivery Subsystem)     

   ----- Transcript of session follows -----
While talking to dsea.dsea.com:
>>> RCPT To:<@dsea.dsea.com:chris.clark@hightech>
<<< 554 <@dsea.dsea.com:chris.clark@hightech>... Never heard of hightech in domain dsea . com
554 chris.clark@hightech... Service unavailable

   ----- Unsent message follows -----
Received: by challenge.dsea.com (931110.SGI/930416.SGI)
	for @dsea.dsea.com:chris.clark@hightech id AA08260; Tue, 30 Aug 94 12:28:32 -0700
Date: Tue, 30 Aug 94 12:28:32 -0700
From: hotrod (Hotrod List)
Message-Id: <9408301928.AA08260@challenge.dsea.com>
To: chris.clark@hightech
Subject: Re: Welding a cast iron manifold   

Reply-to: hotrod@dsea.com
Posted-Date: Tuesday, Aug 30 1994 12:22:04
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>From hgoalie@aol.com (HGoalie)       

In article , hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List) writes:

I saw in one of the major hotrod magazines, a new style of torch head that
allows for the welding of cast iron.  It uses a squeeze bulb type device
to inject a powdered silver solder like material into the area being
heated.  This device is intended for do it yourself use as well as pros.
Sorry I don't have any specifics at this time.