From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun May  1 10:43:23 1994
Subject: ADMINISTRIVIA: Hotrod List Charter
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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This is what will become a periodic posting of the charter of the hotrod
mailing list.  With all the new participants  we are picking up from
the alt.hotrod group, many have probably not seen this.  It is automatically
posted twice a month, on the 1st and on the 15th.

I wrote the charter in consultation with several people who helped get the
list going.  It has changed several times over the about 2 years the list
has been going.  If you think there needs to be another change, then
by all means bring it up for discussion.  My experience has been that 
most people don't seem to care a whole lot about the charter so 
I try to seek a consensus among those who do.

John
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Posted by: hotrod@dixie.com
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 00:00:18 1994
Subject: Re: Plumbing my shop for air - questions on tubing
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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->  PVC might not hold up under 200lbs pressure.

 It says "400 PSI" right on the pipe.  If it fails at a mere 125 psi,
there's a whole infrastructure of consumer protection organizations just
waiting for a Cause.


-> Iron needs to be threaded.

 Which is a ripping pain in the ass, requiring rental, purchase, or
borrowing of tools, plus it's not real easy to bend iron pipe around to
fit it into the wall unless you bore a hole clear outside and run it in
thataway.
                                                                       

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Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 00:20:27 1994
Subject: Re: FW: Re: Re : The end is Near
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In article <1gc6-pr@dixie.com> hotrod@dixie.com writes:

>[The EFI system is pretty simple.  A dallas semi DS5000 hybrid supplies 
>all the smarts.  This is a pretty amazing part.  It contains an
>8052-like processor, ram, "rom" (battery-backed ram), timers, watchdog
>timer and some other goodies in a double height 40 pin dip.  It has
>3 8 bit I/O ports and a serial port.  Best of all, you program it
>by jinking several pins during power up and then pumping intel HEX
>records into the serial port.  when the END record is received,
>the chip reboots and starts running the program as if it were in
>ROM.  The remainder of the EFI consists of a simple 8 channel, 8 bit
>A/D converter and some driver transistors.

I like the sound of this part!  Is there a phone number for dallas semi?
And are cheap/free 8052 compilers/assemblers available?


Steve Ravet	sravet@bangate.compaq.com
"Baby you're a genius when it comes to cooking up some chili sauce...."

[My dallas stuff is all packed away but I recall they have an 800 
number.  They'll also sell to individuals via plastic.  Not a
bad outfit.  There's a blue shitload of free 8052 assemblers out
there.  I've been using one called PseudoAsm.  Mine's a commercial
product but I think the now distribute it shareware or something.
The reason I use it is to also be able to use PseudoSim, an 8052
simulator.  IT costs about $100.  I think they sell DS5000 
instruction set extensions separately.  A good shareware
C compiler is the Micro-C compiler by Steve (I think) Duncan.
Look on Simtel.  

Another option that should be given VERY serious consideration for
the DS5000 is the Systronix BASIC compiler.  Now pay attention and
don't shrivel that nose like the C bigot you are!  This is good
stuff.  assembler is seamlessly folded into the basic statements
and the basic itself is very powerful.  (I mean, do you REALLY 
enjoy codeing a loop control structure in assember for the Nth time?)
Even more important for DS5000 users, they've integrated the Dallas
extensions into the compiler.  About the only bitch I have with it
is the price - $299 - and the fact that I've never been able to
wedge a free evaluation copy outta them :-)  They're at 
801 487 7412.  JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!bangate.compaq.com!sravet
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 00:32:08 1994
Subject: Re: Headers
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8407
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For info on Doug Thorley, call Doug Thorley Headers in Corona, 
California.  Sorry, I don't have the phone number (Though I do have a set 
of Tri-Ys on the Camaro in the garage.  Be prepared, though.  They cost 
$250 five year ago!

John Hess
johnhess@indial1.io.com

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Posted by: emory!IO.COM!johnhess (John Hess)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 12:50:50 1994
Subject: 1964 Country Sedan (Hearse) by Ford
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8408
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*>>> Hi guys from sunny Oztrailya.

     I need something to finish off a 1964 Ford Galaxie Country Sedan.
     A hearse actually.
     289/C4 and sixties style (steels/baby moons, orig. body) but one
     elusive part has been unobtainable here for the last god knows how 
     many swap meets.
     The rear window winder assembly (with barrel and key would be good)
     I'm speaking external here not internal. The mechanism inside the
     tailgate is not nessesary just the handle/housing.
     Can anybody help me ? The car is a Canadian build like all our 50's
     and 60's big Fords were. The name may be different in North America
     but it was badged as a Galaxie here...and Country Sedan to boot.

     Please ?
     Geof Evans
     Bigfoot to my friends.

-- 
  ___________________________________________________________________  
|| Geof Evans                 | DOMAIN: rxkgre@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au  ||
||   If they *really* wanna know...tell 'em that God was drunk.      ||
  -------------------------------------------------------------------

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Posted by: emory!minyos.xx.rmit.EDU.AU!rxkgre (Geof Evans)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 13:59:23 1994
Subject: Headers for a tight fit ( 428 -> '69 Mustang ) 
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8409
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Well after spending all of Saturday trying to remove an engine from my 
friend's '69 Mustang - I dread the though of putting back together.

Here's the problem"

The car blew a head gasket - big time.

It is impossible to get the heads off with out getting the headers off 
first.  You can't get the headers out with out pulling the motor.  About 
the only way to pull the motor is to disassemble the front steering.  Even 
then tight fit is an understatement.

Question:
Was a 428 ever available in a '69 Mustang?  428 Medium riser.  Did they do 
something special with the shock towers (ala 429 Boss?).

What about headers?  This car was bought with Hooker Super Comps.  Every 
thing seemed to fit O.K. when driving down the road - but access to certain 
bolts, and starter motor is severly limited - not to mention header bolt 
problems.

Short of fiberglass lift of front end what would you suggest to make this 
install easier.

Things I have considered:
1) Drilling out the treads on some of the transmission mountings (esp 
starter motor) so that the bolt can be threaded in from the fire wall side 
with a nut on the engine side.  Bolt access was a major slow down.
2) Drilling access holes in the wheel well so that we can get at the header 
bolts.
3) custom headers.

Any suggestions or ideas or stories about how you got around a tight fir 
would be appriciated. 

The way we got the motor out was to separate the engine and trans.  Tilt 
the engine ~ 45 degress - with headers still attached - and then remove the 
trans.  Then with careful manuvering the engine cam out.  Since we didn't 
have a tie-rod fork the steering wasn't remove (and the air compressor 
wasn't working and we didn't feel like muscling the steering box and idler 
arm bolts...

Dirk

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Posted by: emory!STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV!OADDAB (DIRK BROER)
 



From rsiatl!hotrod Mon May  2 14:56:54 1994
Subject: Quest for F1 topics (fwd)
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8410
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Hi, 

	This stuff is great and I'm going to stay subscribed, brings 
	back many happy days of visits to our main liitle piece of concrete
	in UK, not to mention some street 1/4 mile grunts.

	For reasons you don't want to know, I know in THE desert of motor
	sport and fast cars, Singapore.  This is the place where they 
	scrapped plans for a circuit because of the {bad} influence motor
	racing would give its citizens.	

	I'd like to see some news about F1.  I haven't seen too much of
	F1 in here, so should I be looking in an another group.
	
Keep up the great work...



+---------------------------+-----------------------------------------------+
|  Shaun Martin             |                                               |
|  shaun.martin@swi.com.sg  |                                               |
|  SW Internaional Pte Ltd  |                                               |
|  Singapore 7780066        |                                               |
----------------------------+-----------------------------------------------+

[I will personally strangle anyone who brings any F1 pap to this list.
Rec.autos.sport is soggy with the stuff.  That's the place to look.  JGD]
----------
Posted by: "Shaun Martin" 
 



From rsiatl!hotrod Mon May  2 15:00:51 1994
Subject: DIY EFI system, how many interested?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8411
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

--------

   For sometime now I've been contemplating building my own EFI, and in fact
have drawn up schematics for maybe 50% of it.  I'm planing on a 68HC000 (now
ordering parts) with gcc as a cross compiler (up and running) on "my" work
station (should also work on PC running LINUX).  Currently, I have an old
Radio Shack model 100 laptop computer monitoring RPM, exhaust O2, and MAP.
Soon it will take over timing and provide "computer aided tuning" (I
hope). What I have so far is built into a card rack so changing CPU's or
adding hardware is easy.

   Much of my inspiration to this point can be attributed to the members of
the hotrod mailing list. In the event that this mailing list does come to an
end, I would like to know how may others would be interested in starting
another lower-volume mailing list that is concerned strictly with EFI design.
If interested, E-mail me at the address below.

                                       John S Gwynne
                                          Gwynne.1@osu.edu
_______________________________________________________________________________
               T h e   O h i o - S t a t e   U n i v e r s i t y
    ElectroScience Laboratory, 1320 Kinnear Road, Columbus, Ohio 43212, USA
                Telephone: (614) 292-7981 * Fax: (614) 292-7292
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------



----------
Posted by: John S Gwynne 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 17:36:12 1994
Subject: Re: 1964 Country Sedan (Hearse) by Ford
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8412
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
X-Comment: Send subscription and drop requests to hotrod-request@dixie.com
X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

> 
>      I need something to finish off a 1964 Ford Galaxie Country Sedan.
>      A hearse actually.
>      289/C4 and sixties style (steels/baby moons, orig. body) but one
>      elusive part has been unobtainable here for the last god knows how 
>      many swap meets.
>      The rear window winder assembly (with barrel and key would be good)
>      I'm speaking external here not internal. The mechanism inside the
>      tailgate is not nessesary just the handle/housing.
>      Can anybody help me ? The car is a Canadian build like all our 50's
>      and 60's big Fords were. The name may be different in North America
>      but it was badged as a Galaxie here...and Country Sedan to boot.
>      Please ?
>      Geof Evans
> 
Hi Geof,
I spent last Saturday in a junkyard looking for parts for my '63 Galaxie.
(Needed an armrest.) Just as I was about to give up, I looked behind an
old trailer and discovered...a '63 Country Squire station wagon with the
part I needed (and almost destroyed in the process of removing it).

Anyhow, I think it does have the external winder, but I'll have to check.
Also the '63 and '64 Galaxie was more or less the same car in the
U.S. I do know that some lines migrated to Australia a year or two later
and/or lasted longer than here.  But since you said that it was Canadian
built, I'll assume that it is an equivalent model.

Next trip out to the junkyard I'll see if it's what you need.

Hi to Anita.

--
Dave Tartaglia    indy@immacc.prepnet.com 

----------
Posted by: Dave Tartaglia 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 17:49:03 1994
Subject: Re: H20 injection
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8413
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In article , hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List) writes:
|> I too have had good result with water injection in my '66 Mustang with 
|> 10.5 CR.  I run 87 octane and never get a knock.  My system is quite 
|> refined to get the mixture ratios perfect yet, but it's getting close.  
|> I'd be curious to here the details of how yours is set up.  Let me know 
|> if you want me to discribe my home made system.  It cost me about $35 to 
|> build.
|> 
|> Chip Schweiss
|> lschweis@nyx.cs.du.edu
|> 
|> ----------
|> Posted by: emory!nyx10.cs.du.edu!lschweis (Lester Schweiss)

Sounds neat!  
How's it work?

$0.02 

EricY

----------
Posted by: (EricY)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 18:32:12 1994
Subject: Car Trailers
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8414
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In the Drag Racing list there has been some discussion on car trailers.

I was wondering does anyone have a source for top quality parts and 
perhaps even design of a car trailer.

I could grab axles and suspension from a FWD mini-van and perhaps lengthen 
them (the axles).  But I also know that a proper design is needed to keep 
the average load from swaying the trailer.  Short of finding a trailer that 
I like and taking measurements where can I look for info?

Hey, I know its a little off subject - but you have to haul those project 
cars around somehow...

Dirk

[Being deep in the process of building two trailers right now and having
built several others in the past, I can comment.  Getting the rear axle
of a FWD car or van is possible but you end up paying yourself oh, about
10 cents an hour while you work to adapt it.  By far the cheapest place
to get axles and other trailer hardware is Northern Hydraulics (800
533 5545.)  I have a store about a mile away so they are real handy
but they also do mail order.  When I had to look elsewhere for an axle
that northern was out of, everyone told me to just wait on them to restock
because no one else can compete with them and their chinese manufacturing
sources.  They also sell a book on trailer design.

In general, the industry has settled in on two classes of axles - 2000 lb
and 3500 lb.  The springs hubs, brakes and bearings are standardized 
to these classes.  Northern sells straight, dropped and sprung axles 
in each capacity.  

The BBQ smoker trailer I'm just finishing up weighs about 1500 lbs loaded.
Here's a rundown on what I used.

3500 lb axle               62.99
2000 lb leaf springs       32.99 set
3500 lb shackle kit        13.99
3500 lb u-bolt spring kit   9.99
3500 lb 5 bolt hubs        47.99
B78-13 tires and wheels    65.00 ea
Fenders                    19.99 ea
Hitch                       7.99
Lighting kit               34.00
Tongue jack                29.99

I constructed the trailer frame, as I usually do, from 2" X 3" X 0.120"
(thinwall) rectangular steel tubing.  This stuff is very strong, easy
to cut and weld and looks REAL good when painted.  I used 3 20' sticks
of this stuff on my BBQ trailer and it cost $128 from a very high priced
but handy local steel distributor.  Figure about 2/3 that from a large
distributor (Atlanta Steel recommended for Atl area people).  I decked it
with 11 ga diamond plate, the lightest commonly available in stock.
This stuff weighs 200 lbs a 4X8' sheet.  To give you an idea of how
strong a trailer can be, I have a flatbed trailer I built from a mobile
home axle over 10 years ago.  I once used it to haul an 8000 lb lead
radiation shield.  First time those mobile home springs had ever flexed :-)
but the trailer didn't.  I do all my welding with a DC arc welder and 
7018 rods.  I highly recommend MIG for this but I don't have one (sob!)
7018 is a low hydrogen rod which is very strong and welds well in
all directions but must be baked to remove any trapped moisture prior
to use.  

In terms of design, I roll my own, just using the basics of good
chassis design - triangulation and gusseting at the stress points.
In terms of balance, the rule of thumb is that about 10% of the load
weight should be on the tongue.  That is, for a 3000 lb trailer, put
about 300 lbs on the tongue.    How to do that, you say?  I do it
the old fashioned way - by hand.  I fabricate the frame of the 
trailer, lay it on the floor with 1" steel dowels under each side and then
load the trailer with what I expect to haul.  I then roll the frame back 
and forth on the dowels until my bathroom scales show the right
amount of tongue weight.  I mark that point on the frame and then place the
axle(s) under it.  Works every time.

For a car trailer, you'll want brakes and tandem axles.  Northern has
both.  The tandem axle shackle kit costs $36.99 plus the above cost for each 
of the springs.  Brake kits cost about $99 per wheel.

For brakes you have two choices - electric or inertial surge.  The electric
system requires the tow vehicle be equipped with a controller.  A good
controller will set you back $100.  The surge brake system uses a hydraulic
master cylinder mounted in the hitch such that the inertia of the trailer
actuates it.  Hydraulic brakes on the axles do the braking.  Both have
advantages and disadvantages.  The electric brakes cost more and require
the tow vehicle be wired for the controller.  But they allow you to
actuate them manually which is the only reliable way of quenching 
severe sway.  The surge brake system works with any tow vehicle, is self-
contained, is IMHO more reliable and does not need external power.
The hitch contains a breakaway trip that when actuated, fires a spring that
locks the trailer brakes.  This too, requires no external power unlike
electric brakes which must have a breakaway switch and battery.

There seems to be some controversy about surge brakes.  "Circle Track"
magazine did a series on towing awhile back in which they quoted some
official saying that surge brakes have been outlawed by the feds.
The problem is, I can't find anyone who agrees with this.  I've called
Ga-DOT AND have stopped at a "chickencoop" to see what the actual 
enforcement peckerheads look for and write tickets against.  None of
them have heard of any ban.  I'm installing surge brakes on my
BBQ serving trailer.  I recommend anyone else doing this call their
state DOT and make sure there are no local rules against them.
The rules enforced here are that surge brakes may be used on any
trailer of 3500 lbs Gross weight and on boats to 10,000 lbs Gross.
A heavy full-sized stock car and trailer may bump up against this 
limit.  One thing you can do (and I'm doing on my trailer) is install
surge brakes on one axle and electrics on the other.  That gives
me the reliable braking of the surge brake system plus the 
unquestioned legality of electric brakes plus the ability to activate
them from the cab in the event I ever get into a sway situation.

Finally, a word about mobile home axles.  These are wonderful creations.
Huge hubs, spindles, bearings and brakes.  Gobs of load capacity.  BUT.
The first problem is it must be cut down for trailer use.  I cut my own
but I don't recommend that for anyone who doesn't have a TIG welder and
the ability to re-heat treat it.  Will cost you about $50 to have it done.
The big potential problem is that I hear from a wide variety of sources
that these axles either have been or are about to be outlawed for other
uses.  I took my flatbed trailer down to the Ga Hwy Patrol and had it
inspected and an approval sticker affixed and they had no problems.
I'd certainly check around before using one today.  The other problem is
the wheels are real hard to get centered on the hub because of the way
they are clamped.  It can be done but it is a pain in the ass.
JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV!OADDAB (DIRK BROER)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 18:41:42 1994
Subject: More headers
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8415
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  John Hess and another, in response to my header inquiries, recommended
Doug Thorley Tri-Y headers for low- and mid-range torque increases.  Since
that's what I'm looking for, I called Doug Thorley (if anyone else in
interested, the phone number for their warehouse/outlet/distributor is
1-800-350-7110 which is for California High Performance) and they gave me
a lot of info on the #375Y headers for my car.  They are nickel-plated
chrome, made from 14-gauge tubing, and have a lifetime warranty against 
leakage.  But my question is this --> does anyone have any comments on the 
performance increases that these headers yield, and, any comments on the 
coating applied to them (how long it lasts, how well it keeps heat inside 
the headers, how well it protects against rust, etc...)?
Thanks once again for your comments.
                              -- Mazz

----------
Posted by: MICHAEL MAZZITELLI 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 18:47:57 1994
Subject: new horizons
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Hi all,
	I'm dropping off of the list until i arrive at the next place of 
business. I'm taking a three week vacation before I start the new place
with the new title and more $$$ for the car. 

	I hope the list is picked up by someone by then... It is a great pool 
of information.

Thanks again John you really made the list what it is today...

-dan a.
dhoward@stratus.com

-soon to be (as of May 31st)
dhoward@wellfleet.com
Customer Service Network Engineer
Wellfleet Communications
5 Federal Street 
Billerica Ma.

----------
Posted by: Dan Howard 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 19:02:27 1994
Subject: Continuation of The Hot Rod Mailing List
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8417
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

A while back I suggested that maybe I might be able to provide a home for the
mailing list.  I have gotten the aforementioned promotion and will be moving to
a new set of systems (if I was staying in this department I could garentee the
list a new home).  I haven't received anything from anyone on the
requirements as to what will be required, but, if someone else has not been
found to take over the list (I haven't seen anyone named) I will attempt 
to move it to my new system.  

Since, John, may have to leave soon, could anyone interested in continuing the
list send me their E-mail address and if we get disconnected then when I get 
things set up (I transfer over 20 May) I will attempt to resurect things.
My address is darcy@metro.bst.rochester.edu.

Thanks,

SJRD

----------
Posted by: Sean J Roc D'Arcy 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 23:34:07 1994
Subject: Re: DIY EFI system, how many interested?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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You can count me in on a mailing list.  I'm trying to hack Chrysler's
systems at the moment (68HC11 based).  Let me know whats happening.

  -- Greg

-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
 "Autocrossers go in deeper and come out harder" 1991 Spirit R/T-G Stock
 B.S. Computer Sci., Minor Experimental Psychology - you figure it out
 "A day is how you play within it"  10/30/93

----------
Posted by: emory!rpi.edu!stiegg
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  2 23:58:21 1994
Subject: Headers for a tight fit ( 428 -> '69 Mustang )
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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-> Was a 428 ever available in a '69 Mustang?  428 Medium riser.

 Yep.  I know for sure the 390 was; I'm pretty sure the 428 was.


-> Did they do something special with the shock towers (ala 429 Boss?).

 Nope.  Just a lot of Vaseline and a couple of guys jumping on the valve
covers.


-> It is impossible to get the heads off with out getting the headers
-> off first.  You can't get the headers out with out pulling the motor.

 Is this a Mustang engine?  Big car and truck FE motors have the
manifold bolts vertical - one on top, one on bottom, at each port.
Mustangs and most late FEs have diagonal bolt patterns so you can get to
both bolts from the top.  Actually, most of them I've seen are dual
pattern.
                                                                                     

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 00:10:06 1994
Subject: California engine swaps
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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I have a 1974 Chevy Blazer and am planning on putting a 454 in it. As it
is I have a stock 350 in it. I called a DMV tech line and they said I could
put in any motor as long as it was 1974 or newer. Then he said it could
not be out of a vehicle that had a GVW of 8500 or more.

Well I already have the 454. How do I tell what year it is? How does
the referee tell what the motor came out of? 

What chevy trucks had a GVW less than 8500 and a 454 from the factory?

If this is the wrong place to ask these questions let me know?

--
Dean Waters				E-Mail:  dwaters@interbase.borland.com
Systems Engineer
Borland International			Fax:     (408)431-4144
100 Borland Way
Scotts Valley, CA 95067			Phone:   (408)431-1917


----------
Posted by: Dean Waters 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 00:20:04 1994
Subject: Re: Headers for a tight fit ( 428 -> '69 Mustang ) 
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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: Well after spending all of Saturday trying to remove an engine from my 
: friend's '69 Mustang - I dread the though of putting back together.

: Here's the problem"

: The car blew a head gasket - big time.

: It is impossible to get the heads off with out getting the headers off 
: first.  You can't get the headers out with out pulling the motor.  About 
: the only way to pull the motor is to disassemble the front steering.  Even 
: then tight fit is an understatement.

: What about headers?  This car was bought with Hooker Super Comps.  Every 
: thing seemed to fit O.K. when driving down the road - but access to certain 
: bolts, and starter motor is severly limited - not to mention header bolt 
: problems.

	This sounds a bit strange to me.  I have a 70 Stang with a 302
(which engine is in this 69?).  I have hooker headers, installed them
with the engine in place (not too difficult), have removed the heads
without removing the engine, and installed the engine/transmission
together without disassembling any suspension.  The starter is
reasonably accessable when using the appropriate combination of
extensions and socket.  I will agree that it is difficult to take off
the heads without taking off the headers!  Perhaps your friend has some other
engine other than a small block?


----------
Posted by: emory!cs.ucdavis.edu!smitha (Alex Smith)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 00:30:06 1994
Subject: What's the last year Ford made 9" rears?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Does anybody know the last year Ford made 9" rears?  Do they still make them? 
Do any of the '80s full sized Fords or possibly trucks have them?  Or, did
they quit making them in favor of 8" or other sized rears because they don't
have anything with enough power to warrant them?

Thanks,
Tom

----------
Posted by: Tom Carver 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 00:36:07 1994
Subject: Headers for a tight fit ( 428 -> '69 Mustang )
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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>Question:
>Was a 428 ever available in a '69 Mustang?  428 Medium riser.  Did they do 
>something special with the shock towers (ala 429 Boss?).
>
>Dirk

My best friend in high school had a 428 Cobra Jet '69 Mustang.  It had the
standard shock towers, and according to a factory service manual I saw, the
flat rate for changing plugs was 8 hours labor - you had to pull the engine
to do a tune-up !!!  He had the tops of the shock towers cut and flat
plates welded in after we pulled the engine the first time, and after that
changing plugs was a breeze.  The plates were from a Mustang mail order
house and gave about 3 or 4 inches or extra room on each side (and still
didn't hit the springs.  Why did Ford make the towers so big?).  I can't
remember what brand headers he had.

Regards,

Carl Ijames     ijames@helix.nih.gov


----------
Posted by: emory!helix.nih.gov!ijames (Carl F. Ijames)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 00:42:29 1994
Subject: Re: Headers for a tight fit ( 428 -> '69 Mustang )
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Well, the 428/427/FE Mustang setup is about the tightest ford setup I 
have ever seen.  Very few ppl put the headers on that combo.  I think 
that It may have been available in 69, but I am not sure.  
The 427 Fairlanes had access holes in the shock towers for the manifold 
bolts.  You may be able to do likewise.
I don't think custom headers can help much.  You could re-route the offending
tubes yourself.  Just make up new sections of pipe where you want them, 
and cut out a section of the old header tube. 

----------
Posted by: emory!mtu.edu!mrshirle (MARK R. SHIRLEY)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 13:33:48 1994
Subject: Re:  What's the last year Ford made 9" rears?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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->  Does anybody know the last year Ford made 9" rears?  Do they still make them? 

Tom,

   I believe they wer in trucks untill 84 or so.  I saw a 1981 in my friends
bone yard a week or 2 ago.  Look in the hollander interchange book ( the one
the junk yards use ) for the absolute info.

Bill


#### Only my opinion...

----------
Posted by: emory!genrad.com!wdp (William D. Poudrier)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 13:44:26 1994
Subject: Re: DIY EFI system, how many interested?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8426
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In article <#9g6_+-@dixie.com> you wrote:
> --------

>. I would like to know how may others would be interested in starting
> another lower-volume mailing list that is concerned strictly with EFI design.
> If interested, E-mail me at the address below.

You bet! put my name on the list:

chchm@tibalt.supernet.ab.ca

*************************************************************** 
*Marcel Chichak  Certified Mini Nut | Go in deeper, come out  * 
*voice (403)466-6004                |harder and come from     *
*Fax (403)469-8650                  |behind!, That's what it's* 
*chichm@tibalt.supernet.ab.ca       |like to race a Mini!     *
*************************************************************** 


----------
Posted by: Marcel Chichak 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 13:58:38 1994
Subject: Re: More headers
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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I'm new to the hotrod newsgroup...so may have missed some more info on 
your specific application re the Tri-Ys by thorley. i know some folks who 
have used them and they picked up some worthwhile HP. 



----------
Posted by: emory!netcom.com!jeffyip (Jeff Yip)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 17:00:10 1994
Subject: No Subject Line
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8428
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Thought you guys would be interested in this subscription request.

John
------------------------------------------------------------
>From emory!delphi.com!WLDABOUTWHLS 

Please sign me up to this list and any other automotive list
that you can.  If you have ever seen the T.V. show Wild About
Wheels, that is us, now on line.  Please feel free to give our
adress to anyone who would like to contact us!  Thanks!
Carl at Wild About Wheels!

----------
Posted by: hotrod@dixie.com
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 17:12:18 1994
Subject: Re: What's the last year Ford made 9" rears?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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On May 2, 10:36pm, The Hotrod List wrote:
} Subject: What's the last year Ford made 9" rears?
> Does anybody know the last year Ford made 9" rears?  Do they still make them? 
> Do any of the '80s full sized Fords or possibly trucks have them?  Or, did

 believe in the early 1980's.  Currently they offer the 8.8 inch rear in
their F150's.  Yes, in the Ford SVO Motorsport Catalog, they offer new 
axle housings which can be purchased in quanity from Ford to be welded
into 9 inch housings.  But they made so many that you can find them everywhere
used for almost nothing if you are a shopper.Mike


-- 
Mike Brattland(Brattlan@cyber.net) "Three Deuces and a 4 Speed" 
Insurance Auto Auctions, Spring Valley, California 800-322-8284   
E-MAIL me for Tech Info on Small and Big Block Ford Tri-Power Information! !

----------
Posted by: "Michael G. Brattland" 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 17:25:33 1994
Subject: Re: Headers for a tight fit ( 428 -> '69 Mustang )
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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On May 2, 12:58pm, The Hotrod List wrote:
} Subject: Headers for a tight fit ( 428 -> '69 Mustang )
> Was a 428 ever available in a '69 Mustang?  428 Medium riser.  Did they do 
> something special with the shock towers (ala 429 Boss?).
>
Yes.  In fact my neighbor has a primo 69 428 Cobra Jet sitting in his garage.
Why don't you post this to the mustang list.  Someone probably has had simmilar
problems.  Also, Sanderson and several other header outfits are making shorty
headers for tight fits which might meet your needs. Mike




-- 
Mike Brattland(Brattlan@cyber.net) "Three Deuces and a 4 Speed" 
Insurance Auto Auctions, Spring Valley, California 800-322-8284   
E-MAIL me for Tech Info on Small and Big Block Ford Tri-Power Information! !

----------
Posted by: "Michael G. Brattland" 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 17:35:50 1994
Subject: Re: 1964 Country Sedan (Hearse) by Ford
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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*>>> Dave Dave Dave Dave Dave !
     Big smile on my dial reading this post ! A tear in my eye almost :)
     Hello to Anne from both of us ! Forgot all about your *new* vehicle
     in the near millenium that has passed since we spoke last. How is it
     going ? God it is good to hear from you. If you can source this part
     for me...well I be one happy chappy :) 
     Isn't it amazing how things like this just happen ?

     Loved the *low key* approach...not revealing anything till the 
     "Hi to Anita" bit....you certainly know how to give good value.

     Man...you made me smile and I was feeling pretty shitty too !

     Gday old friend.
     Geof.
-- 
  ___________________________________________________________________  
|| Geof Evans                 | DOMAIN: rxkgre@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au  ||
||   If they *really* wanna know...tell 'em that God was drunk.      ||
  -------------------------------------------------------------------

----------
Posted by: emory!minyos.xx.rmit.EDU.AU!rxkgre (Geof Evans)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 18:46:17 1994
Subject: FE's and more...
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In 681/2 Ford offered the 428. It was definitly a tight fit. As for 69-70
versions Ford offered the 428 in Mach 1 trim or as an option. Was a tight
fit but better then the 67-68 style. As the BOSS 429 stands the car was sent
to KAR KRAFT shops outside Detroit, for the mods on the chassis. The shock
towers on the BOSS are definetly different. They cut and moved towers from
the a-arm mounting holes up. In about 2" for clearance of the heads. 

Now you can attempt to modify the towers. This seems a little sketchy. My
choice is to by headers that are two piece.They are design to wrap infront
and under the lower control arm. I think your best choice would be J. Bittle
of America located in San Diego Ca. "sorry no #" They will have the best
header choice. They make just about everything for Fords. 

As for any other ideas. I've seen people cut the towers OFF and replace it
with a complete Pinto/Mustang II  front end. Very clean and the 69 -70
spidles and rotors can be used. Also it has rack-n-pinion. How it done
is something I haven't tried. YET! 

Did you say that you pulled the engine up through the top or dropped it
down? The latter is much easier. 

If this is the orignal engine/car combo I'd try to go back the cast iron
exhaust manifolds. If not what about a set of cast iron 64 Galaxie headers
they are very good for performance. 

That's all I can think of.

See ya
MPQ

----------
Posted by: emory!ingres.com!mquinn (Michael Quinn)
 



From rsiatl!hotrod Tue May  3 18:53:28 1994
Subject: Re: What's the last year Ford made 9" rears?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8432
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In article <9hh6zsd@dixie.com> you wrote:
: Does anybody know the last year Ford made 9" rears?  Do they still make them? 
: Do any of the '80s full sized Fords or possibly trucks have them?  Or, did
: they quit making them in favor of 8" or other sized rears because they don't
: have anything with enough power to warrant them?
: 
Full sized Ford trucks had them until around 84-85, and 86 had the 8.8 rear.
Large cars had them till the early 80's.
Late 70's cars are good for a 9".

Mark

----------
Posted by: Mark Shirley 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 18:58:23 1994
Subject: The List
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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I am prepping my ( personal? ) SGI Challenge for this task.  Loading 5.2
Irix takes time.  I will soon have an alias available.  Keep checking
"hotrod@dsea.com" or perhaps "hotrod@challenge.dsea.com".

Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097

----------
Posted by: emory!rebel.dsea.com!frank (Frank Evan Perdicaro)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 19:43:30 1994
Subject: Re:  What's the last year Ford made 9" rears?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8435
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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I believe that Ford still makes 9" rears, in two general classes.

First, there is the light-weight full-size pickup version, and then
there is the full-size car version.  I think you can get a real
9" in a new Lincoln still.

Not long ago I stopped in at Currie ( the Ford 9" folks ) and found what
appeard to be pallets of brand new Ford 9" rear ends out in the parking
lot.  Not sure where they came from.  Currie can make a Ford 9" for any
application.

Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097

----------
Posted by: emory!rebel.dsea.com!frank (Frank Evan Perdicaro)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 19:49:46 1994
Subject: Trailers
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8436
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This subject keeps coming up now and again.

I've built a few trailers, and have towed with about a dozen of the, 
for a total of a few thousand miles.

If I had to build a good-handling, good-towing trailer, I'd use
those "square-tube-with rubber hose" axles, and surge brakes.  

My father-in-law's Award trailer has those axles, so do the high-end
motorcycle trailers.  Very simple to setup; integeral spring and shock
absorber.  My opinion is that the cost is worth it.  Yes, these are
sold through Northern Hydraulics.

You also might want to consider an anti-sway bar, and damped trailer
to tow vehical connection.

Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097

----------
Posted by: emory!rebel.dsea.com!frank (Frank Evan Perdicaro)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 20:13:26 1994
Subject: Re: DIY EFI system, how many interested?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8437
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In message   writes:

> >. I would like to know how may others would be interested in starting
> > another lower-volume mailing list that is concerned strictly with EFI 
> > design.

Please add me to the list.

Thanks

Rob
gallant@oasys.dt.navy.mil

----------
Posted by: "Robert Gallant"  
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 20:26:25 1994
Subject: Re:  What's the last year Ford made 9" rears?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8438
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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My '85 Bronco has a 9-inch rear.

-Bob


-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
| Bob Wise          | INET:622-1322 | MCIMail:468-2222 | Pager:719-577-1928 |
|                   |-------------------------------------------------------|
| MCI               | Phone:719-535-1322 | Internet:rmwise@apdev.cs.mci.com |
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

----------
Posted by: emory!mcigate.apdev.cs.mci.com!rmwise (Bob_Wise)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May  3 20:43:34 1994
Subject: 454 Trade
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8439
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

  I live in the Colorado Springs area,  I would like to trade even up for a 
small block (350).  The 454 is in the truck running, it has a brand new stock 
cam and has just had the heads redone infact I'll pick it up from the machine 
shop this Friday.  I will trade everything on the engine with it so I will 
need everything for the 350 ie. altenator, water pump, exhaust manifolds ect.  
I don't want to spend much money on the swap.  My reason for swaping is better 
gas milage.  Call Wayne at work (719) 576-6845 or home (719) 260-6438

----------
Posted by: emory!sosi.com!wayne (Wayne Minks)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 02:44:54 1994
Subject: Re:  Re: DIY EFI system, how many interested?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Me too. I have a programmer in the lab too!


					P.H

----------
Posted by: Pierre-Henry Marbot 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 03:06:39 1994
Subject: paint question
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I'm repainting a motorcycle frame, and it's not going well.
My problem is that overspray from painting one section of the
frame is sticking to the paint on other sections, and it isn't
flowing out.  The frame's made of lots of little tubes so I
have to spray at it from all sorts of directions.

I'm using DuPont Centurion (not sure if that's the name, it's
C-something) 2-part epoxy paint, silver color.  I'm spraying it with an
automotive 'touch-up' gun.   I've experimented with using lower
pressure (30 psi instead of 50-60 that the gun maker calls for)
and using less thinner.  At 50-60 psi I get some runs when I
accidentally hit a flat bracket on a tube.  I still get overspray.
At 30 psi, no runs, more overspray.

I expermented a little last night with a brush, and got a halfway
decent coat onto a hunk of smooth scrap.  So I might brush it
on, as bizarre as that sounds.  I think it'll run a lot if I
brush it unless I'm really careful, it's very thin paint.

But maybe there's something else I can change about the way it sprays
to make it work?  Should I use more thinner?  Or use a slower-drying
thinner?  The one I got from the paint shop is 'medium-fast'
thinner... how slow is 'slow'?

Any suggestions?

BTW, I think this paint would work fine if I was painting
large flat surfaces, like on a car...
-- 
            Eric Murray                 ericm@microunity.com
In this game, the winner is also the loser, and the judge's decisions are final

----------
Posted by: emory!MicroUnity.com!ericm (Eric Murray)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 03:20:13 1994
Subject: H20 injection
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Chip,
 
  > I too have had good result with water injection in my '66 Mustang with
  > 10.5 CR.  I run 87 octane and never get a knock.
 
Sounds like just like what I'm looking for.
 
  > My system is quite refined to get the mixture ratios perfect yet, but
  > it's getting close.
 
How do you know that the mixture isn't setup quite right? Does it stumble or
do something else?
 
  > Let me know  if you want me to discribe my home made system.  It cost me
  > about $35 to  build.
 
I for one would like to get a description.
 
Thanks in advance.
 
 
Matt.

----------
Posted by: emory!genie.geis.com!p.beaubien1
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 14:21:50 1994
Subject: RE:Re:Re:DIY EFI system, how many interested?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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I would DEFINATLY like to talk to others who are trying to build their own FI
systems.  At the moment, I like the 6811 because of it's great timers. 
Initally, I am building a distributorless ignition system because it is
simpler.  A fuel injection system is ALMOST the same, just a little bit more
software.  Most of the timing stuff transfers over, too.  My test car is a 72
Volvo with a '286 in the passenger seat for data ack. and display.  I have a 12
volt to 120 volt motor/generator to power it all.  I use GM sensors (the same
as from my '89 beretta so they act as spares) except for temperatures.  I use
type K thermocouples because I found a couple of 16 channel conditioners for
almost free.  My wife HATES this car, and won't let me move it to MY new 2 car
garage, so this weekend I'm going to chop it up into little pices, keep the
engine, trans, rear end and make an engine stand so I can run it on the ground.
 When I'm done, I plan on makeing a dyno with the rear end for tuning purposes.
 A 100 hp dyno shouldn't be that hard.  Hey, I finally figured how to calculate
the density of air (in grams per litere) given the output from my map sensor
and the air temperature!  This will be used for one axis of my fuel map, with
RPM on the other.  Mail me if you would like to know how.

  Hey John!  Thanks again for all of your efforts!  How about telling us the
name and author of that book you mentioned about making a home brew FI system! 
Thanks in advance!

  Please add me to your list of people interested in home brew FI systems.

- Steven Ciciora

----------
Posted by: "Ciciora Steve" 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 14:33:57 1994
Subject: No Subject Line
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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answers...
 
The Hotrod List (hotrod@dixie.com) wrote:
: O.k... I think my lack of engine knowledge will be apparent
: after you read these questions...they're pretty easy.
:      
:      1. What are hardened valve seatss, and what does that
:       do?
 
These are more resistant to cylinder temperature heat and will
last longer, especially when a 3 angle (or multi-angle) valve cut 
is used.  Normally found in aluminum heads.
 
:      2. What is the main webbing of the block?
 
The main webbing is the part of the block where the crank shaft is
supported.  The main webbing is also called the main bulkheads.
 
:      3. What is MMagnafluxing? 
 
Magnafluxing is a magnetic process used with ferrous engine parts to
determine if there are any cracks or other defects in the part.
 
:      4. What is a windage tray, and how does it increase
:       horsepower?
 
A windage tray is usually secured with special main bearing cap bolts
and runs the length of the oil pan.  It increases horsepower by 
keeping the oil droplets normally suspended in the crankcase in the 
oil pan.  It's effect is not usually great under about 4000 rpm, but
above that, it makes a difference.  Some claim as much as 25 hp.
 
...other stuff killed...
 
Nick
 
 
 ***************************************************************************
 *       Nick Ciarallo                                                     *
 *       SR Telecom Inc.            telephone: 514-335-2429  ex: 438       *
 *       Microwave Group            facsimile: 514-334-7783                *
 *       8150 Trans Canada Hwy      internet : nick@vlsi.polymtl.ca        *
 *       St. Laurent, Quebec        hamradio : ve2hot@ve2fkb.pq.can.na     *
 *       Canada  H4S-1M5                                                   *
 ***************************************************************************
 *        Accept no substitutes, *REAL* ham radio lives on 220 MHz!        *
 ***************************************************************************
----------
Posted by: emory!softimage.qc.ca!nickc
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 14:46:47 1994
Subject: Re: What's the last year Ford made 9" rears?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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| Does anybody know the last year Ford made 9" rears?  Do they still
| make them? Do any of the '80s full sized Fords or possibly trucks
| have them?

4 Wheel & Off Road says that '85 was the last year for 9" in trucks.
1/2-ton trucks, at least.

----------
Posted by: JimBob 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 14:59:09 1994
Subject: trans cooler/elctric fan
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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I'm hoping someone can help me out with approving this setup or
suggesting a better one.

I am going to run the trans lines through the aux cooler only(not
through radiator) is this good or bad?  Will it make much difference?
The trans is a chevy TH350 with a 3000-3500 stall converter.  I figure
the engine will idle 1200-1500(blower motor) The cooler is rated for up
to 24000 GVW and is made of 1/2" tubing.  The car wieghs in around
24000, give or take.  I am going to mount the cooler in front of the
radiator.  Which is the second question.  I am unable to use a
conventional water pump mounted fan due to the small space between the
front of the engine and the radiator.  Realistically there is about 3 to
3 1/2" of usable space to mount an electric fan.  can someone suggest a
certain brand/model?  I've been looking at the Flex-a-lite dual low
profiles.  they are 2 1/4" total depth and rated to flow 2200 cfm.  Will
something like that be enough?  Would I also need a "pusher" type fan??
This car is for street use.

Thanks for any help!

 -Mark


-- 
Mark Fugazzotto                        |  mfugazzo@resdgs1.er.usgs.gov
United States Geological Survey        |
Reston, VA 22092                       |  [INSERT SNAZZY TAGLINE HERE]
(703) 648-4558                         |

----------
Posted by: emory!resdgs1.er.usgs.gov!mfugazzo (Mark Fugazzotto)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 17:49:25 1994
Subject: RE: FE's in a 69...
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Earlier, someone asked about a 428 in a 69-70 Mustang. They did come with 428's
as a Mach 1 or an option. They were definitly a tight fit. Not as bad as a 67
68 model but pretty bad. As for headers, well J. Bittle of America in San Deigo
Ca make the best design headers for about every Ford out there. (sorry no #)

The kind of header I've seen is the two piece which wraps under and in front of
the lower control arm. Seems sketchy I know but will help with clearance.
Have you thought about droppping the engine straight down? This works well
on uni-body cars. The worst possilbe car is the Sunbeam Tiger. My friend
and I learned the hard way on his. 

As for cutting the shock towers? EEECCKK!!! The 69-70 Boss 429's were redesigned
at Kar Kraft facilities outside Detroit. They completely revamped the shock
towers to accommodate the heads of the 429. From the arm bolts up were cut
back 2" for clearance. They also beefed up the suspension too. 

If you really want clearance. I've seen people cut right at the frame rail
the whole length from firewall to rad. support and remove the Mustang suspension
To replace it with a Pinto/MustangII front end. With this you can still use
the front rotors fromthe original car. You have rack-n-pinion steering as well.
I've seen this done a couple of times. It's turned out pretty cleanly.

Just a thought.

See ya
MPQ

----------
Posted by: emory!ingres.com!mquinn (Michael Quinn)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 18:36:39 1994
Subject: Re: Painting Motorcycle frame
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Here's a few ideas to maybe help you out with painting your motorcycle frame:

Try rigging it up so you can rotate it easily to where you want to spray,
like maybe attaching it to a rotating plate on a motor stand or hanging it
from the rafters somehow.  

I'm no expert, but I think the best way would be to try to cover the whole
entire frame with very light coats all at one time.  Rigging it up so that
you can easily rotate it over while you're painting it should help you.  If
you can get a thin wet coat all the way around before it has a chance to dry
anywhere, then you don't have to worry about the overspray -- it'll all blend
in.  If you use a slower drying solvent then your main problem will be trying
to avoid runs by making sure you don't pile on too thick of a layer in one
spot.  Take a light pass, rotate it a little, and take another overlapping
pass.  If you do it quick enough, the overlapping passes will wet into each
other.

	It helps a lot to have lots of bright lights to help see what you're
doing.  I found it helpful to look at the reflection of the lights in the wet
paint to be able to tell how wet you need to get it with each pass.  I tried
to make the passes at the speed that would just barely leave enough paint to
see a reflection in.  If you can't see a reflection, then it's too thin or
it's going on too dry.

	My experience was mostly with laquers and a little enamel.  I will be
trying out some PPG DP-40 Epoxy primer in a week or too, which sounds similar
to the Centauri paint you're using.  I'd be interested in hearing how yours
comes out.

	Good luck,
	Tom

----------
Posted by: Tom Carver 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 18:50:17 1994
Subject: Transmission cooler installation
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Mark Fugazzotto writes:
>I am going to run the trans lines through the aux cooler only(not
>through radiator) is this good or bad?  Will it make much difference?
>The trans is a chevy TH350 with a 3000-3500 stall converter.

This question is tough to answer for a couple of reasons.  You
didn't say if the car is for street use, nor did you say what
kind of temperatures you expect to encounter when running the car.

A converter of 3000-3500 RPM is not practical for street use so
I'll assume that you are building a race only car.  Is it for drag
races?  Circle track?  Road racing?  You don't need a lot of cooler
if the tranny is only run for 10 seconds or so, and then is allowed
to cool down between runs.  On the other hand, if you are doing
road racing where you have to run for an hour or two under widely
varying RPM then you will need excellent cooling.

If you will run the car hard when things are cold then you should
think about plumbing your external cooler first, then plumbing its
output through the normal radiator heat exchanger.  This allows the
engine coolant to warm up the tranny fluid and considerably improves
the ability of the tranny fluid to lubricate things.  It also improves
the ability of the seals to prevent leakage and the associated
pressure loss inside the trans.

If you plan to spend a lot of time with the engine RPM below the
converter's stall speed then you should run the biggest external
cooler that you can fit into the car.  You probably also will want
to install a temperature gauge in the tranny pan.

Bob Hale   hale@brooktree.com

----------
Posted by: emory!brooktree.com!hale (bob hale)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 18:57:01 1994
Subject: Re: Re:Re:DIY EFI system, how many interested?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In article  you write:
> When I'm done, I plan on makeing a dyno with the rear end for tuning purposes.
> A 100 hp dyno shouldn't be that hard.  

I've always wondered about making a homemade dyno...  How do you go about 
doing this?

> Hey, I finally figured how to calculate
>the density of air (in grams per litere) given the output from my map sensor
>and the air temperature!  This will be used for one axis of my fuel map, with
>RPM on the other.  Mail me if you would like to know how.

Sounds interesting....  Could you post to the list or e-mail me?

-thanks
Brian

----------
Posted by: Brian Scott Haskett 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 22:01:22 1994
Subject: Ultimate Transmission ? !
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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FYI:

Following a lead from Car Cruft magazine... I called G-Force Products.  
Among other things they market their own line of performance 4 and 5 speeds
.  These are all out transmissions - versions of which have with stood Pro-
stock - ie 900-1100ft lbs of torque and 15" wide slicks...  I got the basic 
info on 3 models:
Street / Road race 5-speed - requires the unloading of the transmission to 
shift out of a gear.  It does allow down shifting.  Reduce torque capacity 
from the Pro race trans.  Cost - hold on to you wallets - $3395   Ouch!

Pro Street - This is a semi-clutchless trans - to shift out of 1st and 2nd 
gear no clutch is required - just full throttle bang and go.  This 
transmission ties the counter shaft to the main shaft with "hand cuffs" 
that keep one from pushing the other through the case - this is one of the 
things that gives this tranny the 1100 ft-lbs rating.  Down shifting into 
1st and 2nd is not allowed - my understanding is these gears are sort of a 
one way gear and engine braking doesn't work.  These gears are ment for up-
shifting only.  Cost - grab you ankles - $4295 - I don't like spending this 
much on a car....

Pro Race - Full clutchless shifts in all gears - very similar to the Pro-
Street trans.  Price is the same - $4295 - for $200 you can get torsion 
tube output to take up some of the shock....

This particular salesman scoffed at Doug Nash, Jerico and the like - saying 
ultimately that they where all based on either 20year old designs or 
production designs...  The only company he called in the same class was 
Liberty.

Not that he put down the other makes of transmissions just that he didn't 
consider them in the same class.  

They can be reached at 1-612-767-9546

Just an FYI.

Dirk

----------
Posted by: emory!STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV!OADDAB (DIRK BROER)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 22:13:34 1994
Subject: My Chevelle runs
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Well, I finally got it to run....

About a year and a half ago, I posted for ideas about what car to buy
for a project.  I wanted a pre-66, easy to work on, easy to get parts
for, possibly fast car.

For about 10 years I have sat and gathered ideas and notions and cash.
I took a job here in CA, and decided to go for it.  I must note here
that it takes a lot more cash, patience, and maturity than it appears
in this note to do what I have done.  Also, it is important to have a
spouse that wants the same things in a car.

What I have is a 64 Chevelle, a CA car.  I bought it for the body
mostly, and because it was all there.  All the bright bits and glass
were intact.  The one ( obvious at the time ) body problem was a dent
in the trunk caused by a transmission that was not bolted down.  It
had started life as a I6, but had been bought and "tinkered with" by a
father-son hacker team.  When I got it it had a tired 283 and TH350,
and a few surgury problems.

Now, it is different.

   Drive train is a 1994 ZZ3 GM replacement motor, the aluminim-head
     345 HP version, followed by a 1990-case T700R4 with Corvette
     converter, complete HD rebuild, anti-kickdown, and 4th gear
     auto-locker for the converter.

     I had to cut the shaft and massage the firewall quite a bit to 
     get this in.  The cooler is the largest one I could find, and it
     was interesting getting the cooling lines in between the 
     starter and the headers.

     The rest of the engine compartment is pretty tame.  I had to get
     a new starter and alternator, wires and belts.  I had to machine
     carb plate and alternator mount, radiator mounts and many other
     small parts.  New battery, box and cables.

     The shifter is a MegaShifter with all four speeds enabled in 
     both ratchet and normal mode.

     Exhaust is Hooker Headers and dual 2" pipes dumping before the 
     rear axle.  Currently it sounds wicked, perhaps that is because
     it actually is.

   As one might expect in an original 30 year old car, the interior
     toast.  The previous hackers had killed the bench seat and
     "installed" wasted buckets.  I bought the OPGI Stage 2 kit
     containing a COMPLETE new interior, and put it in after
     dissassembling, sanding and painting the inside of the passenger
     compartment.  I had to fabricated nearly complete new seat
     mounts, so they are adjustable for height.  The seats got new
     springs, foam, uhpolstry and rubber bits.  

   Chassis is pretty tame, with the exception of a 1" rear anti-sway
     bar, an 1.25" bar in the front, and 4 new springs.


   All this is finished, and it runs.  Thanks for your help.

   Time from purchace to running?  Three months.  I did think about 
   it for a few years though.  I had all the hard decisions finished
   before I started.

   To Come
      I still have the single-circuit brakes.  These will leave in the
      next cash effusion.  I am gathering parts for a 4 wheel brake
      swap to ( LE1 ) disks.  Related to this is a Lincoln-style,
      Detroit-Lockered, A Body, Ford 9".  

      With the front disks will come new spindles and control arms,
      and probably new shocks.

      Soon I have to get that roll bar.

      The 2 core radiator will have to go, as will the wimpy stock fan setup.

      I like the sound of 450 ft-lbs somebody else mentioned.  I will
      likely go to EFI some time in the next year.

      Paint.  It is puke yellow, black, and grey currently.

      Tires; wheels.  I expect to make all these bald....;)

      MSD 6AL

      Next summer I will get the 5th speed option for the T700.
      I'll start saving now.

      I have noticed that the spare PC boards we have here are just
      about the right price, size and rigidity to make some ground
      effects stuff.  Also, I have to make a set of ventilation 
      riser blocks for my hood.

      A radio?  There is just a hole in the dash now.

      More guages, perhaps an alarm.

      OPGI trunk and rear shelf cleanup kits and paint.

      Oh year, my wife wants air.  ( Dave W: the local REI has 
	isobutane, as does Hilton's in downtown Boston. Want some? )

      In short, another few grand.  It looks like I will have the
      cash, and will just do it.  I'll keep you all informed.


   Ultimate goal is for my wife and I to race in the Fall 1995 Silver
      State Challenge unlimited speed race across Nevada, and do 
      respectably well.  Like say 170 mph top speed, and 150 mph 
      average.

   Don't ask how much it cost, I have not added it all up.  At least it 
      is all paid for; I have been paying as I go.
Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097

----------
Posted by: emory!rebel.dsea.com!frank (Frank Evan Perdicaro)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 22:26:38 1994
Subject: Re: DIY EFI system, how many interested?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8453
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In alt.hotrod you write:

>I would DEFINATLY like to talk to others who are trying to build their own FI
>systems.  At the moment, I like the 6811 because of it's great timers. 
>Initally, I am building a distributorless ignition system because it is
>simpler.  A fuel injection system is ALMOST the same, just a little bit more
>software.  Most of the timing stuff transfers over, too.  My test car is a 72
>Volvo with a '286 in the passenger seat for data ack. and display.  I have a 12
>volt to 120 volt motor/generator to power it all.  I use GM sensors (the same
>as from my '89 beretta so they act as spares) except for temperatures.  I use
>type K thermocouples because I found a couple of 16 channel conditioners for
>almost free.  My wife HATES this car, and won't let me move it to MY new 2 car
>garage, so this weekend I'm going to chop it up into little pices, keep the
>engine, trans, rear end and make an engine stand so I can run it on the ground.
> When I'm done, I plan on makeing a dyno with the rear end for tuning purposes.
> A 100 hp dyno shouldn't be that hard.  Hey, I finally figured how to calculate
>the density of air (in grams per litere) given the output from my map sensor
>and the air temperature!  This will be used for one axis of my fuel map, with
>RPM on the other.  Mail me if you would like to know how.

>  Hey John!  Thanks again for all of your efforts!  How about telling us the
>name and author of that book you mentioned about making a home brew FI system! 
>Thanks in advance!

>  Please add me to your list of people interested in home brew FI systems.

>- Steven Ciciora

Hi Steve,
	My name is Joe and I'm an ME student at U of I .  I have been wanting
to learn more about how to devise a simple setup to run a set of 4 injectors
on my motorcycle and to that effect have taken an introductory computer
engineering class.  I'm starting to get a grasp of the whole affair but I
really need to get this bike going in the immediate future so I was wondering
if you had any helpful hints on how to rig up something that would work.  
I have a GM mass air flow sensor, oxygen sensors, map sensor, throttle 
position sensor and the ignition system on the bike is the original
transistorized unit which fires a pair of plugs at each engine revolution 
(4 cylinder in line Suzuki).  I was really only looking for a simple setup
that would basically take a throttle position reading for calculation of the
rate of throttle opening and a mass air flow reading and from those two alone
pick a value from a table to send to a device to control the pulse width.  I
also have the throttle housing with the four injectors, I really only need a 
device that will determine the amount of fuel to spray.  I know I should have
some sort of feedback loop but I haven't taken a controls class as of yet and
all I really have in mind for this bike is serious dragracing since it is 
definitely not on the street legal side of things.  Any help is greatly 
appreciated.  I'v been told that a simple analog system may be my best bet,
I'm willing to learn either digital or analog methods in enough detail to 
produce the desired results but I originally thought that if I started with 
a single board computer with A/D circuitry on it already it would be much 
simpler to adjust settings as well as upgrade the level of sophistication
as I learned more.

		I apreciate any and all help I can get.

			Sincerely, 
					Joemama   
					    

    

----------
Posted by: immordino joseph jr 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 22:41:17 1994
Subject: Re:  paint question
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Eric Murray sez:
>I'm repainting a motorcycle frame, and it's not going well.
>My problem is that overspray from painting one section of the
>frame is sticking to the paint on other sections, and it isn't
>flowing out.  The frame's made of lots of little tubes so I
>have to spray at it from all sorts of directions.
>
>I'm using DuPont Centurion (not sure if that's the name, it's
>C-something) 2-part epoxy paint, silver color.  I'm spraying it with an
>automotive 'touch-up' gun.   I've experimented with using lower
>pressure (30 psi instead of 50-60 that the gun maker calls for)
>and using less thinner.  At 50-60 psi I get some runs when I
>accidentally hit a flat bracket on a tube.  I still get overspray.
>At 30 psi, no runs, more overspray.

The Centurion is good paint (we used it on the frame of our T-*uckit
project...  It is a _real shitter_ to sand, though!  When you are having
problems with light overspray on previously-painted sections, try this
old trick:  After spraying the new section (causing overspray on old
sections) load a gun with straight thinner and lightly mist the overspray
areas.  Often, the overspray will "merge" into the previously painted
section.  If this shortcut doesn't get it, you can always buff or
lightly (super-fine grit) wet sand the overspray region.

>
>I expermented a little last night with a brush, and got a halfway
>decent coat onto a hunk of smooth scrap.  So I might brush it
>on, as bizarre as that sounds.  I think it'll run a lot if I
>brush it unless I'm really careful, it's very thin paint.

A brush, yikes!

>But maybe there's something else I can change about the way it sprays
>to make it work?  Should I use more thinner?  Or use a slower-drying
>thinner?  The one I got from the paint shop is 'medium-fast'
>thinner... how slow is 'slow'?

Using a slower thinner on what I have described as "previously painted"
regions should make the condition better.  Hell, it couldn't hurt to
try; IMHO, anything would be better than using a brush!  :-)

>Any suggestions?
>
>BTW, I think this paint would work fine if I was painting
>large flat surfaces, like on a car...

It worked great on a square 2x3 auto frame!  Good luck!
jC.
_________________________________________________________
James C. Akers         FiberCom, Inc.        Roanoke, VA
jca@fibercom.com     uunet!fibercom!jca     (703)342-6700

----------
Posted by: emory!fibercom.com!jca (James C. Akers)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 22:54:58 1994
Subject: Re:  trans cooler/elctric fan
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8455
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You probably have a decent setup with for the tranny cooler.  I like to 
run hot oil to the radiator first, then to the cooler.

I would ( and will soon ) go with dual electric fans on seperate thermostats.
Get adjustable 'stats with built in relays; I used ( an will use ) 
"Fanstat"s.  Set the 'stats to slightly different temps., and run the 
manual overrides to a switch on your dash board, prefferabley a lighted
one.  Another good idea is to get a tranny temp guage with two probes, 
in and out, and pay attention.

I think it is this month's _Car Crap_ that has an article on exactly this
subject ( and GM A body headliner installation, too ).
Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097

----------
Posted by: emory!rebel.dsea.com!frank (Frank Evan Perdicaro)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May  4 23:07:16 1994
Subject: DIY EFI system -- New Mailing-list
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

--------

The response to the DIY_EFI system question has been "strong". I must
now request that subscription inquirers be direct to the
mail server cited below and not to me. For those that have already
inquired and have not received a subscription notice, you should 
re-subscribe.

What is the future of the DIY_EFI mailing-list? The answer depends on the 
future existence of hotrod mailing-list. For now, I'll just let it 
run in parallel and for starters, over the next couple of weeks I'll post
details of some of the thing I've been working on. Several of you are also
working on various EFI project that are also worthy of "group discussion". 
*Please* take the time to write up a few paragraph and post. We all 
would like to know more ...


================================================================

        Do - It - Yourself    Electronic   Fuel  Injection

================================================================

To subscribe: Send "subscribe DIY_EFI [ 
 ]" to
    Majordomo@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu. The request
    must be in the body of the message; *not* the subject line.

For help: Send "help" to Majordomo@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu.

To post: Send to "DIY_EFI@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu"

Charter: (subject to change)
    This mailing-list is *strictly* dedicated to the discussion
of topics related to EFI design and modification. I would like
to see discussion on control algorithms, hardware, electronics,
and sensor/sensor-interface designs. Additionally, modification
and adaptations of OEM ECU's would also be welcomed.

    This list is temporary, and its continuance depends on the
level of participation of its readers.

                                       John S Gwynne
                                          Gwynne.1@osu.edu
_______________________________________________________________________________
               T h e   O h i o - S t a t e   U n i v e r s i t y
    ElectroScience Laboratory, 1320 Kinnear Road, Columbus, Ohio 43212, USA
                Telephone: (614) 292-7981 * Fax: (614) 292-7292
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------



----------
Posted by: John S Gwynne 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May  5 03:49:13 1994
Subject: Re: Trailers
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In alt.hotrod you write:

>This subject keeps coming up now and again.  If I had to build a
>good-handling, good-towing trailer, I'd use those "square-tube-with
>rubber hose" axles, and surge brakes.
>Posted by: emory!rebel.dsea.com!frank (Frank Evan Perdicaro)

For the low-buck route, on every trailer I've ever built (5) I used
rear axles from Toronado's, etc.  There pretty plug-n-play...  You
chop'em down the middle, weld in two peices of Uni-Strut (one in the cut
channel, one outside) and run the brake lines to your favorite surge
hitch.  Let me tell you they can take abuse.  More abuse than a Blazer
I know :-(  I was helping excavate the hillside of my uncle's place for
his new garage, and dumping it in his funnel-shaped corral.  I had the
sucker loaded with about 5 yards of wet dirt.  When I got to the edge of
the corral and slowed, it pushed the blazer with all wheels locked.  It
was slow motion as I heard the trailer folding in the Blazer's bumper
and rear quarter-panel. This was only a dual-axle job.  The one I built
earlier for my dads house boat was three-axle'er (can you say 
over-engineered?  :-)


--DAVE (johnson@wrs.com)

"And now, a man who faces his destiny at FULL THROTTLE...  Its David Letterman!"

								   (c)1993 CBS

----------
Posted by: David Johnson 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May  5 04:04:08 1994
Subject: My trip to the Welding shop
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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I dropped by my friendly local welding store today to buy some rods
for the first time in about 6 years.  Amazin' how long 150 lbs of rods
will last the casual welder :-)  Anyway, this store is an MG dealer.
In case you don't know, MG is famous for its dozens of specialty 
rods and alloys.  Expensive rods.  "Suck-wind-until-your-meatballs-bounce"
expensive rods.  I used to sell 'em in my store.  In Single rod quantities
in some cases.  

Anyway, in the decade since I had my welding store, the've been busy.
Their handbook on their rods is now 164 pages!  The book is called
"Superior Alloys for Maintenance and Repair" and can be had from
your local MG dealer or 800 558 8524.  The book is free.  I picked up one
and have found some interesting stuff.

First is their collection of cast iron welding rods and MIG wire (!).
Yep, you can MIG cast iron.  They list 3 rods that can be used with AC,
a bare rod that color matches gray cast iron, and amazingly enough,
a rod that can be used to weld oily or burnt cast iron or weld
steel to cast iron (MG-289).  One application shown is welding a steel 
plate over a hole in an engine block!  They also list a gouge/Vee rod 
(MG-570) which in one pass will prep the crack for welding.

Next is Aluminum.  They list several rods for aluminum including the 
MG-400 that can be used either with a torch or DC stick. They also
have a couple of rods that they describe as being between a filler rod
and a brazing rod.  The deal is the aluminum base is heated with a torch
until it just barely starts to surface melt and then this rod is applied
like a brazing rod.  I alloys with the base metal.  And they have an arc
rod for oily aluminum.

Then there is the cutting rod, the MG-560, which they claim will
cut as cleanly as an acetylene cutting torch.  I used a predecessor
to this rod and it worked as advertised.

Probably the most amazing rod they have is the MG-600 rod which is
designed for stud removal.  It is a special high strength alloy
rod coated with a special flux.  If a stud is broken off down in
a hole, one simply pushes the rod down on the stud.  The flux
flows out and protects the threads from the metal.  The metal builds up
until it protrudes from the hole.  It is allowed to build up a bit
more, then a nut is laid down over the protruding alloy and welded to
it.  Then the nut is turned, removing the stud.  Supposedly the alloy
is strong enough not to break before the stud comes loose.  They claim
it can also be used to remove broken taps and drills.  They say this
rod can also be used to weld things like automotive springs!

The rest of the rods are equally interesting including a stick welding
rod for copper!  This is interesting stuff.

John

-- 
John De Armond, WD4OQC, Marietta, GA    jgd@dixie.com 
Performance Engineering Magazine.  Email to me published at my sole discretion
"If we let this leak, it'll just kill him"  Clinton about Vince Foster

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May  5 12:41:50 1994
Subject: RE:trans cooler/elctric fan
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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MARK WRITES:

>I'm hoping someone can help me out with approving this setup or
>suggesting a better one.

>... I figure
>the engine will idle 1200-1500(blower motor) The cooler is rated for up
>to 24000 GVW and is made of 1/2" tubing.  The car wieghs in around
>24000, give or take.  I am going to mount the cooler in front of the
>radiator.  Which is the second question.  I am unable to use a
>conventional water pump mounted fan due to the small space between the
>front of the engine and the radiator.  Realistically there is about 3 to
>3 1/2" of usable space to mount an electric fan.  can someone suggest a
>certain brand/model?  I've been looking at the Flex-a-lite dual low
>profiles.  they are 2 1/4" total depth and rated to flow 2200 cfm.  Will
>something like that be enough?  Would I also need a "pusher" type fan??
>This car is for street use.

  Mark, I have a '91 Supercharged Mustang GTConv, I've run into heating 
problems at idle (700rpms-1100) in city traffic on hot days. I guess my stock 
fan clutch just wasn't moving enough air at that speed. (no problems when 
car's moving faster than 35mph). Well first I tryed adding a pusher 10" fan on 
the front of the radiator (rated at 500 cfm). well On the hot days, it didn't 
get superhot, but more than I liked. Well a friend of my runs the Dual 
Flex-a-lite in his 10 second mustang. and he recommended it to me (I have mine 
on order). Only one problem...it draws 20amps. So it my put a load on your 
alternater. I have no doubt that this fan will work for me. 

-Ajay Patel
AXP@roadnet.ups.com

----------
Posted by: emory!roadnet.ups.com!AXP (Ajay Patel)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May  5 12:57:53 1994
Subject:  Dyno     
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8460
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

In an article last week John talked about a Radar dyno.              

What do you use the radar device for ?? - measuring velocity at given time 
intervals ??

[Yes.  Knowing the velocity at two points in time lets you compute 
acceleration. Take the samples often enough and you can develop a 
nice smooth acceleration curve.  JGD]

I have a similar idea although I have been unable to get it going due to
lack of time and know how !!

Since the weight of the car, gear ratios, tyre data are all known it seems to 
me all one has to do is measure the engine RPM accurately at known time 
intervals and you have all the info you need to make some estimation of
output.  

Because I have no idea how to count pulses using a pc I used a freq-volt 
convertor and then an a/d convertor to get the pc to "read the voltage".
Using my oscilloscope with the car stationary I managed to get a good
linear calibration curve for RPM vs Volts.     

Main problem now is the freq-voltage convertor appears to be slow if you use 
the low gears but in the high gears you run out of road !!!!.  Other problem is 
a bad bit of programming on my part, computer stops collecting data !!!!  

It has since occured to me that it may be better to try to count the time 
interval between successive pulses using one of the computers I/O ports but I 
dont know which one or how to do it, offers of help would be appreciated. 

Does this approach sound reasonable to anyone out there on the list?

[The only problem with your approach, and it's a big one, is that
tire slip and/or tranny/clutch/torque converter slip fools your measurements.
You can get rid of all the error terms except wheel slip by monitoring the
drive shaft.  A couple of magnets attached to the drive shaft with a 
coil nearby to pick up the pulses works well.

The easiest way to count pulses, one that will work with my radar scheme
too if I establish a ground rule of at least a 386, is to route the 
pulses through an 8 bit programmable divider chip and then to the *ACK line
on the parallel printer port.  I can't recall the number of this chip 
but it's a simple CMOS part.  Connect the divider programming bits
to the parallel port data lines and the strobe line to the printer port
STROBE.  Then write a little routine which will increment a software
counter each time the printer port interrupt is triggered.  A fast 
386 or 486 can snag up to a couple thousand interrupts/sec.  The scheme
is, when your software detects the pulse rate is approaching the 
upper limit, you simply write out a new programming byte to the counter
to divide the incoming frequency by a higher divisor.  Similarly,
when the interrupt rate gets to slow, reduce the divisor.  With this 
scheme, you'd be looking literally at one chip in the digital section
and it could be powered from the parallel port.  JGD]


Now having downloaded the fit.zip I have developed an interest in FI !!! 
It would be useful to have the facility to test injectors etc, the "readme" in 
fit.zip references an article in performance engineering V1 No 1.  Is it 
possible for me to buy a reprint of this article ?? if so HOW ??

[You'll need both issues to complete the EFI bench.  The sample is free.
The first (and only) real issue is $6.  Just send that to me in 
US funds plus sufficient postage and I'll send you both magazines.
Figure postage for 4 ounces.  Send it to:  PE Magazine, PO Box 669728,
Marietta, GA 30066  JGD]

Mel.
e-mail  M.M.Leitch@newcastle.ac.uk

----------
Posted by: emory!newcastle.ac.uk!M.M.Leitch
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May  5 13:06:26 1994
Subject: TV: *Televised Events #94-18*
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8461
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

----------------------------------------------------------------------
			       TV Events

Now in its third year of weekly publication, TVE is a compilation of 
info. gleaned from TV listings, auto mags., newspapers, tea leaves, my 
favorite bartender, and the nice folks at TNN.  PLEASE confirm dates and 
times with your local listings before setting your VCRs.

TVE will USUALLY be updated no later than every Friday morning and will 
be most accurate (or least inaccurate) for the following 7 days. If your 
favorite event is "tba'd", please don't panic unless it's in the 7 day 
window.

As mentioned previously, this listing is now being submitted to the new 
group rec.autos.sport.info.  Assuming the moderators approve, this list 
will be available in the r.a.s.i group from now on.  In an attempt to get 
the word to as many r.a.s readers as possible, I will continue to cross-
post to r.a.s for a short time. (This again assumes the moderators of 
r.a.s.i do not object to my doing so.)

If you are having trouble with this list arriving at your site in
a timely fashion, please let me know via e-mail and I will also start
mailing you a copy.

Comments, suggestions, additions, extra pit passes, etc. to:
					  stoffel@oasys.dt.navy.mil

		   ---------------------------------

(T)=Taped  (L)=Live  (SD)=Same Day  (?)=dunno

12:00AM = 0000 hours = start of day

    EVENT                             DATE  TIME(Eastern, USA)  NETWORK

POWERBOAT RACING, STANTON (T)         05/05    12:30-1:30PM     HTS*
AMA SUPERBIKE, POMONA (T)             05/05    2:00-3:00PM      HTS*
Motor Sports Hour                     05/05    3:00-4:00PM      HTS*
MOTORCYCLE RACING (?)                 05/05    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
MotorWeek (Aurora)                    05/05    8:30-9:00PM      MPT**
NHRA, GATORNATIONALS, GAINESVILLE (T) 05/05    8:00-9:00PM      HTS*
AMA SUPERBIKE, POMONA (T)             05/05    9:00-10:00PM     HTS*
Motor Sports Hour                     05/05    10:00-11:00PM    HTS*
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (L)    05/05   11:00PM-12:00AM   HTS*
AMA SUPERCROSS, INDIANAPOLIS (T)      05/06    1:00-2:00AM      ESPN
Motoworld II                          05/06    6:30-7:00PM      ESPN2
Motoworld II                          05/07    12:30-1:00AM     ESPN2
Checkered Flag (F1 @ Imola)           05/07    1:30-2:00AM      ESPN
Speed Racer (cartoon)                 05/07    7:00-7:30AM      MTV
Shadetree Mechanic (timing chains)    05/07    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
MotorWeek                             05/07    10:00-10:30AM    WGN
BUSCH GN, LOUDON (L)                  05/07    1:00-4:00PM      TNN
Hydropower                            05/07    3:00-4:00PM      ESPN2
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              05/07    4:00-4:30PM      TNN
A Race For Heroes (Parnelli Jones)    05/07    4:30-5:00PM      ESPN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      05/07    4:30-5:00PM      TNN
MotorWeek (Aurora & Civic)            05/07    5:00-5:30PM      MPT**
Road To The Indianapolis 500          05/07    5:00-6:00PM      ESPN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               05/07    5:00-5:30PM      TNN
SpeedWeek                             05/08    12:30-1:00AM     ESPN
A Race For Heroes (Rodger Ward)       05/08    1:00-1:30AM      ESPN
Motoworld                             05/08    2:30-3:00AM      ESPN
BMW VINTAGE RACE, LIME ROCK (T)       05/08    3:30-4:30AM      ESPN
INDYCAR, LONG BEACH (T)               05/08    4:30-5:00AM      ESPN
IMSA, EXXON SUPREME, ATLANTA (T)      05/08    5:00-6:00AM      ESPN
SpeedWeek                             05/08    6:30-7:00AM      ESPN
Motoworld                             05/08    7:30-8:00AM      ESPN
Movie: Heart Like A Wheel             05/08    8:30-10:25AM     MAX
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               05/08    9:00-9:30AM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              05/08    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
N Bonnett's Winners (Connie Kalitta)  05/08    10:00-10:30AM    TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              05/08    10:30-11:00AM    TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      05/08    11:00-11:30AM    TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           05/08   11:30AM-12:00PM   TNN
World Of Speed & Beauty               05/08    2:00-2:30PM      TNN
N Bonnett's Winners (Connie Kalitta)  05/08    2:30-3:00PM      TNN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               05/08    3:00-3:30PM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              05/08    3:30-4:00PM      TNN
Legends Of The Brickyard (1979)       05/08    4:00-4:30PM      ESPN
Legends Of The Brickyard (1980)       05/08    4:30-5:00PM      ESPN
Legends Of The Brickyard (1978)       05/08    5:00-5:30PM      ESPN
NHRA, WINSTON INVITATIONAL, ROCKNGHM(T05/08    5:00-6:25PM      TNN
RaceDay Update w/Pat Patterson (L)    05/08    6:25-6:30PM      TNN
Shadetree Mechanic (timing chains)    05/08    7:00-7:30PM      TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              05/08    7:30-8:00PM      TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      05/08    8:00-8:30PM      TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           05/08    8:30-9:00PM      TNN
Road Test Magazine w/Don Garlits      05/08    11:00-11:30PM    TNN
World Of Speed & Beauty               05/08   11:30PM-12:00AM   TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           05/09    12:00-12:05AM    TNN
AMA?, DAYTONA 125CC SUPERCROSS (T)    05/09    12:05-1:30AM     TNN
Countdown To Indy                     05/09    11:00-11:30PM    HTS*
A Race For Heroes (Troy Ruttman)      05/10    1:00-1:30AM      ESPN
Legends Of The Brickyard (1981)       05/10    1:30-2:00AM      ESPN
A Race For Heroes (Jim Rathmann)      05/10    2:00-2:30AM      ESPN
Road To The Indianapolis 500          05/10    3:30-4:30AM      ESPN
SAAB PRO SERIES, SEBRING (T)          05/10    4:30-5:00AM      ESPN
Auto Racing?                          05/10    1:00-3:00PM      ESPN2
Drag Racing?                          05/10    3:00-4:00PM      ESPN2
INDY 500 PRACTICE (L)                 05/10    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN
Countdown To Indy                     05/10    11:00-11:30PM    HTS*
INDY 500 PRACTICE (L)                 05/11    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN
Countdown To Indy                     05/11    11:00-11:30PM    HTS*
NHRA, SOUTHERN NATIONALS, ATLANTA (T) 05/12    1:00-2:00PM      HTS*
AMA SUPERBIKES, POMONA (T)            05/12    2:00-3:00PM      HTS*
Motor Sports Hour                     05/12    3:00-4:00PM      HTS*
INDY 500 PRACTICE (L)                 05/12    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN
Motorcycle Racing?                    05/12    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
NHRA, SOUTHERN NATIONALS, ATLANTA (T) 05/12    7:00-8:00PM      HTS*
Countdown To Indy                     05/12    8:00-8:30PM      HTS*
MotorWeek (Cobra & Impala SS)         05/12    8:30-9:00PM      MPT**
AMA SUPERBIKES, POMONA (T)            05/12    9:00-10:00PM     HTS*
Motor Sports Hour                     05/12    10:00-11:00PM    HTS*
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (L)    05/12   11:00PM-12:00AM   HTS*
AMA SUPERCROSS (T)                    05/13    1:00-2:00AM      ESPN
INDY 500, LAST PRACTICE DAY (L)       05/13    2:00-3:00PM      ESPN
INDY 500, LAST PRACTICE DAY (L)       05/13    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN
Motoworld II                          05/13    6:30-7:00PM      ESPN2
Countdown To Indy                     05/13    11:00-11:30PM    HTS*
INDY 500, LAST PRACTICE DAY (T)       05/14    3:30-4:30AM      ESPN
Road To The Indianapolis 500          05/14    4:30-5:30AM      ESPN

		  ----------COMING EVENTS----------

NASCAR SOUTHWEST, SONOMA (L)          05/14    4:30PM           ESPN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, POLE DAY (L) 05/14    tba              tba
FORMULA 1, MONACO (L)                 05/15    9:20AM       ESPN,TSN [1]
NHRA Today, Memphis (L)               05/15    10:30-11:00AM    TNN
ASA, TOLEDO (L)                       05/15    1:00-3:30PM      TNN
WINSTON CUP, SEARS POINT (L)          05/15    4:00PM           ESPN
IROC #2, DARLINGTON (T)               05/15    tba              ABC
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 2ND DAY (L)  05/15    3:00PM       ESPN,TSN
NHRA Today, Memphis (L)               05/15    6:00-6:30PM      TNN
NHRA, MID-SOUTH NATIONALS (L)         05/15    6:30PM           TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Charlotte (L)  05/18   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Charlotte (L)  05/19   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Charlotte (L)  05/20   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
THE WINSTON SELECT, CHARLOTTE(L)      05/21    7:30-10:30PM     TNN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 3RD DAY (L)  05/21    5:00PM       ESPN,TSN
BUSCH GN, NAZARETH (L)                05/22    1:00PM           TNN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 4TH DAY (L)  05/22    4:00PM           ESPN
NHRA, NATIONALS, ENGLISHTOWN (?)      05/22    tba              tba
Indy 500 Festival Parade (L)          05/28    1:00-2:30PM      TNN
BUSCH GN, CHARLOTTE (?)               05/28    tba              tba
FORMULA 1, SPAIN (L)                  05/29    7:50-10:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
INDIANAPOLIS 500 (L)                  05/29   11:00AM-3:30PM    ABC
WINSTON CUP, CHARLOTTE (L)            05/29    5:00PM           TBS
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      06/01   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      06/02   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      06/03   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
BUSCH GN, DOVER (L)                   06/04    tba              TNN
WINSTON CUP, DOVER (L)                06/05    12:10PM          TNN
INDYCAR, MILWAUKEE (L)                06/05    4:00-6:00PM      ABC [1]
BUSCH GN, MYRTLE BEACH (?)            06/11    tba              tba
FORMULA 1, CANADA (L)                 06/12    2:00-4:00PM  ESPN,CBC
INDYCAR, DETROIT (L)                  06/12    2:00-4:30PM      ABC [1]
WINSTON CUP, POCONO (L)               06/12    12:30PM          TNN
IROC #3, TALLADEGA (T)                06/12    tba              ABC
NHRA, SPRINGNATIONALS, KIRKERSVILLE(?)06/12    tba              tba
WINSTON CUP, MICHIGAN (L)             06/19    1:00PM           CBS
BUSCH GN, WATKINS GLEN (?)            06/25    tba              tba
ASA, BRAINERD (L)                     06/26    tba              TNN
INDYCAR, PORTLAND (L)                 06/26    4:00-6:30PM      ESPN [1]
NHRA, NATIONALS, TOPEKA (?)           06/26    tba              tba
WINSTON CUP, DAYTONA (L)              07/02    11:00AM          ESPN
FORMULA 1, FRANCE (L)                 07/03    7:50-10:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
BUSCH GN, MILWAUKEE (?)               07/03    tba              tba
ASA, CEDAR RAPIDS (L)                 07/04    tba              TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Loudon (L)     07/06   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Loudon (L)     07/07   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Loudon (L)     07/08   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
FORMULA 1, GREAT BRITAIN (L)          07/10    8:50-11:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
WINSTON CUP, LOUDON (L)               07/10    1:00PM           TNN
INDYCAR, CLEVELAND (L)                07/10    1:30-3:30PM      ABC [1]

[1] CBC also carries all F1 and most IndyCar races (the Indy 500 & Long 
Beach will not be shown this year).  The races are usually broadcast on a 
tape-delayed basis at 11:37PM ET on the evening following the race.  I 
understand that it is not uncommon for CBC to delay the broadcast as much 
as an hour beyond the 11:37PM start, so please use extra caution if you 
plan to tape the race.  If you have access to it, and your French isn't 
too rusty, you may also want to check out RDS which used to broadcast 
each F1 race live. (I don't know for sure if they still do).  Thanks to 
Tak Ariga for info. on coverage in Canada.

* HTS (formerly Home Team Sports) is a regional sports network centered
in the Baltimore/Wash. DC area.  If you have a regional sports network,
please check their listings for these shows.  If they don't have them,
you may want to ask them why they don't.  Your times will almost
certainly vary from those shown with the probable exception of "This
Week In NASCAR".  On race weeks TWIN is usually broadcast live from a
 location somewhere near the track at 11:00PM (Eastern) on the Thursday 
before the race.  An interesting (IMO) show which usually includes a live 
audience, driver/guest, and viewer call-ins.  This show, as well as
many of the others, originate on the Prime Network.

Other possible cable sources for at least some of these shows;

    Network               Area                         Thanks to...

     ASN                Arizona                         Ben Loosli
     TSN                 Canada                       Tom Haapanen
     MSG                New York                    G. Bruce Rodgers
  SportSouth            Atlanta                      David Cornutt
    "    " (aka SPS) E. Tenn. & West NC                 Ken Key
  PrimeTicket         Southern CA                      Chuck Fry
    Empire              Buffalo
     NESN           Boston/N. England                 Trace Kangas
     KBL                Pittsburgh                   Mike Sturdevant
     PASS               Michigan                         Hartz
   Sunshine             Florida
     HSE                 Texas
     PSN           Minneapolis/St. Paul               Dean Barker
     PSN                Seattle                         Gary Eng
     PSN                Portland                       Mike Butts
  SportsChannel      San Francisco                     Chuck Fry
  SportsChannel (SC)    Chicago                      Jim Fuerstenberg

** MPT (Maryland Public TV) - "MotorWeek" is produced by MPT
and distributed to other public and commercial TV stations throughout
N. America.

-------

----------
Posted by: emory!oasys.dt.navy.mil!stoffel (Bill Stoffel)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May  5 16:39:59 1994
Subject: My Chevelle runs
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-> 345 HP version, followed by a 1990-case T700R4 with Corvette
-> converter, complete HD rebuild, anti-kickdown, and 4th gear
...
-> I had to cut the shaft and massage the firewall quite a bit to
-> get this in.  The cooler is the largest one I could find, and it

 Uh, Frank - did this car have the correct V8 mounts, or was it a
homemade swap?  My '65 Chevelle had a 327 and Turbo 400, and you could
practically wrap your arm around the transmission.  A T700 doesn't
*look* bigger than a 400...
                                                                            

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May  5 16:54:22 1994
Subject: C-6 Dimensions
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Hi All,
     I need to know about Ford C-6 transmission tailshaft
dimensions.  Does anyone know the length of the tailshaft for
    1) Big block w/C-6 in 1969 Mustang
    2) Big block w/C-6 in 1969 Torino/Cyclone
    3) Big block w/C-6 in 1972 Torino/Montego
    4) Big block w/C-6 in 1971 Mustang

     I'd appreciate this to no end.  I haven't been able to
find a definate answer on this.

Mark Zimmerman  1969 Mach I, 1969 Mercury Cyclone

----------
Posted by: emory!cray.com!maz (Mark A Zimmerman)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May  5 17:08:55 1994
Subject: RE: painting a Motorcycle...
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Eric,

First problem is that you thinned the paint. Any two part epoxy paints should 
only be reuced as recommended by the manufacuter. 

Did check the viscosity of the paint prior to painting. People often have 
problems with acrylic(epoxy) paints because they treat them like lacquers.

DuPont recommends spraying the paint @ 50-60 psi. Right? You should be
able to spray the paint at 50psi and not get any runs. The most important
thing is tempeture. This is why you need to check the vicosity. 

The reducers (not thinner) are varied for just this reason. 
SLOW for hat days 85-95 degree range
MED. for moderate days 70-85 "      "
FAST for cold days  55-70 "       "
and so on...

Now the Dupont Century is a 3 part system. 1:1:4 Right?

The last thing is that the "flash time" waiting between coats, was long
enough? Did you wait for the paint to flash? You might have had a hard time
on small areas trying to tell if the paint flashed. If it's cold (45-50)
then no matter what you did the paint is going to run ecspecailly if you thinned
it. If you can wait until it sunny I would or until the temps are up. This will
help you out. 

Now I would recommend lightly sanding down the paint and starting over. I know
what a pain, but at least you have a good base coat. If you any questions
call or e-mail me.

See ya
MPQ

----------
Posted by: emory!ingres.com!mquinn (Michael Quinn)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May  5 17:25:31 1994
Subject: Re: H20 injection
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: I added water injection to a 65 GTO 389, running 10.75:1, and it worked
: great.  I used to get a lot of rattle when punching it at lower rpms,
: and after water injection I could floor it in 3rd/4th at 35 mph and it
: would just pick up and go.  It was a very simple installation and it 
: helped, although I still ran half premium/half premium unleaded.


     Randy,
     Where did you get your water injection from?  I'd like to know
the brand, price, where you got it, etc.  I've heard that there are
some electronic ones around, but haven't really seen any.  Thanks
in advance.

Mark Zimmerman  '69 Mach I, '69 Mercury Cyclone

----------
Posted by: emory!cray.com!maz (Mark A Zimmerman)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May  6 01:46:51 1994
Subject: Re: Plumbing my shop for air - questions on tub
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In article @dixie.com, hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List) writes:
> 
> Hi all.  I know this went around a few months ago, but I can't find any of
> the articles (and I can't remember if they answered what I'm looking for) so
> I have a few questions.  
> 
> It's getting to the time when I am going to plumb my garage/shop for the 
> air compresser (I don't have the compressor yet.)  I am wondering what type
> of tubing is best to use and what the best method of joining the joints
> together is?  I'm probably going to plumb it all in behind the drywall, so
> looks aren't that important. :) :)
> 
> Also, any other suggestions are more that welcome.  Thanks!

PVC water pipe is the easiest and cheapest way to go!!
And its rated to 250-400psi.
----------
Posted by: emory!cray.com!rjm (Roger Mrdutt)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May  6 23:44:21 1994
Subject: Re: H20 injection
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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>Chip,
> 
>  > I too have had good result with water injection in my '66 Mustang with
>  > 10.5 CR.  I run 87 octane and never get a knock.
> 
>Sounds like just like what I'm looking for.
> 
>  > My system is quite refined to get the mixture ratios perfect yet, but
>  > it's getting close.
> 
>How do you know that the mixture isn't setup quite right? Does it stumble or
>do something else?
> 
>  > Let me know  if you want me to discribe my home made system.  It cost me
>  > about $35 to  build.
> 
>I for one would like to get a description.
> 
>Thanks in advance.
> 
> 
>Matt.

>----------
>Posted by: emory!genie.geis.com!p.beaubien1

Since I've had quite a bit of response about water injection I'll go 
ahead and post what I've written to others about my water injection system.

I learned almost everything I know about H2O injection from the Hotrod
list, so you might want to start by downloading all the late '92 and early
'93 archives of the list and searching for keywords like H20 and water. 

My system is no where near perfect yet, but I have some ideas how to get 
it there which I will be trying within the next month.  To start with 
I'll describe the situation mine is running under.  My engine is '289 V-8 
with the Edelbrock Performer RPM package (intake, cam, and edelbrock 
suggested head work)  I decided to go a step further than their package 
though.  They suggest 9.5 compression and 93 octane gas.  I went with 
10.5 compression because I love torque.  This obviously creates a problem 
with running any pump gas, and it did.  My engine knocks like crazy on 94 
octane with 1 oz lead added per gallon which makes it 96 octane.  I had 
to seek a solution to fix my knock and not spend a fortune on race 
blends.  Cheapest solution I've found is water injection.  I spent my 
load on the engine build up so I had to go cheap on the injection.  In 
doing so I fabricated a few parts (water tank, injectors, electronic 
control box, and vacuum switch).

The biggest problem in trying to retrofit my system to another car is the 
vacuum switch.  The switch on my system is a modification to my Edelbrock 
Performer carb.  The Performer carb has metering rods controlled by vacuum 
signal.  This worked out great for me since I needed injection when the 
engine was under load and the metering rods would raise up in the carb to 
switch the carb to power mode.  My modification was changing the cover 
plate for changing the rods, to a contact which the plunger, that drives 
the rods, would touch when the carb is in power mode.  This turns my 
water injection on whenever the carb goes into power mode.  This works 
ok, but is what I will be changing in my system in order to work out its 
flaws.  More on my idea for a better switching system later.

The injectors were almost too easy once I thought of them.  Since my 
intake is dual plane I needed two injectors.  My solution: Basket ball 
needles.  Since the water is best to not be vaporized when entering the 
cylinders, these worked out great.  All I did was solder the end whole 
shut so water could only come out the side and spot weld them to my air 
cleaner so they would shoot straight down the primary throats of my carb.  
When water is flowing the primaries are always open enough for the water 
to go straight through the carb and splash on the bottom of the intake.  
Any techies out there know if this theory is right, or should the water 
be vaporized?  I haven't heard much argument either way?

The water tank was the easiest to design but took the longest to
construct.  My tank holds 3 gallons of water.  ('66 Mustangs have a lot of
room to play with under the hood.) This lasts about 4 tanks of gas (about
220 miles per tank).  I would try and achieve at least 1 gallon capacity,
when building your own tank.  The tank is made of plexiglass which is
seamed with household silicone caulk.  The tank is supported in a frame
constructed of 1" angle steel welded together. 

To drive the injection I used a window washer pump.  The only 
restrictions on chosing a pump is make sure it is an impeller pump so you 
have a continuous flow of water.  The flow rate is controlled by a valve in 
line between the pump and the injectors.  

The circuitry is an important part of my systems operation.  Since my 
switch was inside my carb exposed to fuel vapor I had to avoid any 
sparks being generated.  My switch simply closes a ground so only one 
wire runs to my carb.  To turn the pump on I have a 10 amp, 12 volt relay 
I bought at radio shack.  The coil is charged when the wire to the carb 
is grounded.  The coil is I believe 320 ohm resistance so very little 
energy is required to flow through the coil reducing the chance of a 
spark.  The pump is powered whenever the relay is closed.  I also have 
a switch I added in the interior of my car to shut the injection off when 
the motor is not running, because without vacuum to open my switch water 
would flow with the engine is off and ignition turn on, like when 
starting the engine.  The circuitry will be growing more complex as I 
revise my system.  

The draw backs to my system as it stands now is only one flow rate for 
the water.  To fix that I am going to be constructing a multi stage vacuum 
switch.  How I plan to do this is similar to the way my carb knows when 
to go to power mode.  The vacuum of the intake is below a plunger 
sitting on a spring.  Right now this has only on or off operation.  I'm 
going to to make a longer tube for one of these plungers to ride on a 
taller spring.  I inherited a lathe so this is not a challenge to make.  
The tube will have small holes drilled through them on the side so light 
will shine from one side and be received on the other side by light 
sensitive resistors (sold at radio shack, I can remember what they are 
called right now).  These resistors will be wired to a series of relays 
which will power the pump through various resistors to run the pump at 
different speeds.  I'm going to try 4 stages of flow at first if that is 
still not enough flow control I will increase the number of stages.  
Here's a rough  side view of the vacuum switch:

	 _____     Top will have a small hole to allow air in the top.
	|     |
	|     |
        |  o  |    Stage four,  Very low vacuum at this point like at 
	|     |    wide open throttle when lots of water is needed.
        |     |
        |  o  |    Stage three
        |     |
	|     |
        |  o  |    Stage two
	|     |
	|     |
        |  o  |    Stage one, small flow rate when plunger first covers 
	|     |    this hole and stops light. 
	| ___ |
	||   ||
	||   ||
	||   ||
	||   ||
	||   ||
	||   ||
	||___||
	| \   |
	|  \  |    Spring long enough to push plunger to top of cylinder 
	|   \ |	   under low vacuum.  Vacuum signal is routed to the
	|____\|	   bottom of the cylinder from the intake.
    

The location of the holes will have to be determined experimentally.  

My investments in this system thus far:
  Water pump:  $12 (auto zone)
  plexi-glass: $6  (WalMart)
  angle steel: $4  (local steel supply)
  basket ball needles: $0.75 (WalMart)
  Relay: $1.99 (Radio Shack)
  Circuit box: $0.99 (Radio Shack)
  Silicone Caulk: $3.75 (WalMart)
  Wire and widow washer hose I had laying around.
  Interior switch: $1.99 (Radio Shack)  

  I spent about $10 working with a throttle switch, which I scrapped for 
the interior switch.

Adding my new switching system will probably cost about $20 - $30 in
material, it will require 4 relays, 4 light sensors, light bulb, and about
6" of 3/4" brass stock. 

Any questions, let me know.  I'd probably be willing to sell a copy of my 
final system when working.  I could reconstruct the system fairly easily 
after doing it once.

Chip Schweiss
lschweis@nyx.cs.du.edu


----------
Posted by: emory!nyx10.cs.du.edu!lschweis (Lester Schweiss)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May  6 23:57:31 1994
Subject: Welding A Cast Iron Block
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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I am seeking information on experiences of successful welding of cast iron
engine blocks.  

I have a 1936 SS-Jaguar 1.5 L engine with freeze damage to the external
water jacket. A hole about four inches in diameter (including the freeze
plug) has cracked out, plus some line cracks.  Since the engine has cast-in
babbit bearings, I do not wish to heat treat the block before and after
welding as in the standard approach. 

Renyolds (from Hemmings) advised "touch MIG welding" with one touch every
few minutes so that the surrounding material never really heats up and
develops high stresses. He also advised the drill/tap/screw method.

Has anyone successfully repaired a cast iron block without heat treating?

All information greatly appreciated.

[MG (the welding rod company) lists a rod for no-preheat, no heat
treat welding of cast iron.  They note in the application note that
the metal is not machinable.  JGD]

----------
Posted by: emory!fnal.gov!nezrick (Frank Nezrick)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat May  7 00:08:17 1994
Subject: powder coating
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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I am looking to get a buncha parts for my car powder coated. I know very
little about the process. All I know that it is much more resistant to
scratching and chipping then paint.
How is the process exactly done and what are the pros and cons to it.
What should I look out for?? Is the coating exhaust manifold heat resistant?
Thanks for helping....

Frank

----------
Posted by: emory!OAS.PSU.EDU!FBS3     (SZYMKOWSKI.FRANK)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat May  7 21:47:15 1994
Subject: Air cleaner assembly ffor '70 Mercury
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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I need an air cleaner for a 1970 Mercury with a 429 CID engine. Any good 
sources? Junk yards or mail order?

Paul

--
kroth@railnet.nshore.org (paul roth)
Railnet BBS +1 216 786 0476

----------
Posted by: emory!railnet.nshore.org!kroth (paul roth)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat May  7 21:59:41 1994
Subject: Re: Headers for a tight fit ( 428 -> '69 Mustang )
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: Question:
: Was a 428 ever available in a '69 Mustang?  428 Medium riser.  Did they do 
: something special with the shock towers (ala 429 Boss?).
      
     Yes, they came in either the 428 CJ or 428 SCJ flavors.  There was
also a 390 available that is about the same amount of fun to work on.
And no, there were no shock tower modifications like the Boss 429 had.
The shock towers had some extra bracing (molded plate by the frame), 
but I think all '69s had this and the '68s didn't.  My Mustang is 
originally a 390 car, but I had a 428 SCJ in it and yes, it's a pain
with headers.

: What about headers?  This car was bought with Hooker Super Comps.  Every 
: thing seemed to fit O.K. when driving down the road - but access to certain 
: bolts, and starter motor is severly limited - not to mention header bolt 
: problems.

     The headers I had were Hedman headers and they didn't even fit the
block (requiring some dimpling of the headers) and if I remember right,
as this was about ten years ago, I had that engine in and out about
three or four times before I figured out the right sequence of installing
the whole combination.  Alot of nasty words in the garage to be sure.

: Short of fiberglass lift of front end what would you suggest to make this 
: install easier.

     The lift off won't help as the shock towers and engine compartment
panels are welded onto the frame.  And if this is an original 428 car,
cutting it all up just to get at the headers would be a major sin since
these cars are getting way up there in value if they're in any kind of
shape.  Keep an eye on some Mustang magazines and you'll see what I  
mean.
     Alot of us would love to have a chassis that has the "Q" or "R"
as the engine code (fourth or fifth digit in the car's serial number).

: Things I have considered:
: 1) Drilling out the treads on some of the transmission mountings (esp 
: starter motor) so that the bolt can be threaded in from the fire wall side 
: with a nut on the engine side.  Bolt access was a major slow down.
: 2) Drilling access holes in the wheel well so that we can get at the header 
: bolts.
: 3) custom headers.

: Any suggestions or ideas or stories about how you got around a tight fir 
: would be appriciated. 

: The way we got the motor out was to separate the engine and trans.  Tilt 
: the engine ~ 45 degress - with headers still attached - and then remove the 
: trans.  Then with careful manuvering the engine cam out.  Since we didn't 
: have a tie-rod fork the steering wasn't remove (and the air compressor 
: wasn't working and we didn't feel like muscling the steering box and idler 
: arm bolts..

     It does help alot if you take out the idler arm bolts that go   
through the frame.  You can kind of swing down the steering mechanism
for more clearance on alot of that starter access.  The crossmember is
bolted in also and I removed mine for more access when working on it.
Be patient, when it's running right, it's worth it.

Mark Zimmerman '69 Mach I, '69 Mercury Cyclone

     P.S.  Again, don't go cutting it up though.  It'll fit and
you'll look like you know what you're doing when you get it done.
Again, the price of the original 428 cars should make you think
twice about cutting it up and ruining the value.

----------
Posted by: emory!cray.com!maz (Mark A Zimmerman)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat May  7 22:04:42 1994
Subject: red lead stuff
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 I'm doing my first differential rebuild.  The service manual calls for
using red lead paste to check the gear alignment.  "No problem," thinks
I, "I'll just bop over to the store and buy some."

 BRAWWK!  Not so simple, clodhopper...

 So far no local parts store or dealer carries or can get any, and I
can't find any in any of my catalogs.  What *is* "red lead paste" and
where can I get some?
                                                                    

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat May  7 22:12:32 1994
Subject: Welding A Cast Iron Block
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-> [MG (the welding rod company) lists a rod for no-preheat, no heat
-> treat welding of cast iron.  They note in the application note that
-> the metal is not machinable.  JGD]

 You can get both machineable and non-machineable rods for cast iron.
The non-machineable ones are hard as hell, but the machineable rods are
very nice.  You can even hand-scrape welded gasket areas.


-> water jacket. A hole about four inches in diameter (including the
-> freeze plug) has cracked out, plus some line cracks.  Since the

 My local welder guy (I can burn stuff together, but I take important
stuff to him) has done half a dozen blocks and heads for me over the
years without a single problem.  You've got lots of metal in that
thickwall Jag block, and the water jacket isn't part of the major
structure, so it should be no sweat.
                                                                                                                           

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun May  8 01:46:29 1994
Subject: Re: Headers for a tight fit ( 428 -> '69 Mustang )
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     I couldn't remember yesterday, but I do believe that a 
company in California named Ford Power Parts (you should be
able to get the address and phone number from a Mustang    
magazine) has a shock tower modification kit also.  It 
involves cutting the shock tower similar to what was done
on the Boss 429 cars.  Can't tell you what is involved, what
else is done or what ever though, but they did list a 
shock tower modification kit.

Mark Zimmerman '69 Mach I, '69 Mercury Cyclone

----------
Posted by: emory!cray.com!maz (Mark A Zimmerman)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun May  8 01:56:24 1994
Subject: Re: H20 injection
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>[nice description of water injection system deleted]
>
>  I spent about $10 working with a throttle switch, which I scrapped for 
>the interior switch.
>
>Adding my new switching system will probably cost about $20 - $30 in
>material, it will require 4 relays, 4 light sensors, light bulb, and about
>6" of 3/4" brass stock. 
>
>
>Chip Schweiss
>lschweis@nyx.cs.du.edu

Was the throttle switch you tried a simple on/off switch?  How about using
a throttle-position sensor (a potentiometer whose output voltage is directy
proportional to throttle opening)?  You could use this low-current signal
to control a power transistor which drives your pump, to get more flow as
the throttle opens.  Some simple analog electronics could provide a minimum
threshold below which there is no flow, and you could tailor the pump
voltage-throttle opening curve to whatever water delivery curve you wanted.

Regards,

Carl Ijames     ijames@helix.nih.gov


----------
Posted by: emory!helix.nih.gov!ijames (Carl F. Ijames)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun May  8 03:40:49 1994
Subject: Re: Ultimate Transmission ? !
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In article <1fk6j+#@dixie.com> hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List) writes:
>From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
>Subject: Ultimate Transmission ? !
>Date: Thu, 05 May 94 01:20:12 GMT

>FYI:

>Following a lead from Car Cruft magazine... I called G-Force Products.  
>Among other things they market their own line of performance 4 and 5 speeds
>.  These are all out transmissions.......

Would these have the gear teeth on the face of the gear?   I remember reading 
about these face-tooth geared transmissions awhile back....   does anyone have
any info on these?    thanks -rex

----------
Posted by: emory!indiana.edu!BURTON (J REX BURTON)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun May  8 21:43:23 1994
Subject: Re:  My Chevelle runs
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Regarding the T700/T400 fit issues, I do have the correct V8 mounts.

The main problem I had was with the area around the starter, which
also houses the cooler lines.  I had to move a section of firewall
about the size of a paperback book.  To me, this being the first 
firewall smashing I have done, and the section being at a three-way
fold, it seemed like quite a bit of work.  I worked the area cold, and
even with a good-sized hammer, it took a while.

Currently, my cheesy 2-core radiator leaks :(

Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097

----------
Posted by: emory!rebel.dsea.com!frank (Frank Evan Perdicaro)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun May  8 21:48:40 1994
Subject: Re:H2O injection
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Much has been said about water injection
on the list lately.

There seems to be much emphasis on home 
made units?? 

What about the system by 
Edelbrock?? All of the hard work is done
for you by a company with more money and
development time and money than most of us. 
The system has RPM and vacuums sensors and
in my opinion is very well priced. I paid
about US$125 here in Australia, so it should 
be even cheaper in the USA. 

John 

[speaking for me only, a) buying shit and bolting it on takes all the 
fun out, and b) Edelbrock has a lot of loot but I'm not sure how the
split between R&D and Hype&Marketing is but I suspect we get the short
end of the stick.  JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!spri.levels.unisa.edu.au!johnt (John Tsimbinos)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun May  8 23:55:57 1994
Subject: spun main bearings
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 A friend of mine works for a local Chevy dealer and has obtained three
1993-1994 350 short blocks, replaced under warranty in trucks and vans.
Two spun the #3 main bearings, one spun #1.  This may be an ongoing
block or bearing problem for GM.  Anyway, these engines are otherwise
low mileage (one has less than 100 miles!) virtually-new truck motors.
One even has four bolt mains and the one-piece rear main.

 We were talking about what to do with them.  The "correct" solution, of
course, is to disassemble them, have them line bored, then tanked and
new freeze plugs and cam bearings.  This is a fair amount of trouble,
plus it costs money - line boring alone is $100 to $150 around here,
plus $50-$75 for tanking and cam bearing installation.  (I really need
to make a cam bearing tool on the lathe)

 Since he's talking about dropping an engine in his old play car, we
don't need a "proper" fix.  The one engine we have apart has bad scars
on the #1 main.  It's still the correct size by the mike, but the mike
is only seeing the high spots.  There wouldn't be a whole lot of
retention once the cap was torqued.  (no crush)

 Some older cars used to have larger-OD bearings available for just this
sort of problem, but I haven't seen any in years.  I came up with three
ideas to patch the engines up enough to use:

1) stipple (centerpunch) the journal to bite the bearing shells.  This
   is common on machinery, but it might not last long on an engine.

2) drill through the bearing and into the block and insert a roll pin,
   a'la aluminum rods.  This ought to work.

3) just Loctite the damned shell in.  I favor this one.  It's simple,
   the bearing would have no way to shift, there'd be good thermal
   contact between the bearing and block, the block and bearing would
   not be altered or modified, and the Loctited bearings can be removed
   with a propane torch and a punch, no trouble.  Loctite makes umpteen
   zillion different kinds of goops, including ones designed for exactly
   this sort of application.
                                                                                             

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  9 03:40:59 1994
Subject: Re:  My Chevelle runs
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-> Currently, my cheesy 2-core radiator leaks :(

 Local prices would be around $150 to have your radiator recored, $225
for a new 3 core.  On the other hand, the dirt track/NASCAR magazines
have ads from radiator shops who will sell you a brand new three or four
row aluminum racing radiator for less than $200; you'll have to build
your own brackets, but it's a lot of radiator!
                                                            

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  9 03:49:24 1994
Subject: Re:H2O injection
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-> There seems to be much emphasis on home
-> made units??
-> What about the system by
-> Edelbrock?? All of the hard work is done

 You can make your own for $10-$20 depending on the contents of your
scrapbox.  Last I looked, Edelbrock wanted considerably more than that.
                                             

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  9 03:54:05 1994
Subject: Re: H2O injection
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>>Much has been said about water injection
>>on the list lately.
>>
>>There seems to be much emphasis on home 
>>made units?? 
>>
>>What about the system by 
>>Edelbrock?? All of the hard work is done
>>for you by a company with more money and
>>development time and money than most of us. 
>>The system has RPM and vacuums sensors and
>>in my opinion is very well priced. I paid
>>about US$125 here in Australia, so it should 
>>be even cheaper in the USA. 
>>
>>John 
>>


>
>[speaking for me only, a) buying shit and bolting it on takes all the 
>fun out, 

You are right, as long as the shit that the user builds himself is as
good, or better that the `shit' he can buy. For example, I don't think it
would be much fun experimenting with a home made water injector with
insufficient or incorrectly calibrated sensing/electronics that may 
feed to much water and ruin a $5000 engine. 


>and b) Edelbrock has a lot of loot but I'm not sure how the
>split between R&D and Hype&Marketing is but I suspect we get the short
>end of the stick.  JGD]

Again, you are probably right about the short end of the stick, 
but even the short end of a very big stick is often all that 
it takes for product development.
(eg. 1% of $XX,000,000 is more money than I have)


----------
Posted by: emory!spri.levels.unisa.edu.au!johnt (John Tsimbinos)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  9 12:38:44 1994
Subject: Re: H2O injection
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-> You are right, as long as the shit that the user builds himself is as
-> good, or better that the `shit' he can buy. For example, I don't
-> think it would be much fun experimenting with a home made water
-> injector with insufficient or incorrectly calibrated
-> sensing/electronics that may feed to much water and ruin a $5000
-> engine.

 What makes you think the Edelbrock unit would be even close to what you
need?

 Too little water is obvious - you still have detonation.  You're not
likely to get too much water unless you use a garden hose.
                    

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  9 18:56:44 1994
Subject: Re: red lead stuff
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Dave Williams wrote:
 So far no local parts store or dealer carries or can get any, and I
can't find any in any of my catalogs.  What *is* "red lead paste" and
where can I get some?

I don't know if us mere mortals can get it any more.  It is a lead compound
with a reddish color.  It's a soft paste.  I suspect that it may have been
used in paints in the past.  I suspect that it is "politically incorrect"
at this time.

A satisfactory substitute is Dykem layout paint.  The purpose of the
red lead paste was to allow you to see if the gears were touching in
the correct places.  The red lead paste would be squeezed out of the
contact areas and thus would show the fit.  The Dykem will be worn
off by the gear contact and will show you the same thing.  It's a bigger
nuisance because the gears have to be degreased for the Dykem to stick,
and you may have to spray the gears a number of times.  And when you
are done you will need a good solvent to take off the Dykem.  I have used
the usual solvents such as acetone and MEK.  Maybe alchohol would work
better; the Dykem is alchohol based.  Hoppe's #9 Nitro Powder Solvent
seems to work very well so maybe kerosene would work.

Bob Hale   hale@brooktree.com

[I'd consider Dykem to permanent to be useful.  What you want is something
that will leave a distinctive mark as a thin film and yet rub off easily.
I noticed at the last NHRA race I attended that the Strange Gear people
were using what looked to me like a white pigmented, very thin grease.
Richmond Gear was using something that looked very similar.  I'd not be 
surprised to find that they'd mixed titanium dioxide paint pigment with
some light white grease.  A call to either Strange or Richmond should
reveal the secret formula.  Me, I use exactly that.  Titanium dixoide
paint pigment is available from paint stores.  JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!brooktree.com!hale (bob hale)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  9 19:08:50 1994
Subject: Re: spun main bearings
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Dave Williams wrote about a block with a spun bearing, and the possibilities
for fixing it:
3) just Loctite the damned shell in.  I favor this one.  It's simple,
   the bearing would have no way to shift, there'd be good thermal
   contact between the bearing and block, the block and bearing would
   not be altered or modified, and the Loctited bearings can be removed
   with a propane torch and a punch, no trouble.  Loctite makes umpteen
   zillion different kinds of goops, including ones designed for exactly
   this sort of application.


I'm not so sure that the heat transfer would be good enough after filling
the space between the bearing and the block with Locktite.  Is there any
data on the thermal resistance of Locktite?  The problem is that there
are now large voids between the bearing and the block and those will be
full of several mils of hardened Locktite.

Bob Hale   hale@brooktree.com

----------
Posted by: emory!brooktree.com!hale (bob hale)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  9 19:26:54 1994
Subject: Re: Ultimate Transmission ? !
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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>>Following a lead from Car Cruft magazine... I called G-Force Products.  
>>Among other things they market their own line of performance 4 and 5 speeds
>>.  These are all out transmissions.......
>
>Would these have the gear teeth on the face of the gear?   I remember reading 
>about these face-tooth geared transmissions awhile back....   does anyone have
>any info on these?    thanks -rex

>From the conversation - they seem to have 4 or 6 (or something like that) 
engagement lugs on the side of the gears.  I recently (Saturday) got the 
flyer they send out.  Seems these engagement lugs are ramped on one side (
for the clutchless trans)  This allows the trans to be engaged in two gears 
at once - the slower / lower gear would then be overdriven.  This 
eliminates the need to unload the low gear before the shifter lever can be 
moved.  This also means that decelorating against the gears is impossible.

They also claim to use a unique methode to engage the nuext gear.

Again these transmission are expensive - but they have survived against 
fully clutchless shifting in 1200hp NHRA Pro Stock cars 2500lbs and 15" 
wide slicks.  The problem they had in Pro-Stock was violent tire shake 
seems Lenco's are a little softer...

Now if the company could sells these transmissions for $2000.......

Dirk

----------
Posted by: emory!indiana.edu!BURTON (J REX BURTON)
 


----------
Posted by: emory!STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV!OADDAB (DIRK BROER)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  9 19:37:41 1994
Subject: Re: red lead stuff
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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 So far no local parts store or dealer carries or can get any, and I
can't find any in any of my catalogs.  What *is* "red lead paste" and
where can I get some?
                                                                    
-----------------------------------

It is also blue (sometimes) ...... that's what I used.
Even Al's got it!

it is called something like (prussian) blue dye, comes in a little tooth-paste
like tube.


					Peter

----------
Posted by: Pierre-Henry Marbot 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  9 19:43:15 1994
Subject: FREE AUTOMOTIVE VIDEO CATALOG
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If anyone would like to recieve a free catalog full of the best
automotive videos around from Carroll Shelby to Pro Modifieds to antique trucks E- mail me at 
wldaboutwhls@delphi.com   From the producers of the hit t.v. series
Wild About Wheels.

----------
Posted by: emory!delphi.com!WLDABOUTWHLS
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  9 19:47:42 1994
Subject: V6 Pinto for the drag strip?
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I am interrested in setting up one of the V6 Pintos for the local drag
strip and would like to know a few things:

1) Has anyone in the group tried this?  If so, why didn't you do it or
   how was it if you did?

2) Does anyone make aftermarket parts for this motor?  I remember there
   was a place that did stuff the the 4 cyl. quite awhile back.

3) If there anything about this motor which makes it a particularly bad
   choice?

4) Were manual transmissions available for it anywhere, or are adaptors
   available/needed?

I am interrested in this because it seems I could start into it fairly
cheap and it just seems like a fun car to attempt w/o a shop full of

----------
Posted by: emory!alpham.cerfnet.com!Steve_Lawson
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May  9 22:02:09 1994
Subject: SUMMARY: motorcycle frame painting
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Thankx to all of you who answered my questions.

Rephrased, my problem was with painting a complex (many tubes)
motorcycle frame- I was getting both runs and rough paint from
overspray, using DuPont Centurion 2-pack paint.


What I would up doing was this:  I sprayed it with paint &
hardener, no reducer (thinner).  Of course, I sanded out the
runs and rough overspray paint from before.   I also used a small
camel-hair brush to get some paint onto the most difficult-to-reach
spots and into some of the deep crevices, so I wouldn't be tempted
to spray too much in those areas and thereby get runs next to the
spots I was trying to cover.

I also set the air pressure back down to 30-40 psi, and changed the
gun's adjustments to a fan pattern instead of a spot pattern.
This was so I'd get less paint in any one area and reduce the chances of
runs. 

It worked out pretty well.  The paint went on slower, and without
reducer, it took a lot longer to dry.  Even when I was done with
the second coat, it was still tacky.  Then I hit it with a couple
light coats of pure reducer (thanks for the suggestion) to get the
paint to smooth out.  Looking at it this morning, I found only two
small spots of rough overspray paint, and no runs.  I'll wet-sand them
out, brush-paint them, and then wet-sand that to smooth it out.
They're not in really noticable spots, and this is a race bike, not
a show bike, so I won't be all that worried if the paint's not
completly perfect..

I wound up with a less-glossy finish than I'd gotten with the reducer.
That's ok with me, it's about how I wanted it to look.

-- 
            Eric Murray                 ericm@microunity.com
In this game, the winner is also the loser, and the judge's decisions are final

----------
Posted by: emory!MicroUnity.com!ericm (Eric Murray)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 03:43:04 1994
Subject: dissolving Dykem Blue/Red
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Dykem Blue probably isn't much use for setting up gears, but it's good for
laying out steel parts for machining.  

The best thing I've found to dissolve it is Methyl Alcohol -- it works even
faster than Acetone.  Methyl Alcohol also works great for dissolving the
permanent ink left behind by those "Sharpie" pens.

Sharpie pens can also be used to draw traces on home-made circuit boards
before etching.  The "etch-resist" pens they sell at electronics stores for
around $2.00 are actually just 49 cent "Sharpie" permanent ink pens.  I like
to use Sharpie pens to lay out cut lines on aluminum.  The ink is bold and
black and stays there until you wipe it off with some methyl alcohol when
you're through.

If you use titanium dioxide in a paste to set up gears, you should try to
clean it all off carefully.  Titanium dioxide is kind of abrasive.  I think
they used to use lead compounds because they were so soft, and because they
act like a high-pressure lubricant.

Tom

----------
Posted by: Tom Carver 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 03:58:34 1994
Subject: H2O inject with LPG!,,?
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Hi all , 
        I have a FJ45 Toyota Landcruiser which is power by a 350 chev and 
runs on LPG, with the LP the 350 runs a little hot and I`m worried about my
cast valve seats in the head, now would water injection help to make the 
motor run cooler and/or do any good for the valve seats??

  I have my Landcruiser in bits at the moment and I think I`ll have to 
use some bits i have accumulated to build a strong gas motor, does anyone 
have experience with LPG cams, the motor will use:

                         350 4bolt Flat top forged pistons
                         492 angel plug Double humps($300 worth of porting
                         ,angel milled down to 57cc chambers)
I bought the heads milled, they were used in the U.S. for some sort of 
stock class of Nascar racing!
                         Elderbrock Vic Jnr manifold.
                         Recurved HEI (22intial,39total)
                         Roller rockers and flat tappet lifters
                         600 cfm Holley(acting as the throttle body for
                         Impco 425a complex gas mixer)
                         Impco 300l series gas converter.

Because this is a 4wd the cam must have  very strong torque down too about
600 rpm, the motor would have about 11:1 compression, I don`t want to go
to conservative on the cam(262, .39 lift etc), i have seen small blocks
with cams like 272,284,.454,.484 run on gas and they go down to low rpms
on gas with no cough in very soft sand on the beach !
Is there a recomended thing to do when running LPG (more lift ,dual pattern
different lifts between int/ex ????????????)

Other goods bit i have just bought that will go in when i put it back 
together :      4.11 Detroit locker for the rear
                86 Nissan patrol 5 speed box (12% overdrive, and a way 
way way stronger transfer case)

Any help and suggestion are greatly aprciated.
Justin...

 

 



----------
Posted by: Justin Zrinski 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 04:30:12 1994
Subject: Re: Headers
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In article <7k-65bb@dixie.com>, you write...
>  I have a 1970 Camaro and I'm thinking of installing headers, but I'm
>not sure which kind to use.  I've narrowed it down to either Hooker
>Competition or Blackjack AK5000.  I'm leaning towards the Blackjack because
>of the aluminum coating, but I'd first like to know if anyone has had any
>experience, good or bad, with either.  Any comments on the strengths or
>weaknesses on both of these headers would be appreciated.  Thanks.
>                                -- Mazz
I've used Blackjacks before.  The price was good, the weight
savings were as expected, fuel economy and horsepower were
noticably increased, and that all-important sound was there
(even with generic turbo mufflers). Drawbacks: The head
bolt holes seemed too close to the tubes; had a heck of a time
getting the bolts started and you may as well forget using a
rachet on some of them.  The header walls lost their black
color near the heads and further down they began to rust.
I live in New Mexico. It's a desert; no humidity to speak of.
I'd hate to see the rust problem in a coastal state.

Installation: Typical amount of difficulty - I put my '72
Nova on wheel ramps and installed the headers from underneath.

I've never tried Hooker headers, so I can't comment.  Perhaps
the newer blackjacks are better than mine were (10 years ago).
> 
A car with headers performs better. I gained 4mpg, more power,
and lost about 20 pounds off the front of the car.
Can't go wrong with headers! 
Hope this helped.

----------
Posted by: emory!APSICC.APS.EDU!WOLF
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 12:44:35 1994
Subject: Re: H20 injection
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In article  hotrod@dixie.com writes:

>The circuitry is an important part of my systems operation.  Since my 
>switch was inside my carb exposed to fuel vapor I had to avoid any 
>sparks being generated.  My switch simply closes a ground so only one 
>wire runs to my carb.  To turn the pump on I have a 10 amp, 12 volt relay 
>I bought at radio shack.  The coil is charged when the wire to the carb 
>is grounded.  The coil is I believe 320 ohm resistance so very little 
>energy is required to flow through the coil reducing the chance of a 
>spark.  The pump is powered whenever the relay is closed.  I also have 

The coil of a relay is inductive impedance, not resistive.  Inductive
circuits _always_ spark when switched.  You want a high impedance coil, not
low, since less current flows through a high impedance circuit.  Less
current means less spark, obviously.  I would consider using a solid-state
relay rather than a coil relay, or a switching circuit using MOS transistors.
Or a sealed switch would work.  I think you might be able to get one from
a marine shop.

Of course, you obviously haven't blown up, so the setup must work, but...
I would be extremely leery if this was in my car.  Otherwise this really
sounds like a great idea.  It's amazing what you can accomplish for little $$$
if you put your head to it.

Steve Ravet	sravet@bangate.compaq.com
"Baby you're a genius when it comes to cooking up some chili sauce...."

----------
Posted by: emory!bangate.compaq.com!sravet
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 13:00:48 1994
Subject: No Subject Line
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Does anyone know the name/address/phone number of the shop (I think it's
in Jacksonville, Fla.) that specializes in gofasters for the Ford SVO 2.3
litre engine? I'm talking about using the powertrain combination from
a 84 or 85 Mustang. I believe the 87 and 88 Thunderbird Turbo Coupes
used the same engine but they were hooked up to a T5 instead of the
German Ford 5 speed as the early Mustangs used. Any information you can
provide is appreciated. Thanks.

----------
Posted by: Bob Bigelow 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 13:16:28 1994
Subject: Re: red lead stuff
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 What about yer basic zinc oxide ointment goo? Oil based, very white, 
fluoresces nicely under black light.

----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 13:29:12 1994
Subject: Re: red lead stuff
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In article  hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List) writes:
>  I'm doing my first differential rebuild.  The service manual calls for
> using red lead paste to check the gear alignment.  "No problem," thinks
> I, "I'll just bop over to the store and buy some."
> 
>  BRAWWK!  Not so simple, clodhopper...

Whip round to you local enginering supply and get some 'blue'.

It may take some chasing though. I asked a GOOD machinest where
he got it, and went there.

--
~Paul
                                                       +61 (09) 257-1001
prep@yarrow.wt.uwa.edu.au ( preferred )                1 Crescent Rd,
zrepachol@cc.curtin.edu.au                             Kalamunda,
                                                       West Aust    6076

----------
Posted by: emory!yarrow.wt.uwa.edu.au!prep (Paul Repacholi)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 13:48:14 1994
Subject: Re: H2O inject with LPG!
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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The Hotrod List writes:
>         I have a FJ45 Toyota Landcruiser which is power by a 350 chev and 
> runs on LPG, with the LP the 350 runs a little hot and I`m worried about my
> cast valve seats in the head, now would water injection help to make the 
> motor run cooler and/or do any good for the valve seats??
 
1st, how hot is hot?  Anyway, I doubt water injection is going to do
much for you, you need to fix the cooling system.

>   I have my Landcruiser in bits at the moment and I think I`ll have to 
> use some bits i have accumulated to build a strong gas motor, does anyone 
> have experience with LPG cams, the motor will use:

I don't have much experience with LPG, but I have worked with CNG.
We didn't cam any differently for CNG.
 
>                          Elderbrock Vic Jnr manifold.

If you need low end torque (600rpm?!?!), then this is absolutely the
wrong manifold to be running.  Trade it for a Performer.a

>                          Recurved HEI (22intial,39total)

Hmmm...  those number are without the vacuum advance, right?  That
initial advance sounds kinda high to me, especially if you plan to be
running WOT at 600rpm.  I don't have the spark table from ym truck
handy, but I believe we had about 15 degrees of initial advance, and
that was on CNG which needs more advance than LPG.  We were running
11:1 compression, with 64cc heads and popup pistons.

>                          600 cfm Holley(acting as the throttle body for
>                          Impco 425a complex gas mixer)

Did you know that the 425 will bolt directly to the Holley throttlebody?
If you're running LPG, it makes for a lot cleaner installation than
running a hat on top of a complete gasoline carb.  It also lets you sit
a "normal" aircleaner directly on the mixer.

Something else you might be concerned about is your mixture...  I'm sure
the 425 works better on propane than it did on CNG, but that isn't
saying much.  I'd definately get an O2 sensor in one of the collectors
and see whats going on.  I'm not sure where you want run mixture-wise on
propane, on CNG we had to run lean at WOT (peak temp is rich of stoich
with CNG...  your burn holes in pistons when you go rich).  You might
give Autotronics (MSD) in El Paso a call (ask them about their closed
loop systems for Impco's, and while you've got them on the phone,
conveniently ask them about proper WOT tuning for propane).

Personally, I like the OHG mixers a lot more than the Impco's.  There
isn't a whole lot in the way of tuning you can do on the Impco other
than changing springs in the convertor..  The OHG has gas valves that
are readily changed and easily modified so you can shape the fuel curve
to whatever you need.


-- 
Jonathan R. Lusky  --  lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu
 "Turbos are nice but I'd rather be blown!"
   89 Jeep Wrangler - 258 / pile of junk!
       80 Toyota Celica - 20R / 5spd

----------
Posted by: emory!knuth.mtsu.edu!lusky (Jonathan R. Lusky)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 13:55:16 1994
Subject: Re: Plumbing my shop for air - questions on tub
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>PVC water pipe is the easiest and cheapest way to go!!
>And its rated to 250-400psi.
>----------
>Posted by: emory!cray.com!rjm (Roger Mrdutt)

I opt against this, because the PVC can degrade with many factors
like sunlight exposure and chemical exposure.  When it bursts, it's 
like a grenade.

(I suppose I'd consider it if I used it only for painting 
and kept the pressure down to 40-50 PSI)

I prefer copper at least "L" type.  

-Eric


-- 
One has to wonder how many people who had the "I believe you, Anita"
bumperstickers will place a "I believe you, Paula" sticker right next
to it . . . 
Or was the original sticker placed more for politics than principal?

----------
Posted by: emory!everest.Stanford.EDU!eap (Eric Perozziello)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 16:54:56 1994
Subject: Radiators
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-> Currently, my cheesy 2-core radiator leaks :

Here is my input. I bought a 3-core Modine for my truck at Pep Boys. It
was brand new and cost me only $125.00 at the time. 

Is there a Pep Boys in your neighborhood?

Just a thought.

See ya
MPQ

----------
Posted by: emory!ingres.com!mquinn (Michael Quinn)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 18:16:00 1994
Subject: N2O
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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A friend of mine told me I could get de-natured
N2O (N2O+a little SO2) from a welding supply place.
But they said all they had was N2O and you had
to be a doctor to buy it.
So is it true only speed shops sell Nitrous you
can buy?

[No.  I've written fairly extensively on this in the past so check
the archives for details.  Executive summary:  The welding shop can
sell N2O to anyone as long as they reasonably believe that it is
not being used for medical purposes.  How a welding shop treats 
this is up to each one.  In MY shop, I would sell N2O to anyone who
didn't obviously act like a druggie and who seemed to know at least
a bit about hotrodding.  Buying the stuff to make the transfer
hose from me was a major mark in his favor :-)  On the other hand,
if you came into my shop with hair down to your waist and an untrimmed
beard wearing a Dead tee shirt and smelling of having missed a bath
for a week or worse, like a joint, then forget it.  Sorry.  Price
one pays for freedom of expression or whatever motivates these people.
Another way to guarantee you walk out empty handed is to make some wise-
crack about how high you can get from one of those like, majorly big
cylinders, man.  I suggest trying another welding shop.  JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!sugar.NeoSoft.COM!jamelott (Jay Melott)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 18:24:46 1994
Subject: One problem with headers
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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There's one problem that headers always give me:  The extra heat they put out
into the engine compartment ALWAYS fries the rubber in the upper control arm
bushings.  The upper control arm bushings get brittle, crack up, and are
usually totally shot within a few years.  

	Someday I'll wise up and put some little heat shields around the
bushings, or put thermal wrap around the headers.

	The upper control arm bushings on most Chevys are only about an inch
or two away from the headers.

	Tom

----------
Posted by: Tom Carver 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 18:35:12 1994
Subject: Rod Insurance
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I just thought I'd add a bit of a note about the insurance side of
our hobby.  My wife the insurance wiz looked for quite a while.  
Insurance for modified vehicals is something that most insurance 
agencies do not understand and do not want to deal with.
We got quotes for all sorts of bad policies with limited liabiltiy, 
high deductables, and various Blue Book / appraisal issues.  All 
for $1500 per year.  

Yeah, sure...

Anyway, after searching the specialty market for a while, we finally
found what we wanted.  An agreed value policy with $250 deductable
and high liability schedule.  This means that if my Chevelle disappears,
the insurance company already has agreed to pay me an amount ($10,000 
minus $250 in my case) with no further discussion.  This costs $421,
a much more reasonable price, right here in not-too-cheap SoCal.
The company is A+ rated to boot.

Yes, the list of restrictions is rather long, but worth the $1000.
Shop carefully for your insurance, you can save a great deal if you
know what to look for.

Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097

----------
Posted by: emory!rebel.dsea.com!frank (Frank Evan Perdicaro)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 20:51:08 1994
Subject: Re: V6 Pinto for the drag strip?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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In alt.hotrod you write:


>I am interrested in setting up one of the V6 Pintos for the local drag
>strip and would like to know a few things:

>2) Does anyone make aftermarket parts for this motor?  I remember there
>   was a place that did stuff the the 4 cyl. quite awhile back.

Check out Racer Walsh in Jacksonville, FL and Esslinger Engineering 
(somewhere in the LA area) and JBA in near San Diego. They carry many 
aftermarket parts helpful for fords and the first two sell amny 
Pinto-specific items.

>3) If there anything about this motor which makes it a particularly bad
>   choice?

Many people have done V8 conversions and the late model T-Bird/SVO turbo 
2300 is almost a "factory" style conversion. Motor mounts are factory parts 
and the C4 automatic is also a factory part. Hopefully the V6 can use these 
parts as well? 

A T-5 can be installed but a crossmember must be fabricated and the 
shifter hole must be enlarged towards the dashboard. Once you get past 
the hassle of getting headers out of the engine compartment, there is 
plenty of room for a full dual exhaust system. A 8" rear end housing 
from a Mustang II will drop right in as will the heavy duty Mustang II 
sway bars and front coil springs.  The fenders are large enough to put 
265/50-15s in the rear and 225/50-15s in the front with no"clearancing" 
if the proper offset wheels are selected. The car has a natural 
handling advantage in its long wheel base and wide track with respect 
to its overall size. 

Note that the '74 thru '80 models are much more sturdy than the '71 thru 
'73 models. There is a weight penalty for this however.

>I am interrested in this because it seems I could start into it fairly
>cheap and it just seems like a fun car to attempt w/o a shop full of

Indeed it has been said that no part of a Pinto costs more that $50 at 
the salvage yard and this certainly is an advantage when it comes time to 
make some financial decisions. The worlds first recyclable car?

In terms of bang/buck, a sleeper Pinto can bring can bring great 
satisfaction; anyone can go fast in a car that costs multi-kilobucks.

Kevin Martinez
lps@rahul.net
-- 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
 Kevin Martinez    lps@rahul.net    Member of the Julie Kangas Fan Club
 Those Roly Poly Fishheads told me what to write...            Mmmmmm!!
------------------------------------------------------------------------

----------
Posted by: Kevin Martinez 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 20:57:59 1994
Subject: Re: v6 Pinto race car
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Steve, I had on of those in 1980. It was a Station wagon with the 2.8 German
v6. It was a 76 model. They were not available with a manual trans, only the
c-3 automatic. It ran okay, but it was far from fast. I do remember it had
the solid lifters that always clacked when it was cold :-(
It was a b*itch to work on though.
I would go with the 2.3l 4 and give a call to Racer Walsh. They specialize
in the 2.3 4. I don't have their #.  Anybody??

Frank

----------
Posted by: emory!OAS.PSU.EDU!FBS3     (SZYMKOWSKI.FRANK)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 23:30:32 1994
Subject: BB Tower Mounts
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Is there anyone out there that knows where I can find
a pair of frame tower mounts for a 67 big block Chevelle?

These are the mounts that bolt to the crossmember that the
motor mount bolts to. I have tried a few local dealerships
and a few classic chevy parts house's. No luck yet.

Thanks for any help!

..Don


----------
Posted by: emory!sclara.qms.com!don (Don Henslee)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 23:39:31 1994
Subject: Re: spun main bearings
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-> I'm not so sure that the heat transfer would be good enough after
-> filling the space between the bearing and the block with Locktite.
-> Is there any data on the thermal resistance of Locktite?  The problem
-> is that there are now large voids between the bearing and the block
-> and those will be full of several mils of hardened Locktite.

 Loctite has a tech support number; they *might* have that kind of data.

 The bearing's main means of cooling is the oil, however.  I doubt your
temperature would vary more than a few tens of degrees max.
              

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 23:45:29 1994
Subject: Re: red lead stuff
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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-> it is called something like (prussian) blue dye, comes in a little
-> tooth-paste like tube.

 Okay, blue.  Or chartreuse or mauve or flamingo pink - where do I GET
some?
              
[Most any machine shop supply company.  Zeigler's here in Atlanta
if all else fails.  JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 10 23:50:53 1994
Subject: V6 Pinto for the drag strip?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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-> 2) Does anyone make aftermarket parts for this motor?

 Offenhauser makes 2bbl and 4bbl intakes.  The usual cam companies make
cams.  TRW makes pistons.  Mallory used to (probably still does) make a
distributor.  Thunderbird makes headers.  DOBI and Racer Walsh would be
your primary parts sources.


-> 3) If there anything about this motor which makes it a particularly
-> bad choice?

 The fiber timing gears suck snot.  TRW wants about $100 for their
aluminum gears.  I'd recommend them for any performance work, or even a
good rebuild.

 The rod bearings are *very* narrow - back inna old days most places
couldn't turn the cranks because there wasn't enough room to get the
grinding wheel in.  Nowadays narrow wheels are more common.

 They heads are only OK, nothing to brag about.  The fuel pumps stink -
plan on going to an electric pump.


 A 350 or 500 Holley 2bbl will bolt onto the stock intake.  The engines
love to rev and make their power 'way up in the RPM band even stock;
they like lots of cam too.


-> 4) Were manual transmissions available for it anywhere, or are
-> adaptors available/needed?

 I don't know about Pintos, but in the Capri and Capri II you could get
a four speed.  You'd need to adapt a shifter; the Capri shifter is part
of the body and stinks.  You can also use a T5 or anything you find
behind a 2.8, 2.9, or 4.0 Ford Ranger pickup, or a Mazda 4.0 pickup.
They're the same motor, except the 4.0 is a high deck variant.  Parts
availability for the 4.0 is about zero, though.


-> I am interrested in this because it seems I could start into it
-> fairly cheap and it just seems like a fun car to attempt w/o a shop

 You can have plenty of fun for cheap.  I'd recommend getting a good
shift kit - you should have the common C4 auto, not the weirdball Warner
- and keeping the automatic.  You could usefully use a 3500 stall
convertor on a track-only car.
                                                                       

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 11 02:42:12 1994
Subject: No Subject Line
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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-> Does anyone know the name/address/phone number of the shop (I think
-> it's in Jacksonville, Fla.) that specializes in gofasters for the
-> Ford SVO 2.3

Racer Walsh Co                  Pinto/Ford                      11/93
5906 Macy Ave.
Jacksonville FL 32211
800-334-0151
904-743-8253


 You might want to grab this file while dixie is still online:


             The Automotive Contact List, version 94.04.01
        created and maintained by: dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us

 The newest version of this list may be obtained via internet mail from
Performance Engineering Magazines's mail server.  To retrieve it, send
mail to listserv@dixie.com and in the body of the message include the
following:
             address    (optional)
             send vendors

 You will get the vendor list back in three separate files.

 Please don't ask me to send you the list directly; my mailer only
accepts 200 lines at a time, and I send the latest versions to dixie
on floppy.  You can also download the list via modem at The Courts of
Chaos BBS, (501)985-0059 as CARLIST.LZH.
                                                                                                                    

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 11 02:47:06 1994
Subject: Re: red lead stuff
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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-> A satisfactory substitute is Dykem layout paint.  The purpose of the
-> red lead paste was to allow you to see if the gears were touching in

 Hell, I have half a pint of Dykem.  (for the Dykem-impaired, Magic
Marker works just fine)   I thought the point of the lead paste was to
be thick, to better see how the gears were meshing?  Layout paint is
pretty thin stuff when dry.


-> and you may have to spray the gears a number of times.  And when you
-> are done you will need a good solvent to take off the Dykem.  I have

 What would it hurt to leave the Dykem on there?


-> reveal the secret formula.  Me, I use exactly that.  Titanium dixoide
-> paint pigment is available from paint stores.  JGD]

 Hobby stores sell "Prussian Blue" paint in little tubes.  Would that
work?
                                            

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 11 02:52:41 1994
Subject: welding
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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So, John, can I get some rods for an arc welder to do body sheet metal?
or am I better off buying a mig welder?  I can weld OK with an arc 
, never tried a mig.  I have a 76 pontiac ventura I want to fool around 
with.
Marc
mw8236@acspr1.acs.brockport.edu

[Lemme put it this way.  I was nuclear certified in a previous life and
*I* can't stick weld sheet metal much thinner than 14 ga.  I've never
seen anyone else who could either.  I CAN TIG sheet metal, though it
takes a very specialized setup and technique.  This includes a small
100 amp torch, very fine filler rod, heat dams on either side of the
joint and a very good fitup.  Everything you do is aimed toward fusing
the metal with the absolute minimum of heat.  I've fabricated thin
gauge stainless steel machine guards using TIG but I'd not want to 
do much in the way of body work.

Just get a MIG.  I was looking at what Miller has on my last trip to
the welding shop.  They've got a nice cart-mounted MIG that retails
for $750.  It should discount for $75 less.  It has all the nifty stuff
like electronic speed control, stitch, spot and so on.  Compared to 
what you get with the $400 el-cheapo units sold in the auto parts
places, there'd be no question I'd get the Miller.  I'm sure the 
other major brands have something competative. JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!ACSPR1.acs.brockport.edu!MW8236
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 11 02:58:38 1994
Subject: Re: H20 injection
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In alt.hotrod you write:

>>[nice description of water injection system deleted]
>>
>>  I spent about $10 working with a throttle switch, which I scrapped for 
>>the interior switch.
>>
>>Adding my new switching system will probably cost about $20 - $30 in
>>material, it will require 4 relays, 4 light sensors, light bulb, and about
>>6" of 3/4" brass stock. 
>>
>>
>>Chip Schweiss
>>lschweis@nyx.cs.du.edu

>Was the throttle switch you tried a simple on/off switch?  How about using
>a throttle-position sensor (a potentiometer whose output voltage is directy
>proportional to throttle opening)?  You could use this low-current signal
>to control a power transistor which drives your pump, to get more flow as
>the throttle opens.  Some simple analog electronics could provide a minimum
>threshold below which there is no flow, and you could tailor the pump
>voltage-throttle opening curve to whatever water delivery curve you wanted.

>Regards,

>Carl Ijames     ijames@helix.nih.gov

I've considered this approach, but ruled it out because throttle position 
isn't a good indicator of the amount of water needed.  When I stomp on 
the gas the engine needs a little water at low rpm and a lot at high rpm.  
A lot of water like I have now hurts low rpm power.  Vacuum is still not 
the perfect solution, but possibly using a combination of ported vacuum 
and manifold vacuum I might be able to get close enough.  Computer 
control would obviously be the best solution.  I haven't learned enough 
yet on computer control to build this yet.  It is my ultimate goal though.

Chip Schweiss
lschweis@nyx.cs.du.edu

----------
Posted by: emory!nyx10.cs.du.edu!lschweis (Lester Schweiss)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 11 12:39:13 1994
Subject: Re: paint question
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8514
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Centari is normally an easy enamel to spray.
Make sure the thinner matches the temp. your spraying in and follow the
thinning instructions. Experiment with your spray pattern on scrap and
make sure you have about 50% overlap on your spray passes. Put on a thin
"tack" coat, wait about 20 minutes(or until it is quite tacky) then give 
it 1 or 2 more "wet" coats. Just keep trying! NO BRUSHES ALLOWED!!

----------
Posted by: emory!cray.com!rjm (Roger Mrdutt)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 11 12:44:37 1994
Subject: gear spotting
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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>A satisfactory substitute is Dykem layout paint.

Don't use Dykem Layout Blue! It dries to a tough, brittle "skin".
If you don't dissolve and wash the skin completely off, the skin
will flake off and the little flakes can sometimes cause problems.

>it is called something like (prussian) blue dye, comes in a little
>tooth-paste like tube.

Prussian blue is what it has been referred to for years. Dykem's
version of prussian blue is called Hyspot. It too comes in a
small tooth-oaste like tube. It's used in the tool & die trade to
check on metal to metal contact and in the injection mold trade to
check on mold surfaces sealing off together. These types of
products can be obtained at most industrial supply houses, tool
& die supply, and/or mold supply houses. And it is not expensive. A
couple of bucks per tube. The tube I've got now, I've had for 20
years. A little goes a loooooooooooooooooong way! It never dries out,
and it will wash off with acetone.


peter crisler
middletown, ky   wd4ars
peter.crisler@tfd.iglou.com


----------
Posted by: emory!tfd.iglou.com!peter.crisler (Peter Crisler)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 11 17:59:12 1994
Subject: Re: welding
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8516
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On May 11,  2:10am, The Hotrod List wrote:
} Subject: welding

I bought a used Millermatic 35 two years ago and it was like dying and
going to heaven. It is a super machine. It is just right for really thin 
stuff and has plenty of umph for thicker steel. I concur with John. If you 
are going to buy a welder, look for a good used name quality professional 
version before putting out bucks on one those cheapie Century or other 
units you see. When they break, you will find that the cheapies are pretty 
hard to look after as against one of the professional brands.Mike



-- 
Mike Brattland(Brattlan@cyber.net) "Three Deuces and a 4 Speed" 
Insurance Auto Auctions, Spring Valley, California 800-322-8284   
E-MAIL me for Tech Info on Small and Big Block Ford Tri-Power Information! !

----------
Posted by: "Michael G. Brattland" 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 12 00:45:24 1994
Subject: mig
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8517
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Thanks guys for the mig info....but i am quite a novice to body work.
my idea of body work is if i can bolt it off, i can bolt a new one on.
so Mig is metal inert gas....right?  Ive built go carts with my dads
arc welder( what a pain, hes an electrical engineer and the circuit breaker
was only 20 amps...always cut out).

so I have this 76 ventura, and a 73 nova...the nova is in pretty good
shape, no major rot, even the quarters only have a little rot on them.
definately fixable.

The 76 is a heap...170000 on a 260 pontiac and a turbo 350 (which is
dying).  the main structural points are good, the rear fenderwells are
poor at best, but I think I can cut back to some real metal.  how hard
is it gonna be to mig this thing back to some reasonable shape?

Thanx,
Marc
mw8236@acspr1.acs.brockport.edu

----------
Posted by: emory!ACSPR1.acs.brockport.edu!MW8236
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 12 11:01:41 1994
Subject: Swap Meet
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8518
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Is there a big Ford swap meet in Calif.? I need a Ram Air clearner for a 
1970 Mercury CJ 429 cid Cyclone Spoiler. I've heard of some fantastic 
prices so bone yard or swap meet price would be much better. Thnk you

Regards,
Paul

--
kroth@railnet.nshore.org (paul roth)
Railnet BBS +1 216 786 0476

----------
Posted by: emory!railnet.nshore.org!kroth (paul roth)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 12 16:50:33 1994
Subject: TV: *Televised Events #94-19*
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8519
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

----------------------------------------------------------------------
			       TV Events

Now in its third year of weekly publication, TVE is a compilation of 
info. gleaned from TV listings, auto mags., newspapers, tea leaves, my 
favorite bartender, and the nice folks at TNN.  PLEASE confirm dates and 
times with your local listings before setting your VCRs.

TVE will USUALLY be updated no later than every Friday morning and will 
be most accurate (or least inaccurate) for the following 7 days. If your 
favorite event is "tba'd", please don't panic unless it's in the 7 day 
window.

As mentioned previously, this listing is now being submitted to the new 
group rec.autos.sport.info.  Assuming the moderators approve, this list 
will be available in the r.a.s.i group from now on.  In an attempt to get 
the word to as many r.a.s readers as possible, I will continue to cross-
post to r.a.s for a short time. (This again assumes the moderators of 
r.a.s.i do not object to my doing so.)

If you are having trouble with this list arriving at your site in
a timely fashion, please let me know via e-mail and I will also start
mailing you a copy.

Comments, suggestions, additions, extra pit passes, etc. to:
					  stoffel@oasys.dt.navy.mil

		   ---------------------------------

(T)=Taped  (L)=Live  (SD)=Same Day  (?)=dunno

12:00AM = 0000 hours = start of day

    EVENT                             DATE  TIME(Eastern, USA)  NETWORK

NHRA, SOUTHERN NATIONALS, ATLANTA (T) 05/12    1:00-2:00PM      HTS*
AMA SUPERBIKES, POMONA (T)            05/12    2:00-3:00PM      HTS*
Motor Sports Hour                     05/12    3:00-4:00PM      HTS*
INDY 500 PRACTICE (L)                 05/12    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN
Motorcycle Racing?                    05/12    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
NHRA, SOUTHERN NATIONALS, ATLANTA (T) 05/12    7:00-8:00PM      HTS*
Countdown To Indy                     05/12    8:00-8:30PM      HTS*
MotorWeek (Cobra & Impala SS)         05/12    8:30-9:00PM      MPT**
AMA SUPERBIKES, POMONA (T)            05/12    9:00-10:00PM     HTS*
Motor Sports Hour                     05/12    10:00-11:00PM    HTS*
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (L)    05/12   11:00PM-12:00AM   HTS*
AMA SUPERCROSS (T)                    05/13    1:00-2:00AM      ESPN
INDY 500, LAST PRACTICE DAY (L)       05/13    2:00-3:00PM      ESPN
INDY 500, LAST PRACTICE DAY (L)       05/13    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN
Motoworld II                          05/13    6:30-7:00PM      ESPN2
Countdown To Indy                     05/13    11:00-11:30PM    HTS*
Motoworld II                          05/14    12:30-1:00AM     ESPN2
Secrets Of Speed                      05/14    1:00-1:30AM      ESPN2
INDY 500, LAST PRACTICE DAY (T)       05/14    3:30-4:30AM      ESPN
Road To The Indianapolis 500          05/14    4:30-5:30AM      ESPN
Checkered Flag (F1 @ Imola)           05/14    5:30-6:00AM      ESPN
Speed Racer (cartoon)                 05/14    7:00-7:30AM      MTV
Shadetree Mechanic (fuel injectors)   05/14    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
MotorWeek                             05/14    10:00-10:30AM    WGN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, POLE DAY (L) 05/14    12:00-2:30PM     ABC
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans(Live@Memphis)05/14    2:00-2:30PM      TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      05/14    2:30-3:00PM      TNN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               05/14    3:00-3:30PM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              05/14    3:30-4:00PM      TNN
Hydropower                            05/14    3:30-4:30PM      ESPN2
BUSCH GN, ROUGEMONT (T)               05/14    4:00-5:30PM      TNN
NASCAR SOUTHWEST, SONOMA (L)          05/14    4:30-6:30PM      ESPN
Glory Days                            05/14    4:30-5:00PM      ESPN2
MotorWeek                             05/14    5:00-5:30PM      MPT**
Auto Racing?                          05/14    5:00-6:00PM      ESPN2
Secrets Of Speed                      05/14    7:00-7:30PM      ESPN2
SATURDAY NIGHT LIGHTNING (L)          05/14    7:30-9:30PM      ESPN2
DRAG RACING, HOUSTON (T)              05/14    9:30-10:30PM     ESPN2
Power Wheels                          05/14    10:30-11:30PM    ESPN2
Review of Pole Day at Indy            05/15    12:30-1:00AM     ESPN
SpeedWeek                             05/15    1:00-1:30AM      ESPN
A Race For Heroes (Arie Luyendyk)     05/15    1:30-2:00AM      ESPN
Motoworld                             05/15    2:30-3:00AM      ESPN
Review of Pole Day at Indy            05/15    3:30-4:00AM      ESPN
NASCAR SOUTHWEST, SONOMA (T)          05/15    4:00-6:00AM      ESPN
SAAB PRO, ATLANTA (T)                 05/15    6:00-6:30AM      ESPN
SpeedWeek                             05/15    6:30-7:00AM      ESPN
Motoworld                             05/15    7:30-8:00AM      ESPN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               05/15    9:00-9:30AM      TNN
FORMULA 1, MONACO (L)                 05/15    9:20-11:30AM ESPN,TSN [1]
Trucks And Tractor Power              05/15    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
N Bonnett's Winners (Morgan Shepherd) 05/15    10:00-10:30AM    TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans(Live@Memphis)05/15    10:30-11:00AM    TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      05/15    11:00-11:30AM    TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           05/15   11:30AM-12:00PM   TNN
ASA, TOLEDO (L)                       05/15    1:00-3:30PM      TNN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 2ND DAY (L)  05/15    2:00-3:00PM      ABC
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 2ND DAY (L)  05/15    3:00-4:00PM  ESPN,TSN
IROC #2, DARLINGTON (T)               05/15    3:00-4:00PM      ABC
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               05/15    3:30-4:00PM      TNN
WINSTON CUP, SEARS POINT (L)          05/15    4:00-7:00PM      ESPN
N Bonnett's Winners (Morgan Shepherd) 05/15    5:00-5:30PM      TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans(Live@Memphis)05/15    6:00-6:30PM      TNN
NHRA, MID-SOUTH NATIONALS (L)         05/15    6:30-7:00PM      TNN
Shadetree Mechanic (fuel injectors)   05/15    7:00-7:30PM      TNN
World Of Speed & Beauty (S Nationals) 05/15    7:30-8:00PM      TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      05/15    8:00-8:30PM      TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           05/15    8:30-9:00PM      TNN
Road Test Magazine w/Don Garlits      05/15    11:00-11:30PM    TNN
World Of Speed & Beauty (S Nationals) 05/15   11:30PM-12:00AM   TNN
RaceDay Update w/Pat Patterson (L)    05/16    12:00-12:05AM    TNN
AMA?, DAYTONA 200 (T)                 05/16    12:05-1:30AM     TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              05/16    2:00-2:30AM      TNN
NHRA, MID-SOUTH NATIONALS (T)         05/16    2:30-3:00AM      TNN
Movie: Heart Like A Wheel             05/16    2:30-4:25PM      MAX
Review of 2nd day of gualifying @ Indy05/16    4:30-5:00PM      ESPN
INDY 500 PRACTICE (L)                 05/16    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN
Motorcycle Racing?                    05/16    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
Countdown To Indy                     05/16    11:00-11:30PM    HTS*
FORMULA 1, MONACO (T)                 05/17    1:00-2:30AM      ESPN
WINSTON CUP, SEARS POINT (T)          05/17    1:00-3:00PM      ESPN
Drag Racing?                          05/17    3:00-4:00PM      ESPN2
INDY 500 PRACTICE (L)                 05/17    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN
Power Wheels                          05/17    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
Countdown To Indy                     05/17    11:00-11:30PM    HTS*
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Charlotte (L)  05/18   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
Auto Racing?                          05/18    1:00-3:00PM      ESPN2
INDY 500 PRACTICE (L)                 05/18    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN
Motorcycle Racing?                    05/18    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
Countdown To Indy                     05/18    11:00-11:30PM    HTS*
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Charlotte (L)  05/19   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
WORLD SUPERBIKE, DONINGTON PARK (T)   05/19    2:00-3:00PM      HTS*
Motor Sports Hour                     05/19    3:00-4:00PM      HTS*
Auto Shop                             05/19    5:00-6:00PM      QVC
INDY 500 PRACTICE (L)                 05/19    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN
Motorcycle Racing?                    05/19    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (SD)   05/19   11:00PM-12:00AM   HTS*
AMA SUPERCROSS, PONTIAC (T)           05/20    1:00-2:00AM      ESPN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Charlotte (L)  05/20   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
INDY 500 PRACTICE (L)                 05/20    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN
Motoworld II                          05/20    6:30-7:00PM      ESPN2
Countdown To Indy                     05/20    11:00-11:30PM    HTS*
Motoworld II                          05/21    12:30-1:00AM     ESPN2
Secrets Of Speed                      05/21    1:00-1:30AM      ESPN2

		  ----------COMING EVENTS----------

THE WINSTON SELECT, CHARLOTTE(L)      05/21    7:30-10:30PM     TNN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 3RD DAY (L)  05/21    5:00PM       ESPN,TSN
BUSCH GN, NAZARETH (L)                05/22    1:00PM           TNN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 4TH DAY (L)  05/22    4:00PM           ESPN
NHRA, NATIONALS, ENGLISHTOWN (?)      05/22    tba              tba
Indy 500 Festival Parade (L)          05/28    1:00-2:30PM      TNN
BUSCH GN, CHARLOTTE (?)               05/28    tba              tba
FORMULA 1, SPAIN (L)                  05/29    7:50-10:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
INDIANAPOLIS 500 (L)                  05/29   11:00AM-3:30PM    ABC
WINSTON CUP, CHARLOTTE (L)            05/29    5:00PM           TBS
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      06/01   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      06/02   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      06/03   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
BUSCH GN, DOVER (L)                   06/04    tba              TNN
WINSTON CUP, DOVER (L)                06/05    12:10PM          TNN
INDYCAR, MILWAUKEE (L)                06/05    4:00-6:00PM      ABC [1]
BUSCH GN, MYRTLE BEACH (?)            06/11    tba              tba
FORMULA 1, CANADA (L)                 06/12    2:00-4:00PM  ESPN,CBC
INDYCAR, DETROIT (L)                  06/12    2:00-4:30PM      ABC [1]
WINSTON CUP, POCONO (L)               06/12    12:30PM          TNN
IROC #3, TALLADEGA (T)                06/12    tba              ABC
NHRA, SPRINGNATIONALS, KIRKERSVILLE(?)06/12    tba              tba
WINSTON CUP, MICHIGAN (L)             06/19    1:00PM           CBS
BUSCH GN, WATKINS GLEN (?)            06/25    tba              tba
ASA, BRAINERD (L)                     06/26    tba              TNN
INDYCAR, PORTLAND (L)                 06/26    4:00-6:30PM      ESPN [1]
NHRA, NATIONALS, TOPEKA (?)           06/26    tba              tba
WINSTON CUP, DAYTONA (L)              07/02    11:00AM          ESPN
FORMULA 1, FRANCE (L)                 07/03    7:50-10:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
BUSCH GN, MILWAUKEE (?)               07/03    tba              tba
ASA, CEDAR RAPIDS (L)                 07/04    tba              TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Loudon (L)     07/06   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Loudon (L)     07/07   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Loudon (L)     07/08   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
FORMULA 1, GREAT BRITAIN (L)          07/10    8:50-11:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
WINSTON CUP, LOUDON (L)               07/10    1:00PM           TNN
INDYCAR, CLEVELAND (L)                07/10    1:30-3:30PM      ABC [1]
BUSCH GN, S. BOSTON (?)               07/16    tba              tba
INDYCAR, TORONTO (L)                  07/17    2:00-4:00PM      NBC [1]
WINSTON CUP, POCONO (L)               07/17    12:30PM          TBS
BUSCH GN, TALLADEGA (?)               07/23    tba              tba
WINSTON CUP, TALADEGA (L)             07/24    12:15PM          CBS
NHRA, MILE-HIGH NATIONALS, MORRISON(?)07/24    tba              tba

[1] CBC also carries all F1 and most IndyCar races (the Indy 500 & Long 
Beach will not be shown this year).  The races are usually broadcast on a 
tape-delayed basis at 11:37PM ET on the evening following the race.  I 
understand that it is not uncommon for CBC to delay the broadcast as much 
as an hour beyond the 11:37PM start, so please use extra caution if you 
plan to tape the race.  If you have access to it, and your French isn't 
too rusty, you may also want to check out RDS which used to broadcast 
each F1 race live. (I don't know for sure if they still do).  Thanks to 
Tak Ariga for info. on coverage in Canada.

* HTS (formerly Home Team Sports) is a regional sports network centered
in the Baltimore/Wash. DC area.  If you have a regional sports network,
please check their listings for these shows.  If they don't have them,
you may want to ask them why they don't.  Your times will almost
certainly vary from those shown with the probable exception of "This
Week In NASCAR".  On race weeks TWIN is usually broadcast live from a
 location somewhere near the track at 11:00PM (Eastern) on the Thursday 
before the race.  An interesting (IMO) show which usually includes a live 
audience, driver/guest, and viewer call-ins.  This show, as well as
many of the others, originate on the Prime Network.

Other possible cable sources for at least some of these shows;

    Network               Area                         Thanks to...

     ASN                Arizona                         Ben Loosli
     TSN                 Canada                       Tom Haapanen
     MSG                New York                    G. Bruce Rodgers
  SportSouth            Atlanta                      David Cornutt
    "    " (aka SPS) E. Tenn. & West NC                 Ken Key
  PrimeTicket         Southern CA                      Chuck Fry
    Empire              Buffalo
     NESN           Boston/N. England                 Trace Kangas
     KBL                Pittsburgh                   Mike Sturdevant
     PASS               Michigan                         Hartz
   Sunshine             Florida
     HSE                 Texas
     PSN           Minneapolis/St. Paul               Dean Barker
     PSN                Seattle                         Gary Eng
     PSN                Portland                       Mike Butts
  SportsChannel      San Francisco                     Chuck Fry
  SportsChannel (SC)    Chicago                      Jim Fuerstenberg

** MPT (Maryland Public TV) - "MotorWeek" is produced by MPT
and distributed to other public and commercial TV stations throughout
N. America.

-------

----------
Posted by: emory!oasys.dt.navy.mil!stoffel (Bill Stoffel)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 12 17:07:45 1994
Subject: Re: Swap Meet
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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On May 12, 10:48am, The Hotrod List wrote:
} Subject: Swap Meet
> 
> Is there a big Ford swap meet in Calif.? I need a Ram Air clearner for a 
> 1970 Mercury CJ 429 cid Cyclone Spoiler. I've heard of some fantastic 
> prices so bone yard or swap meet price would be much better. Thnk you

Paul, Ford Power Parts in Norwalk Ca as well as JBA in San Diego run
semi-annual car shows, used parts sales, where they drag all their
goodies out for sale.  Ford Power Parts on the West Coast by far has the
primo selection of used Ford performance parts, especially the exotic
stuff, which is for sale right in their warehouse every day.  JBA is a
little shy on the kind of parts you are looking for, but they do have
some good stuff there also.  If you read HEMMINGS, you will notice
Peorgie Enterprises in New Jersey 609 448 1684.  They regularly
advertise the parts you are looking for in their many HEMMINGS ads.
They also show up at Carlise, Englishtown and Hershey swap meets, which
are all excellent places to look for your parts.  The west coast Pamona
swap meet is the big Giant killer on the left coast.  Other than the
annual Mustang show and swap at Knotts Berry Farm every spring, there
isn't any specific Ford only swap meets.  Mike

> 
> Regards,
> Paul
> 
> --
> kroth@railnet.nshore.org (paul roth)
> Railnet BBS +1 216 786 0476
> 
> ----------
> Posted by: emory!railnet.nshore.org!kroth (paul roth)
>  
> 
> 
>-- End of excerpt from The Hotrod List



-- 
Mike Brattland(Brattlan@cyber.net) "Three Deuces and a 4 Speed" 
Insurance Auto Auctions, Spring Valley, California 800-322-8284   
E-MAIL me for Tech Info on Small and Big Block Ford Tri-Power Information! !

----------
Posted by: "Michael G. Brattland" 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 12 17:20:46 1994
Subject: Re: H20 injection
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In article <6nr63mj@dixie.com> hotrod@dixie.com writes:

>>Was the throttle switch you tried a simple on/off switch?  How about using
>>a throttle-position sensor (a potentiometer whose output voltage is directy
>>proportional to throttle opening)?  You could use this low-current signal
>>to control a power transistor which drives your pump, to get more flow as
>>the throttle opens.  Some simple analog electronics could provide a minimum
>>threshold below which there is no flow, and you could tailor the pump
>>voltage-throttle opening curve to whatever water delivery curve you wanted.
>
>>Regards,
>
>>Carl Ijames     ijames@helix.nih.gov
>
>I've considered this approach, but ruled it out because throttle position 
>isn't a good indicator of the amount of water needed.  When I stomp on 
>the gas the engine needs a little water at low rpm and a lot at high rpm.  
>A lot of water like I have now hurts low rpm power.  Vacuum is still not 
>the perfect solution, but possibly using a combination of ported vacuum 
>and manifold vacuum I might be able to get close enough.  Computer 
>control would obviously be the best solution.  I haven't learned enough 
>yet on computer control to build this yet.  It is my ultimate goal though.
>

What about tying water delivery to engine rpm?  A frequency to voltage converter
chip could measure rpm from the distributor, output a voltage signal to a
power transistor to drive the pump.

Steve Ravet	sravet@bangate.compaq.com
"Baby you're a genius when it comes to cooking up some chili sauce...."

----------
Posted by: emory!bangate.compaq.com!sravet
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 12 17:26:21 1994
Subject: Houston Area Events
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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I will be in Houston this summer, June-August.  Before I arrive, I 
thought someone could help me out as far as:

1.  Summer Racing Events (and locations).

2.  Places to visit that would carry a good selection of used
    1970-74 Challenger parts.

3.  Good (cheap) speed shops in the Houston area.

Thanks

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mark Levorson                             Valmet Automation
markl@sa-cgy.valmet.com                   Calgary, Alberta, Canada
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

----------
Posted by: Mark Levorson 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 12 23:28:59 1994
Subject: Wanted Jeep Commando
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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   Would like to purchase a 72 or 73 Commando with
Body and frame in good condition. I am looking for
a project car and am not too worried about mechanical 
condition.  If any one knows of such an auto I 
would appreciate a return post.
                           Thanks.



----------
Posted by: mdill@mms29.40 (Mike Dillon)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 13 22:59:38 1994
Subject: Water Injection
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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I saw a post where someone was worried about injecting too much water
into their engine and ruining it, something that I think is basically
impossible.  I used to have a very simple setup on my old '71 Torino
w/302 auto that was just a ford windsheild washer box reservoir
w/internal pump.  The injector was just a piece of 1/8" copper tubing
that was crimped in the center of the orifice such that it left two .014
holes, drilled to size, of course.  A toggle switch to run it was all
the input it needed.

When I drag-raced it I mixed water and methanol 50/50, pumping a full
quart and a half in 13.235 seconds.  I gained a full tenth of a second
believe it or not!  After three runs I had to replace the plugs as both
of the electrodes were eaten away leaving a .090+ gap.  I opened the
top-end during the week after my first races.  the pistons and valves
were so clean that you'd swear that they were brand-spankin' new!  There
was no noticable deterioration of the pistons.

So I'd say to go ahead and inject as much water as my orifice setup will
allow with an adjustable metering needle and seat you can restrict the
flow to be just drowning the knock.  Unless you are foolish enough to
run some kind of large orifice flow, I can't see anything harming the
engine, if you manage to flow enough water to drown the flame you're
going to lose so much power that you won't run long enough to harm the
engine anyways.

Millam

[That pretty much agrees with my experience.  I've not put too much
research into this because water injection seems to tolerant to a
wide range of water flow.  You'll inject enough to put the fire out
long before you hydraulic the motor.  My little bit of tuning, as it
were, consisted of finding out approximately how little water I could
get by with so that I didn't have to fill the tank so often.  I've
never used water injection in a non-turbocharged engine so my
setup is dirt simple.  A pressure line from the intake applies pressure
to the water resevoir.  Water is injected into the intake before
the turbo and is metered with a Holly carb jet.  A homemade holdoff 
valve holds off the water flow until an adjustable minimum pressure is 
reached.  That's it.  Flow is roughly proportional to boost pressure.
JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!naucse.cse.nau.edu!met (Millam Tackitt)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 13 23:10:54 1994
Subject: Re: H2O injection
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In alt.hotrod you write:

>> For example, I don't think it would be much fun experimenting with a
>> home made water injector with insufficient or incorrectly calibrated
>> sensing/electronics that may feed to much water and ruin a $5000
>> engine.

> You're not likely to get too much water unless you use a garden hose.
> Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)

I've used ye'ol "water injection" trick on old cars that have decades
of carbon build up.  This is *not* a hotrod mod!  This *is* a trick to
extend the life of an old bucket that deisel's and ping's from peices of
glowing carbon in the camber.  You use a garden hose with a hand-nozzle
to flood the engine to the point just before it dies.  The relatively
heavy, dense water droplets knock most of the hair-like growths off the
carbon.  I've never had any problem with any car I've done this on,
and I can't imagine anyone would carry a 55 gallon drum of water in
their rod.  Just as a precautionary measure, if you see clouds of steam
streaming from your exhaust, use a little less water :-)

--DAVE (johnson@wrs.com)

"And now, a man who faces his destiny at FULL THROTTLE...  Its David Letterman!"

								   (c)1993 CBS

----------
Posted by: David Johnson 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat May 14 17:38:55 1994
Subject: My ride..Hello!
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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   Hello all,
   I currently have a 1993 GMC S-15 Jimmy with the 200 HP 4.3l V6.
   I have put in a Premier performance Shift Chip (JET stage 1 with
   trans shifting recall'd.  Gets about 30ft rubber when it hits 2nd!)
   180 degree thermostat, Edelbrock tubular headers, Jacobs UltraTeam
   ignition system, 3" cat back exhaust with Walker Ultra-Flow muffler
   and 3" dia tailpipe.  Before the 3" exhaust, I had a 2.5" inlet, dual
   2" outlet flowmaster.  Times were:
   stock: 16.29 @81 mph
   With flowmaster exhaust, all else stock: 15.71 @88 mph
   Have not run it with all the other toys yet.  Oh yeah, Also have
   K&N airfilter.  It doesn't feel like the headers or ignition made
   much difference.  Will see this weekend at the track what the numbers
   really are, but anyone with any ideas please let me know what else
   I can do (short of N20) to make this thing run harder!
   It also has 3.08 gears and no posi.
   Thanx,
   Dave
   DavidC9186@aol.com



----------
Posted by: emory!aol.com!DavidC9186
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat May 14 17:47:00 1994
Subject: V-12 for sale
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Would anyone be interested in a Seagrave V-12 "dual engine"?  It is in a 1959
Seagrave open cab pumper firetruck with 57,000 miles on the odometer.  It
runs fine, I am converting the firetruck into a parade unit and want to drop
in a V-8 with automatic.  I don't know the displacement but it is a flathead
V-12 with two starters, two distributers, 24 sparkplugs, four coils, 2 carbs
and a water cooled generator.  Any offers?

I will also throw in a huge radiator, 1500 gallon water tank and a solid
brass 1200 GPM pump which works fine.

----------
Posted by: emory!aol.com!DrZenon
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun May 15 00:41:45 1994
Subject: Re: My ride..Hello!
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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The Hotrod List writes:
>    I currently have a 1993 GMC S-15 Jimmy with the 200 HP 4.3l V6.
>    I have put in a Premier performance Shift Chip (JET stage 1 with
>    trans shifting recall'd.  Gets about 30ft rubber when it hits 2nd!)
>    180 degree thermostat, Edelbrock tubular headers, Jacobs UltraTeam
>    ignition system, 3" cat back exhaust with Walker Ultra-Flow muffler
>    and 3" dia tailpipe.  Before the 3" exhaust, I had a 2.5" inlet, dual
>    2" outlet flowmaster.  Times were:

Hmmm, where have I heard of that truck before?  :)

Glad to see ya on the net, David.

-- 
Jonathan R. Lusky  --  lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu
 "Turbos are nice but I'd rather be blown!"
   89 Jeep Wrangler - 258 / For Sale: $8000 obo
       80 Toyota Celica - 20R / 5spd

----------
Posted by: emory!knuth.mtsu.edu!lusky (Jonathan R. Lusky)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun May 15 00:48:43 1994
Subject: Good quality bone yard or Hot rod shop in Ogden, UT
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Looking for a good quality bbone yard (recycle center) or hot rod 
shop/parts store in Ogden, UT area. Please post back to me.
Karl



--
kroth@railnet.nshore.org (paul roth)
Railnet BBS +1 216 786 0476

----------
Posted by: emory!railnet.nshore.org!kroth (paul roth)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun May 15 10:50:28 1994
Subject: ADMINISTRIVIA: Hotrod List Charter
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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This is what will become a periodic posting of the charter of the hotrod
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I wrote the charter in consultation with several people who helped get the
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most people don't seem to care a whole lot about the charter so 
I try to seek a consensus among those who do.

John
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Posted by: hotrod@dixie.com
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May 16 17:48:36 1994
Subject: Re: Swap Meet
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8531
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The Hotrod List (hotrod@dixie.com) wrote:

: Is there a big Ford swap meet in Calif.? I need a Ram Air clearner for a 
: 1970 Mercury CJ 429 cid Cyclone Spoiler. I've heard of some fantastic 
: prices so bone yard or swap meet price would be much better. Thnk you

you missed the biggest one around - Turlock - the last weekend in January

Pomona has about 5 or 6 swap meets that may fit your needs - they 
advertize in all the car-related mags

LA Roadsters annual Father's Day Run & Swap at Pomona is not only a
big dplace to look for parts - they also have dealers/vendors who
show up & may be able to help you

there's a couple more swap meets at Turlock (one was about a month ago and 
there'll be another in the fall)	

there's swap meets at Shoreline ampitheatre in Mountain View - next one is
June 19, July 10, Sept 11, Oct 30

Watsonville has spring, summer series, and fall swap meets

Pleasanton has swap meets almost every month - the biggest are in the 
spring & fall in conjunction with the goodguys car events - but the
rest are usually pretty good too

Gault has started having auto swap meets

you've already been told abodut Hemmings - now go to some auto related
swap meets and pick up copies of "the scrounger", "miss information",
and \the Johnson's swap meet paper .......

--
____________    __      ____________  "They that can give up essential
\_____     /   /_ \     \     _____/  liberty to obtain a little
 \_____    \____/  \____/    _____/  temporary safety deserve
  \_____                    _____/  neither liberty nor safety."
     \___________  ___________/          --Benjamin Franklin
               /    \           ALL disclaimers apply ....
               ~~~~~~

----------
Posted by: emory!zuni.litc.lockheed.com!sharen (Sharen Rund)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May 16 18:02:27 1994
Subject: xmission problems.
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8532
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did my prior message get thru on migs?  i am a novice at body work.
how hard is it to use a mig?
M.

----------
Posted by: emory!ACSPR1.acs.brockport.edu!MW8236
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 17 00:47:39 1994
Subject: V6 Pintos and more...
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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>Steve writes:I am interrested in setting up one of the V6 Pintos for
>the local drag strip and would like to know a few things:
>
>1) Has anyone in the group tried this?  If so, why didn't you do it or
>   how was it if you did?
>
>2) Does anyone make aftermarket parts for this motor?  I remember there
>   was a place that did stuff the the 4 cyl. quite awhile back.
>
>3) If there anything about this motor which makes it a particularly bad
>   choice?
>
>4) Were manual transmissions available for it anywhere, or are adaptors
>   available/needed?
>
>I am interrested in this because it seems I could start into it fairly
>cheap and it just seems like a fun car to attempt w/o a shop full of

Well, I would first start of with the 4.0 Ranger/Explorer motor. If
you really want to get anywhere. It's the same basic engine as the 2.8-2.9

As for performance. Try 4.0 Perfromance in Central California. The guy
who runs the place drives a Ranger that runs 13's. He has about all the 
knowledge and parts you need. There's not a big demand for parts, but he tells
me that it's getting better. His # is 805-925-8848. Ask for Dennis Hillard.

Or...

Maybe a 2.3 L4 would work. I've seen a big '87 T-bird with the modified 2.3
turbo run 12's. Not bad for a over 3000 pound sled. There's definitly
more parts for the 2.3.

Anyway have fun.


See ya
MPQ

----------
Posted by: emory!ingres.com!mquinn (Michael Quinn)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 17 12:54:58 1994
Subject: swap meets again
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   There has been a recent flurry about swap meets on the net.  I
 would like to know what are the good ones in the southern half of
 the country.  I realize that Hemmings lists all ( most ) but being 
 unfamiliar with the areas in question I want to go to the right 
 ones.  I missed Charlotte in the spring, oh well.  I would like to
 go in Late July/August.  My intent:  I would like to pickup a 1968
 or 1969 rust free R code Torino body to play with.  I worked at a
 local Ford dealer during those years and must have driven hundreds
 of 428 cars.  If only time travel existed.  Beam me up Scotty.

   On an related note I found a 1966 427 block this weekend at a 
 swap meet in Massachusetts and I'm getting itchy.  The block is 
 0.060 over and complete.  The fellow claims that it magnafluxed
 ok and all machine work is complete.  The block is coated with 
 some form of protective oil and looks pretty good.  What's a block
 worth.  

Bill

Only mine, Noone elses.

----------
Posted by: emory!genrad.com!wdp (William D. Poudrier)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 17 13:08:40 1994
Subject: Re: Hotrod Mailing List Digest #161 (May 17, 1994)
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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>>Steve writes:I am interrested in setting up one of the V6 Pintos for
>>the local drag strip and would like to know a few things:
>>
>>1) Has anyone in the group tried this?  If so, why didn't you do it or
>>   how was it if you did?
>>

    My brother had a 1974 Mustang II with the 2.8l V6.  Isky
torquer cam, 10:1 pistons, heads slightly ported and polished, doug
thorley headers, edelbrock intake with the 4 bbl top and a holley
390 4 bbl.  Car had a 4 speed.  On street tires it would literally
spin them all the way to red line in first through 3rd gear, and
get about 75 feet of rubber when banging 4th.  At L.A. county
raceway, it ran 13.10@ 103mph.  Car revved for ever.  Felt like it
would never quit pulling.  It had 3.55 gears.
Later,
Dave
 
>

----------
Posted by: emory!davasha.win.net!cooldave (David Cooley)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 17 20:59:53 1994
Subject:      Re: swap meets again
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Re: Southern Swap Meets
This one hasn't gotten as much publicity as most.
Atlanta Motor Speedway, June 11th and 12th.
Was worth attending when last held during 1992.

----------
Posted by: Bob Bigelow 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 17 23:59:29 1994
Subject: changing to synthetic
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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I've used "regular" oils in my new 5.0 engine since I installed it
about 2k miles ago. I'd like to switch to synthetics as I will
be going to a track event in July. (can you say hot?)
	Are there any do's or don'ts about making the change?

--
****************************************************************************
Tom Stangler                QC Mngr, TRACOR Applied Sciences, Chesapeake Ops
Va Beach, VA                                  Tidewater Sports Car Club, LTD
stangle@infi.net                                            tsccnet@infi.net
86 Mustang GT, C/P                           Nat'l Tour, Norfolk VA, June 94

----------
Posted by: emory!infi.net!stangle (Tom Stangler)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 18 01:34:21 1994
Subject: clearance for Locktite?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Found this on the net.  Thought it might come in handy.

John
----------------------------------------------------------------

Greg Lewis (gregl@zimmer.CSUFresno.EDU) wrote:
: How much clearance should one allow for a cylindrical shaft and hole
: set with Loctite?...

... and how long is that piece of string anyway? :)

How much you can get away with depends on which particular flavor of Loctite
you're using. Optimally, the gap should be between 1 and two thou all the
way around. Incapable of leaving it at that, however, I'll throw in the table
from the current Loctite catalog on the end of this posting.

Yes, I know it's overkill but someone else might find it useful. It's not
readily available unless you call Loctite for the data sheets or go find a
supplier with some spare catalogs.

Tim
--
Tim Kirby --------- Cray Research Inc., Eagan, MN, USA ---------- trk@cray.com
Disclaimer: Cray didn't say this... I did...
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If all else fails, Immortality may always be assured by spectacular error(JKG)
------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Loctite Retaining Compounds
---------------------------
Notes:

+ The gap fills are all *maximum*. According to the guy at Loctite when I
  asked these very questions some time ago, the optimum gap is between 0.001"
  and 0.002" (0.002 to 0.004 diametral) for any of theses adhesives.
+ This table refers to the *retaining compunds*, not *threadlock compunds*
+ The viscosity "Low/Med./High" is from the descriptions for each product
+ The '660' is referred to as 'Quick Metal', considered a non-running product
+ If you're using another brand (is there any other ? :) you're on your own.
+ Cure Speed assumes no accelerator is used. Activators/accelerators may
  improve the gap filling capabilities slightly as well as ensuring proper/
  faster curing respectively. If you need to accelerate it, talk to your
  dealer; I don't have any specific numbers.
+ Primers are useful on inactive surfaces such as aluminum, black oxide,
  stainless steel and thermoset plastics
+ Remember... *CLEAN CLEAN CLEAN* !!!

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Compound  No.     609    620    635    640    642    660     675    680
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Color            Green  Green  Green  Green  Green  Silver  Green  Green

*Maximum*
Gap Fill         0.005" 0.015" 0.010" 0.007" 0.012" 0.020"  0.005" 0.015"
(Diametral)

Viscosity        V.Low  High   High   Med.   Med.   !!!!    Low    Med.
  (cP)            125   7000   2000   600    500   1200000  125    1250

Shear (psi)      3000   3000   4000   3000   3500   3000    3000   4000

Temp Range(F)

   Low           -65    -65    -65    -65    -65    -65     -65    -65
   High          300    450    300    400    350    300     300    300

Cure Speed

 Fixture (Min)   10     30     60     60     5      10      20     10
   Full  (Hrs)   24     24     24     24     24     24      24     24

Primer         T or N   T      T      T   T or N    N       T      T


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Uses:

609: spindle bearings, lip seals, bearing races

620: engine cylinder liners, heat exchanger tubes

635: gears, pulleys, fans, collars, rotors, sprockets, cams and flywheels
           to shafts.

640: bushings and sleeves, rotors to shafts

642: bushings in manual transmissions

660: worn shafts, worn housings, worn end bells, bearing spinouts,
           wallowed keyways, wallowed splines

675: oil impregnated bushings, drill bushings

680: gears, wheels, pulleys, cams, collars, flywheels, sprockets, and rotors
           to shafts, replacement bearings in worn housings or on worn shafts.
           
-- 
John De Armond, WD4OQC, Marietta, GA    jgd@dixie.com 
Performance Engineering Magazine.  Email to me published at my sole discretion
You know your country is dying when you have to make a distinction between
what is moral and ethical and what is legal.

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 18 01:42:51 1994
Subject: Flow Bench from HELL!
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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 Through a most amazing stroke of luck, I found a truck wrecking yard
south of Bald Knob, Arkansas that sold me a useable 6-71 supercharger
for $100 plus tax.  They let me pick through a whole pallet of the
things to get the best one.

 I also have a 1600 Cortina engine sitting in the shed.  Lots easier on
the electric bill than a 75hp electric motor.  Looks like a few 2x4s, a
trip to the local farm supply store for some sprockets and chain, a
little sheetmetal and machine work, and a few items from the Dwyer
instrument catalog will let me have a flow bench capable of sucking the
valves right out of a head!
                                                                                                    

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 18 17:45:52 1994
Subject: Re: swap meets again
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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On May 17, 11:52am, The Hotrod List wrote:
} Subject: swap meets again
> 
> 
>  swap meet in Massachusetts and I'm getting itchy.  The block is 
>  0.060 over and complete.  The fellow claims that it magnafluxed
>  ok and all machine work is complete.  The block is coated with 
>  some form of protective oil and looks pretty good.  What's a block
>  worth.  

Bill if you come across a bellhousing and big spline top loader for a 429 
Ford, let me know.  I am looking for the same.Mike. I would say you have a
nice find with your 427 block. Swap meets are great! Mike
> 



-- 
Mike Brattland(Brattlan@cyber.net) "Three Deuces and a 4 Speed" 
Insurance Auto Auctions, Spring Valley, California 800-322-8284   
E-MAIL me for Tech Info on Small and Big Block Ford Tri-Power Information! !

----------
Posted by: "Michael G. Brattland" 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 18 17:58:32 1994
Subject: Future of hotrod list?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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	The plug gets pulled on dixie.com on Friday, according to John.
Has anyone stepped forward to host the list and its archives after that?

	I don't have the resources (hell, I don't even own my own computer),
or I'd be happy to do it.

--
Chris BeHanna  DoD# 114  KotSTA   Ed Green         1975 CB360T - Baby Bike
behanna@syl.nj.nec.com            Fan Club #004    1991 ZX-11  - Zexy
kore ha NEC no iken dewa arimasen.                 1973 RD350A - seized
I was raised by a pack of wild corn dogs.          1987 EX500  - the RaceBike


[C'mon Chris, pay attention.  I'm pulling the plug on only the firearms 
politics mailing list on friday because I'm tired of messing with the
whining babies who populate that list.  Dixie.com (and this list)
will be around for awhile longer and I think a transition is 
underway. JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!syl.nj.nec.com!behanna (Chris BeHanna)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 18 18:11:00 1994
Subject:       Re: changing to synthetic
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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> I've used "regular" oils in my new 5.0 engine since I installed it
> about 2k miles ago. I'd like to switch to synthetics as I will
> be going to a track event in July. (can you say hot?)
>     Are there any do's or don'ts about making the change?

   I wouldn't switch until the engine had at least 5,000 miles on
   it.  If you switch too soon the rings may not seat as well as
   you'd like.  Other than that there is nothing to it.
   
   Mark W. Blunier
blunier@cei.com
(217) 351-3117
fax (217) 351-8576

----------
Posted by: "Mark Blunier" 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 18 18:21:10 1994
Subject: RE: changing to synthetic
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Tom Stangler writes:

> I've used "regular" oils in my new 5.0 engine since I installed it
> about 2k miles ago. I'd like to switch to synthetics as I will
> be going to a track event in July. (can you say hot?)
>	Are there any do's or don'ts about making the change?

1) if your engine is new, well wait for about 2k-3k more miles so that it's 
broken in properly.

2) next...drain your oil, and fill it with synthetic. Todays synthetics are 
compatable with regular oils, so you do not have prepare your engine to use it.

I have a Vortex Supercharged Mustang, I've tried Mobile 1, but found the 
engine ran much smoother and with less oil blowby with Castrol Syntex. (5-50)
My blower also has less whine with Syntex, One thing which still amazes me is 
that with mobile1 I burn up about 3/4 qt of oil around 2500-3000 miles, not 
true with the Syntex. When my car wasn't supercharged, Mobile1 usually lasted 
me around 5000-7500 miles. Don't use it past 7500miles, because your oil 
filter will get pretty bad.

Ajay Patel
'91 Vortex GT Conv

----------
Posted by: emory!roadnet.ups.com!AXP (Ajay Patel)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 19 03:45:54 1994
Subject: Re: changing to synthetic
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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That was what I was searching for. a recommended milage. Thanks for
the input.

In article  you wrote:
: > I've used "regular" oils in my new 5.0 engine since I installed it
: > about 2k miles ago. I'd like to switch to synthetics as I will
: > be going to a track event in July. (can you say hot?)
: >     Are there any do's or don'ts about making the change?

:    I wouldn't switch until the engine had at least 5,000 miles on
:    it.  If you switch too soon the rings may not seat as well as
:    you'd like.  Other than that there is nothing to it.
:    
: Posted by: "Mark Blunier" 

--
****************************************************************************
Tom Stangler                QC Mngr, TRACOR Applied Sciences, Chesapeake Ops
Va Beach, VA                                  Tidewater Sports Car Club, LTD
stangle@infi.net                                            tsccnet@infi.net
86 Mustang GT, C/P                           Nat'l Tour, Norfolk VA, June 94

----------
Posted by: emory!infi.net!stangle (Tom Stangler)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 19 03:59:11 1994
Subject: synthetic switch
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Along the same lines as the question about switching to synthetic oil...

		At what point in the engine's life does it no longer
pay to switch to synthetic?  For example, I am trying to get all the milage
I can out of my Chevette with 87K. Would switching now do me any good?

			Thanks!
					--Erik
					emueller@eden.rutgers.edu

[For street use, the day you crank it for the first time.  The fact
is, regular dinasaur residue does the job just fine, thankyouverymuch.
Synthetics give you a warm fuzzy feeling when you pour it in, it
makes your car slightly faster because your wallet is lighter, and
in a racing environment actually offers some benefit.  But not on
the street.  JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!eden.rutgers.edu!emueller (Erik Mueller)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 19 04:15:27 1994
Subject: Hotrod generator
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Amazing the places an intrepid hotrodder can find to ply his trade.

We're getting ready for our first BBQ catering job this weekend.  We
have the whole affair set up for a dry run in our carport.  Since most
of these places have inadequate power, a successful caterer carries his
own generator, in my case a 3.8KW yamaha.  Problem is, I have this 
coffee pot which takes 2400 watts, a tea brewer that takes 1200 watts
and some steam tables that take about 600 watts.  Oops!  4.2KW.  
The yamaha goes UGGGHHH!  The coffee maker overflows cuz the brew
timer is runnning slow.  The lights dim.  Not good.

Being the hotrodder that I am, I decided to take a peek.  A quick check
showed that the generator didn't overheat at 4.2kw; the motor simply
lacked the balls.  First step - open up the air cleaner housing.  
A bit more noise but now a solid 4 kw.  Not much one could do to the
exhaust since more noise is highly undesirable.  What to do.  My
die grinder trigger finger got real itchy as I looked the motor over.
Hmm, a port'n'polish would probably take too long, seeing as we have
to leave Friday night.  Then I noticed the carb has an adjustable mainjet.
A light goes on!!!!!  Quick trip to the shop for some rummaging...
Ah, there it is, my little 5 gal can of nitro.  I whip out a batch
of 10% nitro in nothing flat.  Into the generator it goes, followed
by a bit of tweaking to get the mixture on.  Even did a plug reading :-)

Viola!!!

Now the govenor isn't even fully open at 4.2kw.  Now I only have one 
small problem to solve - how to get the gas masks to all my customers :-)
I'll just tell 'em it's my BBQ sauce that's making their eyes water.
Hey, that's the ticket.

John

-- 
John De Armond, WD4OQC, Marietta, GA    jgd@dixie.com 
Performance Engineering Magazine.  Email to me published at my sole discretion
You know your country is dying when you have to make a distinction between
what is moral and ethical and what is legal.

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 19 14:01:02 1994
Subject: Caddy Performance
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Hey all,

Anybody worked on Cadillac motors?  I've got a 61' 
Coupe Deville with a tired 390 and an even more tired 
hydromatic 4 speed.  My plans are to first replace the 
hydro with a T700 4 speed.  Later in life, hopefully 
soon, I will be buying a bone-yard Caddy 500 and do 
a mild to moderate build up, cash flow the limiting 
factor on how much building I'll do. 
Are the tranny bolt patterns the same for the 390 and  
the 500?  How about late model Caddy T700 tranny's?  
Will they bolt up to the 500 motors?  
I am just in the planning stages now.  I got 2 good
sources for Caddy 500 performance parts from Dave's 
vendor list.  Thanks a million for the list Dave!!!
They've got a Chevy tranny to Caddy 500 adapter plate,
but thats another $90 I'd rather put into the engine.
So, if any of you have any words of wisdom on any part
of this project, I'd like to hear them. Thanks.


gregg




----

Gregg Pitkin			Fidelity Investments
Systems Administrator		400 E. Las Colinas Blvd
gregg@fmrco.com			Irving TX, 75039
(214)830-7843

----------
Posted by: emory!fmrco.com!gregg (Gregg Pitkin)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 19 14:07:12 1994
Subject: Small block Chevy engine weights
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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A while back I had commented that my engine weight measurements
for the small block Chevy came to 400 pounds while the factory
specs as published in various places were closer to 500 pounds.
Dave Williams asked for my numbers; I have been unable to find
my notes so I remeasured as many parts as I have ready access to.

This list isn't complete - I didn't have access to some of the
smaller parts such as oil pumps, fuel pump pushrods, timing
chain cover, etc. so there are some blanks in the list.  If
anyone reading this list has actual weight data for these items
then I would appreciate it if you would post it.

Also, I have omitted some of the miscellaneous parts that go
into the engine, for example, the bolts that hold on the timing
cover.  Most of this stuff is negligible in weight but if anyone
wants to add the missing items to the list then please feel free.


165	bare block
 88	heads, assembled
 49	crankshaft
 12	intake manifold, aluminum
  9	camshaft
  7	harmonic balancer, small
 14.4	pistons, including pins
  	rods with bolts and caps
  5.7	head and main bolts
	bearings
  2.9	lifters
  1.7	pushrods
  4	rocker arm kits
	oil pump & drive shaft
  2.7	timing chain & sprockets
 	water pump
	distributor & coil
  1.7	spark plug wires
  3.2	valve covers
  1	spark plugs
	thermostat & housing
	fuel pump push rod
	oil pan
	timing cover

Total of listed parts: 367 pounds.  Figuring about 40 pounds for the
unmeasured items brings the total to 407 pounds.

While not part of the engine, the starter and carburetor also add weight:

 13	carburetor, Holley 4 barrel
 17	starter

And you will need some kind of exhaust system, and a flywheel or flex plate.
Most people will also use an air cleaner and a crankcase ventilation
system.  The selections here vary widely in weight, and are not part of
the engine, so I haven't included their weights.

Bob Hale   hale@brooktree.com

----------
Posted by: emory!brooktree.com!hale (bob hale)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 19 14:13:02 1994
Subject: Re:  Hotrod generator
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8549
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 Howzabout you get a squirrel cage blower from the scrap pile and put a
ounce or two of boost on it? I bet the little feller is hurting for 
air. The blower ought to take a couple hundred watts and more than pay you
back...

[Been thinking about that.  I do have a 1/2 horse motor driving a smog
pump that I use on my glass blowing bench.  That should give it enough
boost.  What a rig!!!!  Boy, talking about a toggle switch throttle :-) 
I'll give it a try after this weekend is over.  JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 19 19:54:47 1994
Subject: coolants...
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Hi y'all...

I remember reading a Street Rodder article a while back (can't
find it now) about using pure propylene glycol (mixed 50/50
with water, that is) as a coolant, rather than the ethylene
glycol-based commercial products. As I recall, the article
claimed much longer coolant life, better heat transfer, better
lubrication qualities, much higher boiling point, etc., etc.
(non-poisonous, too). I have a street rod that runs a little
hot and was thinking about flushing it out and trying some of
this stuff. Anyone have any real experience using propylene
glycol? I'm sure it costs more than discount store prices for
regular coolant, and I'm not really looking to squander any
cash on snake oil.

Thanks,
Dave

----------
Posted by: emory!amp.com!dave.miller (Dave Miller)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 19 20:03:56 1994
Subject: Swap meet
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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On the West coast there are a couple of swap meets to choose from.
The biggest is the Pomona Faigrounds (aka L.A.Fairgrounds) Next date 6/5/94
they have just about everything you need. I've seen parts from Daytona Chargers
to SOHC 427's and everything in between. Everytime I've gone I arrived
at 5:00am to start shopping. It will take a six-pac and a good 3 hours
to walk the whole swap meet. Bring a wagon and lots of cash.

There's a swap meet in San Diego at Jack Murphy stadium it much smaller
but I've hear of better deals. I don't know when the next date is though.

I'm not sure what's a good deal for a 427 block. I've heard of complete
motors going for 4k to 7k complete. I'm not 100% sure.

My neighbor had a 69 Fastback Torino with a 427. It ran 11's.
Or was it a 68 I can't remember. 

If you can make it to the Pomona Swap Meet don't forget to swing by your
nearest In-Out Burger they are the best. 

Oh yeah, remember to pick-up a Recycler and Auto trader magazines. You can
find them just about anywhere.

See ya
MPQ

----------
Posted by: emory!ingres.com!mquinn (Michael Quinn)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 19 23:57:08 1994
Subject: RE: Caddy Performance
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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>Hey all,
>
>Anybody worked on Cadillac motors?  I've got a 61' 
>Coupe Deville with a tired 390 and an even more tired 
>hydromatic 4 speed.  My plans are to first replace the 
>hydro with a T700 4 speed.  Later in life, hopefully 
>soon, I will be buying a bone-yard Caddy 500 and do 
>a mild to moderate build up, cash flow the limiting 
>factor on how much building I'll do. 

I thought all Caddies use the BOP bolt patter - the TH700 definitly only 
comes in Chevy flavours.  You can get adapters to make the BOP to Chevy 
trasition.

>Are the tranny bolt patterns the same for the 390 and  
>the 500?  How about late model Caddy T700 tranny's?  
>Will they bolt up to the 500 motors?  

Do they use TH700 or do they use TH200R4 (or whatever) - I was pretty sure 
it was the latter.

Of course TH400's were available for the 500's - if you go with an adapter 
your could also get the truck version of the overdrive 4-speed - internally 
it is supposidly like a TH400.  This requires a special electronic 
controller to switch the gears.  Check with Edlebrock for custom version 
of the controller.  I really don't know how long a TH700 would last in your 
application.  Another option would be a two speed overdrive mounted on the 
tail shaft - used in motor homes and larger trucks.  These will set you 
back about $1000 by the time your done but they really hold up.

Dirk

----------
Posted by: emory!STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV!OADDAB (DIRK BROER)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 00:05:43 1994
Subject: Caddy parts
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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My father started down the road you are on a while back.
Due to a divorce, the project stopped, and as a result, 
there are vairous Caddy parts available to me.  Heck, the whole
project, including  a very clean "sleeper" to put it
in is around.

Caddy parts are expensive.

I have a complete dissassembled 502(??) in eastern Massachusetts, 
and a already-rebuilt T400 to go with it.  Interested?

About T700s:  I have researched this issue for a few years.
T700s never came in anything but two Chevy bolt patterns.  T700 had
its name changed to 4L60, and its family grew to include the 4L60E
and the 4T60E.  The only "late model caddy T700" is a 4T60E, a 
transversal Chevy-transversal-bolt-pattern 4 speed electrically-
actuated tranny, although I cannot speak for NorthStar stuff.  
I think what you really want is the 4L80E ( 454SS Pickup; find a 
wrecked one ), or perhaps a 4L80 if you can find one ( some new 
Diesel trucks?? ).
Personally, I have a 500 ft.lb. 4L60 in my '64 Chevelle.  
These things are NOT cheap.  Also very appealing is the 
extra gear option for a T350, T400, T700, 4L60, 4L80.  
These cost like a new transmission.

If you are in the planning stages, plan to spend a lot of money.

Sounds like a fun project, though.  Good luck.
Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097

----------
Posted by: emory!rebel.dsea.com!frank (Frank Evan Perdicaro)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 00:16:20 1994
Subject: Re: changing to synthetic
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In article  emory!roadnet.ups.com!AXP (Ajay Patel) wrote: 

: I have a Vortex Supercharged Mustang, I've tried Mobile 1, but found the 
: engine ran much smoother and with less oil blowby with Castrol Syntex. (5-50)
: My blower also has less whine with Syntex, One thing which still amazes me is 
: that with mobile1 I burn up about 3/4 qt of oil around 2500-3000 miles, not 
: true with the Syntex.

I always though that an engine should burn some minimal amount of oil
or otherwise the valve guides and piston rings wouldn't get adequate
lubrication and would wear out quickly. Anyone have a feel for what
that minimum should be? I thought that a quart every 3000-4000 miles
was about right.  Or is this too high?

--
Norb Brotz                Cray Research Park    Internet: nbrotz@cray.com
Sr. Programmer/Analyst    655F Lone Oak Drive   UUCP:     uunet!cray!nbrotz
Software Division         Eagan, Mn. 55121      phone:    (612) 683-5698


----------
Posted by: emory!sdiv.cray.com!nbrotz (Norb Brotz)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 03:50:06 1994
Subject: Hotrod generator
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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-> Ah, there it is, my little 5 gal can of nitro.  I whip out a batch of
-> 10% nitro in nothing flat.  Into the generator it goes, followed

 Heck, cruise by your local motorcycle junkyard and pick up one of those
teeny Hitachi turbos the Seca Turbos used.  Keep your Yamaha all Yamaha.
 

 Hmm... Crane claims they'll regrind practically any cam you send
them...  a little porting, bump the compression...  hey, lawnmowers,
chainsaws, what makes generators too good to hotrod?

[Gotta keep those RPMs constant unless you don't mind running everything
on 70 hz or something.  Not sure a cam would do much without being
able to raise the RPM.  Have been thinking about a good port
and valve job and maybe a boost in compression.  I'm really trying to
stay with this beast cuz I can juuuussstt barely pick the sucker up
to put it in the truck.  A larger one would cause me to drop a nut
or something.  JGD]

  Went out early this morning and started cleaning out the shed, finally
found the old Cortina motor.  Cute little 1600 Kent, about the same size
as a 6-71.  Found I could pick up the complete motor, starter, carb, and
all.  My eyes bugged out a bit, but it sure looks funny next to that
Olds 455.  Next step - trying to find where I stuck the transmission, so
I can use the input shaft and main housing for a PTO.
                                                        

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 03:57:42 1994
Subject: Caddy Performance
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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-> Are the tranny bolt patterns the same for the 390 and
-> the 500?

 No.  Almost all T700s are Chevrolet bolt pattern.  GM has two V8 bolt
patterns - Chevrolet and "corporate," which is all other V8s, inline 6s,
and most 90 degree V6s.

 There are persistent rumors of T700s in Olds-powered Oldsmobiles, which
would be a corporate pattern, but I haven't seen one, and several
authorities deny there was ever a corporate T700.  If you find one, let
me know!

 Also, the '61 390 predates the corporate pattern.  Nothing will fit but
a Cadillac box of the proper pattern.  The 500 is corporate, no trouble.

 I would recommend, given the low-end torque available from the 500,
that you simply retain the 500's T475 auto and adjust the rear end ratio
to whatever your rear-plus-OD would have been with the T700.  The T475
is a heavy duty version of the T400.  You won't usually find parts
listed specifically for it, but T400 parts fit.


-> sources for Caddy 500 performance parts from Dave's
-> vendor list.  Thanks a million for the list Dave!!!

 You're welcome!
                    

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 10:45:12 1994
Subject: Re: synthetic switch
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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>[For street use, the day you crank it for the first time.  The fact
>is, regular dinasaur residue does the job just fine, thankyouverymuch.
>Synthetics give you a warm fuzzy feeling when you pour it in, it
>makes your car slightly faster because your wallet is lighter, and
>in a racing environment actually offers some benefit.  But not on
>the street.  JGD]


I dont agree with this.  I did the Synthetic oil change in my street car
last oil change and my gas mileage has gone from a consistant 20mpg
to 23mpg.  It works for me, and I've been thinking of trying it in my
race car.. except my race car normally looses a quart of oil ever 2 races
so its not worth the cost.


----------
Posted by: Mark Tapper 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 10:53:56 1994
Subject: RE: Caddy Performance
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8558
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>Hey all,
>
>Anybody worked on Cadillac motors?  I've got a 61' 
>Coupe Deville with a tired 390 and an even more tired 
>hydromatic 4 speed.  My plans are to first replace the 
>hydro with a T700 4 speed.  Later in life, hopefully 
>soon, I will be buying a bone-yard Caddy 500 and do 
>a mild to moderate build up, cash flow the limiting 
>factor on how much building I'll do. 

I think it's a great idea what you're doing.  As far as trannies go, by far
your cheapest bet would be to find a TH400 from a Caddy, Buick, Olds, or
Pontiac. (BOP bolt pattern)  Here's the deal though....you could get a whole
car with running motor and trans.  Only Eldorado's came with 500's from
'70?-'74.  But they are front wheel drive and the trans would be of no use to
you.  If you'd be willing to settle for a 472 (same block, shorter stroke) you
could get any 70-74 deville/seville whatever...it's usually cheaper to buy the
whole running car for a couple hundred bucks than to get ripped off at the
junk-yard!  ALSO, all 75-76 Cads have 500's/TH400's, so that may be your best
bet.
Or if money is no object, I'd go for the heavy duty 4L80 4-spd.  It's 
electronically controlled, but several aftermarket outfits offer stand-alone 
controllers that let you adjust just about anything you'd ever want to (shift 
points, lock-up speed, etc)  Just think, with all the torque those motors have,
and with a highway-geared rearend and your trans in 4th gear, you could rocket 
down the road with the motor practically idling.
 

----------
Posted by: "MATT BOSSARD , 1-2508, PGR#1541, MS D1-50" 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 11:00:17 1994
Subject: Aftermarket fuel injection info
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8559
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Anyone know of some information on current aftermarket electronic fuel 
injection systems? (i.e. Haltech, Accel/DFI,....)  I bought a book called 
"FUEL INJECTION: Performance, Tuning, Modifications" or something to that
effect.  It's fairly informative, but being a few years old, there's probably
since been some updated/new systems available in addition to the one's that are
covered in the book.    Thanks



                         ________________________
                        |                       | 
                        |                       | 
           --------------                         ----------------  
         /       There's no substitute for cubic inches.        /
        /                  ('cept for nitrous)                 /   
       /_________________     Matt Bossard       _____________/
                        | mbossard@ptd.intel.com|
                        |_______________________|


----------
Posted by: "MATT BOSSARD , 1-2508, PGR#1541, MS D1-50" 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 11:05:47 1994
Subject: Re:  Caddy parts
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8560
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

 Why not rebuild the existing transmission, rather than going to the 
bother of adapting a newer, probably less stout one? If you have a
TH400-based OD 4-speed transmission, it's a rarity. My '63 Caddy had
what I think was an overdrive 4-speed auto. However, I'm not sure that
it was a TH400 base; might have been some weird Caddy offshoot. On the
other hand, the TH400 might have evolved from that Caddy transmission.
Before tossing it, you might pull it and see how similar it is to a
later TH400. If the wear parts interchange to any extent, you ought
to have a pretty good package, capable of more input torque than 
later automatics. Caddies of the early '60s vintage were pretty 
overengineered. 

----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 13:44:48 1994
Subject: Re: changing to synthetic
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8562
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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>I always though that an engine should burn some minimal amount of oil
>or otherwise the valve guides and piston rings wouldn't get adequate
>lubrication and would wear out quickly. Anyone have a feel for what
>that minimum should be? I thought that a quart every 3000-4000 miles
>was about right.  Or is this too high?

>Norb Brotz

Norb,
      Yes mustangs engines do blowby oil to the top of the cylinders, and 
usually at a rate of 1qt per 4k-5k. But, with synthetics, it doesn't burn up. 
Regular 'dino-power' oils burn around 330 degrees, where synthetics (pure, not 
blended)  will hold it's own up to 500-600 degrees. That's why I mentioned in 
my last posting that my supercharged engine burned up Mobile1, but not too 
much of the Syntec. Synthetics also have a uncanny ability to keep the engine 
coated with oil, even when cold, thus reducing friction at startup.



_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/
_/                              _/
_/      Ajay Patel              _/
_/      AXP@ROADNET.UPS.COM     _/
_/                              _/
_/      '91 Vortex GT Conv      _/
_/                              _/
_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/_/

----------
Posted by: emory!roadnet.ups.com!AXP (Ajay Patel)
 



From rsiatl!hotrod Fri May 20 13:55:54 1994
Subject: TV: *Televised Events #94-20*
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8561
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

----------------------------------------------------------------------
			       TV Events

Now in its third year of weekly publication, TVE is a compilation of 
info. gleaned from TV listings, auto mags., newspapers, tea leaves, my 
favorite bartender, and the nice folks at TNN.  PLEASE confirm dates and 
times with your local listings before setting your VCRs.

TVE will USUALLY be updated no later than every Friday morning and will 
be most accurate (or least inaccurate) for the following 7 days. If your 
favorite event is "tba'd", please don't panic unless it's in the 7 day 
window.

As mentioned previously, this listing is now being submitted to the new 
group rec.autos.sport.info.  Assuming the moderators approve, this list 
will be available in the r.a.s.i group from now on.  In an attempt to get 
the word to as many r.a.s readers as possible, I will continue to cross-
post to r.a.s for a short time. (This again assumes the moderators of 
r.a.s.i do not object to my doing so.)

Also, this week a special thanks to Chuck Swinehart for helping me thru
what is probably the busiest time of year for motorsports coverage.

If you are having trouble with this list arriving at your site in
a timely fashion, please let me know via e-mail and I will also start
mailing you a copy.

Comments, suggestions, additions, extra pit passes, etc. to:
					  stoffel@oasys.dt.navy.mil

		   ---------------------------------

(T)=Taped  (L)=Live  (SD)=Same Day  (?)=dunno

12:00AM = 0000 hours = start of day

    EVENT                             DATE  TIME(Eastern, USA)  NETWORK

VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Charlotte (L)  05/20   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
INDY 500 PRACTICE (L)                 05/20    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN
Motoworld II                          05/20    6:30-7:00PM      ESPN2
Countdown To Indy                     05/20    11:00-11:30PM    HTS*
Motoworld II                          05/21    12:30-1:00AM     ESPN2
Secrets Of Speed                      05/21    1:00-1:30AM      ESPN2
Speed Racer (cartoon)                 05/21    7:00-7:30AM      MTV
Shadetree Mechanic (customizing)      05/21    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
MotorWeek                             05/21    10:00-10:30AM    WGN
Checkered Flag (F1 @ Monaco)          05/21    1:30-2:00PM      ESPN
A Race For Heroes (Gordon Johncock)   05/21    2:00-2:30PM      ESPN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              05/21    2:00-2:30PM      TNN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 3RD DAY (L)  05/21    2:30-3:30PM      ESPN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      05/21    2:30-3:00PM      TNN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               05/21    3:00-3:30PM      TNN
Hydropower                            05/21    3:00-4:00PM      ESPN2
Trucks And Tractor Power              05/21    3:30-4:00PM      TNN
NHRA, SOUTHERN NATIONALS, ATLANTA (T) 05/21    4:00-5:30PM      TNN
AMA SUPERCROSS (T)                    05/21    4:00-5:00PM      ESPN2
MotorWeek (Porch 911 Carrera)         05/21    5:00-5:30PM      MPT**
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 3RD DAY (L)  05/21    6:00-7:00PM    ESPN,TSN
Glory Days                            05/21    6:00-6:30PM      ESPN2
IHRA Hall Of Fame Ceremony            05/21    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
THE WINSTON SELECT, CHARLOTTE(L)      05/21    7:30-10:30PM     TNN
SATURDAY NIGHT LIGHTNING (L)          05/21    7:30-9:30PM      ESPN2
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 3RD DAY (T)  05/21    8:00-9:00PM      TSN
DRAG RACING, GAINESVILLE (T)          05/21    9:30-10:30PM     ESPN2
N Bonnett's Winners (Kenny Bernstein) 05/21    10:30-11:00PM    TNN
Power Wheels                          05/21    10:30-11:30PM    ESPN2
Indy, Review of 3rd Day Qualifying    05/22    12:00-12:30AM    ESPN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 3RD DAY (T)  05/22    12:30-1:30AM     ESPN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 3RD DAY (T)  05/22    1:30-2:30AM      ESPN
Motoworld                             05/22    3:00-3:30AM      ESPN
Indy, Review of 3rd Day Qualifying    05/22    6:30-7:00AM      ESPN
Motoworld                             05/22    7:30-8:00AM      ESPN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               05/22    9:00-9:30AM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              05/22    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
N Bonnett's Winners (Kenny Bernstein) 05/22    10:00-10:30AM    TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              05/22    10:30-11:00AM    TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      05/22    11:00-11:30AM    TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           05/22   11:30AM-12:00PM   TNN
BUSCH GN, NAZARETH (L)                05/22    1:00-3:00PM      TNN
Legends Of The Brickyard (1982)       05/22    3:00-3:30PM      ESPN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               05/22    3:00-3:30PM      TNN
SpeedWeek                             05/22    3:30-4:00PM      ESPN
Trucks And Tractor Power              05/22    3:30-4:00PM      TNN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 4TH DAY (L)  05/22    4:00-7:00PM      ESPN
World Of Speed & Beauty (VW Nationals)05/22    6:00-6:30PM      TNN
Shadetree Mechanic (customizing)      05/22    7:00-7:30PM      TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              05/22    7:30-8:00PM      TNN
SCCA, TRANS AM, BOWMANVILLE (SD)      05/22    7:30-9:30PM      PRIME
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      05/22    8:00-8:30PM      TNN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 4TH DAY (T)  05/22    8:00-9:00PM      TSN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           05/22    8:30-9:00PM      TNN
SCCA, TRANS AM, BOWMANVILLE (SD)      05/22   10:00PM-12:00AM   HTS*
Road Test Magazine w/Don Garlits      05/22    11:00-11:30PM    TNN
World Of Speed & Beauty (VW Nationals)05/22   11:30PM-12:00AM   TNN
RaceDay Update w/Pat Patterson (L)    05/23    12:00-12:05AM    TNN
NHRA, WINSTON SELECT, ROCKINGHAM (T)  05/23    12:05-1:30AM     TNN
INDIANAPOLIS QUALIFYING, 4TH DAY (T)  05/23    3:30-5:30AM      ESPN
Checkered Flag (F1 @ Monaco)          05/23    1:00-1:30PM      ESPN
Indy, Review of 4th Day Qualifying    05/23    2:00-2:30PM      ESPN
AMA SUPERCROSS, PONTIAC (T)           05/23    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
SCCA, TRANS AM, BOWMANVILLE (T)       05/23    7:00-9:00PM      HTS*
Secrets Of Speed                      05/23    7:30-8:00PM      ESPN2
SCCA, TRANS AM, BOWMANVILLE (T)       05/23    8:00-10:00PM     MSG
A Race For Heroes (A.J.)              05/24    1:30-2:00AM      ESPN
SATURDAY NIGHT LIGHTNING (T)          05/24    1:00-3:00PM      ESPN2
DRAG RACING (?)                       05/24    3:00-4:00PM      ESPN2
Auto Shop                             05/24    10:00-11:00PM    QVC
Movie: The Crowd Roars                05/25    7:20-8:35AM      TMC
Phoenix 500 Air Races & Fly-In        05/25    1:00-2:00PM      ESPN2
SpeedWeek                             05/25    2:00-2:30PM      ESPN
Indy, Review of 4th Day Qualifying    05/25    2:30-3:00PM      ESPN
AMA SUPERCROSS, MINNEAPOLIS (T)       05/25    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
WINSTON CUP, POLE NIGHT, CHARLOTTE (L)05/25    7:00-9:00PM      HTS*
Movie: Days Of Thunder                05/25    8:00-10:00PM     CBS
NASCAR, SPORTSMAN 100, CHARLOTTE (L)  05/25    9:00-11:00PM     HTS*
NASCAR, SPORTSMAN 100, CHARLOTTE (T)  05/26    3:00-5:00AM      PRIME
WORLD SUPERBIKES, HOCKENHEIM (T)      05/26    2:00-3:00PM      HTS*
IHRA Hall Of Fame Ceremony            05/26    3:00-4:00PM      ESPN2
Motor Sports Hour                     05/26    3:00-4:00PM      HTS*
AMA SUPERCROSS, ORLANDO (T)           05/26    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (L)    05/26    8:00-9:00PM      PRIME
NHRA, SOUTHERN NATIONALS, ATLANTA (T) 05/26    8:00-9:00PM      HTS*
MotorWeek (Neon,Corolla,Saturn, et al)05/26    8:30-9:00PM      MPT**
WORLD SUPERBIKES, HOCKENHEIM (T)      05/26    9:00-10:00PM     HTS*
Motor Sports Hour                     05/26    10:00-11:00PM    HTS*
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (SD)   05/26   11:00PM-12:00AM   HTS*
Movie: Heart Like A Wheel             05/27   10:30AM-12:25PM   MAX
Motoworld II                          05/27    6:30-7:00PM      ESPN2
Special w/ Mario Andretti             05/27    7:00-10:00PM     QVC

		  ----------COMING EVENTS----------

Motoworld II                          05/28    12:30-1:00AM     ESPN2
Secrets Of Speed                      05/28    1:00-1:30AM      ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/28    12:00-12:30PM    ESPN
A Race For Heroes                     05/28    12:30-1:00PM     ESPN
Indy 500 Festival Parade (L)          05/28    1:00-2:30PM      TNN
BUSCH GN, CHARLOTTE (L)               05/28    1:00-4:00PM      TBS
1993 Indy 500                         05/28    1:00-2:00PM      ESPN
Hydropower                            05/28    3:00-4:00PM      ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/28    4:00-4:30PM      ESPN
A Race For Heroes                     05/28    4:30-5:00PM      ESPN
Indy 500 Film                         05/28    5:00-6:00PM      ESPN
Indianapolis 500 Preview              05/28    6:00-7:00PM      ESPN
Indy 500 Film                         05/28    7:00-7:30PM      ESPN2
SpeedWeek                             05/28    7:30-8:00PM      ESPN
Indy 500 Film                         05/28    7:30-8:00PM      ESPN2
Indy 500 Film                         05/28    8:00-8:30PM      ESPN2
Indy 500 Film                         05/28    8:30-9:00PM      ESPN2
Indy 500 Film                         05/28    9:00-9:30PM      ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/28    9:30-10:00PM     ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/28    10:00-10:30PM    ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/28    10:30-11:00PM    ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/28    11:00-11:30PM    ESPN2
AUTO RACING (?)                       05/29    12:30-2:00AM     ESPN
SpeedWeek                             05/29    3:00-3:30AM      ESPN
Motoworld                             05/29    7:30-7:50AM      ESPN
A Race For Heroes                     05/29    7:30-8:00AM      ESPN2
FORMULA 1, SPAIN (L)                  05/29    7:50-10:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
A Race For Heroes                     05/29    8:00-8:30AM      ESPN2
A Race For Heroes                     05/29    8:30-9:00AM      ESPN2
A Race For Heroes                     05/29    9:00-9:30AM      ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/29    9:30-10:00AM     ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/29    10:00-10:30AM    ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/29    10:30-11:00AM    ESPN2
INDIANAPOLIS 500 (L)                  05/29   11:00AM-3:30PM    ABC
WINSTON CUP, CHARLOTTE (L)            05/29    4:45-9:30PM      TBS
PORSCHE CUP, SAN MARINO (T)           05/29    5:00PM           ESPN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      06/01   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      06/02   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      06/03   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
BUSCH GN, DOVER (L)                   06/04    tba              TNN
WINSTON CUP, DOVER (L)                06/05    12:10PM          TNN
INDYCAR, MILWAUKEE (L)                06/05    4:00-6:00PM      ABC [1]
PORSCHE CUP, MONACO (T)               06/10    1:00AM           ESPN
BUSCH GN, MYRTLE BEACH (?)            06/11    tba              tba
FORMULA 1, CANADA (L)                 06/12    2:00-4:00PM  ESPN,CBC
INDYCAR, DETROIT (L)                  06/12    2:00-4:30PM      ABC [1]
WINSTON CUP, POCONO (L)               06/12    12:30PM          TNN
IROC #3, TALLADEGA (T)                06/12    tba              ABC
NHRA, SPRINGNATIONALS, KIRKERSVILLE(?)06/12    tba              tba
PORSCHE CUP, SPAIN (T)                06/18    12:30PM          ESPN
WINSTON CUP, MICHIGAN (L)             06/19    1:00PM           CBS
BUSCH GN, WATKINS GLEN (?)            06/25    tba              tba
ASA, BRAINERD (L)                     06/26    tba              TNN
INDYCAR, PORTLAND (L)                 06/26    4:00-6:30PM      ESPN [1]
NHRA, NATIONALS, TOPEKA (?)           06/26    tba              tba
WINSTON CUP, DAYTONA (L)              07/02    11:00AM          ESPN
FORMULA 1, FRANCE (L)                 07/03    7:50-10:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
BUSCH GN, MILWAUKEE (?)               07/03    tba              tba
ASA, CEDAR RAPIDS (L)                 07/04    tba              TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Loudon (L)     07/06   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Loudon (L)     07/07   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Loudon (L)     07/08   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
FORMULA 1, GREAT BRITAIN (L)          07/10    8:50-11:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
WINSTON CUP, LOUDON (L)               07/10    1:00PM           TNN
INDYCAR, CLEVELAND (L)                07/10    1:30-3:30PM      ABC [1]
BUSCH GN, S. BOSTON (?)               07/16    tba              tba
WINSTON CUP, POCONO (L)               07/17    12:30PM          TBS
INDYCAR, TORONTO (L)                  07/17    2:00-4:00PM      NBC [1]
PORSCHE CUP, FRANCE (T)               07/17    5:00PM           ESPN
BUSCH GN, TALLADEGA (?)               07/23    tba              tba
WINSTON CUP, TALADEGA (L)             07/24    12:15PM          CBS
PORSCHE CUP, BRITAIN (T)              07/24    12:30PM          ESPN
NHRA, MILE-HIGH NATIONALS, MORRISON(?)07/24    tba              tba

[1] CBC also carries all F1 and most IndyCar races (the Indy 500 & Long 
Beach will not be shown this year).  The races are usually broadcast on a 
tape-delayed basis at 11:37PM ET on the evening following the race.  I 
understand that it is not uncommon for CBC to delay the broadcast as much 
as an hour beyond the 11:37PM start, so please use extra caution if you 
plan to tape the race.  If you have access to it, and your French isn't 
too rusty, you may also want to check out RDS which used to broadcast 
each F1 race live. (I don't know for sure if they still do).  Thanks to 
Tak Ariga for info. on coverage in Canada.

* HTS (formerly Home Team Sports) is a regional sports network centered
in the Baltimore/Wash. DC area.  If you have a regional sports network,
please check their listings for these shows.  If they don't have them,
you may want to ask them why they don't.  Your times will almost
certainly vary from those shown with the probable exception of "This
Week In NASCAR".  On race weeks TWIN is usually broadcast live from a
 location somewhere near the track at 11:00PM (Eastern) on the Thursday 
before the race.  An interesting (IMO) show which usually includes a live 
audience, driver/guest, and viewer call-ins.  This show, as well as
many of the others, originate on the Prime Network.

Other possible cable sources for at least some of these shows;

    Network               Area                         Thanks to...

     ASN                Arizona                         Ben Loosli
     TSN                 Canada                       Tom Haapanen
     MSG                New York                    G. Bruce Rodgers
  SportSouth            Atlanta                      David Cornutt
    "    " (aka SPS) E. Tenn. & West NC                 Ken Key
  PrimeTicket         Southern CA                      Chuck Fry
    Empire              Buffalo
     NESN           Boston/N. England                 Trace Kangas
     KBL                Pittsburgh                   Mike Sturdevant
     PASS               Michigan                         Hartz
   Sunshine             Florida
     HSE                 Texas
     PSN           Minneapolis/St. Paul               Dean Barker
     PSN                Seattle                         Gary Eng
     PSN                Portland                       Mike Butts
  SportsChannel      San Francisco                     Chuck Fry
  SportsChannel (SC)    Chicago                      Jim Fuerstenberg

** MPT (Maryland Public TV) - "MotorWeek" is produced by MPT
and distributed to other public and commercial TV stations throughout
N. America.

-------

----------
Posted by: emory!oasys.dt.navy.mil!stoffel (Bill Stoffel)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 20:52:11 1994
Subject: re: Coolant
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8563
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

>Hi y'all...
>
>I remember reading a Street Rodder article a while back (can't
>find it now) about using pure propylene glycol (mixed 50/50
>with water, that is) as a coolant, rather than the ethylene
>glycol-based commercial products. As I recall, the article
>claimed much longer coolant life, better heat transfer, better
>lubrication qualities, much higher boiling point, etc., etc.
>(non-poisonous, too). I have a street rod that runs a little
>hot and was thinking about flushing it out and trying some of
>this stuff. Anyone have any real experience using propylene
>glycol? I'm sure it costs more than discount store prices for
>regular coolant, and I'm not really looking to squander any
>cash on snake oil.
>
>Thanks,
>Dave
>
>- ----------
>Posted by: emory!amp.com!dave.miller (Dave Miller)
>
   Dave,
   A couple years ago, there was a company called MECCA
Industries.  They sold what they called MECCA COOLANT, which was
pure propylene glycol, and reverse flow conversion kits for chevy
v8's.  There prop was about $35.00/gal if I remember right. 
Anyway, they kinda faded into the wood work, but at Wal-Mart, I
bought Sierra Coolant.  Propylene Glycol! 3.59/gal.  I used it at
about a 70% mixture in my Jimmy and it seems to run cooler (head
temperature) than with ethylene glycol.  It supposedly does not
acidify with age as ethylene glycol does too.  Also, the regular
temp gage in the water stream will read hotter, as it extracts
heat more efficiently that ethylene glycol.  My reg. temp gage
reads about 10 deg higher than before, but a good temp gage in the
cyl heads shows about 10 deg less than before.  More efficient.
Hope this helps,
Dave Cooley
cooldave@davasha.win.net 

----------
Posted by: emory!davasha.win.net!cooldave (David Cooley)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 21:03:35 1994
Subject: Re:  Caddy parts
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8564
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

Jum Swonger wrote:
>My '63 Caddy had
>what I think was an overdrive 4-speed auto.


Before the Turbo 400 was used in Cadillacs the transmission was
a 4 speed Hydramatic.  This tranny used a fluid clutch, not a
torque converter.  In fact, a few models of these actually had
another fluid clutch internal to the tranny!  There was no
overdrive in the tranny; the cars typically had low ratio rear
end gears so that they could cruise at 130 with a decent engine RPM.

Because there was no torque converter you got torque multiplication
only from the gears.  The gear ratios were spaced OK on the 1-2 and
the 3-4 shifts but there was a pretty big gap between 2 and 3.
The aftermarket guys were just starting to look into improving the
ratios when the T400 came out; the T400 effectively killed aftermarket
developments for the Hydramatic.

One other problem with the Hydramatics was the double shift on 2-3.
If you got the timing wrong the the tranny would go:

1st
2nd
1st (for a few milliseconds) 3rd
4th

On the other hand, if you took the conservative approach and opted
for safe timing you got:

1st
2nd
4th (for a few milliseconds) 3rd
4th

The double shift was responsible for a lot of coloring of the air in
some shops :-).

Bob Hale   hale@brooktree.com

----------
Posted by: emory!brooktree.com!hale (bob hale)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 21:14:51 1994
Subject: Re: Hotrod Mailing List Digest #170 (May 20, 1994)
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8565
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

>
> Why not rebuild the existing transmission, rather than going to the 
>bother of adapting a newer, probably less stout one? If you have a
>TH400-based OD 4-speed transmission, it's a rarity. My '63 Caddy had
>what I think was an overdrive 4-speed auto. However, I'm not sure that
>it was a TH400 base; might have been some weird Caddy offshoot. On the
>other hand, the TH400 might have evolved from that Caddy transmission.
>Before tossing it, you might pull it and see how similar it is to a
>later TH400. If the wear parts interchange to any extent, you ought
>to have a pretty good package, capable of more input torque than 
>later automatics. Caddies of the early '60s vintage were pretty 
>overengineered. 
>
>- ----------
>Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
>

   James,
   The old 4 speed hydromatic wasn't an overdrive, but the
extremely low 1st gear lets you run cruising gears and still launch
like a rocket.  I had a 64 pontiac catalina w/ 4bbl 389 and 4 spd
hydro.... convertible no less.  At 4300lbs less the driver, I
walked away from many a mustang and vette.  It hooked well, and
the 1st gear was incredible.  at 25 mph, the engine was at about
5000 rpm. but with the 3.23 gears (I think) it had, it was still a
respectable 2200rpm at 60 mph.  Very stout too!  Just like the 400.
Later,
Dave Cooley
cooldave@davasha.win.net
 

----------
Posted by: emory!davasha.win.net!cooldave (David Cooley)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 21:25:31 1994
Subject: Re: Future of hotrod list?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8566
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

In article  The Hotrod List (hotrod@dixie.com) wrote:
:>[C'mon Chris, pay attention.  I'm pulling the plug on only the firearms 
:>politics mailing list on friday because I'm tired of messing with the
:>whining babies who populate that list.  Dixie.com (and this list)
:>will be around for awhile longer and I think a transition is 
:>underway. JGD]

	I thought I was paying attention.  Confusion reigns.  Sorry.

--
Chris BeHanna  DoD# 114  KotSTA   Ed Green         1975 CB360T - Baby Bike
behanna@syl.nj.nec.com            Fan Club #004    1991 ZX-11  - Zexy
kore ha NEC no iken dewa arimasen.                 1973 RD350A - seized
I was raised by a pack of wild corn dogs.          1987 EX500  - the RaceBike


----------
Posted by: emory!syl.nj.nec.com!behanna (Chris BeHanna)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 21:36:46 1994
Subject: Re: coolants...
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8567
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

In article  The Hotrod List (hotrod@dixie.com) wrote:
:>Hi y'all...

:>I remember reading a Street Rodder article a while back (can't
:>find it now) about using pure propylene glycol (mixed 50/50
:>with water, that is) as a coolant, rather than the ethylene
:>glycol-based commercial products. As I recall, the article
:>claimed much longer coolant life, better heat transfer, better
:>lubrication qualities, much higher boiling point, etc., etc.
:>(non-poisonous, too). I have a street rod that runs a little
:>hot and was thinking about flushing it out and trying some of
:>this stuff. Anyone have any real experience using propylene
:>glycol? I'm sure it costs more than discount store prices for
:>regular coolant, and I'm not really looking to squander any
:>cash on snake oil.

	I've been running propylene glycol in my ZX-11 for over a year
now, and it works just fine.  Runs great.  Runs cool.

	The Sierra stuff is pretty reasonably priced and is turning up in
discount stores everywhere now.

--
Chris BeHanna  DoD# 114  KotSTA   Ed Green         1975 CB360T - Baby Bike
behanna@syl.nj.nec.com            Fan Club #004    1991 ZX-11  - Zexy
kore ha NEC no iken dewa arimasen.                 1973 RD350A - seized
I was raised by a pack of wild corn dogs.          1987 EX500  - the RaceBike


----------
Posted by: emory!syl.nj.nec.com!behanna (Chris BeHanna)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 20 21:44:32 1994
Subject:  ADMINISTRIVIA:  Listus interruptus
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8568
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

I'm outta here for a day or two so don't panic at the lack of traffic.

73 John

----------
Posted by: hotrod@dixie.com
 



From rsiatl!hotrod Sun May 22 13:50:09 1994
Subject: List of Ford vintage parts suppliers
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8569
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

Is there a list of vintage part suppliers for Fords? About 1970 models 
regards, Karl

--
kroth@railnet.nshore.org (paul roth)
Railnet BBS +1 216 786 0476

----------
Posted by: emory!railnet.nshore.org!kroth (paul roth)
 



From rsiatl!hotrod Sun May 22 13:51:10 1994
Subject: Re: changing to synthetic
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8571
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: > I've used "regular" oils in my new 5.0 engine since I installed it
: > about 2k miles ago. I'd like to switch to synthetics as I will
: > be going to a track event in July. (can you say hot?)
: >	Are there any do's or don'ts about making the change?

     I agree with the previous two posts.  I had a new 1977 Ford
T-Bird with the 400 engine.  The engine had 2,000 miles on the clock
like yours and I switched to Mobil 1.  Remember, this was in 1977.
I burned 2 quarts of Mobil 1 in about 500 miles.  I was totally 
stressed thinking that my engine had gone sour, but went back to 
regular oil for another 4,000 miles.  I then put in the Mobil 1 and
had absolutely NO problems from there on out.  My 400 didn't turn
any RPMs like your 5.0 will, so I can't say if another synthetic is
any better than any of the others.  This was 1977 and Mobil 1 was
about the only synthetic available to me then.  I did get outstanding
mileage after the switch to synthetic, too.

Happy Motoring,
Mark Zimmerman,  '69 Mach I, '69 Mercury Cyclone
 

----------
Posted by: emory!cray.com!maz (Mark A Zimmerman)
 



From rsiatl!hotrod Sun May 22 13:52:10 1994
Subject: Hotrod generator
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8572
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com


-> [Gotta keep those RPMs constant unless you don't mind running
-> everything on 70 hz or something.  Not sure a cam would do much

 You can tighten the lobe centers and bump the lift a bit without moving
the RPM band enough to notice.  Most industrial-type cams (at least that
I've come across) are primitive harmonic-motion things.  A modern
asymmetrical lobe could do wonders.


-> able to raise the RPM.  Have been thinking about a good port
-> and valve job and maybe a boost in compression.  I'm really trying to

 Of course, porting is free, and I won't tell that you held the head up
against a belt sander to shave it.  Actually, some of the local shops
are set up to use big industrial-size belt sanders for refacing heads
and blocks.  A couple of companies sell them for that express purpose,
at the special auto-engine-rebuilder bend-over price.
                                                                                                    

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From rsiatl!hotrod Sun May 22 13:53:11 1994
Subject: Re: coolants...
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8570
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
X-Comment: Send subscription and drop requests to hotrod-request@dixie.com
X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List) writes:

> Hi y'all...
> 
> I remember reading a Street Rodder article a while back (can't
> find it now) about using pure propylene glycol (mixed 50/50
> with water, that is) as a coolant, rather than the ethylene
> glycol-based commercial products. As I recall, the article
> claimed much longer coolant life, better heat transfer, better
> lubrication qualities, much higher boiling point, etc., etc.
> (non-poisonous, too). I have a street rod that runs a little
> hot and was thinking about flushing it out and trying some of
> this stuff. Anyone have any real experience using propylene
> glycol? I'm sure it costs more than discount store prices for
> regular coolant, and I'm not really looking to squander any
> cash on snake oil.
> 
> Thanks,
> Dave
> 
> ----------
> Posted by: emory!amp.com!dave.miller (Dave Miller)

...and remember the carbs that got 100 mpg. No seriously, with all the 
money spent by Prestone etc. on research to find the best product, I 
think the best you can do is flush out the system or boil out the 
radiator.
Karl

--
kroth@railnet.nshore.org (paul roth)
Railnet BBS +1 216 786 0476

[Actually propylene glycol is a better coolant in a number of ways.
Less corrosive, higher boiling point and lower freezing point than
ethylene glycol, particularly when used undilluted.  The grand thing
about using it undiluted is that one does NOT have to run a pressurized
cooling system because the propylene glycol will not boil off
under reasonable conditions.  The only reason it wasn't popular in the
past was that ethylene glycol was cheaper.  Since ethylene glycol is now
under the econazi gun for being toxic and propylene glycol isn't,
a market niche has been created.  JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!railnet.nshore.org!kroth (paul roth)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May 23 01:39:55 1994
Subject: List of Ford vintage parts suppliers
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8573
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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-> Is there a list of vintage part suppliers for Fords? About 1970
-> models

 There are some in the vendor list on dixie.
                                               

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May 23 16:48:00 1994
Subject: Waterwetter & prop Glyc
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8574
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

With all this talk lately about prop glyc in stead of ethy glyc, I was
wondering if the Redline waterwetter powder was compatible with the
Sierra antifreeze? Any comments?

Frank

----------
Posted by: emory!OAS.PSU.EDU!FBS3     (SZYMKOWSKI.FRANK)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May 23 17:02:01 1994
Subject: Re: synthetic switch
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8575
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

In article  The Hotrod List (hotrod@dixie.com) wrote:
:>>[For street use, the day you crank it for the first time.  The fact
:>>is, regular dinasaur residue does the job just fine, thankyouverymuch.
:>>Synthetics give you a warm fuzzy feeling when you pour it in, it
:>>makes your car slightly faster because your wallet is lighter, and
:>>in a racing environment actually offers some benefit.  But not on
:>>the street.  JGD]


:>I dont agree with this.  I did the Synthetic oil change in my street car
:>last oil change and my gas mileage has gone from a consistant 20mpg
:>to 23mpg.  It works for me, and I've been thinking of trying it in my
:>race car.. except my race car normally looses a quart of oil ever 2 races
:>so its not worth the cost.

	It is most certainly worth the cost in your race car, especially if
you're in a stock class.  The reduced friction nets you a pony or two at
the rear wheels.  That could make all the difference in the world.

--
Chris BeHanna  DoD# 114  KotSTA   Ed Green         1975 CB360T - Baby Bike
behanna@syl.nj.nec.com            Fan Club #004    1991 ZX-11  - Zexy
kore ha NEC no iken dewa arimasen.                 1973 RD350A - seized
I was raised by a pack of wild corn dogs.          1987 EX500  - the RaceBike


----------
Posted by: emory!syl.nj.nec.com!behanna (Chris BeHanna)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May 23 17:06:39 1994
Subject: Re: coolants...
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8576
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However, propylene glycol has not been approved by GM for cars under warranty.
They sent out a bulletin specifically naming Sierra, and any other propylene
glycol based coolant as not meeting the GM specs for coolant, and therefore
as not being acceptable for use in any GM car under warranty.  This appeared
in the back of the latest NCRS (National Corvette Restorers Society) magazine.

Kevin Smith
kevins@ibeam.intel.com

----------
Posted by: emory!ibeam.intel.com!kevins
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May 23 22:02:35 1994
Subject: racing oil
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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On Saturday night I won a prize at a local car show/cruise: a case of SAE 
40 Valvoline Racing oil.  While this stuff may work wonders in Joe 
Amato's fuel-burning motor, I have no intention of draining the Mobil 1 
out of my Chevy street machine and pouring racing oil back in.  My 
question is: what are the advantages/disadvantages of racing oil and the 
associated dangers of using it in a street car?  I'd like to know so I 
can decide who to give my "prize" to.

I won the oil and a cash prize at the weekly Saturday night cruise in
Kissimmee, FL at the Old Town plaza located near the Disney resort. 
If you are ever in the central Florida area, seriously consider attending
the cruise.  There are typically 300 - 500 cruisers in attendance,
sporting streetrods and muscle cars from mild to wild. The only
stipulation is that they are pre 1973.  Thousands of spectators line the
streets cheering on the cruisers, and a live band cranks out the oldies.  
Highly recommended!  And yes, they do it EVERY Saturday night.

----------
Posted by: Mike Hasselbeck 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May 23 22:13:34 1994
Subject: heads for '89 chevy 350
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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 Have a friend who just aquired an '89 chevy 350 minus heads and intake.
Would like to know what year heads will bolt onto this block. Also would
like to know what style seals the oil pan uses on this block(one piece).
Am not familiar with the newer style blocks. He wants to put the engine
in a Vega, so not sure if the Moroso Oil pan will work on this block.
 Thanks for any help/advice

 Mark.


-- 
Mark Fugazzotto                        |  mfugazzo@resdgs1.er.usgs.gov
United States Geological Survey        |
Reston, VA 22092                       |  [INSERT SNAZZY TAGLINE HERE]
(703) 648-4558                         |

----------
Posted by: emory!resdgs1.er.usgs.gov!mfugazzo (Mark Fugazzotto)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May 23 22:24:10 1994
Subject: Re: Swap meet
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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The Hotrod List (hotrod@dixie.com) wrote:

: On the West coast there are a couple of swap meets to choose from.
: The biggest is the Pomona Faigrounds (aka L.A.Fairgrounds) Next date 6/5/94
: they have just about everything you need. I've seen parts from Daytona Chargers
: to SOHC 427's and everything in between. Everytime I've gone I arrived
: at 5:00am to start shopping. It will take a six-pac and a good 3 hours
: to walk the whole swap meet. Bring a wagon and lots of cash.

in addition to the 6/5 Pomona Swap meet is the L.A.Roadsters Father's Day
Run, Swap Meet, Cars for Sale, etc - its big - its good - it's in its 25th
year......

----------
Posted by: emory!zuni.litc.lockheed.com!sharen (Sharen Rund)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 24 00:20:52 1994
Subject: Re: Hotrod Mailing List Digest #175 (May 23, 1994)
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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>With all this talk lately about prop glyc in stead of ethy glyc, I was
>wondering if the Redline waterwetter powder was compatible with the
>Sierra antifreeze? Any comments?
>
>Frank
>
   Frank,
   According to RedLine, Water wetter is compatible with all coolants.


>From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
>Subject: Re: coolants...
>
>However, propylene glycol has not been approved by GM for cars under warranty.
>They sent out a bulletin specifically naming Sierra, and any other propylene
>glycol based coolant as not meeting the GM specs for coolant, and therefore
>as not being acceptable for use in any GM car under warranty.  This appeared
>in the back of the latest NCRS (National Corvette Restorers Society) magazine.
>
>Kevin Smith
>kevins@ibeam.intel.com
>
>
   Kevin,
   I was concerned about this when the dealer told me they had no
earthly idea what sierra or prop was.  Sierra's response back to me
was that it was a safe substitute anywhere ethylene glycol could be
used.  They also stated that General Motors in particular has
controlling interest in several chemical plants that manufacture
ethylene glycol.  I forget which branch of the fed. govt. regulates
warranties etc, but back in a hot rod magazine last year, there was a
very large article on warranty's and what voids them.  It was stated
that "No aftermarket parts can void any part of a warranty unless it can
be proven without a doubt that the aftermarket product was the sole
cause of said failure".  This was a direct quote from one of these
govt officials.  They specifically used the example of the eprom chips.
If the aftermarket chip was installed, and the engine started running
bad a few months down the road due to a flat cam, in the past, the
dealers would have voided the warranty due to the aftermarket eprom. 
But, the eprom has nothing to do with the camshafts physical wear, so
they would have to fix it under warranty.  Whereas if the ECM had
failed, then they could point the finger and void the warranty.
Later,
Dave Cooley
cooldave@davasha.win.net
 

----------
Posted by: emory!davasha.win.net!cooldave (David Cooley)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 24 00:26:14 1994
Subject: 93 GMC S-15 Jimmy
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Hello all,
Just wanted to post 1/8 mile times for my Jimmy with 4.3L CPI V6.
Couldn't leave very hard, as the stock tires do spin easily, but I made
10 runs, that varied from 10.013 to 10.205.  The .205 was after I
removed the Air cleaner thinking I could get more air in.  the next
slowest run was 10.139 all runs between 68.25 and 68.75 mph.  The
truck really started to pull hard about 3/4 track.  Short times were
all in the 2.2 region.  (one run was in the 2.6's, but that was an 1/8
mile burnout and ended at 12.705 @58.05)  The truck ran a 15.72 1/4
mile before headers etc.  I need to find a way to boost low end torque
and hp without NOS. I have headers, underdrive pulleys, Chip, 180 deg.
thermostat, K&N, 3" cat back exhaust, and Jacobs ignition (ultra team)
Any suggestions will be welcomed. 
Thanks in advance,
Dave Cooley
cooldave@davasha.win.net


----------
Posted by: emory!davasha.win.net!cooldave (David Cooley)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 24 01:51:15 1994
Subject: Re: heads for '89 chevy 350
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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The Hotrod List writes:
> 
>  Have a friend who just aquired an '89 chevy 350 minus heads and intake.
> Would like to know what year heads will bolt onto this block. Also would

1955 - 1994 I believe will bolt on.  The only difference bolt pattern
wise is the center intake bolts on the later model iron heads are at a
different angle than other SBC heads.

> like to know what style seals the oil pan uses on this block(one piece).
> Am not familiar with the newer style blocks. He wants to put the engine
> in a Vega, so not sure if the Moroso Oil pan will work on this block.
>  Thanks for any help/advice

I'm not that familiar with the differences in pans, but I do know all of
the Vega specific pans I've seen are for left hand dipsticks, and that
89 block should have the dipstick on the right side.
I'd say call the manufacturers (Moroso, etc) and ask.

-- 
Jonathan R. Lusky  --  lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu
 "Turbos are nice but I'd rather be blown!"
   89 Jeep Wrangler - 258 / For Sale: $8000 obo
       80 Toyota Celica - 20R / 5spd

----------
Posted by: emory!knuth.mtsu.edu!lusky (Jonathan R. Lusky)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 24 16:36:41 1994
Subject: 283 Chevy heads
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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I have a 283 engine laying around, and I was wondering if the heads on it are
especially good for anything.  It's a 1967 2-barrel with 9.25 : 1 compression
ratio stock.  Would these heads be any good on a 350?, or are the ports too
small in diameter.  It seems like they would give you a pretty good
compression ratio.  If you look at the small ports, it's obvious that they
could use a little porting work.  Does the casting thickness around the ports
allow much porting?

One thing that sucks is that they would need to have hardened valve seats
installed, which would probably wreck the flow of the heads even more.

Would these heads, with their high compression and small ports, give you tons
of low and mid-range torque if you put them on a 350?  Would they also give
you better mileage?  Has anybody tried this combination?

Thanks,
Tom

----------
Posted by: Tom Carver 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 24 23:46:02 1994
Subject: Re: ADMINISTRIVIA:  Listus interruptus
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Hey man!.....
The Hot Rod bug has hit hard....

I just got off the phone where I conected with my "missing link".
Last fall, I was driving down the road and saw a sighn that put fire in my
dormant over 40 brain... it said..  "30-31 model A...$25"
It didn't matter, that it was dark...I drug a rusty cowl section home.

Later...at a local swapmeet... I spent $100 on a hood, fenders, Radiator
and shell and a coffee can full of knobs,screws and handles.....

Then...again later.... a frame and front suspention(stock)..cheap!

Finely....at the big swapmeet in Portland, I bought a '29 tudor
body....doors on back. and a "duce" grillshell.

Everything, rusty, funky but unmolested and no cancer!

So, I was on my way...just one thing, the cowl was 30-31
and the body was 29. I started to desire a '29 cowl.....
and was sweating it...but, just found a good one!...and...cheap,enough!

Time to build a nostalgia rod....chopped 4"....
Biggies on Back, smallies on front..... Dropped "Dago" axel...
w/moon eyes and a pissed woodpecker!

----------
Posted by: emory!lclark.edu!wheeler (Duane Wheeler)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 24 23:56:12 1994
Subject: Re: Waterwetter & prop Glyc
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In article <1056fz_@dixie.com> The Hotrod List (hotrod@dixie.com) wrote:
:>With all this talk lately about prop glyc in stead of ethy glyc, I was
:>wondering if the Redline waterwetter powder was compatible with the
:>Sierra antifreeze? Any comments?

	As far as I know, Water Wetter was not intended to run with glycol.
It is intended instead for applications for which glycol will not be used,
e.g., for racing in which glycol is banned because it fouls the track when a
leak from a crash occurs.

	At least, the only folks I know who use Water Wetter use it for
racing.

--
Chris BeHanna  DoD# 114  KotSTA   Ed Green         1975 CB360T - Baby Bike
behanna@syl.nj.nec.com            Fan Club #004    1991 ZX-11  - Zexy
kore wa NEC no iken dewa arimasen.    FOLMA #17    1973 RD350A - seized
I was raised by a pack of wild corn dogs.          1987 EX500  - the RaceBike


----------
Posted by: emory!syl.nj.nec.com!behanna (Chris BeHanna)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 00:07:27 1994
Subject: Re: Swap meet
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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The Hotrod List (hotrod@dixie.com) wrote:

: in addition to the 6/5 Pomona Swap meet is the L.A.Roadsters Father's Day
: Run, Swap Meet, Cars for Sale, etc - its big - its good - it's in its 25th
: year......

whoops! - I think I'm off by about 5 years - should be 30th!!!


--
____________    __      ____________  "They that can give up essential
\_____     /   /_ \     \     _____/  liberty to obtain a little
 \_____    \____/  \____/    _____/  temporary safety deserve
  \_____                    _____/  neither liberty nor safety."
     \___________  ___________/          --Benjamin Franklin
               /    \           ALL disclaimers apply ....
               ~~~~~~

----------
Posted by: emory!zuni.litc.lockheed.com!sharen (Sharen Rund)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 00:11:56 1994
Subject: Burlington NATS
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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there was a post last week about the 1st Burlington Nationals...

I talked to some of the NSRA guys at Bakersfield this past weekend 
about it - they said they already have 2400 cars registered
it's going to be big

also, they leaked out the site for the 1995 NSRA Nationals
Syracuse, NY !!!!! at the fasirgrounds

so, you Northeasters finally lucked out!!!! Congrats!


--
____________    __      ____________  "They that can give up essential
\_____     /   /_ \     \     _____/  liberty to obtain a little
 \_____    \____/  \____/    _____/  temporary safety deserve
  \_____                    _____/  neither liberty nor safety."
     \___________  ___________/          --Benjamin Franklin
               /    \           ALL disclaimers apply ....
               ~~~~~~

----------
Posted by: emory!zuni.litc.lockheed.com!sharen (Sharen Rund)
 



From rsiatl!hotrod Wed May 25 00:36:08 1994
Subject: Addresses?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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I would like to get some catalogs and need addresses for the following
suppliers (plus phone # and cost of catalog if available).  I know the
area they are in already and figured I'd get any known addresses before
setting out on the long distance/information phone call route..

DOBI
Racer Walsh
Esslinger Engineering
JBA

Thanks!
stevel@crl.com  (ex: lawson@netcom.com - they pissed me off)

----------
Posted by: Steven Lawson 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 00:53:52 1994
Subject: HELP: Electric oil pressure sender?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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   I've got an Autometer electric oil pressure sender (0-100 psi)
that I want to use as an input to a digital dash I'm building.
Anybody know how these things work?  What I really want is some way
of getting a 0-5v (or 0-12v) signal out of this thing - but I'm not sure
how to hook up the wiring.  It's got one screw terminal on it, and I 
assume the case/threads are ground. Resistance is ~ 68 ohms at atmospheric
pressure (I think that's what it was).  I assume some sort of resitor
network ('voltage divider' for those who've read _The_Art_of_Electronics_)
would do the trick....

-- 
|        Peter J Nelson        |    "Rebels are we! Born to be free!    |
|  pjnelson@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu   |     Just like the fish in the sea!"    | 
| University of Illinois @ U/C |               - Esposito               | 
|    Mechanical Engineering    |     former president of San Marcos     |

----------
Posted by: emory!uxa.cso.uiuc.edu!pjnelson (Peter J Nelson)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 00:58:34 1994
Subject: 5.0L Mustang performance improvements 87-93
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Does anyone have any economical (read 'cheap') suggestions to beef up
performance on my '93 5.0L Mustang GT?  I have already removed the
intake silencer and advanced the timing 2 degrees.  
 
Any suggestions?

Thanks

--Jeff

----------
Posted by: emory!aol.com!jfeige (JFeige)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 05:56:11 1994
Subject: Re: racing oil
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In most cases, racing oil is the highest grade the company produces and
is the same as their fleet-service oil.  Lots of detergent,
anti-oxidant, anti-foam, EP additive.
I burn Shell Rotella T, which is the same they give to their sponsored
racing teams.  I got onto it because it's the same oil they used where
my dad worked for their deisel construction equipment.  It's really good
oil.
All of them I have heard of are petroleum based, so the tradeoffs are a
little different than with synthetics.

-- 
larrymc@teleport.com  Public Access User --- Not affiliated with TECHbooks
Public Access UNIX and Internet at (503) 220-1016 (2400-14400, N81)


--------------------------------------------------------------------
[I'm attaching two articles to this one on the subject of oil.  Both
are well written and accurate.  I believe they answer the questions
about using racing oil in a street engine (don't).  JGD

Newsgroups: rec.boats
Sender: news@exu.ericsson.se
Reply-To: lmcjnwh@LMC.Ericsson.SE
Organization: Ericsson Communications Inc.
Date: Fri, 8 Oct 1993 23:38:36 GMT
X-Disclaimer: This article was posted by a user at Ericsson.
              Any opinions expressed are strictly those of the
              user and not necessarily those of Ericsson.

Not so long ago I got flamed on Rec.moto for being so foolish as to admit 
having used Slick 50. Amidst the many flames I got a lot of useful info; 
I am including the transcript of a magazine article (Road Rider)
investigating various oil additives, esp. the PTFE ones.

It makes interesting reading, especially if you have already used the
stuff!

-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Snake Oil!
Is That Additive Really A Negative?
Article and Photos by Fred Rau  

     Information for this article was compiled from reports and 
studies by the University of Nevada Desert Research Center, DuPont 
Chemical Company, Avco Lycoming (aircraft engine manufacturers), 
North Dakota State University, Briggs and Stratton (engine 
manufacturers), the University of Utah Engineering Experiment 
Station, California State Polytechnic College and the National 
Aeronautics and Space Administration's Lewis Research Center.

     Road Rider does not claim to have all the answers. Nor do we 
care to presume to tell you what to do. We have simply tried to 
provide you with all the information we were able to dredge up on 
this subject, in hopes it will help you in making your own, informed 
decision.

 You Can't Tell The Players Without A Program

     On starting this project, we set out to find as many different 
oil additives as we could buy. That turned out to be a mistake. There 
were simply too many avail able! At the very first auto parts store 
we visited, there were over two dozen different brand names 
available. By the end of the day, we had identified over 40 different 
oil additives for sale and realized we needed to rethink our strategy.

     First of all, we found that if we checked the fine print on the 
packages, quite a number of the additives came from the same 
manufacturer. Also, we began to notice that the additives could be 
separated into basic "groups" that seemed to carry approximately the 
same ingredients and the same promises.

     In the end, we divided our additives into four basic groups and 
purchased at   least three brands from three different manufacturers 
for each group. We defined our four groups this way:
     1.)  Products that seemed to be nothing more than regular 
50-rated engine oil (including standard additives) with PTFE (Teflon 
TM) added.
     2.)  Products that seemed to be nothing more than regular 
50-rated engine oil (including standard additives) with zinc 
dialkyldithiophosphate added.
     3.)  Products containing (as near as we could determine) much 
the same additives as are already found in most major brands of 
engine oil, though in different quantities and combinations.
     4.)  Products made up primarily of solvents and/or detergents.

     There may be some differences in chemical makeup within groups, 
but that is impossible to tell since the additive manufacturers 
refuse to list the specific ingredients of their products. We will 
discuss each group individually.

 The PTFE Mystery

Currently, the most common and popular oil additives on the market 
are those that contain PTFE powders suspended in a regular, 
over-the-counter type, 50-rated petroleum or synthetic engine oil. 
PTFE is the common abbreviation used for Polytetrafloeraethylene, 
more commonly known by the tradename "Teflon," which is a registered 
trademark of the DuPont Chemical Corporation.   Among those oil 
additives we have identified as containing PTFE are: Slick 50, Liquid 
Ring, Lubrilon, Microlon, Matrix, Petrolon (same company as Slick 
50), QMl, and T-Plus (K-Mart). There are probably many more names in 
use on many more products using PTFE. We have found that oil additive 
makers like to market their products under a multitude of "private 
brand" names.
     While some of these products may contain other additives in 
addition to PTFE, all seem to rely on the PTFE as their primary 
active ingredient and all, without exception, do not list what other 
ingredients they may contain.
     Though they have gained rather wide acceptance among the 
motoring public, oil additives containing PTFE have also garnered 
their share of critics among experts in the field of lubrication. By 
far the most damning testimonial against these products originally 
came from the DuPont Chemical Corporation, inventor of PTFE and 
holder of the patents and trademarks for Teflon. In a statement 
issued about ten years ago, DuPont's Fluoropolymers   Division   
Product Specialist, J.F. Imbalzano said, "Teflon is not useful as an 
ingredient in oil additives or oils used for internal combustion 
engines."
     At the time, DuPont threatened legal action against anyone who 
used the name "Teflon" on any oil product destined for use in an 
internal combustion engine, and refused to sell its PTFE powders to 
any one who intended to use them for such purposes.
     After a flurry of lawsuits from oil additive makers, claiming 
DuPont could not prove that PTFE was harmful to engines, DuPont was 
forced to once again begin selling their PTFE to the additive 
producers. The additive makers like to claim this is some kind of 
"proof' that their products work, when in fact it is nothing more 
than proof that the American legal ethic of "innocent until proven 
guilty" is still alive and well. The decision against Dupont involved 
what is called "restraint of trade." You can't refuse to sell a 
product to someone just because there is a possibility they might use 
it for a purpose other than what you intended it for.
     It should be noted that DuPont's official position on the use of 
PTFE in engine oils remains carefully aloof and non-commital, for 
obvious legal reasons. DuPont states that though they sell PTFE to 
oil additive producers, they have "no proof of the validity of the 
additive makers' claims." They further state that they have "no 
knowledge of any advantage gained through the use of PTFE in engine 
oil."
     Fear of potential lawsuits for possible misrepresentation of a 
product seem to  run much higher among those with the most to lose.
     After DuPont's decision and attempt to halt the use of PTFE in 
engine oils, several of the oil additive companies simply went 
elsewhere for their PTFE powders, such as purchasing them in other 
countries. In some cases, they disguise or hype their PTFE as being 
something different or special by listing it under one of their own 
tradenames. That doesn't change the fact that it is still PTFE.
     In addition, there is some evidence that certain supplies of 
PTFE powders (from manufacturers other than DuPont) are of a cruder 
version than the original, made with larger sized flakes that are 
more likely to "settle out" in your oil or clog up your filters. One 
fairly good indication that a product contains this kind of PTFE is 
if the instructions for its use advise you to "shake well before 
using." It only stands to reason that if the manufacturer knows the 
solids in his product will settle to the bottom of a container while 
sitting on a shelf, the same thing is going to hap pen inside your 
engine when it is left idle for any period of time.
     The problem with putting PTFE in your oil, as explained to us by 
several industry experts, is that PTFE is a solid. The additive 
makers claim this solid "coats" the moving parts in an engine (though 
that is far from being scientifically proven).  Slick 50 is currently 
both the most aggressive advertiser and the most popular seller, with 
claims of over 14 million treatments sold.  However, such solids seem 
even more inclined to coat non-moving parts, like oil passages and 
filters. After all, if it can build up under the pressures and 
friction exerted on a cylinder wall, then it stands to reason it 
should build up even better in places with low pressures and 
virtually no friction.
     This conclusion seems to be borne out by tests on oil additives 
containing PTFE conducted by the NASA Lewis Research Center, which 
said in their report, "In the types of bearing surface contact we 
have looked at, we have seen no benefit. In some cases we have seen 
detrimental effect. The solids in the oil tend to accumulate at 
inlets and act as a dam, which simply blocks the oil from entering. 
Instead of helping, it is actually depriving parts of lubricant."
     Remember, PTFE in oil additives is a suspended solid. Now think 
about why you have an oil filter on your engine. To remove suspended 
solids, right? Right. Therefore it would seem to follow that if your 
oil filter is doing its job, it will collect as much of the PTFE as 
possible, as quickly as possible. This can result in a clogged oil 
filter and decreased oil pres sure throughout your engine.
     In response to our inquiries about this sort of problem, several 
of the PTFE pushers responded that their particulates were of a 
sub-micron size, capable of passing through an ordinary oil filter 
unrestricted. This certainly sounds good, and may in some cases 
actually be true, but it makes little difference when you know the 
rest of the story. You see, PTFE has other qualities besides being a 
friction reducer:  It expands radically when exposed to heat. So even 
if those particles are small enough to pass through your filter when 
you purchase them, they very well may not be when your engine reaches 
normal operating temperature.
     Here again, the' scientific evidence seems to support this, as 
in tests conducted by researchers at the University of Utah 
Engineering Experiment Station involving Petrolon additive with PTFE.
     The Petrolon test report states, "There was a pressure drop 
across the oil filter resulting from possible clogging of small 
passageways." In addition, oil analysis showed that iron 
contamination doubled after using the treatment, indicating that 
engine wear didn't go down - it appeared to shoot up.
     This particular report was paid for by Petrolon (marketers of 
Slick 50), and was not all bad news for their products. The tests, 
conducted on a Chevrolet six-cylinder automobile engine, showed that 
after treatment with the PTFE additive the test engine's friction was 
reduced by 13.1 per- cent. Also, output horsepower increased from 5.3 
percent to 8.1 percent, and fuel economy improved from 11.8 percent 
under light load to 3.8 percent under heavy load.
     These are the kind of results an aggressive marketing company 
like Petrolon can really sink their teeth into. If we only reported 
the results in the last paragraph to you, you'd be inclined to think 
Slick 50 was indeed a magic engine elixir. What you have to keep in 
mind is that often times the benefits (like increased horse power and 
fuel economy) may be out weighed by some serious drawbacks (like the 
indications of reduced oil pressure and increased wear rate).

The Plot Thickens
     Just as we were about to go to press with this article, we were 
contacted by the public relations firm of Trent and Company, an 
outfit with a prestigious address in the Empire State Building, New 
York. They advised us they were working for a company called QMI out 
of Lakeland, Florida, that was marketing a "technological 
breakthrough" product in oil additives. Naturally, we asked them to 
send us all pertinent information,  including any testing and 
research data.
     What we got was pretty much what we expected. QMI's oil 
additive, according to their press release, uses "ten times more PTFE 
resins than its closest competitor." Using the "unique SX-6000 
formula," they say they are the only company to use "aqueous 
dispersion resin which means the microns (particle sizes) are 
extensively smaller and can penetrate tight areas." This, they claim, 
"completely eliminates the problem of clogged filters and oil 
passages."
     Intrigued by their press release, we set up a telephone 
interview with their Vice- President of Technical Services, Mr. Owen 
Heatwole. Mr. Heatwole's name was immediately recognized by us as one 
that had popped in earlier research of this subject as a former 
employee of Petrolon, a company whose name seems inextricably linked 
in some fashion or another with virtually every PTFE-related additive 
maker in the country.
     Mr. Heatwole was a charming and persuasive talker with a knack 
for avoiding direct answers as good as any seasoned politician. His 
glib pitch for his product was the best we've ever heard, but when 
dissected and pared down to the verifiable facts, it actually said 
very little.
     When we asked about the ingredients in QMI's treatments, we got 
almost exactly the response we expected. Mr. Heatwole said he would 
"have to avoid discussing specifics about the formula, for 
proprietary reasons."
     After telling us that QMI was being used by  "a  major oil 
company,"  a "nuclear plant owned by a major corporation" and a 
"major engine manufacturer," Mr. Heatwole followed up with, 
"Naturally, I can't reveal their names- for proprietary reasons."
     He further claimed to have extensive testing and research data 
available from a "major laboratory," proving conclusively how 
effective QMI was. When we asked for the name of the lab, can you 
guess? Yup, "We can't give out that information, for proprietary 
reasons."
     What QMI did give us was the typical "testimonials," though we 
must admit theirs came from more recognizable sources than usual. 
They seem to have won over the likes of both Team Kawasaki and Bobby 
Unser, who evidently endorse and use QMI in their racing engines. Mr. 
Heatwole was very proud of the fact that  their product was being 
used in engines that he himself admitted are "torn down and 
completely inspected on a weekly basis." Of course, what he left out 
is that those same engines are almost totally rebuilt every time 
they're torn down. So what does that prove in terms of his product 
reducing wear and promoting engine longevity? Virtually nothing.
     Mr. Heatwole declined to name the source of QMI's PTFE supply 
"for proprietary reasons." He bragged that their product is sold 
under many different private labels, but refused to identify those 
labels "for proprietary reasons." When asked about the actual size of 
the PTFE particles used in QMI, he claimed they were measured as 
"sub-micron in size" by a "major motor laboratory" which he couldn't 
identify - you guessed it - for "proprietary reasons."
     After about an hour of listening to "don't quote me on this," 
"I'll have to deny that if you print it," and "I can't reveal that," 
we asked Mr. Heatwole if there was something we could print. 
"Certainly," he said, "Here's a good quote for you: 'The radical 
growth in technology has overcome the problem areas associated with 
PTFE in the I980s'"
     "Not bad," we said. Then we asked to whom we might attribute 
this gem of wisdom. DuPont Chemical, perhaps?
     "Me," said Mr. Heatwole. "I said that."
     QMI's press releases like to quote the Guinness Book Of Records 
in saying that PTFE is "The slickest substance known to man." Far be 
it from us to take exception to the Guinness Book, but we doubt that 
PTFE is much slicker than some of the people marketing it.

The Zinc Question
     The latest "miracle ingredient" in oil additives, attempting to 
usurp PTFE's cure-all throne, is zinc dialkyldithiophosphate, which 
we will refer to here after as simply "zinc."
     Purveyors of the new zinc-related products claim they can prove 
absolute superiority over the PTFE-related products. Naturally, the 
PTFE crowd claim exactly the same, in reverse.
     Zinc is contained as part of the standard additive package in 
virtually every major brand of engine oil sold today, varying from a 
low volume of 0.10 per cent in brands such as Valvoline All Climate 
and Chevron l5W-50, to a high  volume of 0.20 percent in brands such 
as Valvoline  Race  and  Pennzoil GT Performance.
     Organic zinc compounds are used as extreme pressure, anti-wear 
additives, and are therefore found in larger amounts in oils 
specifically blended for high-revving, turbocharged or racing 
applications. The zinc in your oil comes into play only when there is 
actual metal-to-metal con tact within your engine, which should never 
occur under normal operating conditions. However, if you race your 
bike, or occasionally play tag with the redline on the tach, the zinc 
is your last line of defense. Under extreme conditions, the zinc 
compounds react with the metal to prevent scuffing, particularly 
between cylinder bores and piston rings.
     However - and this is the important part to remember - available 
research shows that more zinc does not give you more protection, it 
merely prolongs the protection if the rate of metal-to-metal contact 
is abnormally high or extended. So unless you plan on spending a 
couple of hours dragging your knee at Laguna Seca, adding extra zinc 
compounds to your oil is usually a waste. Also, keep in mind that 
high zinc content can lead to deposit formation on your valves, and 
spark plug fouling.
     Among the products we found containing zinc 
dialkyldithiophosphate were Mechanics Brand Engine Tune Up, K Mart 
Super Oil Treatment, and STP Engine Treatment With XEP2. The only 
reason we can easily identify the additives with the new zinc 
compounds is that they are required to carry a Federally mandated 
warning label indicating they contain a hazardous substance. The zinc 
phosphate they contain is a known eye irritant, capable of inflicting 
severe harm if it comes in contact with your eyes. If you insist on 
using one of these products, please wear protective goggles and 
exercise extreme caution.
     As we mentioned, organic zinc compounds are already found in 
virtually every major brand of oil, both automotive and motorcycle. 
However, in recent years the oil companies voluntarily reduced the 
amount of zinc content in most of their products after research 
indicated the zinc was responsible for premature deterioration and 
damage to catalytic converters. Obviously this situation would not 
affect 99 percent of all  the motorcycles on the road - however, it 
could have been a factor with the newer BMW converter - equipped 
bikes.
     Since the reduction in zinc content was implemented solely for 
the protection of catalytic converters, it is possible that some 
motorcycles might benefit from a slight increase in zinc content in 
their oils. This has been taken into account by at least one oil 
company, Spectro, which offers 0.02 to 0.03 percent more zinc 
compounds in its motorcycle oils than in its automotive oils.
     Since Spectro (Golden 4 brand, in this case) is a synthetic 
blend lubricant designed for extended drain intervals, this increase 
seems to be wholly justified. Also, available research indicates that 
Spectro has, in this case, achieved a sensible balance for extended 
application without increasing the zinc content to the point that it 
is likely to cause spark plug fouling or present a threat to 
converter- equipped BMW models.
     It would appear that someone at Spectro did their homework.

Increased Standard Additives
(More Is Not Necessarily Better)
     Though some additives may not contain anything harmful to your 
engine, and even some things that could be beneficial, most experts 
still recommend that you avoid their use. The reason for this is that 
your oil, as purchased from one of the major oil companies, already 
contains a very extensive additive package.
     This package is made up of numerous, specific additive 
components, blended to achieve a specific formula that will meet the 
requirements of your engine. Usually, at least several of these 
additives will be synergistic. That is, they react mutually, in 
groups of two or more, to create an effect that none of them could 
attain individually. Changing or adding to this formula can upset the 
balance and negate the protective effect the formula was meant to 
achieve, even if you are only adding more of something that was 
already included in the initial package.
     If it helps, try to think of your oil like a cake recipe. Just 
because the original recipe calls for two eggs (which makes for a 
very moist and tasty cake), do you think adding four more eggs is 
going to make the cake better? Of course not. You're going to upset 
the carefully calculated balance of ingredients and magnify the 
effect the eggs have on the recipe to the point that it ruins the 
entire cake. Adding more of a specific additive already contained in 
your oil is likely to produce similar results.
     This information should also be taken into account when adding 
to the oil already in your bike or when mixing oils for any reason, 
such as synthetic with petroleum. In these cases, always make sure 
the oils you are putting together have the same rating (SA, SE, SC, 
etc.). This tells you their additive packages are basically the same, 
or at least compatible, and are less likely to upset the balance or 
counteract each other.

Detergents And Solvents
     Many of the older, better-known oil treatments on the market do 
not make claims nearly so lavish as the new upstarts. Old standbys 
like Bardahl, Rislone and Marvel Mystery Oil, instead offer  things 
like  "quieter  lifters," "reduced oil burning" and a "cleaner 
engine."
     Most of these products are made up of solvents and detergents 
designed to dissolve sludge and carbon deposits inside your engine so 
they can be flushed or burned out. Wynn's Friction Proofing Oil, for 
example, is 83 percent kerosene. Other brands use naphthalene, 
xylene,  acetone and isopropanol. Usually, these ingredients will be 
found in a base of standard mineral oil.
     In general, these products are designed to do just the opposite 
of what the PTFE and zinc phosphate additives claim to do. Instead of 
leaving behind a "coating" or a "plating" on your engine surfaces, 
they are designed to strip away such things.
     All of these products will strip sludge and deposits out and 
clean up your engine, particularly if it is an older, abused one. The 
problem is, unless you have some way of determining just how much is 
needed to remove your deposits without going any further, such 
solvents also can strip away the boundary lubrication layer provided 
by your oil. Overuse of solvents is an easy trap to fall into, and 
one which can promote harmful metal-to-metal contact within your 
engine.
     As a general rule of thumb these products had their place and 
were at least moderately useful on older automobile and motorcycle 
engines of the Fifties and Sixties, but are basically unneeded on the 
more efficient engine designs of the past two decades.

The Infamous "No Oil" Demo
     At at least three major motorcycle rallies this past year, we 
have witnessed live demonstrations put on to demonstrate the 
effectiveness of certain oil additives. The demonstrators  would  
have  a bench- mounted engine which they would fill with oil and a 
prescribed dose of their "miracle additive." After running the engine 
for a while they would stop it, drain out the oil and start it up 
again. Instant magic! The engine would run perfectly well for hours 
on end, seemingly proving the effectiveness of the additive which had 
supposedly "coated" the inside of the engine so well it didn't even 
need the oil to run. In one case, we saw this done with an actual 
motorcycle, which would be rid den around the parking lot after 
having its oil drained. A pretty convincing demonstration - until you 
know the facts.
     Since some of these demonstrations were conducted using Briggs 
and Stratton engines,  the  Briggs  and   Stratton Company itself 
decided to run a similar, but somewhat more scientific, experiment. 
Taking two brand-new, identical engines straight off their assembly 
line, they set them up for bench-testing. The only difference was 
that one had the special additive included with its oil and the other 
did not. Both were operated for 20 hours before being shut down and 
having the oil drained from them. Then both were started up again and 
allowed to run for another 20 straight hours. Neither engine seemed 
to have any problem performing this "minor miracle."
     After the second 20-hour run, both engines were completely torn 
down and inspected by the company's engineers. What they found was 
that both engines suffered from scored crankpin bearings, but the 
engine treated with the additive also suffered from heavy cylinder 
bore damage that was not evident on the untreated engine.
     This points out once again the inherent problem with particulate 
oil additives: They can cause oil starvation. This is particularly 
true in the area of piston rings, where there is a critical need for 
adequate oil flow. In practically all of the reports and studies on 
oil additives, and particularly those involving suspended solids like 
PTFE, this has been reported as a major area of engine damage.

The Racing Perspective
     Among the most convincing testimonials in favor of oil additives 
are those that come from professional racers or racing teams. As 
noted previously, some of the oil additive products actually are 
capable of producing less engine friction, better gas mileage and 
higher horsepower out put. In the world of professional racing, the 
split-second advantage that might be gained from using such a product 
could be the difference between victory and defeat.
     Virtually all of the downside or detrimental effects attached to 
these products are related to extended, long-term usage. For 
short-life, high-revving, ultra-high performance engines designed to 
last no longer than one racing season (or in some cases, one single 
race), the long-term effects of oil additives need not even be 
considered.
     Racers also use special high-adhesion tires that give much 
better traction and control than our normal street tires, but you 
certainly wouldn't want to go touring on them, since they're designed 
to wear out in several hundred (or less) miles. Just because certain 
oil additives may be beneficial in a competitive context is no reason 
to believe they would be equally beneficial in a touring context.

The Best of The Worst
     Not all engine oil additives are as potentially harmful as some 
of those we have described here. However, the best that can be said 
of those that have not proved to be harmful is that they haven't been 
proved to offer any real benefits, either. In some cases, introducing 
an additive with a compatible package of components to your oil in 
the right proportion and at the right time can conceivably extend the 
life of your oil. However, in every case we have studied it proves 
out that it would actually have been cheaper to simply change the 
engine oil instead.
     In addition, recent new evidence has come to light that makes 
using almost any additive a game of Russian Roulette. Since the 
additive distributors do not list the ingredients contained within 
their products, you never know for sure just what you are putting in 
your engine.
     Recent tests have shown that even some of the most inoffensive 
additives contain products which, though harmless in their initial 
state, convert to hydrofluoric acid when exposed to the temperatures 
inside a firing cylinder. This acid is formed as part of the exhaust 
gases, and though it is instantly expelled from your engine and seems 
to do it no harm, the gases collect inside your exhaust system and 
eat away at your mufflers from the inside out.

Whatever The Market Will Bear
     The pricing of oil additives seems to follow no particular 
pattern whatsoever. Even among those products that seem to be almost 
identical, chemically, retail prices covered an extremely wide range. 
For example:
     One 32-ounce bottle of Slick 50 (with PTFE) cost us $29.95 at a 
discount house that listed the retail price as $59.95, while a 
32-ounce bottle of T-Plus (which claims to carry twice as much PTFE 
as the Slick 50) cost us only $15.88.
     A 32-ounce bottle of STP Engine Treatment (containing what they 
call XEP2), which they claim they can prove "outperforms leading PTFE 
engine treatments," cost us $17.97. Yet a can of K Mart Super Oil 
Treatment, which listed the same zinc-derivative ingredient as that 
listed for the XEP2, cost us a paltry $2.67.
     Industry experts estimate that the actual cost of producing most 
oil additives is from one-tenth to one-twentieth of the  asking 
retail price. Certainly no additive manufacturer has come forward 
with any exotic, high-cost ingredient or list of ingredients to 
dispute this claim. As an interesting note along with this, back 
before there was so much competition in the field to drive prices 
down, Petrolon (Slick 50) was selling their PTFE products for as much 
as $400 per treatment! The words "buyer beware" seem to take on very 
real significance when talking about oil additives.

The Psychological Placebo
You have to wonder, with the volume of evidence accumulating against 
oil additives, why so many of us still buy them. That's the 
million-dollar question, and it's just as difficult to answer as why 
so many of us smoke cigarettes, drink hard liquor or engage in any 
other number of questionable activities. We know they aren't good for 
us - but we go ahead and do them anyway.
     Part of the answer may lie in what some psychiatrists call the 
"psychological placebo effect." Simply put, that means that many of 
us hunger for that peace of mind that comes with believing we have 
purchased the absolute best or most protection we can possibly get.
     Even better, there's that wonderfully smug feeling that comes 
with thinking we might be a step ahead of the pack, possessing 
knowledge of something just a bit better than everyone else.
     Then again, perhaps it comes from an ancient, deep-seated need 
we all seem to have to believe in magic. There has never been any 
shortage of unscrupulous types ready to cash in on our willingness to 
believe that there's some magical mystery potion we can buy to help 
us lose weight, grow hair, attract the opposite sex or make our 
engines run longer and better. I doubt that there's a one of us who 
hasn't fallen for one of these at least once in our lifetimes. We 
just want it to be true so bad that we can't help ourselves.

Testimonial Hype vs. Scientific Analysis
     In general, most producers of oil additives rely on personal 
"testimonials" to advertise and promote their products. A typical 
print advertisement will be one or more letters from a satisfied 
customer stating something like, "1 have used Brand X in my engine 
for 2 years and  50,000 miles and it runs smoother and gets better 
gas mileage than ever before. I love this product and would recommend 
it to anyone."
     Such evidence is referred to as "anecdotal" and is most commonly 
used to pro mote such things as miracle weight loss diets and 
astrology.
     Whenever I see one of these ads I am reminded of a stunt played 
out several years ago by Allen Funt of "Candid Camera" that clearly 
demonstrated the side of human nature that makes such advertising 
possible.
     With cameras in full view, fake "product demonstrators" would 
offer people passing through a grocery store the opportunity to 
taste-test a "new soft drink." What the victims didn't know was that 
they were being given a horrendous concoction of castor oil, garlic 
juice, tabasco sauce and several other foul-tasting ingredients. 
After taking a nice, big swallow, as instructed by the demonstrators, 
the unwitting victims provided huge laughs for the audience by 
desperately trying to conceal their anguish and disgust. Some 
literally turned away from the cameras and spit the offending potion 
on the floor.
     The fascinating part came when about one out of four of the 
victims would actu ally turn back to the cameras and proclaim the new 
drink was "Great" or "Unique" or, in several cases, "One of the best 
things I've ever tasted!" Go figure.
     The point is, compiling "personal testimonials" for a product is 
one of the easiest things an advertising company can do - and one of 
the safest, too. You see, as long as they are only expressing some 
one else's personal opinion, they don't have to prove a thing! It's 
just an opinion, and needs no basis in fact whatsoever.
        On the other hand, there has been documented, careful 
scientific analysis done on numerous oil additives by accredited 
institutions and researchers.
        For example:
        Avco Lycoming, a major manufacturer of aircraft engines, 
states, "We have tried every additive we could find on the market, 
and they are all worthless."
        Briggs and Stratton, renowned builders of some of the most 
durable engines in the world, says in their report on engine oil 
additives, "They do not appear to offer any benefits."
        North Dakota State University conducted tests on oil 
additives and said in their report, "The theory sounds good- the only 
problem is that the products simply don't work."
        And finally, Ed Hackett, chemist at the University of Nevada 
Desert Research Center, says, "Oil additives should not be used. The 
oil companies have gone to great lengths to develop an additive pack 
age that meets the vehicle's requirements. If you add anything to 
this oil you may upset the balance and prevent the oil from 
performing to specification."
        Petrolon, Inc., of Houston, Texas, makers of Petrolon and 
producers of at least a dozen other lubrication products containing 
PTFE, including Slick 50 and Slick 30 Motorcycle Formula, claim that, 
"Multiple tests by independent laboratories have shown that when 
properly applied to an automotive engine, Slick 50 Engine Formula 
reduces wear on engine parts. Test results have shown that Slick 50 
treated engines sustained 50 percent less wear than test engines run 
with premium motor oil alone."
        Sounds pretty convincing, doesn't it?
        The problem is, Petrolon and the other oil additive companies 
that claim "scientific evidence" from "independent laboratories,"  
all refuse to identify the laboratories that conducted the tests or 
the criteria under which the tests were conducted. They claim they 
are "contractually bound" by the laboratories to not reveal their 
identities.
        In addition, the claim of "50 percent less wear" has never 
been proven on anything approaching a long-term basis. Typical 
examples used to support the additive makers' claims involve engines 
run from 100 to 200 hours after treatment, during which time the 
amount of wear  particles in the oil decreased. While this has proven 
to be true in some cases, it has also been proven that after 400 to 
500 hours of running the test engines invariably reverted to 
producing just as many wear particles as before treatment, and in 
some cases, even more.
     No matter what the additive makers would like you to believe, 
nothing has been proven to stop normal engine wear.
     You will note that all of the research facilities quoted in this 
article are clearly identified. They have no problem with making 
their findings public. You will also note that virtually all of their 
findings about oil additives are negative. That's not because we 
wanted to give a biased report against oil additives - it's because 
we couldn't find a single laboratory, engine manufacturer or 
independent research facility who would make a public claim, with 
their name attached to it, that any of the additives were actually 
beneficial to an engine. The conclusion seems inescapable.
     As a final note on advertising hype versus the real world, we 
saw a television ad the other night for Slick 50 oil additive. The ad 
encouraged people to buy their product on the basis of the fact that, 
"Over 14 million Americans have tried Slick 50!" Great. We're sure 
you could just as easily say, "Over 14 million Americans have smoked 
cigarettes!"-but is that really any reason for you to try it? Of 
course not, because you've seen the scientific evidence of the harm 
it can do. The exact same principle applies here.

In Conclusion
     The major oil companies are some of the richest, most powerful 
and aggressive corporations in world. They own multi- million dollar 
research facilities manned by some of the best chemical engineers 
money can hire. It is probably safe to say that any one of them has 
the capabilities and resources at hand in marketing, distribution, 
advertising, research and product development equal to 20 times that 
of any of the independent additive companies. It therefore stands to 
reason that if any of these additive products were actu ally capable 
of improving the capabilities of engine lubricants, the major oil 
companies would have been able to determine that and to find some way 
to cash in on it.
     Yet of all the oil additives we found, none carried the name or 
endorsement of  any of the major oil producers.
      In addition, all of the major vehicle and engine manufacturers 
spend millions of dollars each year trying to increase the longevity 
of their products, and millions more paying off warranty claims when 
their products fail. Again, it only stands to reason that if they 
thought any of these additives would increase the life or improve the 
performance of their engines, they would be actively using and 
selling them - or at least endorsing their use.
      Instead, many of them advise against the use of these additives 
and, in some cases, threaten to void their warranty coverage if such 
things are found to be used in their products.
      In any story of this nature, absolute "facts" are virtually 
impossible to come by.  Opinions abound.  Evidence that points one 
direction or the other is avail able, but has to be carefully 
ferreted out, and is not always totally reliable or completely 
verifiable.
      In this environment,  conclusions reached  by  known, 
knowledgeable experts in the field must be given a certain amount of 
weight. Conclusions reached by unknown, unidentifiable sources must 
be discounted almost totally. That which is left must be weighed, one 
side against the other, in an attempt to reach a "reasonable" 
conclusion.
     In the case of oil additives, there is a considerable volume of 
evidence against their effectiveness. This evidence comes from 
well-known and identifiable expert sources, including independent 
research laboratories, state universities, major engine 
manufacturers, and even NASA.
     Against this rather formidable barrage of scientific research, 
additive makers offer not much more than their own claims of 
effectiveness, plus questionable and totally unscientific personal 
testimonials. Though the purveyors of these products state they have 
studies from other independent laboratories supporting their claims, 
they refuse to identify the labs or provide copies of the research. 
The only test results they will share are those from their own 
testing departments, which must, by their very nature, be taken with 
a rather large grain of salt.  




---
+------------------------------------------------------+
| John Walsh : Ericsson Communications Inc.            |         
| Internet   : lmcjnwh@lmc.ericsson.se                 |   
|                                                      |
| [standard disclaimer]                                |  
| --surely some mistake, officer!                      |   
|                                                      |   
+------------------------------------------------------+   
--- end massive excerpt ---

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vesper@kong.gsfc.nasa.gov (Greg Vesper - RMS) writes:

>What is the best oil to run in a high performance engine?

>I drive a 944T and I maintain it meticulously.  I've talked with several  
>mechanics who are down on synthetics.  

>But I've talked with other drivers who swear by synthetics.  I want the best  
>possible engine protection regardless of cost.  

I use synthetic oil in my racebike.  Motorcycle engines rev quite
high and usually share oil with the gearbox, two things you need
good oil for.  

There is no question that synthetic oils flow better than petro
oils when cold.  I refer you to the "starting friction" ads on TV.

Beware, aged vehicle operators: Switching to synthetic oil for
an engine in middle age is probably more trouble than it is worth.
Synthetic oils are thin and slippery, so much so that aging oil 
seals have a hard time containing it.  If your engine is fairly 
new, no problem.  And even if you did replace all the oil
seals for the switch to synthetic, you'd notice a lot more
engine noise, in an older motor that is.

Synthetic oils offer turbo motors a particularly sweet advantage
over petroleum-based oils: not so much Carbon = no coking.


>The same question goes for synthetic transmission fluid.  My transmission is  
>stiff - especially in the winter.  

I tend to relate transmission fluid to automatics, and stiff
transmissions to manuals.  I'm befuddled by your question.

If your looking for synthetic transmission fluid for your
automatic, I would ask you why you bought an automatic Porsche.

If your looking to put synthetic oil in your manual gearbox,
I would say go for it.  You might expect, however, more gear
noise because synthetics are not as thick and cushy as petro oils.
Using any kind of motor oil in the gearbox is preferrable to
heavy gear oils becuase of the detergent and anti-sudsing 
additives.  It would be wise to change this gearbox oil more
often than heavy gear oil because of shearing.  It would
also be wise to use motorcycle oil in this application because
of the anti-shear additives.


>Some definitive feedback would be helpful, preferably from someone who's torn  
>some engines apart and has seen the long term effects of synthetics.

I haven't done this myself, but it was the advice of someone
that had that convinced me.

If I had a new car, I would be using Golden Spectro motorcycle
oil in both my engine and gearbox: 10w40/10w40 in winter,
and 20w50/10w40 in summer.

The following is included for your reading pleasure,
re-quoted without permission or consent of the original
author, whoever that may be:
=======================================================================

Lines: 225

Choosing the best motor oil is a topic that appears frequently
in the rec.motorcycles and rec.autos.tech news groups and in the
various mailing lists read by the motoheads on the net.  The
following article is about how to do just that.

Oil companies provide data on their oils most often refered to
as "typical inspection data".  This is an average of the actual
physical and chemical properties of their oils.  This
information is available to the public through their
distributors or by writing or calling the company directly.  I
have compiled a list of the most popular, premium oils so that a ready
comparison can be made.  If your favorite oil is not on the list
get the data from the distributor and use what I have as a data
base. 

The AMSOIL data showed some independent tests against the oil sold by Honda,
Yamaha, Kawasaki Harley, Castrol, and Valvoline.  In all cases the oil
packaged by the motorcycle manufacturer was equaled or beaten by the
other oils. There is no need to pursue them further. They seem
to be packaged for profit rather than performance.

This article is going to look at the six most important
properties of a motor oil readily availiable to the public: viscosity,
viscosity index (VI), flash point, pour point, % sulfated ash,
and % zinc.

Viscosity is the measure of how thick an oil is.  THIS IS 
THE MOST IMPORTANT PROPERTY FOR AN ENGINE.  An oil with too
low a viscosity can shear and loose film strength at high
temperatures.  An oil with too high a viscosity may not pump to
the proper parts at low temperatures and the film may tear at
high rpm. 

Multi viscosity oils are one of the great
improvements in oils, but they should be chosen wisely.  Always
use a multi grade with the narrowest span of viscosity that is
appropriate for the temperatures you are going to encounter.
Multi viscosity oils start with an oil at or near the low end
and use polymers to prevent the oil from thinning as it warms
up.  These polymers shear and burn forming deposits that can
cause ring sticking and other problems. 10W-40 requires a lot of
polymers to achieve that range and has caused problems in some
engines.  Very few manufactures recommend it any more, and some
treaten to void warranties if it is used.  It was not included
in this article for that reason.  20W-50 is the same 30 point
spread, but because it starts with a heavier base it requires
less viscosity index improvers (polymers) to do the job.  AMSOIL
can formulate their 10W-30 and 20W-50 with _no_ viscosity index
improvers but uses some in the 10W-40.  Mobil 1 uses no
viscosity improvers in their 5W-30, and I assume the new 10W-30.

The W means the oil
passed a set of viscosity measurements taken at low temperature
and is suitable for use in the winter.  As a general rule use 5W-30
below 0 degrees F, 10W-30 above 0 degrees F, and a 20W-XX is OK
above 20 degrees F.  Follow your manufacturer's recommendations
as to which weights are appropriate.

Viscosity index is a measure of how well the oil resists
thinning as it warms up.  It tells how well an oil stays to its'
grade as temperatures change.  The higher the number the better.
These numbers can only be compared within a viscosity range.

Flash point is the temperature at which an oil gives off vapors
that can be ignited with a flame held over the oil.  The lower
the flash point the greater tendancy for the oil to suffer
vaporization loss at high temperatures and to burn off on hot
cylinder walls and piston crowns. 
The flash point is also an indicator of the quality
of the base stock used.  The higher the flash point the better.
400 F is the minimum to prevent high consumption.  Flash point is in degrees F.

Pour point is 5 degrees F above the point at which a chilled oil
shows no movement at the surface for 5 seconds when inclined.
This measurement is especially important for oils used in the
winter.  A borderline pumping temperature is given by some
manufacturers. This is the temperature at which the oil will
pump and maintain adequate oil pressure.  This was not given by
a lot of the manufacturers, but seems to be about 20 degrees F above
the pour point. The lower the pour point the better. Pour point
is in degrees F.

% sulfated ash is how much solid material is left when the oil
burns.  A high ash content will tend to form more sludge and
deposits in the engine. Look for oils with a low ash content.

% zinc is the amount of zinc used as an extreme pressure, anti-
wear additive.  The zinc is only used when there is actual
metal to metal contact in the engine.  Hopefully the oil will do
its job and this will never occur, but if it does the zinc
compounds react with the metal to prevent scuffing and wear.  A
level of .11% is enough to protect an automobile engine for the
extended oil drain interval.  We are all changing our oil at
3000 miles or less anyway (aren't we?) so zinc depletion should
not be a concern.  Those of you with high revving, air cooled
motorcycles or turbo charged cars or bikes might want to look
at the oils with the higher zinc content.  More doesn't give you
better protection, it gives you longer protection if the rate of
metal to metal contact is abnormally high.  High zinc content
can lead to deposit formation and plug fouling.

The Data:

Brand                    VI    Flash    Pour    %ash   %zinc

20W-50
AMSOIL                  136     482     -38     ---     ---
Castrol GTX             122     440     -15     .85     .12
Exxon High Performance  119     419     -13     .70     .11
Havoline Formula 3      125     465     -30     1.0     ---
Kendall GT-1            129     390     -25     1.0     .16
Pennzoil GT Perf.       120     460     -10     .9      ---
Quaker State Dlx.       155     430     -25     .9      ---
Shell Truck Guard       130     450     -15     1.0     .15
Spectro Golden 4        174     440     -35     ---     .15
Spectro Golden M.G.     174     440     -35     ---     .13
Unocal                  121     432     -11     .74     .12
Valvoline All Climate   125     430     -10     1.0     .11
Valvoline Turbo         140     440     -10     .99     .13
Valvoline Race          140     425     -10     1.2     .20

20W-40
Castrol Multi-Grade     110     440     -15     .85     .12
Quaker State            121     415     -15     .9      ---

15W-50
Chevron                204      415     -18     .96     .11
Mobil 1                180      430     -55     ---     ---
Mystic JT8             144      420     -20     1.7     .15

15W-40
Castrol                134      415     -15     1.3     .14
Chevron Delo 400       136      421     -27     1.0     ---
Exxon XD3              ---      417     -11     .9      .14
Exxon XD3 Extra        135      399     -11     .95     .13
Kendall GT-1           135      410     -25     1.0     .16
Mystic JT8             142      440     -20     1.7     .15
Shell Rotella w/XLA    146      410     -25     1.0     .13
Valvoline All Fleet    140      ---     -10     1.0     .15
Valvoline Turbo        140      420     -10     .99     .13

10W-30
AMSOIL                 142      480     -70     ---     ---
Castrol GTX            140      415     -33     .85     .12
Chevron Supreme        150      401     -26     .96     .11
Exxon Superflo Hi Perf 135      392     -22     .70     .11
Exxon Superflo Supreme 133      400     -31     .85     .13
Havoline Formula 3     139      430     -30     1.0     ---
Kendall GT-1           139      390     -25     1.0     .16
Mobil 1                  data not available yet, see 5W-30
Pennzoil PLZ Turbo     140      410     -27     1.0     ---
Quaker State           156      410     -30     .9      ---
Shell Fire and Ice     155      410     -35     .9      .12
Shell Super 2000       155      410     -35     1.0     .13
Shell Truck Guard      155      405     -35     1.0     .15
Spectro Golden M.G.    175      405     -40     ---     ---
Unocal Super           153      428     -33     .92     .12
Valvoline All Climate  130      410     -26     1.0     .11
Valvoline Turbo        135      410     -26     .99     .13
Valvoline Race         130      410     -26     1.2     .20

5W-30
Castrol GTX            156      400     -35     .80     .12
Chevron Supreme        202?     354     -46     .96     .11
Exxon Superflow HP     148      392     -22     .70     .11
Havoline Formula 3     158      420     -40     1.0     ---
Mobil 1                150      430     -65     ---     ---
Mystic JT8             161      390     -25     .95     .1
Quaker State           165      405     -35     .9      ---
Shell Fire and Ice     167      405     -35     .9      .12
Unocal                 151      414     -33     .81     .12
Valvoline All Climate  135      405     -40     1.0     .11
Valvoline Turbo        158      405     -40     .99     .13

So what's the best oil?

All of the oils above meet current SG/CD ratings and all
vehicle manufacture's warantee requirements in the proper viscosity. All are
"good enough", but those with the better numbers are icing on
the cake.  The old addage, you get what you pay for, holds true
for motor oil also.  The more expensive synthetics; AMSOIL, Mobil
1, and Spectro offer the only truly significant differences, due
to their superior high temperature oxidation resistance, 
stable viscosity base, and low temperature flow characteristics.
At up to $6.00 a quart and the 3000 mile oil change intervals
that most of our driving dictates, the benefits may not be
realized. The AMSOIL, Castrol, Havoline, Pennzoil, and Quaker
State also advertize that they meet the more stringent European
CCMC requirements.

The best oil is really one that is actually in your engine, 
is clean, and you feel good about using.

Oil additives should not be used.  The oil companies have gone
to great lengths to develop an additive package that meets the
vehicles requirements.  Some of these additives are synergistic,
that is the effect of two additives is greater than the effect
of both separately.  If you add any thing to the oil you may
upset this balance and prevent the oil from performing to
specification.  Slick 50? Well it contains PTFE or more
commonly, Teflon, a name they had to stop using because it was
not an approved use by Dupont.  My chemical dictionary says that
it will not stick to anything, so how they get something that
won't stick to anything to bond to an oily surface is beyond me.
I'm not saying it can't be done but it does cause the skeptic in
this chemist to come out.  Since it is an oil additive I would
stay away from it.  Sure, the FAA has certified it for use in
aircraft, they just certify that it won't do any harm, not that
it does what it claims.  I'll save my 30 bucks for a few extra
oil changes.

The extended oil drain intervals given by the makers of syntetic
oils are for what is called normal service.  Normal service is
defined as the engine at normal operating temperature, at
highway speeds, and in a dust free environment.  Any stop and
go, city driving, trips of less than 10 miles, exterme heat or cold puts the
oil change interval into the severe service category, which is
3000 miles for most vehicles.  AMSOIL, which says their oils can
be used for up to 25000 miles under normal conditions says that
unless you are using oil analysis, you should follow your
vehicle's severe service oil drain interval.

Hope this helps.

-E. Hackett                  
=======================================================================


-- 
Andrew          
Colfelt@ucsu.Colorado.EDU
--
----------
Posted by: emory!teleport.com!larrymc (Larry McClellan)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 07:49:29 1994
Subject: Re: Hotrod Mailing List Digest #175 (May 23, 1994) 
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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>However, propylene glycol has not been approved by GM for cars under warranty.
>They sent out a bulletin specifically naming Sierra, and any other propylene
>glycol based coolant as not meeting the GM specs for coolant, and therefore
>as not being acceptable for use in any GM car under warranty.  This appeared
>in the back of the latest NCRS (National Corvette Restorers Society) magazine.

A small company has sued GM for infringing upon its patent for reverse
cooling engines.  GM claims that they are not infringing partly
because they use ethylene glycol as a coolant and not propylene glycol
as described in the patent.  (Yeah, right.)

GM *may* have ulterior motives for bashing propylene glycol.

-- Chris.
(ch@lks.csi.com)

  "The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers."
	-- Shakespeare, Henry VI, Part 2, Act 4, Scene 2

----------
Posted by: Christopher Hoover 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 07:55:06 1994
Subject: Warranties
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Dave Cooley wrote:
>It was stated
>that "No aftermarket parts can void any part of a warranty unless it can
>be proven without a doubt that the aftermarket product was the sole
>cause of said failure".

No doubt that official truly believes this, but his opinion does not
have the force of law.  In other words, you probably can't collect
on his opinion.

>If the aftermarket chip was installed, and the engine started running
>bad a few months down the road due to a flat cam, in the past, the
>dealers would have voided the warranty due to the aftermarket eprom. 
>But, the eprom has nothing to do with the camshafts physical wear, so
>they would have to fix it under warranty.

This situation is actually a gray area rather than being clear cut
black and white.  For example, the cam may use a steep profile which
needs good lubrication to avoid premature wear, especially at high
RPM.  If the original ROM had provision for a rev limiter, and the
aftermarket ROM had none, then it is quite possible that the change
of ROMs could have done in the cam because it allowed the driver
to overrev the cam.

Modern cars are systems with a LOT of interdependence between their
component parts.  Making a change to one part may have unintended
effects in the system and may have adverse effects on other parts.
Not that I'm saying "don't change it"; on the contrary, I do suggest
experimentation.  You just need to realize that there is a risk
factor involved which wasn't present in the 1960s.

Bob Hale   hale@brooktree.com

----------
Posted by: emory!brooktree.com!hale (bob hale)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 08:00:39 1994
Subject: T700R4 trans setup
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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        There is this massive project I've embarked upon.....engine swap,
  tranny swap (different design),  brake swap (different design)..,
  interior swap  etc...etc...etc...why not a new car...right??
 
   The body is off the frame on this one, so its easy to work on.  The old
  transmission was a Ford (FMX), and was replaced with the T700R4.  Both
  engine and trans came from the same source. All parts were matched for
  this application (non-racing, just long-life and durability).
 
   I'm a bit skeptical regarding a few things about the transmission

       a) there are only 3 bolts attaching the flywheel to the converter.  Is
          this the norm?  (we're talking 400+ lb/ft torque).  The people at
          the parts source say 'yes, don't worry'

       b) I understand the TV cable setup is very important.  What is the
          correct means pre-operation adjustment.  Various explanations have
          been offered, but I would like more substance to the explanations.
          IE..do this because.....or else this will happen...

       c) The Lockup (TCC) will be operated thru a combination of vacuum 
          switches (no computer).  An article in Car Craft (Jan or Feb 94)
           showed the schematic and wiring.  Any ideas out there about
          making sure this works, so the trans won't overheat and fail.
          Also.....substance....why....how...what for  etc....

   Thanx in advance                rjonst@emcdgs1.er.usgs.gov

----------
Posted by: emory!emcdgs1.er.usgs.GOV!rjonst ( Bob Johnstone x5455 System Adm )
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 12:50:57 1994
Subject: Questions On TH350 and TH400
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In digging through various junkyards I have found a couple of what
should be TH400s.  My question is: Without removing them from the car,
what is the best way to tell a TH400 from the TH350?  If I remember way
back when, the regulators are different in someway and some other
external differences.

Also, has anyone see the book that lists which parts from which cars are
interchangeable?  Ex:  Which windshields will swap between models etc.
Thanks,

SJRD

----------
Posted by: emory!pophost.medicine.rochester.edu!sdarcy (Sean D'Arcy)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 13:00:10 1994
Subject: T200 transmissions
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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 While down at the junkyard today I noticed what looked like a T200.
Big pan, one-piece case, no tailshaft.  Everything looked OK, except it
had the Chevrolet bolt pattern.  *Only* Chevrolet.  Every T200 I've ever
seen has has the bisexual corporate/Chev patterns.  The junkyard guy
said, "Yeah, we see lots of Chevy T200s."
         

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 13:05:17 1994
Subject: heads for '89 chevy 350
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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-> Have a friend who just aquired an '89 chevy 350 minus heads and
-> intake. Would like to know what year heads will bolt onto this block.

 Any year small block heads will work.  Just make sure the heads and
intake are compatible - in '86-'87-'88 Chevy changed the angle of the
four center intake bolts.


-> like to know what style seals the oil pan uses on this block(one
-> piece).

 It uses a rubber coated steel shim gasket, one piece.  You're supposed
to use it dry, no sealer.  The gaskets are expensive.


-> in a Vega, so not sure if the Moroso Oil pan will work on this block.

 No.  But Summit sells a rear seal adaptor that will let you use an
early pan with the late block.  At least, that's what the ad appears to
be selling.
                                                                                 

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 13:10:58 1994
Subject: RE: 283 Chevy heads
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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>I have a 283 engine laying around, and I was wondering if the heads on it are
>especially good for anything.  It's a 1967 2-barrel with 9.25 : 1 compression
>ratio stock.  Would these heads be any good on a 350?, or are the ports too
>small in diameter.  It seems like they would give you a pretty good
>compression ratio.  If you look at the small ports, it's obvious that they
>could use a little porting work.  Does the casting thickness around the ports
>allow much porting?

I doubt there is anything "rare" or valuable about these heads - but on the 
other hand I don't know of any heads that are especially different.  I 
suspect most chevy heads came from more or less the same casting.  
Differences in valve size are about all that I know of.

In '67 they did not have accessory bolts on the front of the heads,  this 
could make alternator mounting dificult in a late model application.  There 
are plenty of work arounds though.

For the average car you can get away without using hardened valve seats.  
If you keep your mixture from getting too lean (keep the exhaust gas 
temperatur resonable) you'll never notice it.

Before you go hog wild on these heads remember this:
To install screw-in studs, bronz guids SS valves, 3-angle valve job, mild 
pocket porting, cc combustion chambers, dual springs will run you very 
close to $1000 including parts.  I paid $750 for a set of 492 castings but 
only after arguing about the $1000 price - I didn't order the dual spring (
this head was going on a truck - no wild camshaft - low end torque ) so the 
speed shop paid the difference - including the machine work.

For the same price you could get Dart II heads - fully assebled!  Just 
dissaseble and clean up the flashing.  There are also small valve versions 
of the Dart head and there are alot of companies makeing aluminum heads.  
Why spend alot of money on old, maybe bad heads when brand new is only a 
little more?

Of course if you do a quick freshening up on the heads none of the above 
apply.

Dirk

----------
Posted by: emory!STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV!OADDAB (DIRK BROER)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 13:17:28 1994
Subject: bug bite...
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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> Time to build a nostalgia rod....chopped 4"....
> Biggies on Back, smallies on front..... Dropped "Dago" axel...
> w/moon eyes and a pissed woodpecker!

Do it, Duane! I'm currently cruising a '30 coupe, but have been
having 50's hiboy sedan dreams myself...

----------
Posted by: emory!amp.com!dave.miller (Dave Miller)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 13:25:54 1994
Subject: RE: 5.0L Mustang performance improvements 87-93
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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>Does anyone have any economical (read 'cheap') suggestions to beef up
>performance on my '93 5.0L Mustang GT?  I have already removed the
>intake silencer and advanced the timing 2 degrees.  
> 
>Any suggestions?

You didn't mention if it was an automatic or manual.  For an automatic a 
new stall converter is a must! (IMHO)

Before you start buying parts:
1) set timing to 13-14 deg TDC
2) insure that throttle is opening all the way when pedal is pressed to 
floor
3) set Throttle Position Sensor (TPS) to read 1.00V at idle

For parts:
1) Ram Air kit - about $150
2) Underdrive pulleys (marginal help at low rpms)
3) Bypass belt - bypasses power steering and smog pump (drag race only)
4) fuel pressure regulator and gauge (try about 46 psi at idle)

Now its starts getting more expensive:
1) complete new dual exhaust system - get full lenght headers and do it 
right from the start (check local emission laws first!).  Remove EGR hump 
in heads once the exhuast is out of the way.
2) 1.7:1 rocker arms
3) 77mm MAF sensor, 65mm throttle, 65mm EGR
4) Extrude hone intake manifold, or GT-40 intake

Now it gets more involved:
1) Cam shaft
2) heads

The items are in approximately the correct order.  Going through the whole 
list could net as much at 350hp (according to magazine test YMMV) most 
claim that the gains would be closer to 100hp.

Other things you should consider:
1) SUBFRAME CONNECTORS  - contact Global West and buy the whole kit (about 
$150) take it too a good frame shop and have them weld them in (expect $200
)  this will make a world of difference and if you drive your car hard it 
will keep the floor boards in one piece.  The difference is night and day 
and I can't recommend this change enough.  The global west SFC's mount from 
bulk head to bulk head and mount next to the existing frame sections, they 
are also tubular and very strong.  The extra kit mounts along the rocker 
panel and would keep the rocker panel from buckling (they all buckle a 
little).  Welding is a little difficult because of all the galvanized metal


From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 13:32:33 1994
Subject: Randy Brown (unx.sas.com)
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Sorry about the personal note - I can't get to Randy otherwise:

"
550 ... Addressee unknown

-------------- Message follows --------------
Date: 25 May 1994 07:16:05 U
From: "Rund, Sharen" 
Subject: RE>Hotrod Mailing List Digest
Return-receipt-to: "Rund, Sharen" 
To: "randy" 


Reply to:   RE>Hotrod Mailing List Digest 

yes - should be in Street Scene & other Hot Rod mags

--------------------------------------
Date: 5/25/94 6:38 AM
To: Sharen Rund
From: Randy Brown
> 
> From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
> Subject: Burlington NATS
> 
> 
> there was a post last week about the 1st Burlington Nationals...

Vermont?
"


--
____________    __      ____________  "They that can give up essential
\_____     /   /_ \     \     _____/  liberty to obtain a little
 \_____    \____/  \____/    _____/  temporary safety deserve
  \_____                    _____/  neither liberty nor safety."
     \___________  ___________/          --Benjamin Franklin
               /    \           ALL disclaimers apply ....
               ~~~~~~

----------
Posted by: emory!zuni.litc.lockheed.com!sharen (Sharen Rund)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 13:38:18 1994
Subject: Chevy Small Block and Starters
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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I'm a mopar guy trying to help out a Chevy neighbor.

Could someone kindly ID the following small block Chevy motor?

	V1015TRH

He thinks this is an early 70's truck motor.

He needs to ID the motor as he's trying to find the right starter.
This is an automatic car (67 Nova II) which has an automatic tranny
with a 14" flex plate.

The last two starters he's tried clearly haven't fit properly -- they
both made an awful racket and chewed up the gear on the starter.

How many different starters are there for automatic Chevy small blocks
and how do you tell them apart?  Any tricks or gotcha's I should warn
him about?

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks,
-- Chris.
(ch@lks.csi.com)

----------
Posted by: Christopher Hoover 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 13:44:27 1994
Subject: Re: T700R4 trans setup
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In article c766hqm@dixie.com, hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List) writes:
>
>        There is this massive project I've embarked upon.....engine swap,
>  tranny swap (different design),  brake swap (different design)..,
>  interior swap  etc...etc...etc...why not a new car...right??
> 
>   The body is off the frame on this one, so its easy to work on.  The old
>  transmission was a Ford (FMX), and was replaced with the T700R4.  Both
>  engine and trans came from the same source. All parts were matched for
>  this application (non-racing, just long-life and durability).
> 
>   I'm a bit skeptical regarding a few things about the transmission
>
>       a) there are only 3 bolts attaching the flywheel to the converter.  Is
>          this the norm?  (we're talking 400+ lb/ft torque).  The people at
>          the parts source say 'yes, don't worry'

This seems like an interesting project. I'd love to hear more about it.

Yes, 3 bolts is the norm. My old TH350 trans has 3 bolts, the TH400 I've
seen had 3, and the same goes for the TH700. I too was surprised the first
time I saw this, but I have never heard of anyone who actually broke these
bolts. The weakest part of the drivetrain seems to the the U-joints. Be
sure to use top-quality there. 

Regards

Markus



----------
Posted by: emory!sta.ericsson.se!etxmst (Markus Strobl 98121)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 13:55:29 1994
Subject: 283 Chevy heads
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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-> I have a 283 engine laying around, and I was wondering if the heads
-> on it are especially good for anything.

 David Vizard thinks they're the hot tip to swap on a 305.  They'll
bring the compression up at least a full ratio.  He also says they don't
flow quite as good as the stock 305 heads, and recommends porting them.
He had an article in PHR on it a few years back.

 My brother ran a set of early 283 heads on a 10:1 350 once, a motor
he'd put together out of parts he had laying around.  Chevrolet OEM
327/350hp cam, Offy Dual Port, 600 Holley, HEI.  The largish cam and
tremendous intake velocity from the DP and small port heads gave the
engine truly impressive throttle response and it pulled like a freight
train up to about 4000 RPM, where it flattened out.  I don't think we
ever had it over 5000; there wasn't any point in it.  The thing also
refused to ping even on cheap regular gas.  Not the kind of motor you'd
want for a street machine, but it'd be great for a tow vehicle.  In
fact, it's out of the original vehicle and slated for his tow truck now.
           

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 14:03:04 1994
Subject: Re: racing oil
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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-> are well written and accurate.  I believe they answer the questions
-> about using racing oil in a street engine (don't).  JGD

 Pennzoil and Valvoline both say it's perfectly OK to use their racing
oils in street engines.
                                                                                              

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 14:08:25 1994
Subject: Re: Hotrod Mailing List Digest #175 (May 23, 1994)
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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-> A small company has sued GM for infringing upon its patent for
-> reverse cooling engines.  GM claims that they are not infringing

 Give me a day or so and I could probably come up with three or four
examples of prior art on reverse cooling.  Not everyone has always fed
the block first, and if you're willing to go back into the 'teens and
'twenties you'll find damned near everything has been tried at least
once.

 The US Patent Office will issue a patent on ANYTHING.  They don't check
for previous inventions of the same type, known as prior art.  You
could, for example, patent the V8 engine, and given the cumulative IQ of
the Patent Office you'd stand a good chance of obtaining a patent.
The patent would be invalid, but you'd have to go through the courts to
have it struck down, and in the meantime as patentholder you'd be
entitled to anything you could screw out of people infringing on your
patent.  It's a sicko arrangement.
                                                                                                            

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 14:14:35 1994
Subject: T700R4 trans setup
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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-> transmission was a Ford (FMX), and was replaced with the T700R4.

 Did you make your own adapter, or use one of the commercial ones?
I've been planning on running a T700 against my 351, but I haven't been
able to come up with a transmission.  The local core place sells them
for $100, supposedly, but each time I call or go there they "just sold
the last one."


-> a) there are only 3 bolts attaching the flywheel to the converter.
-> Is this the norm?  (we're talking 400+ lb/ft torque).

 Works fine, don't worry, be happy.
                                          

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 14:20:30 1994
Subject: Re: 5.0L Mustang performance improvements 87-93
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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In article <#k76n-p@dixie.com> hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List) writes:
>From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
>Subject: 5.0L Mustang performance improvements 87-93
>Date: Wed, 25 May 94 04:45:29 GMT

>Does anyone have any economical (read 'cheap') suggestions to beef up
>performance on my '93 5.0L Mustang GT?  I have already removed the
>intake silencer and advanced the timing 2 degrees.  
> 
>Any suggestions?

>Thanks

>--Jeff

>----------
Remove the CATS with a motorsport H-Pipe.  Bore MAS to 59-60mm.  
Drop in a pre'89 roller cam (same advertised specs but actually 
different)  add 1.7 Cobra roller rockers.  3.55 gears (stick)  3.73 (Auto). 

>Posted by: emory!aol.com!jfeige 
(JFeige)

----------
Posted by: emory!eve579.eve.ford.com!jperry2 (Deputy Dawg)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 18:52:49 1994
Subject: Re: HELP: Electric oil pressure sender?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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>   I've got an Autometer electric oil pressure sender (0-100 psi)
>that I want to use as an input to a digital dash I'm building.
>Anybody know how these things work?  What I really want is some way
>of getting a 0-5v (or 0-12v) signal out of this thing - but I'm not sure
>how to hook up the wiring.  It's got one screw terminal on it, and I 
>assume the case/threads are ground. Resistance is ~ 68 ohms at atmospheric
>pressure (I think that's what it was).  I assume some sort of resitor
>network ('voltage divider' for those who've read _The_Art_of_Electronics_)
>would do the trick....

>Peter J Nelson 

 You assume correctly! The threads/case are used as ground and yes you do 
need to use a voltage divider to get an output.  The sensor operates by 
changing its resistance in relation to the pressure applied to the input.  
As the pressure goes up, so does the resistance.  By connecting a resistor 
in series with the sensor i.e. one end of the resistor connects to the screw 
on the sensor and the other should be connected to power (like 12V), you 
can get a voltage across the sensor that will correspond to the pressure 
applied to the sensor.  As the pressure goes up, so does the voltage.  The 
trick is to use the right value of resistor to get a good range of output 
voltage.  The resistor value can be easily calcualted but you need to know 
the resisitance of the sensor with no pressure applied, and the resistance 
with some amount of pressure applied. The resistance at max pressure is 
best but is not neccessary since it can be reasonably calculated. Since the 
pressure sensor doesn't go to zero ohms with 0psi applied, you will never 
get 0 volts across the sensor.  This limitation can be overcome by using 
an offset voltage on whatever analog to digital converter circuit you 
intend to use.  The offset voltage "fakes out" the analog to digital 
circuit into thinking that the voltage present when the sensor is at 0psi 
is actually 0. By building your A to D circuit correctly, you can get a 
display that will give a display of 0 to 100 with an input from the 
sensor of, say, 2 to 8 volts. The maximum voltage across the sensor will be 
limited by the max resistance of the sensor and the series resistor you 
select. Since I don't know the resitance values of your sensor I can't tell 
you what voltage range you will get from this arrangement. If I remember 
correctly, Radio Electronics Magazine had a series of articles on making a 
digital dashboard.  They listed the sensors you needed to use. Good luck...

 Douglas R. Glosson

    Quality entertainment: A case of beer & a bug zapper.

----------
Posted by: emory!dfmail.usafa.af.mil!CWISP!SCHMIDTMD (MICKEY D. SCHMIDT)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 19:06:30 1994
Subject: RE: Questions On TH350 and TH400
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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>In digging through various junkyards I have found a couple of what
>should be TH400s.  My question is: Without removing them from the car,
>what is the best way to tell a TH400 from the TH350?  If I remember way
>back when, the regulators are different in someway and some other
>external differences.

Vacuum modulator on the 400 is on the passanger side.  On the 350 it is 
toward the rear.  Also 400 have an "irregular shaped pan" something like a 
10 sided polygon.  I think a 350 has a 4 sided pan with one corner cut -  
basically a 5-sided polygon.

>Also, has anyone see the book that lists which parts from which cars are
>interchangeable?  Ex:  Which windshields will swap between models etc.

I think you are talking about the Hollander (sp?) Interchange manuals.  A 
complete set would cost a fortune.  Try getting friendlier with the junk 
yard and go through their set.

I think someone on the mopar list has or had one of the sets maybe if you 
ask nicely.  I don't have the email address for the list, sorry.

Dirk


----------
Posted by: emory!STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV!OADDAB (DIRK BROER)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 19:20:16 1994
Subject: RE: Chevy Small Block and Starters
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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>Could someone kindly ID the following small block Chevy motor?
>
>	V1015TRH

If memory serves me a three letter trailing code makes it a truck motor so 
"TRH" would indicate truck.  Passanger car engines have 2 letters.

>He needs to ID the motor as he's trying to find the right starter.
>This is an automatic car (67 Nova II) which has an automatic tranny
>with a 14" flex plate.

There are two types of flywheels/flex plates.  The 153 teeth ones and the 
168 teeth ones.  The smaller of the two were usually used in tight fitting 
aplications (ie. Cheby II)

Now I think that the 153 tooth flywheels require the parralel bolts on the 
block's starter mounting boss.  The 168 tooth flywheels have a different 
starter mounting boss.  So it is possible he has the wrong flywheel for the 
block.  I may have the info backwards - I'll have to check my truck to be 
sure.  My truck definitly has the 168 tooth wheel and definitly has the 
angled starter mounting bolts.

But don't dispare.  After market startmotors seem to have dual bolt 
patterns - that would allow mounting for either flywheel.

>How many different starters are there for automatic Chevy small blocks
>and how do you tell them apart?  Any tricks or gotcha's I should warn
>him about?

There seem to be two kinds and there is probably high and low torque 
varieties both the kinds.

The popular high performance flex plat is the 168 tooth design - in some 
classes of racing the specify SFI certified flex plates.  Maybe kill two 
birds with one stone?

Dirk
 


----------
Posted by: emory!STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV!OADDAB (DIRK BROER)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 19:26:34 1994
Subject: RE: 283 Chevy heads
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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>-> I have a 283 engine laying around, and I was wondering if the heads
>-> on it are especially good for anything.
>
> David Vizard thinks they're the hot tip to swap on a 305.  They'll
>bring the compression up at least a full ratio.  He also says they don't
>flow quite as good as the stock 305 heads, and recommends porting them.
>He had an article in PHR on it a few years back.

Careful, I think all pre 71 heads were 64cc heads.  Late model smog motors 
use dished pistons and 58cc heads - so the 305 heads actually give better 
compression.  The reason this was done is that the smaller combustion 
chambers seem to have more efficient flame travel.  This is why you really 
want to stay away from pop-up pistons if you can avoid it.  Some cicle 
track racers run 13:1 with flat top pistons (NASCAR is about 15:1 but I'm 
not sure if they allow pop-up pistons).  

64cc heads with standard TRW flat top pistons will give you between 9.6 and 
10.0:1 compression.  Time for premium gas...

Shaving .100 of the heads with a 4" bore is worth about 1.25 cubic inches 
or 20 cc's - give or take 3 full points of compression...(starting with a 
10.0:1 compression motor).

Dirk

----------
Posted by: emory!STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV!OADDAB (DIRK BROER)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 19:32:45 1994
Subject: Re: 5.0L Mustang performance improvements 87-93
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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>>Does anyone have any economical (read 'cheap') suggestions to beef up
>>performance on my '93 5.0L Mustang GT?  I have already removed the
>>intake silencer and advanced the timing 2 degrees.  
>> 

>>----------
>Remove the CATS with a motorsport H-Pipe.  Bore MAS to 59-60mm.  

All '89 and later mustangs had MAF sensors rather than MAP.
DON'T TOUCH THE MAF SENSOR - it is basically calibrated to the injector 
size on the car - enlarging it will decrease the signal to the computer - 
so the computer thinks less air is running through the motor - resultingn 
in a full throttle lean condition.  NOT GOOD!  There are plenty of 
manuafacturers that produce aftermarket sensors that are calibrated to the 
stock injectors (19lbs I think).  At stock fuel pressures this is 
supposidly good for 300hp (you do the math).  At about 50 psi it is 
supposidly good enough for 350 or so horsepower.  YMMV.

>Drop in a pre'89 roller cam (same advertised specs but actually 

Thats a new one on me.  I you go with a different cam you might as well 
get a performance cam - Ford sells 2 or 3 roller cams that "should not 
alter emissions" but they can't / won't guarentee it.  These cams are sold 
as CompuCam 2020, 2030, and 2040 - these are all roller cams and they are 
all billit steel cams - so expect $200+ price tag.  Some of these cams 
require 3.55 gears.  CompuCams claims some of these are 50 state legal.  
YMMV

Dirk

 


----------
Posted by: emory!STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV!OADDAB (DIRK BROER)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 19:40:05 1994
Subject: Re: T700R4 trans setup
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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The Hotrod List writes:
>    The body is off the frame on this one, so its easy to work on.  The old
>   transmission was a Ford (FMX), and was replaced with the T700R4.  Both
>   engine and trans came from the same source. All parts were matched for
>   this application (non-racing, just long-life and durability).
>        a) there are only 3 bolts attaching the flywheel to the converter.  Is
>           this the norm?  (we're talking 400+ lb/ft torque).  The people at
>           the parts source say 'yes, don't worry'
 
Force = Torque divided by distance.  I'd say youre more likely to break
the bolts attaching the flexplate to the crankshaft.

>        b) I understand the TV cable setup is very important.  What is the
>           correct means pre-operation adjustment.  Various explanations have
>           been offered, but I would like more substance to the explanations.
>           IE..do this because.....or else this will happen...

Yes, it's VERY important.  Do not drive the vehicle at ALL with the TV
cable disconnected.  The first WOT 1-2 shift will fry the 2-4 band.
For the linkage on the throttlebody or carb, use a stock one for a 700R4
if there is any way you can, and if not, find one anyway to observe path
that the tv cable attachment point moves relative to the tv cable
mounting bracket as a function of throttle angle....  or just your pivot
at exactly the same place as the OEM one (same X,Y coordinates in the
plane of the throttle arm)...  and you'll want to do your comparisons at
WOT, since the WOT tv position is much more critical than idle.  Your TV
cable bracket needs to be STOUT:  if you can noticeably deflect it with
foot pressure (leg press it), it ain't strong enough.  Adjust the tv
cable just like the factory book says to:  push the "button" on the
cable and pull the cable housing away from the mount, then release the
button.  Next open the throttle by hand at the throttlebody to WOT.
The TV cable is now adjusted to factory specs.  I know some people with
200R4's will push in the button and carefully pull the cable back one
"click" from the factory setting, but I don't think this should be
necessary with the 700R4.  One other note:  get an OEM style TV cable.
I had to use a custom type tv cable with a two-piece housing on my truck
and the compression fitting the attached the two parts of the concentric
cable housings slipped the first time the cable got hot.
 
>        c) The Lockup (TCC) will be operated thru a combination of vacuum 
>           switches (no computer).  An article in Car Craft (Jan or Feb 94)
>            showed the schematic and wiring.  Any ideas out there about
>           making sure this works, so the trans won't overheat and fail.
>           Also.....substance....why....how...what for  etc....

A vacuum switch may give you some serious headaches....  consider this
scenario:  you are crusing along with some amount of vacuum high enough
to trip the vacuum switch.  You depress the throttle a little more until
vacuum drops enough for the TCC to unlock.  The TCC unlocks and RPM's
rise.  Now vacuum rises and the TCC locks again.  TCC locks, RPM's fall
vacuum falls...  see the cycle yet?  I don't know if it will actually
happen, but it very well could.  A vacuum switch with more of a
difference between on and off ratings will fix it.

I don't believe any transmission damage will result from leaving the TCC
disconnected, just decreased fuel economy.  Also, if it screws up and
your cicuit sticks on for some reason (gets shorted to ground
somewhere), it'll drive a little funny, but it isn't dangerous.  The
700R4's that I have seen will only lockup in 3rd and 4th gear, so when
you are coming to a stop the tcc will unlock as soon as the tranny
downshifts to 2nd.  It also locks back up immediately after going back
into 3rd.  The 3-4 shift at low-med throttle is normally done with the
TCC locked anyway, so thats no big deal either.  The only place I see
for damage to occur is WOT with the TCC locked in 3rd or 4th gear, since
the TCC isn't designed to take WOT.  I'm not sure if there is a safety
in the tranny to unlock the TCC as a function of the tv cable/main
pressure.


-- 
Jonathan R. Lusky  --  lusky@knuth.mtsu.edu
 "Turbos are nice but I'd rather be blown!"
   89 Jeep Wrangler - 258 / For Sale: $8000 obo
       80 Toyota Celica - 20R / 5spd

----------
Posted by: emory!knuth.mtsu.edu!lusky (Jonathan R. Lusky)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 23:26:51 1994
Subject: Re: heads for '89 chevy 350
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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-->
-->-> Have a friend who just aquired an '89 chevy 350 minus heads and
-->-> intake. Would like to know what year heads will bolt onto this block.
-->
--> Any year small block heads will work.  Just make sure the heads and
-->intake are compatible - in '86-'87-'88 Chevy changed the angle of the
-->four center intake bolts.
-->

Hi, here's a question along this line,
   I have a 89 305 chevy.  I'm planning to change the cam and intake so I
figured," heck why not the heads too".  But after calling a couple of
manufacturers, it looks like nobody makes an aftermarket head for the late
model 305.  If I use the early model heads can I redrill the center holes
in the intake(edelbrock is the only aftermarket intake for the tbi)?  Well,
if not, I guess I'll have to go to forced induction.

	wes

----------
Posted by: Wes 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed May 25 23:51:56 1994
Subject: Re:  T200 transmissions
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Dave, you may have seen one of the terrible tiny T700s.  A very few early
S10 pickups and Blazers had a mini casing T700.  One of the BAD ones.
I had one of these trannys for a while....  Stay away.  Very short 
production on these, like a half-year.

Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097

----------
Posted by: emory!rebel.dsea.com!frank (Frank Evan Perdicaro)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 26 00:02:52 1994
Subject: Re:  Questions On TH350 and TH400
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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The pan of TH400 looks something like Texas.  Go to the local parts place
and get a gasket for a TH350 and a TH400, and take each with you to
the junkyard.  The gasket for a T700R4 looks square with an extra-thick
section on the passenger-side front.

Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097

----------
Posted by: emory!rebel.dsea.com!frank (Frank Evan Perdicaro)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 26 00:13:28 1994
Subject: Re:  T700R4 trans setup
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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I have been researching T700R4s for a while.

1) Three bolts is fine, just use the correct metric ones.  I think each
has a sheer rating in the ten ton range.

2) and 3)  First, read Mathias Breijka's 1993 book on transmissions.  It
explains EXACTLY what the TV cable does in a T700R4, and why.

Second, and more useful is this.  You need full TV at full throttle.  
Use an aftermarket adjustable TV mounting bracket, and set the cable
so there is full TV at WOT, and a bit of slack at idle.  With a 
heavy-duty clutch set, this should work.

I have my TCC set via an internal 4th gear pressure switch.  Go into 4th,
wait a bit, and it locks.  I have a switch in the dash to override this.
I'd like to wire a vac. switch inline, too.  I also have the 4th WOT
option.  I can justify this setup because I have enough torque to not
need to downshift from 4th to do anything, and because my real intent
for the car is 150mph cruising

As to an indicator for what is working, put a comparator on the line,
or a better current indicator to show when the locking solenoid is 
drawing current.  Also, put a temp sensor in the fluid exhaust, and if
it gets too hot you have a problem.  I believe too hot is like 275F,
from a discussion on the net last year.

Frank Evan Perdicaro 			Dainippon Screen Engineering of America
 Legalize guns, drugs and cash...today.	   3700 Segerstrom Ave
  inhouse: frank@rebel, x210		      Santa Ana CA
   outhouse: frank@dsea.com, 714-546-9491x210	 92704       DoD:1097

----------
Posted by: emory!rebel.dsea.com!frank (Frank Evan Perdicaro)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 26 00:24:27 1994
Subject: Re:  Questions On TH350 and TH400
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8619
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
X-Comment: Send subscription and drop requests to hotrod-request@dixie.com
X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

There are several easy ways to tell a T400 from a T350.  Here's a chart
of the obvious ones:

			T350			T400

kickdown mechanism	Cable to throttle	Electrical connection

governor cover		Retained by bail wire	Retained by 4 bolts

shape of pan		Mostly rectangular,	Irregular, pointy
			with one corner angled	at the rear

pressure test plugs	Several on right side	One on left side

vacuum modulator	At right rear, faces	At right front, faces
			fore and aft		sideways

The T400 will always have an electrical connector which may have one
or two connections depending on whether it has the high gear switch.
The T350 may have an electrical connector depending on whether it has
a lockup converter and/or a high gear switch.  The T400 kickdown wire
was typically an add-on, not part of the harness.  It is an orange
wire which usually had its own grommet in the fire wall.  It connected
connected to a switch usually mounted above the gas pedal.

The T350 throttle linkage cable starts from the right front of the
case just above the pan and goes up to the engine's throttle linkage.

Both transmissions came in several tailshaft lengths.  Different
tailhousing castings were used with the different tailshaft lengths.
If you get the right length then you can probably avoid having to
lengthen or cut the driveshaft.

T350 usually used small u-joints while T400 usually used large u-joints.
However, this isn't always the case so don't depend on it.

The T350 usually used a 12 inch diameter torque converter with a stall
speed near 1800 RPM while the T400 usually used a 13 inch converter
with a stall speed near 1500 RPM.  Again, there are exceptions so don't
count on this.  The standard (non-lockup) converters are interchangeable
between the T350 and T400, at least into the early 80s and maybe beyond.
The converters have different mounting hole radii but the standard flex
plates have holes for both.  A few extra heavy duty torque converters
used 6 mounting bolts; these were usually found in one ton and larger
truck applications.

There is one more variant of the T400 that you might find - this is
the variable pitch converter model usually used in Buicks.  It has
an extra connection in the electrical connector to work the pitch
control.  These torque converters are not interchangeable with the
usual converters but can be adapted to a non-switch pitch trans if
desired.

Bob Hale   hale@brooktree.com

----------
Posted by: emory!brooktree.com!hale (bob hale)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 26 00:30:09 1994
Subject: Re:  Chevy Small Block and Starters
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8620
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
X-Comment: Send subscription and drop requests to hotrod-request@dixie.com
X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

The Chevy truck engine numbering method means that your number breaks
down as follows:

V	manufacturing plant
10	month of manufacture (October)
15	day of manufacture (15th)
T	truck
RH	engine and transmission type

Since the tranny is not now in a truck there is high probability
that the flex plate did not belong to the tranny.  I don't think
that the ID number will help you to find the correct starter
since you appear to be dealing with a hybrid.

Bob Hale   hale@brooktree.com

----------
Posted by: emory!brooktree.com!hale (bob hale)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 26 12:40:51 1994
Subject: TV: *Televised Events #94-21*
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8621
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
X-Comment: Send subscription and drop requests to hotrod-request@dixie.com
X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

----------------------------------------------------------------------
			       TV Events

Now in its third year of weekly publication, TVE is a compilation of 
info. gleaned from TV listings, auto mags., newspapers, tea leaves, my 
favorite bartender, and the nice folks at TNN.  PLEASE confirm dates and 
times with your local listings before setting your VCRs.

TVE will USUALLY be updated no later than every Friday morning and will 
be most accurate (or least inaccurate) for the following 7 days. If your 
favorite event is "tba'd", please don't panic unless it's in the 7 day 
window.

As mentioned previously, this listing is now being submitted to the new 
group rec.autos.sport.info.  Assuming the moderators approve, this list 
will be available in the r.a.s.i group from now on.  In an attempt to 
get 
the word to as many r.a.s readers as possible, I will continue to cross-
post to r.a.s for a short time. (This again assumes the moderators of 
r.a.s.i do not object to my doing so.)

If you are having trouble with this list arriving at your site in
a timely fashion, please let me know via e-mail and I will also start
mailing you a copy.

Comments, suggestions, additions, extra pit passes, etc. to:
					  stoffel@oasys.dt.navy.mil

		   ---------------------------------

(T)=Taped  (L)=Live  (SD)=Same Day  (?)=dunno

12:00AM = 0000 hours = start of day

    EVENT                             DATE  TIME(Eastern, USA)  NETWORK

WORLD SUPERBIKES, HOCKENHEIM (T)      05/26    2:00-3:00PM      HTS*
IHRA Hall Of Fame Ceremony            05/26    3:00-4:00PM      ESPN2
Motor Sports Hour                     05/26    3:00-4:00PM      HTS*
AMA SUPERCROSS, ORLANDO (T)           05/26    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (L)    05/26    8:00-9:00PM      PRIME
NHRA, SOUTHERN NATIONALS, ATLANTA (T) 05/26    8:00-9:00PM      HTS*
MotorWeek (Neon,Corolla,Saturn, et al)05/26    8:30-9:00PM      MPT**
WORLD SUPERBIKES, HOCKENHEIM (T)      05/26    9:00-10:00PM     HTS*
Motor Sports Hour                     05/26    10:00-11:00PM    HTS*
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold (SD)   05/26   11:00PM-12:00AM   HTS*
Movie: Heart Like A Wheel             05/27   10:30AM-12:25PM   MAX
Motoworld II                          05/27    6:30-7:00PM      ESPN2
Special w/ Mario Andretti             05/27    7:00-10:00PM     QVC
Motoworld II                          05/28    12:30-1:00AM     ESPN2
Secrets Of Speed                      05/28    1:00-1:30AM      ESPN2
Speed Racer (cartoon)                 05/28    6:00-6:30AM      MTV
Shadetree Mechanic (air-conditioning) 05/28    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
MotorWeek                             05/28    10:00-10:30AM    WGN
Legends Of The Brickyard (1983)       05/28    12:00-12:30PM    ESPN
A Race For Heroes (Mario)             05/28    12:30-1:00PM     ESPN
Indy 500 Festival Parade (L)          05/28    1:00-2:30PM      TNN
BUSCH GN, CHARLOTTE (L)               05/28    1:00-4:00PM      TBS
1993 Indy 500                         05/28    1:00-2:00PM      ESPN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              05/28    2:30-3:00PM      TNN
Hydropower                            05/28    3:00-4:00PM      ESPN2
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      05/28    3:00-3:30PM      TNN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               05/28    3:30-4:00PM      TNN
Legends Of The Brickyard (1992)       05/28    4:00-4:30PM      ESPN
BUSCH GN, LOUDON (T)                  05/28    4:00-5:30PM      TNN
A Race For Heroes (Danny Sullivan)    05/28    4:30-5:00PM      ESPN
Profile of Mario Andretti             05/28    5:00-6:00PM      ESPN
MotorWeek (Neon,Corolla,Saturn, et al)05/28    5:00-5:30PM      MPT*
Indianapolis 500 Preview              05/28    6:00-7:00PM      ESPN
Indy 500 Film                         05/28    7:00-7:30PM      ESPN2
SpeedWeek                             05/28    7:30-8:00PM      ESPN
A Race For Heroes                     05/28    7:30-8:00PM      ESPN2
A Race For Heroes                     05/28    8:00-8:30PM      ESPN2
A Race For Heroes                     05/28    8:30-9:00PM      ESPN2
A Race For Heroes                     05/28    9:00-9:30PM      ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/28    9:30-10:00PM     ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/28    10:00-10:30PM    ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/28    10:30-11:00PM    ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/28    11:00-11:30PM    ESPN2
Auto Shop                             05/29    12:00-1:00AM     QVC
SATURDAY NIGHT THUNDER (T)            05/29    12:30-2:00AM     ESPN
Motoworld                             05/29    2:30-3:00AM      ESPN
SpeedWeek                             05/29    3:00-3:30AM      ESPN
Motoworld                             05/29    7:30-7:50AM      ESPN
A Race For Heroes                     05/29    7:30-8:00AM      ESPN2
FORMULA 1, SPAIN (L)                  05/29    7:50-10:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
A Race For Heroes                     05/29    8:00-8:30AM      ESPN2
A Race For Heroes                     05/29    8:30-9:00AM      ESPN2
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               05/29    9:00-9:30AM      TNN
A Race For Heroes                     05/29    9:00-9:30AM      ESPN2
Trucks And Tractor Power              05/29    9:30-10:00AM     TNN
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/29    9:30-10:00AM     ESPN2
N Bonnett's Winners (Geoff Bodine)    05/29    10:00-10:30AM    TNN
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/29    10:00-10:30AM    ESPN2
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              05/29    10:30-11:00AM    TNN
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/29    10:30-11:00AM    ESPN2
INDIANAPOLIS 500 (L)                  05/29   11:00AM-3:30PM    ABC
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      05/29    11:00-11:30AM    TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           05/29   11:30AM-12:00PM   TNN
Auto Shop                             05/29    1:00-2:00PM      QVC
World Of Speed & Beauty (vintage bikes05/29    2:00-2:30PM      TNN
N Bonnett's Winners (Geoff Bodine)    05/29    2:30-3:00PM      TNN
Truckin' USA w/Ed Bruce               05/29    3:00-3:30PM      TNN
Trucks And Tractor Power              05/29    3:30-4:00PM      TNN
AMA SUPERCROSS, SACRAMENTO (T)        05/29    4:00-5:00PM      ESPN
NASCAR Trackside                      05/29    4:30-4:45PM      TBS
WINSTON CUP, CHARLOTTE (L)            05/29    4:45-9:30PM      TBS
PORSCHE CUP, SAN MARINO (T)           05/29    5:00-5:30PM      ESPN
NHRA, MID-SOUTH NATIONALS (T)         05/29    5:00-6:25PM      TNN
RaceDay Update w/Pat Patterson (L)    05/29    6:25-6:30PM      TNN
Shadetree Mechanic (air-conditioning) 05/29    7:00-7:30PM      TNN
NHRA Today w/Steve Evans              05/29    7:30-8:00PM      TNN
Inside Winston Cup w/Ned Jarrett      05/29    8:00-8:30PM      TNN
RaceDay w/Pat Patterson (L)           05/29    8:30-9:00PM      TNN
Road Test Magazine w/Don Garlits      05/29    11:00-11:30PM    TNN
World Of Speed & Beauty (vintage bikes05/29   11:30PM-12:00AM   TNN
RaceDay Update w/Pat Patterson (L)    05/30    12:00-12:05AM    TNN
AMA, DAYTONA 250 (T)                  05/30    12:05-1:30AM     TNN
FORMULA 1, SPAIN (T)                  05/30    12:30-2:00AM     ESPN
SpeedWeek                             05/30    1:00-1:30PM      ESPN
IMSA WSC/GTS, LIME ROCK (L)           05/30    1:30-4:00PM      ESPN
AMA SUPERCROSS, IRVING (T)            05/30    6:30-7:30PM      ESPN2
SpeedWeek                             05/31    3:30-4:00AM      ESPN
A Race For Heroes                     05/31    1:00-1:30PM      ESPN2
A Race For Heroes                     05/31    1:30-2:00PM      ESPN2
A Race For Heroes                     05/31    2:00-2:30PM      ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/31    2:30-3:00PM      ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/31    3:00-3:30PM      ESPN2
Legends Of The Brickyard              05/31    3:30-4:00PM      ESPN2
IMSA WSC/GTS, LIME ROCK (T)           06/01    3:30-5:30AM      ESPN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      06/01   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      06/02   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
Harley Davidson: The American Mtrcycle06/02    8:05-9:05PM      TBS
This Week In NASCAR w/Eli Gold, Dover 06/02   11:00PM-12:00AM   HTS*
Harley Davidson: The American Mtrcycle06/02   11:05PM-12:05AM   TBS
MOTORCYCLE GRAND PRIX, OZ (T)         06/03    1:00-2:00AM      ESPN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Dover (L)      06/03   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN

		  ----------COMING EVENTS----------

BUSCH GN, DOVER (L)                   06/04    1:00-3:00PM      TNN
WINSTON CUP, DOVER (L)                06/05    12:00-4:30PM     TNN
INDYCAR, MILWAUKEE (L)                06/05    4:00-6:00PM      ABC [1]
PORSCHE CUP, MONACO (T)               06/10    1:00AM           ESPN
POCONO SPORTSMAN 150 & ARCA 150 (L)   06/11   11:00AM-2:30PM    TNN
BUSCH GN, MYRTLE BEACH (L)            06/11    5:00-7:00PM      TNN
FORMULA 1, CANADA (L)                 06/12    2:00-4:00PM  ESPN,CBC
INDYCAR, DETROIT (L)                  06/12    2:00-4:30PM      ABC [1]
WINSTON CUP, POCONO (L)               06/12    12:00-4:00PM     TNN
IROC #3, TALLADEGA (T)                06/12    tba              ABC
NHRA, SPRINGNATIONALS, KIRKERSVILLE(?)06/12    tba              tba
PORSCHE CUP, SPAIN (T)                06/18    12:30PM          ESPN
WINSTON CUP, MICHIGAN (L)             06/19    1:00PM           CBS
BUSCH GN, WATKINS GLEN (L)            06/25    2:00-4:00PM      TNN
ASA, BRAINERD (L)                     06/26    2:00-4:30PM      TNN
INDYCAR, PORTLAND (L)                 06/26    4:00-6:30PM      ESPN [1]
NHRA, NATIONALS, TOPEKA (L)           06/26    6:00-7:00PM      TNN
WINSTON CUP, DAYTONA (L)              07/02    11:00AM          ESPN
FORMULA 1, FRANCE (L)                 07/03    7:50-10:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
BUSCH GN, MILWAUKEE (?)               07/03    tba              tba
ASA, CEDAR RAPIDS (L)                 07/04    tba              TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Loudon (L)     07/06   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Loudon (L)     07/07   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
VideoMorning RACEWEEK, Loudon (L)     07/08   9:00AM-12:00PM    TNN
FORMULA 1, GREAT BRITAIN (L)          07/10    8:50-11:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
WINSTON CUP, LOUDON (L)               07/10    1:00PM           TNN
INDYCAR, CLEVELAND (L)                07/10    1:30-3:30PM      ABC [1]
BUSCH GN, S. BOSTON (?)               07/16    tba              tba
WINSTON CUP, POCONO (L)               07/17    12:30PM          TBS
INDYCAR, TORONTO (L)                  07/17    2:00-4:00PM      NBC [1]
PORSCHE CUP, FRANCE (T)               07/17    5:00PM           ESPN
BUSCH GN, TALLADEGA (?)               07/23    tba              tba
WINSTON CUP, TALADEGA (L)             07/24    12:15PM          CBS
PORSCHE CUP, BRITAIN (T)              07/24    12:30PM          ESPN
NHRA, MILE-HIGH NATIONALS, MORRISON(?)07/24    tba              tba
FORMULA 1, GERMANY (L)                07/31    7:50-10:00AM ESPN,TSN [1]
BUSCH GN, HICKORY (?)                 07/31    tba              tba
INDYCAR, BROOKLYN, MI (L)             07/31    12:00-3:30PM     ESPN [1]
ASA, TOPEKA (L)                       07/31    tba              TNN
NHRA, NATIONALS, SEARS POINT (?)      07/31    tba              tba
BUSCH GN, INDIANAPOLIS (?)            08/05    tba              tba
BRICKYARD 400 (L)                     08/06    12:00PM          ABC
NHRA, NATIONALS, KENT (?)             08/07    tba              tba

[1] CBC also carries all F1 and most IndyCar races (the Indy 500 & Long 
Beach will not be shown this year).  The races are usually broadcast on 
a 
tape-delayed basis at 11:37PM ET on the evening following the race.  I 
understand that it is not uncommon for CBC to delay the broadcast as 
much 
as an hour beyond the 11:37PM start, so please use extra caution if you 
plan to tape the race.  If you have access to it, and your French isn't 
too rusty, you may also want to check out RDS which used to broadcast 
each F1 race live. (I don't know for sure if they still do).  Thanks to 
Tak Ariga for info. on coverage in Canada.

* HTS (formerly Home Team Sports) is a regional sports network centered
in the Baltimore/Wash. DC area.  If you have a regional sports network,
please check their listings for these shows.  If they don't have them,
you may want to ask them why they don't.  Your times will almost
certainly vary from those shown with the probable exception of "This
Week In NASCAR".  On race weeks TWIN is usually broadcast live from a
 location somewhere near the track at 11:00PM (Eastern) on the Thursday 
before the race.  An interesting (IMO) show which usually includes a 
live 
audience, driver/guest, and viewer call-ins.  This show, as well as
many of the others, originate on the Prime Network.

Other possible cable sources for at least some of these shows;

    Network               Area                         Thanks to...

     ASN                Arizona                         Ben Loosli
     TSN                 Canada                       Tom Haapanen
     MSG                New York                    G. Bruce Rodgers
  SportSouth            Atlanta                      David Cornutt
    "    " (aka SPS) E. Tenn. & West NC                 Ken Key
  PrimeTicket         Southern CA                      Chuck Fry
    Empire              Buffalo
     NESN           Boston/N. England                 Trace Kangas
     KBL                Pittsburgh                   Mike Sturdevant
     PASS               Michigan                         Hartz
   Sunshine             Florida
     HSE                 Texas
     PSN           Minneapolis/St. Paul               Dean Barker
     PSN                Seattle                         Gary Eng
     PSN                Portland                       Mike Butts
  SportsChannel      San Francisco                     Chuck Fry
  SportsChannel (SC)    Chicago                      Jim Fuerstenberg

** MPT (Maryland Public TV) - "MotorWeek" is produced by MPT
and distributed to other public and commercial TV stations throughout
N. America.

-------

----------
Posted by: emory!oasys.dt.navy.mil!stoffel (Bill Stoffel)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 26 14:45:30 1994
Subject: Re: 5.0L Mustang performance improvements 87-93
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8622
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
X-Comment: Send subscription and drop requests to hotrod-request@dixie.com
X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

On May 25, 12:45am, The Hotrod List wrote:
} Subject: 5.0L Mustang performance improvements 87-93
> Does anyone have any economical (read 'cheap') suggestions to beef up
> performance on my '93 5.0L Mustang GT?  I have already removed the
> intake silencer and advanced the timing 2 degrees.  

 good set of headers with a matching exhaust system behind it.Mike


-- 
Mike Brattland(Brattlan@cyber.net) "Three Deuces and a 4 Speed" 
Insurance Auto Auctions, Spring Valley, California 800-322-8284   
E-MAIL me for Tech Info on Small and Big Block Ford Tri-Power Information! !

----------
Posted by: "Michael G. Brattland" 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 26 14:58:18 1994
Subject: Chevy 350 Questions
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8623
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
X-Comment: Send subscription and drop requests to hotrod-request@dixie.com
X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com


  I have a Chevy Target Master 350 long block that was bought around '89.
I am planning on installing this engine in my '72 240Z. As I live in CA, I
will have to meet CA engine swap laws.

  In a nutshell, this means:

	1) engine must be same year or newer than the car

	2) engine must retain all smog equipment used on that engine
	   for the year the engine was built

	3) Cat required only if car had one to begin with

  Numbers one and three are no problem. Number 2 is a problem. Since the 
engine I have is a factory "replacement" engine, and was never installed
in a vehicle, I get different answers from DMV. One guy will say that as
a replacement engine, it will take on the year of the car it is installed
in. For example, if you take a '89 Target Master 350 engine, and install
it in your '72 Camaro, DMV does not expect you to install the '89 smog
equipment.

  The next DMV guy will say that the engine year must be based on the year
is was built, but agrees on the example above for cars orig equipped with
that type engine.

  I plan on taking the "gee Mr. DMV Guy, I bought the engine from a
wrecked '72 Camaro", or 'Vette, whatever. Now for my questions.

	1) Is it possible to tell from the stamped and or cast numbers
	   on the block what year the engine was built?

	2) Can someone provide me with the OE part numbers for things
	   such as intake manifold, carb, exhaust manifold, air pump,
	   and any other smog related equipment used on '72 Camaros or
	   'Vettes.

	3) Does anyone have any practical experiance dealing with CA DMV
	   with regards to engine swaps?

  And yes, I do have the Datsun Z V8 conversion manual from JTR. Any and all
*helpfull* and or *funny* information greatly appreciated! Thanks in advance!

 
Conrad Frank			Conrad.Frank@Quotron.Com

----------
Posted by: emory!godzilla.Quotron.COM!conrad (Conrad Frank)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 26 15:12:09 1994
Subject: Re: Chevy Small Block and Starters
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8624
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
X-Comment: Send subscription and drop requests to hotrod-request@dixie.com
X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

Hello,

I just read your article and I had the same problem.  I have 66 Nova
with a 350 and a standard trans.. My dad finally figure it out by I
think putting in a starter from a 6 cylinder old pickup.????? Let me
know if you need more info and I can ask him how he did it and with
what starter he used.

Talk to later,

Mike

----------
Posted by: emory!oasys.dt.navy.mil!hernandm (miguel hernandez)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu May 26 17:10:36 1994
Subject: Re: 5.0L Mustang performance improvements 87-93
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8625
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
X-Comment: Send subscription and drop requests to hotrod-request@dixie.com
X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com


Ford sets up the computer to run approx. 10% rich from the factory as a safety 
precaution.  With a near-stock engine (like the one I proposed) it has been 
demonstrated that boring the Mass Air Sensor helps.  Due to customer complaints
regarding valve noise (read: warrantee costs) Ford decreased the ramp speeds of
the cam which quieted valvetrain somewhat but also decreased HP.  If you had
been following 5.0L performance testing since '87 you'll notice that they've 
slowed from low 14s to high14s.  This is due to the MASS Air 
restriction,  increased vehcile weight (air bags etc), and a softer 
cam.  It's another reason why the current Mustangs are rated 10hp less 
than the '87 & '88.  Seeing as how cost is a big factor with this 
gentleman, and nothing major (eg heads or intake) is planned by 
definition, I would not go to any of the motorsport cams as was 
suggested.  Your net horsepower-under-the =curve would be less although 
your peak may be higher.....maybe just add the 1.72 rockers and call it 
good.  As for cobra owners, their cam is even softer than the current 
production cam.  Class dismissed, Dirk...

[Additional comment about the previous post:  It is really bad advice to
recommend someone dump the cats on a current production car.  Doing
so may adversely affect the tuning, will make your car stink when I have
to sit behind it in a traffic jam and will cause much grief when emissions
inspections make it to the area.  With large, high performance cats
now available, any reasonable street performance is available while
preventing those nasty carbon monoxide headaches.  JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!eve579.eve.ford.com!jperry2 (Deputy Dawg)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 27 01:06:06 1994
Subject: Re: 5.0L Mustang performance improvements 87-93
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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>Ford sets up the computer to run approx. 10% rich from the factory as a safety 
>precaution.  With a near-stock engine (like the one I proposed) it has been 
>demonstrated that boring the Mass Air Sensor helps.  

That may or may not be true but recent magazine test and most responsible 
mustang specialty shops will admit that rather than changing the chip on a 
mustang equivalent performance can be found by increasing the fuel pressure 
(there is some debate on the mustang list whether this richens or leans the 
WOT mixture) and advancing the timing to 13deg (from a stock 10 deg BTDC.  
A recent post to the mustang list from an employee of Superchips - Peter 
something - suggest that an engine dyno showed peak performance with 
something like 3 deg extra at low rpm 2 deg in the mid range and another 3 
deg at the top end.  He did mention that leaning the mixture somewhat 
increase top end power.  SInce the EECIV is an adaptive computer I suspect 
that increasing the fuel pressure causes the EEC to compensate at low / 
part throttle rpms and then at high rpm the computer may actually run the 
car leaner - I really don't know what the effect would be.


>Due to customer complaints
>regarding valve noise (read: warrantee costs) Ford decreased the ramp speeds of
>the cam which quieted valvetrain somewhat but also decreased HP.  If you had
>been following 5.0L performance testing since '87 you'll notice that they've 
>slowed from low 14s to high14s.  This is due to the MASS Air 
>restriction,  increased vehcile weight (air bags etc), and a softer 
>cam.  It's another reason why the current Mustangs are rated 10hp less 
>than the '87 & '88.  

Actually it has been well documented that the "decrease" in rated 
horsepower from 215 to 205 for the standard H.O. 5.0 is due to a revised 
rating methode.  215hp is typical of one of the better engines commingg of 
the assebly line.  The average engine would rate at 205.  There were 
exactly zero change in going from one year to the next.  The only change on 
record is the '88 californian car change to MASS Air followed in '89 to all 
50 states having MASS Air.  I suspect this change to MASS air has more to 
with keeping emissions under control for longer periods - ie 100,000.  
Since MAF sensors don't require the same look-up tables as MAP engines - 
and engines do wear...

>As for cobra owners, their cam is even softer than the current 
>production cam.  Class dismissed, Dirk...

Who told you that?  Yes Cobras used softer suspension but were was it.
To maintain emission compliance in california you could do the intake + 
heads + cam + headers + 3.27 gears (and probably a few other things) and 
fall under the guise of a single EO number (see SVO catalog for details)

>[Additional comment about the previous post:  It is really bad advice to
>recommend someone dump the cats on a current production car.  Doing
>so may adversely affect the tuning, will make your car stink when I have
>to sit behind it in a traffic jam and will cause much grief when emissions
>inspections make it to the area.  With large, high performance cats
>now available, any reasonable street performance is available while
>preventing those nasty carbon monoxide headaches.  JGD]

Actually that was not the intent.  Texas turbo makes a complete exhaust kit 
with dual cats.  This includes full length headers.  Thrush also makes 
replacement cats - since they are replacement they do not need and EO 
number.  Unfortunately some states don't allow altering the number of cats 
on the car - mustangs have four.

As for the tune on the car - the EEC is actually and amazing computer.  
Through the oxygen sensor it will keep its tune at part-throttle and idle.  
It actually 'learns' the engine tune and stores the appropriate data.  For 
example - after installing flowmaster mufflers and advancing the timing to 
13 degress I started the car.  For about 1min the idle fluctuated between 
about 500 and 1000 rpm.  Then it settle down.  End result - it passed all 
emission test and had significantly more power beyond 4500rpm (seat of the 
pants measurement).  It also idles like new even with 60,000miles.  Add to 
that a great diagnostic mode that not only does key-on-engine-off testing 
and dumping of codes but it also does a key-on-engine-on testing of all 
actuators, testing for weak cylinder, and with you goosing the throttle it 
does a WOT test as well.

A tuneup consits of sparkplugs, timing, tps sensor, run self test...

About the only thing that could screw up the computer is a camshaft with 
too much duration - which would dilute the intake mixture at idle - which 
in turn would require an extra rich mixture at idle.  The factory claimed 
that the X-303, B-303, and E-303 should not effect emissions.  The peak 
power of the wildest of these cams is about 5500 - stock is about 4500.  At 
this point you start fighting the intake runner length (too long).

Before you comment further on the mustang may I suggest "Ford Fuel 
Injection & Electronic Engine Control" - available, among other places, 
from SVO.  Good book for general efi systems.  Doesn't quite go into 
detailed programing (too bad) but has alot of theory and some trouble 
shooting.  For the price its an absolute bargain.  

For performance advice consider Kenne Bell's Mustang tech tips - last 
release is October, 1989 - but good info for the mild build-up.  On the 
wild side there are many newer parts (read expensive) available on the 
market today.  There are also half-a-dozen rags dedicated to nothing but 
mustangs - just take their articles with a grain of salt.

For those interested in late model mustangs:
Contact Gary at
mustang-request@cup.hp.com

Given the nature of the mustang and the aftermarket world - there is 
someone on the list who has tried just about any modification.

Dirk

----------
Posted by: emory!STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV!OADDAB (DIRK BROER)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 27 01:21:51 1994
Subject: Re: xmission problems.
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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In alt.hotrod you write:

>did my prior message get thru on migs?  i am a novice at body work.
>how hard is it to use a mig?
>M.

greetings:
  i don't know if your previous message got thru or not, but i've been 
meening to do this for a while, so here goes...

  i picked up a hobart handler 120 (both wats and volts :) and it works
just fine.  sheet metal is a bit trickey, and i'm still working on getting 
it right, but thicker stuff has welded up fine.  i opted for the 120 cu
ft argon/co2 cyl. and the total cost (not the cheepest in town, but it's
run by honest, reputable people who stand behind their stuff (plus it is
on the drive home...)) was about $950.  (including 2 helmets, 11 lbs of
standard wire, , regulator, hose and tank (w/ gas))..

hope this helps,
kc

----------
Posted by: emory!io.com!kking (kenneth c king)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 27 11:47:04 1994
Subject: RE: 283 Chevy heads
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-> Careful, I think all pre 71 heads were 64cc heads.  Late model smog
-> motors use dished pistons and 58cc heads

 Eh?  Where did you get that idea?

 Some of the newest Chevy small blocks, like the LT1 and the older L98,
use 58cc heads.  The lesser motors and most earlier smog motors used
heads with chambers ranging from 68 to 78 cc.  Chevy also used lots of
72 and 74cc heads on lo-po 327 and 350 motors back in the '60s.  64cc
closed chamber heads are fairly rare, particularly the large valve 327
and 350 variety.
                                                 

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 27 11:54:00 1994
Subject: Re: heads for '89 chevy 350
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-> figured," heck why not the heads too".  But after calling a couple of
-> manufacturers, it looks like nobody makes an aftermarket head for the
-> late model 305.

 Brodix won't make you a set?  Just tell 'em not to drill the two center
holes on each head - you can spot drill and drill them using your late
intake manifold for a guide.
                                                                                                

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 27 11:59:42 1994
Subject: Re:  T200 transmissions
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-> Dave, you may have seen one of the terrible tiny T700s.  A very few
-> early S10 pickups and Blazers had a mini casing T700.  One of the BAD
-> ones.

 I knew the S10 had the T700, but I thought they had the 60 degree V6
weirdball bolt pattern?  As far as I know none of the 60 degree V6
engines had the standard Chevy V8/90 deg V6 pattern.

 The trans I saw had the regular Chevy pattern with the one-piece case
like a T200.


 BTW, I finally managed to pick up a T700.  It's an '86 model.  I gave
$100 for it, with the convertor.  Now to finish putting the rear end
back together so I can reclaim that bench space to gut the
transmission...  you remember that old AAmco TV commercial?  "Ah allus
won't'd tuh work own wun o'dem aw-toe-matic trans-missions..."
                                                           

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 27 12:04:31 1994
Subject: Re:  Questions On TH350 and TH400
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-> the junkyard.  The gasket for a T700R4 looks square with an
-> extra-thick section on the passenger-side front.

 The whole pan of the T700 is offset to the passenger side.  In the
Corvette the passenger-side floor pan has a sizeable hump in it to clear
the pan, TV cable, etc.
                    

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 27 17:38:41 1994
Subject: PAW address ?
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Does anyone have an address and/or phone number
for "Performance Automotive warehouse?"

Thanks in advance-  email is appriciated.

-Eric

PS:  I didn't find it in Dave Williams' contact list
-- 
     Burglary of occupied homes is rampant in London, according to
the April 19 Wall Street Journal because "intruders have little to
fear from unarmed residents."

----------
Posted by: emory!everest.Stanford.EDU!eap (Eric Perozziello)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri May 27 17:51:01 1994
Subject: Re: 5.0L Mustang performance improvements 87-93
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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>Actually it has been well documented that the "decrease" in rated 
>horsepower from 215 to 205 for the standard H.O. 5.0 is due to a revised 
>rating methode.  215hp is typical of one of the better engines commingg of 
>the assebly line.  The average engine would rate at 205.  There were 
>exactly zero change in going from one year to the next.  The only change on 
>record is the '88 californian car change to MASS Air followed in '89 to all 
>50 states having MASS Air.  I suspect this change to MASS air has more to 
>with keeping emissions under control for longer periods - ie 100,000.  
>Since MAF sensors don't require the same look-up tables as MAP engines - 
>and engines do wear...


Still wrong,  '87 & 88 mustangs were rated at 225 hp.  the '93 was rated at 205
 and the '94 is rated at 215 (electric radiator fan + minor intake changes 
from '93).  After talking with different folks here at Ford, including a 
chief-engineer level person from prowertrain, there indeed was a cam change.  
That coupled with the weight and extra inlet restriction of a mass air did 
indeed lower the ACTUAL performance of these vehicles.  If you don't believe me
just look at the 1/4 mile times from 1987-1988 as compared to today.  Trust me
on this one.

>>As for cobra owners, their cam is even softer than the current 
>>production cam.  Class dismissed, Dirk...

>Who told you that?  Yes Cobras used softer suspension but were was it.
>To maintain emission compliance in california you could do the intake + 
>heads + cam + headers + 3.27 gears (and probably a few other things) and 
>fall under the guise of a single EO number (see SVO catalog for details)

The people who designed it.  The bigger intake ports/head ports dropped idle
quality so they changed the cam again, but this time the advertised specs are
actually differ as well. 
 
>>[Additional comment about the previous post:  It is really bad advice to
>>recommend someone dump the cats on a current production car.  Doing
>>so may adversely affect the tuning, will make your car stink when I have
>>to sit behind it in a traffic jam and will cause much grief when emissions
>>inspections make it to the area.  With large, high performance cats
>>now available, any reasonable street performance is available while
>>preventing those nasty carbon monoxide headaches.  JGD]

Actually, Mass Air cars can easily adapt to the reduced exhaust back pressure.
Near stock speed-density cars can also function without cats because the open
loop strategy is set rich as I previously mentions.  As far as sniffer tests 
go, prior to heavily modifying my mustang recently, I passed every test I've 
taken both without cats or an air pump.  Of course, you should only delete 
these for offroad use.  Of course, you should only drive fast at the track so 
offroad shouldn't be an issue. 

[ You will NOT pass the 2nd generation dyno-based tests after you
remove your cats nor will you pass 1st generation tests in states like
Georgia which do a visual inspection in addition to sniffing your 
tail pipe.  Frankly, I'd have no sympathy at all if they toss you under
the jail for such stunts.  Removing cats was a reasonable thing to do in
the late 70s; it is not today.  That bozos continue doing so is all the
justification the EPA needs to force ever more stringent inspection 
requirements on us.  JGD]

>About the only thing that could screw up the computer is a camshaft with 
>too much duration - which would dilute the intake mixture at idle - which 
>in turn would require an extra rich mixture at idle.  The factory claimed 
>that the X-303, B-303, and E-303 should not effect emissions.  The peak 
>power of the wildest of these cams is about 5500 - stock is about 4500.  At 
>this point you start fighting the intake runner length (too long).

Only the E303 is emissions legal....

----------
Posted by: emory!eve579.eve.ford.com!jperry2 (Deputy Dawg)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat May 28 22:47:14 1994
Subject: Re: Chevy Small Block and Starters
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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In article , hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List) wrote:

> Hello,
> 
> I just read your article and I had the same problem.  I have 66 Nova
> with a 350 and a standard trans.



Apparently there are many different configurations for the starter housings
on these engines.  I had a problem going though starters on my truck until
I finally broke down and brought it in to a starter service to have them
custom match a housing to my application. The person who did the work said
my problem finding a starter that would work was due to a small machining
error on the block.  Just something to keep in mind. Good luck!

----------
Posted by: emory!mcnc.org!utxsvs!cc.utexas.edu (James Lukenbill)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat May 28 22:59:01 1994
Subject: Cylinder pressure sensors?
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Sorry if this is a repost, I can't remember if I asked this here before.

Does anyone make a pressure sensor rugged enough to live in the 
combustion chamber?  I seem to remember someone mentioning that
there was one that went on the spark plug or something...

thanks

--steve


Steve Ravet	sravet@bangate.compaq.com
"Baby you're a genius when it comes to cooking up some chili sauce...."

[Yes.  Kistler, Valedyne, Piezo, Endevco all make piezoelectric 
pressure transducers.  Kistler makes one built into a spark plug.
Better grab hold of that wallet and get ready for a ride though.
Several hundred bux a shot.  Then you need the external charge amp
which is more $$$.  Kistler advertises in most of the hotrod magazines
(Circle track and Stock Car Racing, for sure) and they all do in
"Sensors" and "Measurement & Controls" magazines, the latter being
the journal of the Instrument Society of America.

If you can sit tight for a couple of years, these things will be OEM
off-the-shelf items.  This is going to be the next big increment in
engine management sensor technology and several companies are on the 
verge of rolling out production engines with combustion chamber 
transducers.  

Incidentally, there was an interesting article in one of the SAE
pubs within the last year or so about using the spark plug gap
resistance to measure cylinder pressure.  Might want to look that one
up.  JGD]
----------
Posted by: emory!bangate.compaq.com!sravet
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat May 28 23:07:27 1994
Subject: RE: 283 Chevy heads
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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>
>-> Careful, I think all pre 71 heads were 64cc heads.  Late model smog
>-> motors use dished pistons and 58cc heads
>
> Eh?  Where did you get that idea?

Well, the only small block heads I've ever seen that were pre-69 (no 
accessory bolts on the head) were the double-hump kind which I always 
assumed were all 64cc.

The heads I have for my truck are "492" castings - with 1.96 Intake and 1.
60 exhaust (larger exhaust vavles where put in to improve breathing.  it is 
my understanding that these where the origional "Turbo" or "Bow Tie" heads 
and never came stock on any chevy.  These are supposidly still available 
and very popular with the circle track crouwd.  I think these are 64cc 
heads - combustion chamber volumes where supposidly matched.  Does anyone 
know anything different about these heads.  They are going to be used with 
Manely flat-top pistons (about the same as TRW flat tops) and I'm expecting, 
and worring about - close to 10:1 compression.  But maybe its not that high


From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat May 28 23:12:43 1994
Subject: Re: heads for '89 chevy 350
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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-> figured," heck why not the heads too".  But after calling a couple of
-> manufacturers, it looks like nobody makes an aftermarket head for the
-> late model 305.

Have you contacted Summit?  I think they carry the TFS heaads - there is 
supposidly a version for late model v-8's.

Dirk

----------
Posted by: emory!STDVAX.GSFC.NASA.GOV!OADDAB (DIRK BROER)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun May 29 16:21:20 1994
Subject: REQUEST FOR INFORMATION JAGUAR XJ/CHEVY TRANSPLANT
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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I'm looking for my next car and I want something a bit different this time.

I've seen adds in Hemmings for what looks like a fairly common conversion
of a chevy motor & trans in an XJ6 chassis.  Looking in the paper, I've
found a few, early model XJ's in "not running" condition (seems like a
frequent condition), body good, etc.  Likewise, many adds for "hi perf"
chevy small block engines.

So... sounds like a good match to me.  I've done most of my own
maintenance on my various cars, including some engine rebuilds, so I think
I am qualified to do the swap if it doesn't require more than bolting in
some adapter plates, hooking up wiring harnesses, etc.

If anyone's done a conversion like this I would sure appreciate your
responses and compile a summary for posting.

Questions:

Best year chassis for the XJ

Best year/displacement motor/transmission

Kits and suppliers

Installation process, what to watch for in components

Chassis modifications, cutting, fitting, etc.

Engine power/economy/reliability/emissions modifications.

Suspension modifications (springs, swaybars, shocks, wheels, etc.)

Weight, power, handling tradeoffs.

Pleasure or Pain?


Thanks in advance for your help.



----------
Posted by: emory!netcom.com!hjackson (Henry Jackson)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon May 30 19:58:41 1994
Subject: caddy performance
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Hey all,

Thanks for all the advice on the Caddy 500 motor and trans. Based on
your input, I'm changing how I go about this project. First and
foremost, since the 390 in the car now won't accept a modern tranny
easily, I'll have to swap out both the engine and tranny at the same
time.  Hopefully the tranny won't crap out on me while I'm getting it
all together.  To bad, I'll have to be nice to it for the next few
months, or longer.


So, I guess I'll start looking for a doner car with a decent 500 and
TH400 or TH475.  If I can a find a car w/ this configuration for a
reasonable amount of money, I'll probably stick with the tranny and
rebuild the engine.  Later I'll look into the 4 speed option.  If I
just get the engine, I'll rebuild it and look more indepth into all the
tranny options.



I'll be looking primarilly at 500 engines with the elictronic ignition.
 You get higher comression with the early 70's 500's, but I don't want
to spend the approx. $10 a valve seat I was quoted to install hardened
seats, and deal with also ripping of the elec. ignition from another
engine.  Although the ignition has to come off the doner engine anyway.
 I guess the ultimate decision will be made for me in terms of what
year I can find.  Any thoughts?


Anybody know about the TH700 tranny's B&M and Phoenix Transmission
products carry?  They start at around $1200. ( Or any other
manufacturer carries? )

They are supposed to be custom hi-po rebuilds.


gregg




----

Gregg Pitkin			Fidelity Investments
Systems Administrator		400 E. Las Colinas Blvd
gregg@fmrco.com			Irving TX, 75039
(214)830-7843

----------
Posted by: emory!fmrco.com!gregg (Gregg Pitkin)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 31 17:29:05 1994
Subject: Re: JAGUAR XJ/CHEVY TRANSPLANT
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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There is a publisher out of Livermore California called JTR which stands
for Jaguar's That Run. He sels a book on doing engine conversions for
Jaguar's. I only know this because he also sells one for S10's that is
pretty decent in covering any possible problems.

--
Dean Waters				E-Mail:  dwaters@interbase.borland.com
Systems Engineer
Borland International			Fax:     (408)431-4144
100 Borland Way
Scotts Valley, CA 95067			Phone:   (408)431-1917


----------
Posted by: Dean Waters 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 31 17:39:58 1994
Subject: Quadrajet parts
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
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Anybody know of a source for Qjet parts? I need a new baseplate since
the idle adjust needle valve snapped off inside the plate and I can't
get it out.

Thanks,
Mike

----------
Posted by: emory!geta.life.uiuc.edu!mrmike (Mike McCaughey)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 31 18:24:10 1994
Subject: Re: Quadrajet parts
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
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Mike McCaughey wrote:
>I need a new baseplate since
>the idle adjust needle valve snapped off inside the plate and I can't
>get it out.

It may be less trouble to get the broken piece out than to find
a replacement baseplate.  Try a hardware store that sells to machine
shops - they sell chemicals that will eat a broken tap without
touching the aluminum that the tap is stuck in.  It usually takes
about a day for the chemical to eat enough of the broken tap to
free it so I would guess that a day would loosen your broken needle
enough to allow it to be removed.

Bob Hale   hale@brooktree.com

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Posted by: emory!brooktree.com!hale (bob hale)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue May 31 23:32:43 1994
Subject: SLEEP CARS
From: hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
To: hotrod@dixie.com
X-Sequence: 8643
X-Archives: ece.rutgers.edu
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X-Comment: Send comments and trouble reports to jgd@dixie.com

HEllo, 

I'd like to see the specs from the owners of SLEEPER CARS on the net. 

-brad decker 



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Posted by: emory!lsil.com!brad (Brad Decker)