From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  1 01:28:22 1992
Subject: Re: turbocharger scavenge pump
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> You've almost got to have an air vent in the exhaust line.  All the
-> literature warns you about allowing the oil exhaust line from going
-> solid with oil. Among the other problems, the excess oil in the
-> bearing capsule can cause it to overheat or at the least reduce the
-> performance of the blower from the extra drag.

 The service manual for the XJ has about fifty pages of exploded views,
assembly drawings, drawings of every single part, and flow charts.
There's nothing that looks like a vent in the scavenge line - the
scavenge pump (which is below the crankcase oil level) pulls through a
port on the left side of the motor, which has a flex hose running back
to the turbo's oil outlet.

 We're not talking about a drainback line - the setup is designed to
work with a scavenge pump.  Unless I've missed your point again?  It's
been one of those weekends.
                                                     

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  1 03:49:53 1992
Subject: Re: turbocharger scavenge pump
To: hotrod@dixie.com

In wiz.hotrod you write:

> The service manual for the XJ has about fifty pages of exploded views,
>assembly drawings, drawings of every single part, and flow charts.
>There's nothing that looks like a vent in the scavenge line - the
>scavenge pump (which is below the crankcase oil level) pulls through a
>port on the left side of the motor, which has a flex hose running back
>to the turbo's oil outlet.

> We're not talking about a drainback line - the setup is designed to
>work with a scavenge pump.  Unless I've missed your point again?  It's
>been one of those weekends.

I'm reluctant to try to address this particular engine because I've
never worked on one but I've never seen a turbo designed to have a solid
(ie, no air return path) oil exhaust.  Not saying it can't be done.
Just that I've never seen it.  If the turbo is designed for a solid
return, more the better.  Unless you can come up with some kind of bypass
mechanism that probably won't work when you need it, a vent will still be 
the safest bypass to accomidate scavenge pump failure.  If the scavenge
pump really cannot tolerate air, a check valve (brake booster checkvalve,
for instance) would keep air out but let oil overflow if the pump
fails.

John
-- 
John De Armond, WD4OQC        |  To teach is to learn twice.
Rapid Deployment System, Inc. |  
Marietta, Ga                  |  Gun control is hitting the shootoff chickens
jgd@dixie.com                 | 
Need Usenet public Access in Atlanta?  Write Me for info on Dixie.com.

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  1 14:49:49 1992
Subject: Small Block Chevy Question
To: hotrod@dixie.com

While reassembling my 63' 327 (small journal crank) I used the wrong bolt
for the oil pump (too short) and stripped half of the threads out of the
rear main cap.  Has anyone out there ever --successfully or not-- drilled
out the bolt hole and tapped for a larger bolt?  Or does anyone have any
other CHEAP solutions?  I still have half the threads in the hole but I
dont trust it to hold under load (recommended torque is 60-70 lb/ft).

Thanks in advance for any help.

Damon van Dam

----------
Posted by: emory!eng.ufl.edu!dvd
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  1 16:25:03 1992
Subject: Re: Small Block Chevy Question 
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Heli-coil it! You can get long thread repair kits. Maybe take it to a 
good machine shop. 
ron

----------
Posted by: emory!tv.tv.tek.com!rons
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  1 16:48:14 1992
Subject: Re: Small Block Chevy Question
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> 
> While reassembling my 63' 327 (small journal crank) I used the wrong bolt
> for the oil pump (too short) and stripped half of the threads out of the
> rear main cap.  Has anyone out there ever --successfully or not-- drilled
> out the bolt hole and tapped for a larger bolt?  Or does anyone have any
> other CHEAP solutions?  I still have half the threads in the hole but I
> dont trust it to hold under load (recommended torque is 60-70 lb/ft).
> 
> Thanks in advance for any help.
> 
> Damon van Dam
> 
> ----------
> Posted by: emory!eng.ufl.edu!dvd
>  
> 
> 
You could try using a heli-coil.  I don't know how much torque those things
can stand, but it's worth looking into.  

Good luck!!!

-- 

     Greg Peckham  (stimey)        *******************************************
    Sequent Computer Systems Inc. *                                         *
   S40/S200                      *       No cute .signature here!          *
  1st floor, Deschutes          *                                         *
 Phone:  ext. 83022            *******************************************

----------
Posted by: Greg Peckham 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  1 17:24:16 1992
Subject: Re: Small Block Chevy Question
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>[tale of half-stripped bolt hole deleted]

	Why not drill and tap and install a stud so you never have this
problem again?  I did just that successfully--installed a stud into aluminum
with a threadlocker (in my case, muffler putty since the temp was going to be
too high for red Loctite).  Now I use a nut on the stud instead of worrying
about restripping the bolt hole.

My advice is probably worth what you paid for it,
Chris BeHanna		DoD# 114      1983 Harley-Davidson FXWG Wide Glide
behanna@syl.nj.nec.com	              1984 Dodge Omni GLH (well, almost)

Disclaimer:  Now why would NEC agree with any of this anyway?

----------
Posted by: emory!syl.nj.nec.com!behanna
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  1 17:25:15 1992
Subject: Small Block Chevy Question-NEVER MIND
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>Heli-coil it! You can get long thread repair kits. Maybe take it to a 
>good machine shop. 
>ron
>
I was told that Heli-coil would not stand up to any real torque by a couple
other back yard mechanics. After reading this post I called a machine shop
and found that H-c can hold well over 100 lb/ft.

Call me stupid, Ron :-) 
I withdraw my question before everyone else does :-)
Damon van Dam

----------
Posted by: emory!eng.ufl.edu!dvd
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  1 19:47:44 1992
Subject: Small Block Chevy Question
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> rear main cap.  Has anyone out there ever --successfully or not--
-> drilled out the bolt hole and tapped for a larger bolt?  Or does
-> anyone have any other CHEAP solutions?  I still have half the threads
-> in the hole

 You have a 3/8 bolt, right?  The next size up is 7/16, which might
require modifying the pump too.

 Most references call for 1.5 times the bolt diameter.  If you have half
an inch or so of thread left, use an oil pump stud, torque it correctly
(loctite wouldn't hurt) and don't worry about it.
                         

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  1 23:50:53 1992
Subject: Head bolts
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Ok guys, time to take some abuse.

I've got a problem with the old big block chevy. At first I thought it was
a fluke. While doing some routine plug checking after a jet change, I noticed
that one of my head bolts was MISSING! Nice shiny spot where it used to be.
Hmmm. So I built a drill guide and center drilled it and easy-outed it. The 
thing broke through the threads near the shank. I hoped it was a bad bolt.
Stock Chevy stuff, probably been through four or five head removals. This three months after I assembled the engine. No biggie huh, put in a new bolt
and on down the road. Yeah right.
So I'm working on the thing the other day and I noticed a little coolant
leaking from around a head bolt on the other side of the engine. You guessed
it. Another broken bolt!!! Same as the other one. 
I'm a bit lost. The car is running hot and the radaitor gets quite foamy.
Compression is within a few pounds cyl to cyl. Plugs look fine. Doesn't
really point to a haed gasket problem. No water in the oil. The radiator
stays full. 
I'm going to flush it tonight and refill with pure water and try running
it cold w/o the thermostat and with the water pump stopped so I can see
if compsession pressure is somehow getting into the cooling system . Foam 
doesn't cool worth s..t!
I hate to have to pull the heads! But new bolts are a must. Will have my
torque wrench checked too.
Heads and block were milled by a good shop. The gaskets are Fel Pro blue
and torque spec was 75 ft/lbs.
HELP!!! Any ideas what might be happening here? I've never even heard
of this before and neither has anyone else who's opinion I respect.
I'm glad it wasn't my rod bolts..(as I have another piece of humble pie)
RON

----------
Posted by: emory!tv.tv.tek.com!rons
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 09:49:42 1992
Subject: Re:  Head bolts
To: hotrod@dixie.com

 Since a pattern seems to be developing here, I guess it would make sense to
buy a set of new head bolts (probably factory high-perf for one of the high
compression 'Vette engines or some high strength aftermarket ones) and just
go around replacing them in the recommended order. If you're lucky you can 
do it without breaking seal on the gasket. OTOH maybe since seal has already
been broken in spots you should replace the head gasket too. 

----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 09:51:15 1992
Subject: Street Rod Book
To: hotrod@dixie.com


Back in 1988, a company called Budget Rods from Naples, Florida ran an 
advertisement in "Rod Action" magazine for a how-to book. The book was
titled, "How to Build a T-Bucket Roadster for Under $3000" (nice trick!).
It sold for $19.95.

The company is apparently out of business (anyone know differently?) but
I would like to find a copy of that book. If anyone has a copy to sell or
swap please Email.  I have street rod video to swap.  Thanks.  

Dave Tartaglia    indy@immacc.prepnet.com             === ZZ-|O\- .. _   
Motorsport Video  (800)648-1004  free catalog           =(_)-=======(_)===

----------
Posted by: Dave Tartaglia 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 12:48:38 1992
Subject: Re: Trans shift kit for Chevy TH350
To: hotrod@dixie.com


OK fellow hot-rodders, I bought my self a project car (van) last week
end and now I have a new black hole to sink my money into. Its a '74
Chevy shorty van with a 350, 4 barrel, 350TH, 12 bolt 3.31:1? rear. I
plan to use this as just a toy for camping/river trips/drag strip
trips/what ever. Although it runs real strong now (20k miles on rebuilt
motor) I plan to add headers and my Edelbrock performer manifold and a
shit opps I mean shift kit to the trans, this is where my first
question comes. I've used B+M shift kits in the past but I thought I'd
hit you guys up on your experience with other brands of kits. The kit I
want to use is the three stage kit to be set up for street/strip shift
level. My question, is the kit made by TCI comparable  to the B+M kit
although it is cheaper? Also does anyone have experience with the shift
improver kits that just change the separator plate and ??? Do these
improve the shift noticeably or are they a waist of time? BTW if it makes
a difference I plan to retain the stock converter and cam shaft so I'm
not looking to build something that will roast tires to the rims
although it already can abuse them with no effort at all. On another
note, any one have some suggestions of ways that I can get this land
barge to go around corners without scraping the door handles? I've
already installed gas magnum shocks on all four corners and am going to
install urithane (sp?) bushings on the sway bar. Is there anything else I can
do without a major investment, did chevy put larger say bars on some of
these beasts? mine is kinda whimpy. Thats enough for now, thanks for
your input!
 ______________________________________________________________________
|           _______________       OLD CHEVYS NEVER DIE... THEY JUST GO |
|         /                 \          F A S T E R !!                  |
|     __/_____________________\__    OLD JAPANESE CARS NEVER DIE...    |
|    '--:---------------------:--`    THEY TURN BACK INTO BEER CANS!!  |
|   / (_)(_)    _______    (_)(_) \                                    |
|  '===========|_______|===========`  MARK JENSEN     (503) 627-3115   |
|  \_______________________________/  TEKTRONIX METROLOGY LAB.         |
|  |\___/O-O\_____________/O-O\___/|  BEAVERTON OREGON   MS. 39-732    |
|  |       |     `---'     |       |      markj@tekig5.pen.tek.com     |
|__|_______|_______________|_______|___________________________________|

----------
Posted by: emory!tekig5.pen.tek.com!markj
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 14:48:27 1992
Subject: Re: Trans shift kit for Chevy TH350
To: hotrod@dixie.com

 I'd upgrade the sways (beef up front, add rear) right off. My van wallows
like a manatee too. Also think about shorter rubber. The center of gravity iss
too high for good cornering but it can be improved. 

 I haven't seen a need for a shift kit with my TH375; it seems quite firm. A
looser converter might help off the line but my gas mileage already sucks.
Personally, I think putting much performance stuff on a van is a waste of bux.
It's too fat, tall and heavy to ever be a thrill ride (unless you count two-
wheeling it around the corners). Save the money for your hot rod..

----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 14:54:07 1992
Subject: Re: Street Rod Book
To: hotrod@dixie.com

I remember seeing the ads but am sorry to say I don't have a copy, but
in typical net fashion, have a couple of suggestions that may help.
Give a call to CLASSIC MOTORBOOKS in Mn(they have an 800 number.  if you 
don't have it e-mail me and I will check my library) as they may have 
purchased copies and may still have them for sale.  If you are a member 
of NSRA and have little time to wait, put a ad(free mind you) in STREET
SCENE and I am sure that you may come up with a copy.
 If you are looking for info on T-Buckets then there is a lot of other
generic info out there which can help.  California Custom Roadsters(CCR)
in Orange Ca has marketed a complete set of blueprint plans with materials
list for their longtime T-Bucket chassis which I am familiar with.  I used
various ideas from their plans when I built my own T Roadster.
 Total Performance sells a complete assembly book with diagrams and procedures
for assembling their T-Bucket kits which is high quality.  When ever you 
buy any of their products, they usually come with the accompaning plan/
blueprint from their assembly book.  It may be of service to you.
Frank Oddo the Technical editor of STREET RODDER MAGAZINE is the author 
of an excellent publication titled HOW TO BUILD A STREET ROD which gives
a person a lot of information that would take any individual years to
learn otherwise.  Complimenting this book, is HOW TO BUILD REAL HOT
RODS by Leroi Tex Smith which is also readily available.  This book is 
super and well worth a small investment for anyone who likes to modify
cars.  I built one from scratch using a lot of different components on 
the market and bits and pieces I made myself so I am also only to glad
to share information with others.  If you have any particular questions
e-mail or ask on the net.  Nothing is more fun than to talk Hot Rods
and what and how to build them.  I have a 23 Ford which is pretty much
all Ford running a pumped 302, with factory Tri power, toploader 4spd 
with a disc brake nine inch. Because mine is a 4spd I was on my own as 
most Hot Rods these days run"turbo 350's", so info is non existent when
you want to do something different.  Networking with a local club or 
this mailing list is a good deal.  Hope this helps.
Mike Brattland  Brattlan@NPRDC.NAVY.MIL 

----------
Posted by: emory!nprdc.navy.mil!brattlan (CDR Michael Brattland)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 15:01:08 1992
Subject: Re: More questions on my '74 Chevy van, headers this time.
To: hotrod@dixie.com


Back again with the chevy van. I'm looking for headers for it and with
the multiple number of brands on the market its hard to tell what to
choose. I'm considering some Eagle headers that have a life time
guarente (sure, the life of the header). These are not the alumi coated
type but rather the 'el budget type for about 70 bucks. So what I want
to know is what brands should I stay away from because of poor workman
ship or they just fall apart, and what ones have you had good luck
with. I've used Edelbrocks, headmans, and black jacks in the past. I'll
never buy another Black-jack header as long as I live, they where so
poorly made that they would hardly bolt in my '70 Camaro! Thanks for the
input!
 ______________________________________________________________________
|           _______________       OLD CHEVYS NEVER DIE... THEY JUST GO |
|         /                 \          F A S T E R !!                  |
|     __/_____________________\__    OLD JAPANESE CARS NEVER DIE...    |
|    '--:---------------------:--`    THEY TURN BACK INTO BEER CANS!!  |
|   / (_)(_)    _______    (_)(_) \                                    |
|  '===========|_______|===========`  MARK JENSEN     (503) 627-3115   |
|  \_______________________________/  TEKTRONIX METROLOGY LAB.         |
|  |\___/O-O\_____________/O-O\___/|  BEAVERTON OREGON   MS. 39-732    |
|  |       |     `---'     |       |      markj@tekig5.pen.tek.com     |
|__|_______|_______________|_______|___________________________________|

----------
Posted by: emory!tekig5.pen.tek.com!markj
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 15:07:47 1992
Subject: Re: Street Rod Book
To: hotrod@dixie.com

I remember seeing the ads but am sorry to say I don't have a copy, but
in typical net fashion, have a couple of suggestions that may help.
Give a call to CLASSIC MOTORBOOKS in Mn(they have an 800 number.  if you 
don't have it e-mail me and I will check my library) as they may have 
purchased copies and may still have them for sale.  If you are a member 
of NSRA and have little time to wait, put a ad(free mind you) in STREET
SCENE and I am sure that you may come up with a copy.
 If you are looking for info on T-Buckets then there is a lot of other
generic info out there which can help.  California Custom Roadsters(CCR)
in Orange Ca has marketed a complete set of blueprint plans with materials
list for their longtime T-Bucket chassis which I am familiar with.  I used
various ideas from their plans when I built my own T Roadster.
 Total Performance sells a complete assembly book with diagrams and procedures
for assembling their T-Bucket kits which is high quality.  When ever you 
buy any of their products, they usually come with the accompaning plan/
blueprint from their assembly book.  It may be of service to you.
Frank Oddo the Technical editor of STREET RODDER MAGAZINE is the author 
of an excellent publication titled HOW TO BUILD A STREET ROD which gives
a person a lot of information that would take any individual years to
learn otherwise.  Complimenting this book, is HOW TO BUILD REAL HOT
RODS by Leroi Tex Smith which is also readily available.  This book is 
super and well worth a small investment for anyone who likes to modify
cars.  I built one from scratch using a lot of different components on 
the market and bits and pieces I made myself so I am also only to glad
to share information with others.  If you have any particular questions
e-mail or ask on the net.  Nothing is more fun than to talk Hot Rods
and what and how to build them.  I have a 23 Ford which is pretty much
all Ford running a pumped 302, with factory Tri power, toploader 4spd 
with a disc brake nine inch. Because mine is a 4spd I was on my own as 
most Hot Rods these days run"turbo 350's", so info is non existent when
you want to do something different.  Networking with a local club or 
this mailing list is a good deal.  Hope this helps.
Mike Brattland  Brattlan@NPRDC.NAVY.MIL 

----------
Posted by: emory!nprdc.navy.mil!brattlan (CDR Michael Brattland)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 15:48:33 1992
Subject: Re: More questions on my '74 Chevy van, headers this time.
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Be sure you get headers which say they're for a van. My van has about 1"
clearance between the stock manifold and the doghouse lip. The engine is
a fairly tight fit and snugged against the passenger side frame rail. A
generic Chevelle pair of headers may not work out as planned.

I just dualed mine out and forewent the headers, as I hardly ever get above
3000RPM anyhow. I think your TH350 will need its governor adjusted to let
you get much above 4000 without shifting up.

----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 16:49:12 1992
Subject: Re: Street Rod Book
To: hotrod@dixie.com


Michael:
Thanks for the detailed reply.  I am familiar with all the titles you
mentioned. (I read ALOT! My office looks like a car-book dumpster...)

I just sold my 58 Chevy Kustom in February, and now I am looking for
a new project.  I've done a Kustom, maybe now a rod.

The reason I was particularly interested in that title
was because it leaned heavily on Junkyard Parts. I like the idea of 
finding a junkyard item which looks just right, instead of the same thing
everyone else has through the catalogs. Not that I am knocking catalog
merchandise, it is great and so are the people who sell it!

Actually T-Buckets are hard to register in Pennsylvania. PA requires
fenders front and rear, bumpers the same, hood over the top of the engine,
certain height windshield (although *NO* windshield  *IS* acceptable!) etc.
etc.

What I have been kicking around for a while is a street rod based on a
mini-truck chassis. You have probably seen some of the custom mini-trucks
with their tops removed. I saw one and was struck by how similar the pro-
portions were to Model A roadster pickups. (I have been a fan of roadster
PUs since the May '63 issue of Rod&Custom which featured two!)

Then I started thinking. And crawling under every mini-pickup I could find
to examine the chassis for possibilities.  Most of them have a chassis very
similar in size to many 30s cars. And independent front suspension. And
disk brakes. And 12 volt electrics. And very tuneable 4 and 6 cylinder engines
with room for bigger things later on! You get the picture.

The best part is that they are cheap, used. I could build it into a street
rod a little at a time, but still keep it on the road more-or-less during
construction. For example, yank the bed and replace it with a simple flat-
bed or box and cycle type fenders. (One-two day job?) Yank the front clip
and replace with cycle fenders, pedestal mounted headlights, and a track-nose.
The hardest part would be replacing the cab, but it shouldn't be any harder
than doing it on a traditional rod. Maybe just whack off the top with a
conversion kit and leave it at that. Cheap and cheerful.

Am I Nuts?
Regards, 
Dave
--
Dave Tartaglia    indy@immacc.prepnet.com             === ZZ-|O\- .. _   
Motorsport Video  (800)648-1004  free catalog           =(_)-=======(_)===

----------
Posted by: Dave Tartaglia 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 16:54:49 1992
Subject: Re: More questions on my '74 Chevy van, headers this time.
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Headers for a van:  Well, I've had excellent luck with Cyclone headers
(they are identical to Blackjacks, made by the same guys and all) in a van
with a 350.  Left me lots of room to work around the starter, plugs, etc,
and they never leaked, broked, rusted out, etc. in the 3 1/2 years I had
them running.  Actually, I still see the van once in a while (sold it to a 
friend of mine), and the same headers are still on it running great. 

I've got Heddmann headers wrapped with Thermotec Header Wrap in my Z right
now, and they fit no problem, and have a lifetime guarantee against defects
(like breaking welds, I can't remember if that holds for rusting out as well)
and they are a little better built than the Cyclones, but about $20 more.

For anyone out there putting in headers who cares about under-hood temps and
things like starters heating up, burning plug wires, fingers, etc. I strongly
recommend the header wraps.  They have reduced my under-hood temps dramatically
and the car runs at a much more even temperature, 180 degress whether it is
35 out or 95 out.  Only time it hits 200-220 is cruising on a 95 degree day
down the highway at about 4000 rpm.  Also, some people think the header wraps
will cause the headers to rust out quicker because they hold the heat in more,
but in my experience they actually help the header last longer, as paint 
usually flakes off, and after checking a pair of headers that have been used
with wraps for a while, they were still in excellent shape.  Also, by keeping
more heat in the exhaust, you help the scavaging effect on the cylinders which
builds a little more hp (supposedly, although I noticed an improvement when
I put mine on so I believe it.)

Your mileage may vary.

-- Steve

----------
Posted by: emory!gte.com!stm0 (Steven McClure)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 17:49:57 1992
Subject: Re: Re: Street Rod Book
To: hotrod@dixie.com

No I don't think so.  In fact ,even if you found that book I doubt
that it could offer anything over what you have already thought out.
With regard to registering, buying a title is the way to solve that
problem.  I bought one from Walcott in 87 when I was living in Virginia 
which made my project a piece of cake and trouble free, especially
since I am a California resident.  Good luck with your project.
Mike Brattland

----------
Posted by: emory!nprdc.navy.mil!brattlan (CDR Michael Brattland)
 



From z-car@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 21:24:25 1992
Subject: Shortened Springs
To: z-car@dixie.com

    Date: Fri, 29 May 1992 09:42 EDT
    From: mikef%rosevax.rosemount.com@mathcs.emory.edu (Michael Foerster)

	... Driving it was a real thrill.  It has shortened springs
	    that lower it about and inch and it corners like a go cart....

	    What else is required to replace the springs inorder to keep the
	    front and rear suspension geometry in line?  

	    Mikef

Hmm, no replies.  Well, since I'm interested too, I'll jump in [This
mod's on my wish list ... I guess yall are getting bored with my
wish-list :<]  Warning: This is all theory!

Lowering the car by shortenning the springs in mcpherson/chapman strut
suspension is (statically speaking) the same as pushing the car down an
inch.  The transverse link points up (towards the outside) and the
strut is tilted more towards the inside.  It has the effect of changing
the camber and lowering the roll center.   

  According to my primitive calculations, lowering by an inch should
increase the camber by 1/2 degree.    The trig for the roll center is a
bit messier, and I have to get some more real dimensions to figure it
out.   [I also find that at about 2" travel the camber turns around at
2 degrees and starts decreasing again. Seems like it'd be weird driving
on bumpy roads? ]

You can get adjustment bushings for the tops of the struts (?); they're
drilled off center, so by rotating them, you move the top of the strut
in or out.   Moving the top of the strut ~ 1/4" out puts it pretty much
back at its original angle so it fixes the camber.  The transverse link
is still tipped, so the roll center is still low (but perhaps not quite
as much). 

[I haven't yet studied Puhn enough (or my car, for that matter!) to
fully appreciate the significance of roll center.  Apparently it should
be low, but not below the road]

In the Jim Cook catalog, they ominously say that lowering the car "can"
even leave the roll-center below the road.  And they're happy to sell
you the fix: a spacer that (apparently) mounts between the transverse
link and the ball jount to put the link back horizontal, thus putting
the roll center back.  [it's not clear if this piece affects the camber]

Well, that's what can happen and what you can do about it -- in
principle.  But, why not get back to the real world!  Lowering, spring
rates, camber, roll center, (tires, sway bars, ....) all affect the feel
and handling of the car.  What, besides the springs,  did you friend do
to get that "on a rail" feeling?  He may have left the camber & roll
center as they came out! Or it may be that sway bars are doing more for
the feel than the lowering did. Or...

bruce
miller@cam.nist.gov


From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  2 21:30:00 1992
Subject: New subscriber
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Hi, I'm new to this list, and I have a question.  I would like to replace
the small block 400 in my Chevrolet Caprice with a TPI 350.  I've been
calling some junk yards looking for the motor.  One told me that the motor
wouldn't bolt up to a THM350, and you have to bolt it up to a THM700R4.
My question: Is this a true statement?  Is there any other way I can get
the TPI 350 into my car without doing a tranny swap as well?

Dave Nieters
University of Minnesota
daven@vx.acs.umn.edu

----------
Posted by: David Nieters 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun  3 10:52:06 1992
Subject: Re: Re: Street Rod Book
To: hotrod@dixie.com


> With regard to registering, buying a title is the way to solve that
> problem.  I bought one from Walcott in 87 when I was living in Virginia 
> Mike Brattland
> 
I wrote "registering" when I meant "getting it inspected." It is easy enough
to get it registered, as you said. But then it has to pass PA state inspect-
tion, one of the most difficult in the country, so I am told. It is the PA
motor vehicle code which requires the bumpers, fenders etc. even on street rods.

It occurred to me that if the car could be registered  and plated in another 
state that might solve the problem. (or is that what you did?) A car must
conform to the rules of the state it is registered in.  Suppose I registered
the car in say, Utah which has low registration fees. The car would never
actually be in Utah. The Pennsylvania inspection laws would not then apply
to that vehicle. 

I am sure that PA has a law which requires the car to be registered here if 
I live here. (They don't want to lose revenue!) When I moved here from 
New York, my NY driver's license was confiscated when I received my PA license!

Does anyone know of any states which don't require residence to register a car?

--
Dave Tartaglia    indy@immacc.prepnet.com             === ZZ-|O\- .. _   
Motorsport Video  (800)648-1004  free catalog           =(_)-=======(_)===

----------
Posted by: Dave Tartaglia 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun  3 14:37:25 1992
Subject: 350 vs auto tranny 
To: hotrod@dixie.com


Hi, I'm new to this list, and I have a question.  I would like to replace
the small block 400 in my Chevrolet Caprice with a TPI 350.  I've been
calling some junk yards looking for the motor.  One told me that the motor
wouldn't bolt up to a THM350, and you have to bolt it up to a THM700R4.
My question: Is this a true statement?  Is there any other way I can get
the TPI 350 into my car without doing a tranny swap as well?

Dave Nieters
University of Minnesota
daven@vx.acs.umn.edu

----------
Posted by: David Nieters 

Dave,

It will bolt up.  My understanding is that the tranny crossmember is
different for the 2 but aftermarket companies sell them for Camaro/
Firebird line but I'm not sure about a Caprice.  In addition, the 
lengths of the 700R4 and the TH350 are different which means the
driveshaft will have to be shortened or an aftermarket yoke set 
might do it.  Choo-Choo Customs puts the 350TPI in a truck, so I
would bet it is possible to put one in a Caprice.

Mark
Internet: mjpoll@bb1t.monsanto.com

----------
Posted by: emory!bb1t.monsanto.com!mjpoll
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun  3 15:48:36 1992
Subject: Re: 350THM with 350 TPI
To: hotrod@dixie.com


Retain the flex plate from the origional setup (the 350THM trans)
The TC may have differnt bolt circle diameter. I think they
used to be pretty standard, but I'm not sure about the TC on 
the 700R (with lockup converters and all) they may have changed
a lot.

-Eric

----------
Posted by: emory!leland.stanford.edu!eap
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun  3 22:30:13 1992
Subject: Re: turbocharger scavenge pump
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> return, more the better.  Unless you can come up with some kind of
-> bypass mechanism that probably won't work when you need it, a vent
-> will still be the safest bypass to accomidate scavenge pump failure.
-> If the scavenge pump really cannot tolerate air, a check valve (brake
-> booster checkvalve, for instance) would keep air out but let oil
-> overflow if the pump fails.

 Looks like my best solution would be to find a pump that doesn't
obstruct if it doesn't pump.  Lessee... there're rotary and diaphragm
pumps, maybe a diaphragm would work... uh... viscosity might be a
problem.  Dang.  I guess I'll just have to hook a pump to ye olde
battery charger, stick the hoses in a quart of oil, and let it run a few
days.

 The XJ's Hitachi turbo mounts *under* the oil pan, and the scavenge
pump's outlet is (if I read the diagram right) below the oil level as
well.  Evidently there's no trouble with dumping the frothed oil back
into the sump, or the scavenge pump helps work the bubbles our, or
something.
                                   

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun  4 16:24:35 1992
Subject: RE: Water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Concerning water injecting the port FI turbo motor, what kind on engine is it?
An engineer that used to work for Buick and worked on the development of the
Grand National engine told me that that engine was originally meant to be 
alcohol injected with the turbo. In fact some of the early turbos for that
car still had the bosses in the turbo housing for the injector. What they
found was that there were two main problems. The first of which was how to
ensure that the vehicle operator maintained the alcohol level, but the one
that killed the project was that they noticed that engine life was greatly
reduced. This was caused by the alcohol washing the oil off the cylinder walls.
But he did say that when it worked, it really produced power!
I don't think I really answered your question, but its something to think
about.

Ron

----------
Posted by: emory!SKYLER.MAVD.HONEYWELL.COM!MELLUM
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun  4 23:53:31 1992
Subject: Re: Water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>
>Just joined the list a few days ago, and this is my first post here...
>T'was wondering, has enyone ever tinkered with water injection, 
>particularly on a port injected turbo motor? 

Little bit here and there. :-)

>I'm trying to track down
>data on what the percentage of water should be to fuel volume. Are
>there some rough guidelines? 

There really are none because the application varies so much.  If 
your engine is just on the edge of detonation without WI or if 
you simply want to lean the mix a bit for economy, a fine mist
is appropriate.  If you're going for an outer limit engine
as I've been known to do, it may require as much water as gas.
This is strictly a parameter you have to determine experimentally.
It is much better done if you have a chassis dyno but it can be
done on the road.  A knock indicator is very valuable.

>Does water injection have an impact on
>the fuel-air ratio needed to promote maximum power and safe combustion
>temps. I'm guessing that you might be able to run a tad leaner at high
>power because the water is providing some of the cooling effect that
>a richer than stoch mixture normally does. Is this reasonable? 

Actually you can run a lot leaner.  You can bring the mixture back
to near stoch and use the water for cooling.

>Water injection sounds like a good idea to me for two reasons.
>1) Enhanced charge cooling and detonation resistance
>2) It keeps the combustion chamber and in/outlet ports free of
>flow disrupting carbon deposits.

Yup.

>There must be some drawbacks to water injection (besides the havoc that
>would result if you let it run out). What are they ???

There are no operational drawbacks but there are some logistical 
problems.  I've seen reports that WI shortens engine life but I have
a few engines to prove the counterpoint.  I've put over 60k miles on
a 25 psi boost Datsun turbomotor.  The logistical problems include
having to remember to fill the tank, locating the tank somewhere in
the car, freezing in the winter and if you use methanol in the water,
the cost.

>It seems that an electronic injection would be fairly easily adapted
>to a water injection setup. I was thinking of simply using an injector
>pulse to (indirectly) drive another injector selenoid to squirt water
>directly into the intake, immediately after the throttle body. The 
>tricky part would be finding a way to provide a pressurized water 
>source. Maybe compressed air over water? 

Normal fuel injectors rust in the presence of water in milliseconds.
This is the voice of experience talking.  The simplest arrangement is
to simply pressurize the water container with boost pressure and 
pipe the water to the intake upstream of the compressor.  This setup
provides a proportional flow.  Some means of holding the flow off 
until a minimum boost is reached is required.  I've used a valve 
originally used in the de-icing system of the B-29 but they're 
no longer available (no shit!)  This valve is very simple and could
be duplicated easily.  It was a simple right angle plug valve but
with a spring between the stem and the plug.  The flow goes so that
the pressure lifts the plug against the spring pressure.  
Another option is a simple pressure switch and a solonoid valve.  
In any event, a typical cutin pressure is around 5 psi.  I thread
the B-29 valve to accept a holly carb jet that sets the injection
flow.

I've experimented with a number of exotic injection schemes and the only
thing I've found that improves this setup is to hook the solonoid valve
up to a circuit that reads a knock sensor to provide the injection gate.

The worst problem you'll face is keeping the engine clean.  I lost
an engine at 160 mph one day because of a flek of rust that found its
way through the filter and stopped up the Holly jet.  Instant piston
kit.

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun  5 00:56:09 1992
Subject: Re: Water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> T'was wondering, has enyone ever tinkered with water injection, 
> particularly on a port injected turbo motor? I'm trying to track down
> data on what the percentage of water should be to fuel volume. Are
> there some rough guidelines? Does water injection have an impact on
> the fuel-air ratio needed to promote maximum power and safe combustion
> temps. I'm guessing that you might be able to run a tad leaner at high
> power because the water is providing some of the cooling effect that
> a richer than stoch mixture normally does. Is this reasonable? 
> Water injection sounds like a good idea to me for two reasons.
> 1) Enhanced charge cooling and detonation resistance
> 2) It keeps the combustion chamber and in/outlet ports free of
> flow disrupting carbon deposits.
> 

This is also my first post to this list ... I own an 87 Grand National and
I have looked at this possibility also.  If the engine has an intercooler,
there really isn't all that much benefit to the injection of water.  The
only real use would be to inject the water (or a mixture of water and
alcohol) when the car is under high boost with inadequate octane to support
the boost levels.  Otherwise, the intercooler is doing the same thing without
messy fluids being injected.  Also, in my case, the injection would have to
occur after the Mass Air Flow (MAF) sensor, thus screwing up the A/F ratio
a bit, probably making the ECM run the injectors richer.

> There must be some drawbacks to water injection (besides the havoc that
> would result if you let it run out). What are they ???
> 

If you use anything other than distilled MINERAL FREE water (not "purified"
water, since it still contains minerals), you end up with scale and mineral
deposits left on everything the water evaporates off of.  Also, if any of the
intake runners have a place where water may pool, you could end up with
rust in some hard to see places! I would be most worried about this after
shutdown, which could allow condensation inside the intake or around the
valves.  I'd also be careful with my plumbing, since it would be possible
to have a siphon condition after shutoff that would cause dripping 
from the injection nozzle, even with the system off.  This could cause the
puddling and attendant problems.

> It seems that an electronic injection would be fairly easily adapted
> to a water injection setup. I was thinking of simply using an injector
> pulse to (indirectly) drive another injector selenoid to squirt water
> directly into the intake, immediately after the throttle body. The 
> tricky part would be finding a way to provide a pressurized water 
> source. Maybe compressed air over water? 
> I hope that this doesn't sound too silly :-)
> 
> Greg
> jsb@ecl.psu.edu

Again, I would only use the injection under extreme conditions, not all the
time.  A Nitrous fogger nozzle or similar device with an electric pump to
provide pressure would be all you need.  The pump only needs to supply
3-7 psi, since that's all that carbed cars with NOS usually run for fuel
pressure.  The water line would be connected to the fuel jet, with the NOS
inlet blocked off.  You'd probably need a pretty big reservoir for the water.
BTW, there was an article in Muscle Cars mag. that showed the mid-60's
Oldsmobile that had a Turbo on a V8 and had "Power Injection" (or some such
advertising nonsense) which put "power fluid" into the intake under boost.
If I remember right, the "power fluid" was basically water and alcohol.
I thought this was cool, in a silly kind of way! ;-)  Also, I think I've
 seen something like this in J.C Whitney
catalogs ... (Didn't pay much attention to it, so you may want to see if they
have a set up).

However, IMHO, I don't think that any of this is really worth the time and
trouble.  If the original turbo and intake system were properly designed,
the water injection would probably be a real pain to get tuned.  You 
probably would have a hard time discerning any difference between water
injection being on or off.  You'd get better results by running adequate
octane for the boost levels (i.e. 92 or better for the street, I prefer
100 octane Unleaded and CAM2 blue (114) for the track) and increasing
intercooler efficiency (if possible).  My car is basically stock, as far as
engine internals go, but has quite a few bolt ons and tuning tricks.  With
these, I have been able to run a best of 12.26 @ 109 mph in the 1/4 and
11.95 @ 115 with Nitrous.  Bottom line, again in my own personal opinion,
 water injection should be pursued after more conventional performance
upgrades have been exploited.

Now ... stepping off my soapbox ... I'd be fascinated to hear anyone's
experience with this kind of thing.  Maybe somebody has figured out how
to make this work good enough to make it worth while?
-- 
Ken Mosher                   UUCP:     uunet!sparky!kmosher                  =
Sterling Software IMD        INTERNET: kmosher@sparky.IMD.Sterling.COM       = 
Buick Grand National: The Surgeon General never said anything about smoking  =
                      the competition!!                                      =

----------
Posted by: uunet!imd.sterling.com!Ken_Mosher (Ken Mosher)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun  5 00:59:40 1992
Subject: RE: Water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> 
> Concerning water injecting the port FI turbo motor, what kind on engine is it?
> An engineer that used to work for Buick and worked on the development of the
> Grand National engine told me that that engine was originally meant to be 
> alcohol injected with the turbo. In fact some of the early turbos for that
                                                       ^^^^^^^^^^^^

As Ron knows, the early Turbos had no intercooler, so the injection system
would be of greater benefit than the later intercooler versions.  Ron is
very knowledgable in regards to the GN, so I'm just guessing, not 
contridicting.

> But he did say that when it worked, it really produced power!
> I don't think I really answered your question, but its something to think
> about.
> 
> Ron
> 
I can see the alcohol producing power, since it is an oxygenator and
combustible, but how did they account for it in the A/F mixture?  DId the
O2 sensor provide enough feedback to adjust the fuel injectors to lean out
a bit to compensate for what I would guess would be a richer effective 
mixture?  What about WOT, where the O2 sensor is not consulted?  Interesting
though ... Hey Ron!  Want to explore this one some more?  We could take it
to GN/Type list if it bores the rest of the crowd on this list?

-- 
Ken Mosher                   UUCP:     uunet!sparky!kmosher                  =
Sterling Software IMD        INTERNET: kmosher@sparky.IMD.Sterling.COM       = 
Buick Grand National: The Surgeon General never said anything about smoking  =
                      the competition!!                                      =

----------
Posted by: uunet!imd.sterling.com!Ken_Mosher (Ken Mosher)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun  5 10:32:44 1992
Subject: Buick 430 Q&A
To: hotrod@dixie.com


>I love the .sig!  Being a member of the less popular "Buick Bunch", I can
>relate!  BTW, I have a '68 Buick 430 that needs some work ... can I put
>'72 455 heads on it if I change the pushrods to be the center oiling style?
>Is this going to cause other problems ... I ask because I have a set of
>'72 455 heads with a recent valve job that could go on my '68 Rivieria GS.
>Otherwise, I'm going to have to buy the heads off a buddy's '69 Rivie.
>Rather not spend the money now, if possible.

 I also have a 430 Buick "engine kit" and am curious about the same sorts
of things. I noticed on going through the Poston catalog that the lifters
available did not include the 400 and 430 on the same part type as the 455.
Also that no Rhoads type was listed. Other pieces (except pistons & rings)
seem to be identical. What changed between 1969 and 1970 (430->455)?

 Another Buick question: It seems to me that the older 425 "nail head" motor
would have some real screamer potential were it not for the small valves.
(4.3125 bore x 3.6xx stroke). Could later Stage I heads be made to fit this
plant? There's a '66 Riviera in the paper with factory dual quads but it 
seems to me that this package can't live up to its potential with the
1.8/1.5 int/exh valving. 

 Along these lines, I'd also be interested in moving to bigger valving on 
the 430 I already have. The 455 as stock gets a little short of breath
above 4K, while the '67 430 claims 360HP@5K. I figure maybe the smart way
to go in these times is to swap my '67 high-compression heads for some
'72 Stage I heads at 8.5:1, and make up the lost performance in some other
way more compatible with lousy gas. Blow-through boost on a Holley appeals
to me, and N2O is all but definite. I can't see putting boost on a 10.2:1
engine, and my impression is that higher compression doesn't really give
a proportionate power increase. At any rate the slightly bigger valving 
along with the better casting of the Stage I heads ought to let the 430
have an even better "dynamic range" - a sort of personal figure of merit
I like to use to judge an engine (basically the number of octaves under
the fat part of the torque curve).

 Now this post raises some questions about interchangeability. 
Do we have any Buick historians who can relate the changes in the 400/430/455
family? I'd rather find out here than during assembly...

----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun  5 10:47:08 1992
Subject: More Ford 427
To: hotrod@dixie.com


A few more 427 items.  The 352/390/406/410/427/428 are virtually identical
except for bore and stroke.  Lots of different heads.  The deck height,
crank and rod journals, bore spacing, and connecting rod length are the
same (except for 352, the rod is longer).  You can interchange almost
anything to get weird combinations of engines.  This same engine can be found
in trucks as the 360 and 383.  The pistons are all different due to different
distance from pin to top of piston.

The 427 was phased out in the late 60's in favor of the 428.  The 428 longer
stroke, smaller bore produced a "smoother" engine that was found in the
Galaxie and Thunderbird.  The 427 was the real race engine, wound up fast
and ran rough.  It could really propel the Mustang of that era.

Two popular modifications.  Use the older "427" heads on later model 428's. 
You see a few 1968-70 Mustangs with this combination.  You get more power
very easily.

A less common, but very rewarding combination is to use the 428 crank in the
427 block.  With aftermarket pistons and punched out to .030 over, it will
give you 455 cubes.  You need a piston with the 427 bore and the 428 pin to
top distance (they are out there).

The "newer" big block 429/460 is a completely different engine.  No
interchange of parts with the older "FE" engines.  But if you want cubes,
you can bore and stroke these to over 600 CI.

	-- Dan

----------
Posted by: Dan Malek 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun  5 12:23:22 1992
Subject: Re: Water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com

In article  hotrod@dixie.com writes:
>BTW, there was an article in Muscle Cars mag. that showed the mid-60's
>Oldsmobile that had a Turbo on a V8 and had "Power Injection" (or some such
>advertising nonsense) which put "power fluid" into the intake under boost.
>If I remember right, the "power fluid" was basically water and alcohol.
>I thought this was cool, in a silly kind of way! ;-)  Also, I think I've
> seen something like this in J.C Whitney
>catalogs ... (Didn't pay much attention to it, so you may want to see if they
>have a set up).

This was the F85 Jetfire Oldsmobile from 1965. This car featured a
*heavily* boosted 235 CID *aluminum* V8. The power fluid was milk
white. It was supposed to be a mixture of water, alcohol, and some
kind of water soluble lubricant. The engine design was a real piece
of trash, later sold to Jeep, but when the turbo was on it screamed.
Problem was, the little old ladies who bought these "economy" cars
failed to keep the power fluid reservoir filled. High boost, no water,
no engine. My uncle had one, it did scream and it did blow.

Gary

----------
Posted by: gary@ke4zv.uucp (Gary Coffman)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun  5 12:51:09 1992
Subject: Re:  '76 Buick Riviera
To: hotrod@dixie.com

1976 was the last year for the 455 Buick I believe. Probably a single
Quadrajet (780CFM most likely). Still plenty of torque but the emissions
cam sapped the horsepower badly. Sometime in the early-mid '70s Buick
dabbled with the front-drive confuguration ala the Toronado for the Riv.
That version of the 455 was slightly different and, who knows, maybe more
potent than the one for the barges (LeSabre, Electra). The Riviera was 
Buick's on-again, off-again performance platform before, then after (to
a lesser extent) the GS/Skylark A-body which took over from '68 to '72.
Things went downhill after that, but the 455 held out in the bigger Buicks
for a few more years.


It is by will alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the juice of Saphu that
thoughts acquire speed, the lips acquire stains, the stains become a warning.
It is by will alone I set my mind in motion.

----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun  5 13:23:02 1992
Subject: FORD 427
To: hotrod@dixie.com

The 427FE has a 4.230 bore and a 3.780 stroke.
they are all of the old antiquated Y-block design, read that HEAVY!
main drawback to these motors is EXPENSE and availability.
this is FORD's RACE motor, they made many different versions;
hi-riser
mid-riserer
lo-riser
SOHC
DOHC (DOUBLE over-head cams!!!!)
side-oiler
If you have the money you can make some fine engines and any level of 
power you can handle!!!!!v
The 429/460 motor is the FORD 335 series engine, inexpensive and 
capable of more horsepower than any 427.

In a COBRA repli-car the engine of choice is the traditional 427.
Due to the status symbolism of the 427 only!
If you are looking for handling and power for this car, use the motor
that BOB BONDURANT wanted Shelby to use in the car....the lowly 
351 windsor! for the price of a basic rebuild on a 427 FE you can
stroke a 351W to 427ci and get 500+Hp!!
The power/weight ratio is perfect for street or strip.
and for added incentive, you will be able to smoke any 427FE 
repli-cobra that you want, in slaloms or drags!!!
***************************************************
Millam E. Tackitt            met@naucse.cse.nau.edu

1967 Cougar XR-7 271/289 4spd/CR
1969 Mustang Mach I 335/390 4spd./WR 9"locker (sold $15,000)
1968 Galaxie XL-GT 345/390 Auto (destroyed in accident 5-20-92)
1968 Cyclone GT *385*/427 4spd 9"locker
1953 3/4 ton Chevy pickumup truck

Not running... yet:
1968 Cougar 300/390 Auto (sold)
1949 1/2 ton Chevy pickumup truck
***************************************************
and soon i'll be picking up:
1968 Shelby 'R' code Mustang no engine/trans.
cost: the man told me "get it off my property"!!!!
***************************************************

----------
Posted by: emory!naucse.cse.nau.edu!met (Millam Tackitt)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun  5 13:35:50 1992
Subject: Re: Ford 427
To: hotrod@dixie.com

The Hotrod List says:
> 
> >-> I someday hope to build a 427SC Cobra replica (after my 3rd-4th Vette
> >-> of course:-), but have never seen a hint of a 427 by Ford.  My
> >-> assumption is that it evolved to the 429 and is nearly the same.
> >-> Does anyone have info on this motor?
> >
> > There are several variants of the 427.  Yes, Ford not only built a
> >427, they built more than one.  They were basically large bore, short
> >stroke variants of the 332-352-390-406-428 FE series.  Yes, there was a
> >427 *and* 428 *and* 429.  The 429 is an entirely different engine.
> 
> I remember reading somewhere that the displacement of the 427 is really
> only 425 ci, but they called it a 427 because 427 = 7 liters, which is
> the limit for NHRA?   When they came out with an engine that really
> did displace 427 ci, they called it the 428 to avoid confusion.
> 
> > The baddest 427 was the SOHC, single overhead cam hemi 427.  Ford sold
> >lots of them as "crate motors".  Some were put in Cobras, others used in
> >drag racing, at least until the NHRA outlawed OHC engines back in the
> >'60s.
> 
> I wish I had one of these.  They put out something like 650 HP! :-)
> 
Last fall I had the one that goes in my Cobra completely rebuilt
professionally.  I sent them the original 427 (this was a dry sump side
oiler) and they disassembled, ballanced, blueprinted, teflon coated,
reballanced, assembled, benchflowed, and dyno'd the engine.  With shipping
charges (SF Bay area to Memphis TN and back) the total cost was just over 
$14,500.  This was the best price I could find after looking for a
respectable shop through the Shelby Club for 5 months.  I probably paid a
a bit more to insure that numbers matched and what not, but with a car
potentially this valuable, you really can't afford to skimp.  

I usually do my own work, but thats on old british and american iron.  Where
a screwed up engine is gonna cost me maybe $2000 tops.  I trust my work, but
not on a $15,000 piece of 25 year old aluminum racing heritage.

I'll sell you mine for the right price. :^)

BTW the Dyno results show it peaking at only 612 hp if I remember right.  The
torque was up in the 660 range though.

-- 

Miq Millman -- miq@sgi.com or {decwrl,pyramid,att}!sgi!miq  415 390 1041


----------
Posted by: emory!chromavac.esd.sgi.com!miq
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat Jun  6 00:41:03 1992
Subject: Re: Oil loss, overheating
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Hello again,

I have already received numerous responses, and I also appreciate those
that are forthcoming.  I would like to clarify a few points that seem
to have become relevant to the discussion, for example:


genef: Date: Fri, 5 Jun 92 13:52:04 MDT
genef> From: Gene Fusco 
genef> To: mopar@casbah.acns.nwu.edu
genef> Subject: Re: Oil loss
genef>
genef> ...Try checking your spark plugs to see
genef> how things are doing in the combustion chambers.  The residue (if any) on
genef> the plugs should be light tan - medium brown in color, and "fluffy".  If
genef> the tips look dark brown to black and appear oily, or crusty, you are 
genef> most likely loosing oil through the valve guides and/or rings, and the
genef> plugs are doing their best to burn it cleanly for you...

I removed and cleaned the plugs recently.  They tended to be black,
which supports the valve guide/rings theory.  However,

jws> Date: Fri, 5 Jun 92 16:14 EDT
jws> Sender: jws (James W. Swonger)
jws> Subject: Re:  Oil loss
jws> 
jws> I'd guess rings being worn; that gives not only oil consumption (though maybe
jws> not enough to be visible) but also blow-by which is what shoves the oil out
jws> the breather. Hold your hand over the oil fill hole and see if you feel air
jws> pushing or pulsing out. That's your amount of blow-by. If you can feel it 
jws> at all you're heading towards needing new rings or even a grind.

I remember trying this, but it seemed to just waft out smoothly, as
though the engine were not running at all.  It did not appear to be
coming out in pulses, unless they were just too minute to detect (in
which case I don't think it would be much of a problem).  I'll check it
again to make sure, though.


genef> If these turn up negative, clean off the underside of the engine area as
genef> best as you can, and park your car over some newspaper or a cookie sheet.
genef> Look at the paper after the car sets for a day or so.  Spots to check are
genef> the drain plug, rear main seal area and the front seal....

I leave my Fury in the driveway every weekend.  If my car were leaking
oil *at all*, my dad would have a fit!  :-)  I learned to check for oil
leaks when I had my Newport, which leaked a quart a day before I put it
out to pasture.  That is why I said that I know for certain (or as near
as possible) that it is not leaking oil.


genef> > [ Bizarre overheating problem]
genef> 
genef> The best shot I can take at this problem is that you had a temporary
genef> water blockage of some sort.  (kinda like a coronary for your car :-)
genef> It's possible that a blob of scale dislodged from inside a water passage,
genef> and found it's way to a tight spot in the system.  This could have
genef> decreased the flow long enough to cause your overheating, and the subsequent
genef> boiling action may have broken up the scale.
genef>
genef> Your water pump could have
genef> stalled, but you would have heard the belts screaming if that had happened.

That, and it was working fine when it started boiling.


genef> Start simple, like looking at the contents of your coolant.  It should
genef> be water and antifreeze.  Check for oil in the coolant.  (There shouldn't
genef> be any!) This is not where 1 qt/week could be going unless you change 
genef> coolant as often as that. ;-)  Oil in the coolant can signify a bad head 
genef> gasket or a crack in the block. (unlikely but possible)

I don't suspect this, as I have *never* had to add coolant--until now,
of course...  Also, I had checked the level only a few days earlier, so
I have no reason to believe that the radiator wasn't full.  The coolant
has always been green, albeit with that rusty tinge that cries out,
"flush me!".  :-)


jws> See if the suction hose on the lower side of the radiator still has its spring
jws> intact for the whole length. You should not be able to pinch it anywhere. If 
jws> the spring rusts out (and they all do eventually) the hose will collapse at
jws> high RPM when the pump starts to pull, and the suction may hold it shut until
jws> the engine is shut down. Your engine will heat up pretty quickly if this
jws> happens.

I just replaced that hose, along with the heater hoses.  I finally
found an upper hose that will fit, which I will be installing
tomorrow.  When the coolant was boiling, however, I noticed at times
that the upper hose would collapse completely.  Under what conditions
would this happen when driving?

This brings me to another phenomenon: on the highway, at a certain
speed or above, I get no heat via the heater, even when it is on full.
When I drop below this speed, heat begins to come out almost
immediately.  This cutoff speed is quite consistent.

At first I suspected that one of the heater hoses was collapsing, but
now that I have replaced everything but the upper radiator hose, that
one in particular has my attention.  Would a collapsed upper hose
prevent heat from reaching the heater core under the dashboard?  I
thought they were two separate circuits.


I apologize for the bandwidth I am taking with these problems.  I
appreciate the responses I have been getting, and I hope that you have
found the problem(s) as challenging as I have!  :-)
____________________________________________________________________________
          _______________
        //~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~\\  |			Dan Harling
   0  / /_________________\ \| 0		(harling@pictel.com)
    ---------------------------
  / /======|=D=O=D=G=E=|======\ \		Opinions are not necessarily
  \_____________________________/		those of PictureTel, but
  \    _______       _______    /		they should be.
  |\ _/|__|__|\_____/|__|__|\_ /|		
  |      |`V'  `---'  `V'|      |		'70 Dodge Challenger
  |______|               |______|		340 4-bbl.

----------
Posted by: emory!roadrunner.pictel.com!harling (Dan Harling)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat Jun  6 01:08:48 1992
Subject: Re: '76 Buick Riviera
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> 
> My dad bought a New Buick Riviera in 76; then we sold it in 1981 or so; I wish 
> I would have understood cars more or I might have kept it.  Das Boat!
> 

Appropriate nick name!  They are commonly referred to as "Boat Tail" Rivies
for the early seventies Riverias, due to the ummm ... let's say 
"controversial" styling of the pointed rear deck.  (I personally think they
are kind of cool, in a decadent kind of way :-) I don't remember if the
1976 model still had this deck?  Was it in '76 or '77 that they went to
the more convential styling?

> Anyway...I was curious to know exactly what engine was in there!  I know it was 
> big; in the 400's.  Anyone know details like carburation, horsepower, whether 
> it was a good motor, etc.   I was too young to notice how fast it was (plus 
> remember my PARENTS were driving it!)
> 
> I'll take a stab at what engine it was and say it was a 458.  Am I right?
> 

Close, but no cigar ... probably was the 455.  That was about the last year
for the big blocks, before they started going to corporate motors.  By then
the emissions laws pretty much killed horsepower, I'd have to look it up,
but I would guess it was rated at somewhere around 290 hp net.  Probably
had the Quadrajet, lots of torque and good for hauling all that metal around.
Probably produced fairly leisurely acceleration, but could pull stumps like
a tractor!  All in all, a great highway cruiser.
> 
> 
> Got a silver spoon, on a chain.  Got a grand piano to prop up my mortal 
> remains.
> ---
> MTM 'Matt the Mentat' Walsh
> matt@walsh.dme.battelle.org
> 
> ----------
> Posted by: MTM 'Matt the Mentat' Walsh 
>  
> 
> 
> 


-- 
Ken Mosher                   UUCP:     uunet!sparky!kmosher                  =
Sterling Software IMD        INTERNET: kmosher@sparky.IMD.Sterling.COM       = 
Buick Grand National: The Surgeon General never said anything about smoking  =
                      the competition!!                                      =

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Posted by: uunet!imd.sterling.com!Ken_Mosher (Ken Mosher)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat Jun  6 01:08:50 1992
Subject: Re: Buick 430 Q&A
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> 
>  I also have a 430 Buick "engine kit" and am curious about the same sorts
> of things. I noticed on going through the Poston catalog that the lifters
> available did not include the 400 and 430 on the same part type as the 455.
> Also that no Rhoads type was listed. Other pieces (except pistons & rings)
> seem to be identical. What changed between 1969 and 1970 (430->455)?
> 
The way I understand it (and by all means double check this, this is third
hand at best), the 430s had solid pushrods and oiled by drip through the
head.  The 455s oiled through the hollow pushrods.  Now ... I may be 
backwards here ... even completely wet!  I haven't taken mine apart yet
and the 455 heads I have are bare, just new valve seats.  I too would like
to know before I have the car spread all over the garage and then find out
I need a "left handed widget" to make all this work!

>  Another Buick question: It seems to me that the older 425 "nail head" motor
> would have some real screamer potential were it not for the small valves.
> (4.3125 bore x 3.6xx stroke). Could later Stage I heads be made to fit this
> plant? There's a '66 Riviera in the paper with factory dual quads but it 
> seems to me that this package can't live up to its potential with the
> 1.8/1.5 int/exh valving. 
> 

>From what I've been able to read, the old nailheads and the "modern" big blocks
are completely incompatible.  Different water passages, oil gallaries, cams,
etc. I'll have to get with some of our resident big block Gurus in the local
club here.  Some of those guys can quote part numbers for the oil pan drain
plug for every year off the top of their heads!  I'll post the results.

Anyway, I've seem some of those Riveria GS models with the dual quads
do very well (for a land yacht!)  At the GS Nationals this year there was a
big '67 Wildcat with the dual Quads (factory) running 15s in the 1/4.  This
car was very stock appearing and clean as a whistle!  I would have bought it
in a second, if it were for sale!  The owner was justifiably proud of it.
-- 
Ken Mosher                   UUCP:     uunet!sparky!kmosher                  =
Sterling Software IMD        INTERNET: kmosher@sparky.IMD.Sterling.COM       = 
Buick Grand National: The Surgeon General never said anything about smoking  =
                      the competition!!                                      =

----------
Posted by: uunet!imd.sterling.com!Ken_Mosher (Ken Mosher)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat Jun  6 01:10:22 1992
Subject: Re: Ford 427
To: hotrod@dixie.com

The Hotrod List says:
> 
> >-> I someday hope to build a 427SC Cobra replica (after my 3rd-4th Vette
> >-> of course:-), but have never seen a hint of a 427 by Ford.  My
> >-> assumption is that it evolved to the 429 and is nearly the same.
> >-> Does anyone have info on this motor?
> >
> > There are several variants of the 427.  Yes, Ford not only built a
> >427, they built more than one.  They were basically large bore, short
> >stroke variants of the 332-352-390-406-428 FE series.  Yes, there was a
> >427 *and* 428 *and* 429.  The 429 is an entirely different engine.
> 
> I remember reading somewhere that the displacement of the 427 is really
> only 425 ci, but they called it a 427 because 427 = 7 liters, which is
> the limit for NHRA?   When they came out with an engine that really
> did displace 427 ci, they called it the 428 to avoid confusion.
> 
> > The baddest 427 was the SOHC, single overhead cam hemi 427.  Ford sold
> >lots of them as "crate motors".  Some were put in Cobras, others used in
> >drag racing, at least until the NHRA outlawed OHC engines back in the
> >'60s.
> 
> I wish I had one of these.  They put out something like 650 HP! :-)
> 
Last fall I had the one that goes in my Cobra completely rebuilt
professionally.  I sent them the original 427 (this was a dry sump side
oiler) and they disassembled, ballanced, blueprinted, teflon coated,
reballanced, assembled, benchflowed, and dyno'd the engine.  With shipping
charges (SF Bay area to Memphis TN and back) the total cost was just over 
$14,500.  This was the best price I could find after looking for a
respectable shop through the Shelby Club for 5 months.  I probably paid a
a bit more to insure that numbers matched and what not, but with a car
potentially this valuable, you really can't afford to skimp.  

I usually do my own work, but thats on old british and american iron.  Where
a screwed up engine is gonna cost me maybe $2000 tops.  I trust my work, but
not on a $15,000 piece of 25 year old aluminum racing heritage.

I'll sell you mine for the right price. :^)

BTW the Dyno results show it peaking at only 612 hp if I remember right.  The
torque was up in the 660 range though.

-- 

Miq Millman -- miq@sgi.com or {decwrl,pyramid,att}!sgi!miq  415 390 1041


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Posted by: uunet!chromavac.esd.sgi.com!miq
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat Jun  6 09:48:15 1992
Subject: Re: Water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> This was the F85 Jetfire Oldsmobile from 1965. This car featured a
...
-> kind of water soluble lubricant. The engine design was a real piece
-> of trash, later sold to Jeep, but when the turbo was on it screamed.

 Er... a little history here.  The Jetfire used a variant of the Buick
aluminum 215 V8.  A fine motor, still in production in various forms
today.  Buick's beancounters decided an all-aluminum V8 was too
expensive, so they tried an iron block with aluminum heads before they
lopped off two cylinders to turn it into a V6.  They sold the V8 to
British Leyland, who put it into the MGB/GT-V8, Triumph TR8, Rover 3000
and 3500, Range Rover, and others.  Buick later sold the V6 tooling to
American Motors, who put lots of V6s into Jeeps.  After the Gas Crisis,
GM licensed the design back.  The first usage was in Chevrolet's Monza,
even though the engine was officially a "Buick."  Later variants of the
engine powered the Buick Grand National and GNX, which, straight up
against the equivalent years' 350 Corvette, had a higher top speed and a
quicker quarter mile.  I still believe the GNX was killed because GM was
embarrassed about the Corvette not being their baddest ride.

 Back when the GN/GNX was still being developed, Chevrolet Division had
considered using the engine to power the new '84 Corvette.  Zora
Arkus-Duntov wanted the GNX engine *BAD*.  He wanted to use the mid
engine two-rotor Wankel prototype Corvette with the turbo V6 to build a
*real* sports car.  GM management wanted the 350 in a bigger car.
Duntov kicked up so much fuss he was removed from the project.

 Overseas, the Brits bored the 215 out a little to make the 3500, went
to fuel injection instead of the dual side draft SU carbs (possibly the
most idiotic-looking intake system ever devised!) and then lopped off
two cylinders to make a V6 for the large Morris line.  Yes, the Brits
have aluminum Buick V6s.  Jaguar-Rover-Triumph (as British Leyland was
known then) licensed the design to Perkins Diesel's Canadian division,
who developed a diesel version for use in stationary power sources and
irrigation pumps.  Why anyone would want to do that defeats my
imagination.

 Piece of trash?  I hardly think so!  A 215 V8 would look real nice
under the hood of my wife's RX7, maybe with a Huffaker manifold and
four downdraft Webers...
         

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Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat Jun  6 17:47:45 1992
Subject: Rebuilding Ford 289 eng.
To: hotrod@dixie.com

I am in the process of rebuilding the 289 eng. on my '67 Mustang.  Rather than
do a simple disassemble, clean, replace worn parts, and put all back together,
what can I do to increase performance and get more power out of the engine?
I've picked up a few books on rebuilding, and will take it to a machine shop
to bore it out, but how much? .030 or .040?  I'd also like to change pistons
and increase compression ratio, but what is a practical ratio using today's
92/93 supreme unleaded?  Speaking of unleaded, I will also replace all values
to work with unleaded gasoline.  What can I do with the cylinder heads to
increase performance?
Lastly, what about the cam?  I'm sure there is more to it than walking into an
autoparts store and saying "give me the best".
Will all of this significantly increase the power over the stock 289?  

Thanks

vision@cup.portal.com

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Posted by: emory!cup.portal.com!Vision
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat Jun  6 19:48:02 1992
Subject: Re:  Rebuilding Ford 289 eng.
To: hotrod@dixie.com

You don't say what type of transmission and rear-end gears you are running.
I'd guess an automatic with ~2.78 gears, in which case:
get a cam in the 270i/280e duration and .474i/.495e lift.
'67 heads have a large smog bump in the exhaust port so...
either	1)get some 65-66 heads and put in 289 Hipo valves(stainless, of course)
        2)get some 68-69 351 windsor heads
        3)get some 289 Hipo heads, i have a set for sale by the way.
If you have a three or four speed transmission, the cam will work very well
also.
get a four barrel intake and carburator, and you really do need a set of headers
try the stock gt-350 style tri-Y setup, ~149.00 and dual exhaust.
these mods in themselves will get you a VERY noticable increase in Horses for
a good price.
***************************************************
Millam E. Tackitt            met@naucse.cse.nau.edu

1967 Cougar XR-7 271/289 4spd/CR
1969 Mustang Mach I 335/390 4spd./WR 9"locker (sold $15,000)
1968 Galaxie XL-GT 345/390 Auto (destroyed in accident 5-20-92)
1968 Cyclone GT *385*/427 3 deuces and a 4spd with a 9"locker
1953 3/4 ton Chevy pickumup truck

Not running... yet:
1968 Cougar 300/390 Auto (sold)
1949 1/2 ton Chevy pickumup truck
***************************************************
and soon i'll be picking up:
1968 Shelby 'R' code Mustang no engine/trans.
cost: the man told me "get it off my property"!!!!
***************************************************

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Posted by: emory!naucse.cse.nau.edu!met (Millam Tackitt)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat Jun  6 20:24:47 1992
Subject: Re: Rebuilding Ford 289 eng.
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> 
> I am in the process of rebuilding the 289 eng. on my '67 Mustang.  Rather than
> do a simple disassemble, clean, replace worn parts, and put all back together,
> what can I do to increase performance and get more power out of the engine?
Well, you are on the right track, as long as you are taking it apart, do
it right the first time and do it all.


> I've picked up a few books on rebuilding, and will take it to a machine shop
> to bore it out, but how much? .030 or .040? 
Well, the bore will depend on wheather it has been done before/how bad
the engine is worn, at most, you may need, 30 over, but try to go for
10 over, that way you can rebuild agian if need be and not need to
search for another block.

 I'd also like to change pistons
> and increase compression ratio, but what is a practical ratio using today's
> 92/93 supreme unleaded?
Maybe like 9 to 1, or 9.5 to 1.

  Speaking of unleaded, I will also replace all values
> to work with unleaded gasoline.  What can I do with the cylinder heads to
D
C
> increase performance
Well, take it to the shop and have them do a 3 angle valve job and port
and polish them, but thats big money
?
> Lastly, what about the cam?  I'm sure there is more to it than walking into an
> autoparts store and saying "give me the best".
> Will all of this significantly increase the power over the stock 289?  
Even a cam change can greatly improve engine horses, but you will have
to exam and decide what you want the car to do, you have to decide if
you want a racer, a street car, or what, just go to the local auto shop,
and make good friends with them(because you will spending all lot of
money there, and maybe you can get a discount if you are nice to them)
and just bs a little about what cam would work best for what
application.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> vision@cup.portal.com
> 
> ----------
> Posted by: emory!cup.portal.com!Vision
>  
> 
> 
Your welcome,
	Sean
> 

----------
Posted by: emory!odin.unomaha.edu!kelley (Sean Kelley)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun Jun  7 03:02:45 1992
Subject: Rebuilding Ford 289 eng.
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> to bore it out, but how much? .030 or .040?

 The 289 is a thinwall block.  You can't bore it enough to make a
significant difference in displacement.  To maintain cylinder wall
stability, you want a minimum bore - usually .030 or .040.

-> and increase compression ratio, but what is a practical ratio using
-> today's 92/93 supreme unleaded?

 The 289 can handle 11:1 without trouble, depending on the camshaft.
The small Ford is not as sensitive to octane as the small Chevy.
However, there is no useful purpose in going past 10:1 on a mildly
cammed street motor.

->  Speaking of unleaded, I will also replace
-> all values to work with unleaded gasoline.

 Not necessary.  The "unleaded gas burns valves" thing was a GM rumor,
which they tried to use to explain why their first-generation emission
controls and some runs of poorly-made cylinder heads had valve problems.
This was really only a problem with Chevrolet V8 engines and has long
since been corrected.

-> What can I do with the cylinder
-> heads to increase performance?

 Toss them in the nearest ditch, go to the junkyard, and pick up a set
of '69-'72 351 Windsor heads.  They have much larger ports and valves.
You will have to use hardened washers under the head bolts since the
351 uses half inch bolts.  Moroso and Milodon sell washers.  You'll also
have to use the 351 intake gaskets due to water jacket differences.  The
351 Windsor heads are much cheaper than trying to port the 289 heads and
fit oversize valves.

 For a really bad ride, pick up a set of 351C-2V or 400M heads.  They
have 2.05 intakes, 1.65 exhausts, 1.71 rocker ratio, canted valves, and
much bigger ports.  I paid $25 for a pair of them yesterday, which I'll
be putting on a 351W motor.  Then call B&A Ford in Fort Smith, Arkansas,
at 918-427-7757.  Dan or Gary can fix you up with a special intake for
the swap (single or dual plane), the proper pushrods, and miscellaneous
information.  They call the conversion a Street BOSS, and it's basically
the same as a BOSS 302, except the 2V heads are much more suited to the
street than the BOSS 302 heads were.

-> Lastly, what about the cam?  I'm sure there is more to it than
-> walking into an autoparts store and saying "give me the best".

 I could make any of several recommendations, but the best thing is to
call Sig Erson, Competition Cams, or Crane's tech support line, tell
them what kind of engine you're building, and let *them* pick a cam.
They're pretty good at that sort of thing.  Sig Erson is running a racer
direct special - cams $75, spring/retainer/pushrod kit $115.  You'll
probably want to stay with a hydraulic cam with the 351W heads.  B&A
strongly recommends adjustable valvetrain with their Street BOSS engines
(the Cleveland heads usually don't have adjustable valves), so you could
just as easily run a solid cam.

-> Will all of this significantly increase the power over the stock 289?

 Absolutely.  I even have an example:  the last 302 I built has bowl
ported 351W heads, a 600 Holley, Edelbrock dual plane intake, Crower
Baron 288H cam, 12.5:1 compression.  It pulled 280 bhp @ 4100 RPM.
It continues to build power up to 6000, but on the dyno run they
couldn't get it over 4100 because the ignition module was going bad at
the time.

 For your 289, I'd recommend 10:1 compression, 351W heads, a good dual
plane intake like the Edelbrock or Weiand parts, and a hydraulic cam
around 230 degrees @ .050 lift.  Do not run a single plane intake
manifold - the small Fords tend *not* to like them, and they usually
neuter low end response without giving much on top.
                             

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun Jun  7 22:29:39 1992
Subject: Re: ignition questions
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>I am currently using Bosh Platinum plugs.  I have seen some ads for
>"splitfile" spark plugs.  These plugs cost between $5 and $6 each.  Are
>these plugs worth the cost in increased performance and mileage??

Weeellll they might be better than the Bosch plugs.. But so would ordinary
Champions or Autolites or whatever.  Bosch "platinum" (I quote because
the amount of platinum would require a microbalance to measure) are
the worst plugs I've ever tried to use.  REAL platinum plugs are 
made by NGK, among others and cost upwards of $10 each.  Platinum is a
precious metal, after all.  On the good side, they last forever.  
The OEM plugs are still in my wife's Toyota Camry with 70,000 miles.
Good thing too, cuz the intake has to come off to change the rear bank.

About "splitfire" plugs, I suppose they work if "work" is defined as
getting people to open their wallets and pay 5 prices for a sparkplug.
If you want to see of the principle works (hint: it doesn't), 
just take some regular plugs and split the ground electrode with a
strong pair of dykes or a slitting wheel in a Dremel tool.

>I am also thinking about purchasing an ignition system from Jacobs
>Electronics called an "Energy Team".  Does anyone have any experience
>with this system??

Only second hand.  Frankly the Jacob's "from the Dr." bullshit is more
than I can swallow.  I have their media kit and it make me want to 
put on gloves, it is so loaded with BS.  I can't tell whether it does
anything special or not because the literature they send out is 
so full of hype.  I'm going to get one in here to review soon and get 
to the bottom of the hype.

For less money you can get a system that is known to work and is proven
daily and weekly by thousands of racers.  That is the MSD system.
I particularly like the MSD concept because I discovered the same 
principle - that multiple and/or extremely highly energetic spark
is worth real power - as part of a science fair project almost 25 
years ago.  Over a broad range, the more spark energy the better.
the MSD-6AL (or MSD-6T if you don't need a rev limiter) is an excellent
box that only costs about $130 from Summit Racing.  I have one on
all my high performance cars and love 'em.  You will have to run MSW
wires with the MSD box, as the energetic spark will quickly degrade
resistance wires.

I have used the Mallory Hyfire and the Allison systems but I've 
never found anything better than the MSD box, particularly for the money.

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  8 12:53:08 1992
Subject: Re: Water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Thanks to everyone that responded to my query on water injection. Most
of my questions have been answered. There are still one or two things
that have me a bit confused however...
First, where is the "best" place to inject the water, water/methonal, or
whatever? John mentioned injecting it before the compressor (on a
turbo'd engine). My engine does in fact have an intercooler (low-mounted)
and I'm concerned about water mist pooling in the intercooler. Now I know
that some of you will ask why I'm trying ti water inject an intercooled
turbomotor. Well, I really do need more charge cooling, I can feel a 
big drop in power when it gets above 75-80 degrees outside. An 
aftermarket intercooler would cost me at least $800. I'm hoping to
find a slightly "cheaper" way :-) 
I am also wondering about water vapor upstream of the throttle body.
If in fact it's better to inject water ahead of the throttle body, and
there is no danger of corrosion damage, it would make the water jet
installation a lot easier. (I won't have to pull the intake manifold
to drill and tap it for the jet.)
Pressurizing the water bottle with boost pressure sounds like the
logical way to feed it. I'm currently involved in the final design
of a microprocessor based boost controller, and it would be real
easy to add a few components and software to drive a another selenoid
for water injection control. This would allow me to vary the boost
setpoint at which the water injection selenoid opened.
I'm not an dyed-in the wool hotrodder like most of you people. I'm 
more of a tinkerer/slightly dangerous EE type. Someday I might buy
a real hotrod, but for now, I'm having enough fun trying to coax a
few more ponies out of my little 2 liter diamond star turbo.
(slightly red-faced, embarrased look :-))

Greg
jsb@ecl.psu.edu

----------
Posted by: GREG GRANVILLE 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  8 14:30:21 1992
Subject: Fury overheating: update
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Hello again,

Earlier I described an unusual overheating problem with my '66 Fury
(383) the other day.  The temperature had shot up to the top of the
gauge in about a minute, and the coolant proceeded to violently boil
over.  It lost about three gallons while doing its impression of "Old
Faithful".

I filled it back up with water and drove home.  This time, the
temperature gauge barely made it to the bottom of the "normal operating
range" zone by the time I got home.  Pretty strage, I thought; could
the water be doing *that* much better than antifreeze?

I replaced the upper radiator hose on my Fury on Saturday.  I also
replaced the angled nozzle with a straight one, as the car no longer
has air conditioning.  As I removed the nozzle, I saw that the
thermostat had literally fallen apart.  I had replaced this one
earlier with a new one, but the new one made it run a little too high
on the temp gauge, so I had put the old one back in.

Some part of the thermostat must have lodged itself in the radiator
hose, so that the blockage caused the engine to overheat--and pretty
quickly, I might add!  Needless to say, I put the new thermostat back
in.  I haven't driven it any distance since then, but I suspect that
the problem has been solved.

Of course, that still doesn't explain where all the oil is going... :-P
____________________________________________________________________________
          _______________
        //~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~\\  |			Dan Harling
   0  / /_________________\ \| 0		(harling@pictel.com)
    ---------------------------
  / /======|=D=O=D=G=E=|======\ \		Opinions are not necessarily
  \_____________________________/		those of PictureTel, but
  \    _______       _______    /		they should be.
  |\ _/|__|__|\_____/|__|__|\_ /|		
  |      |`V'  `---'  `V'|      |		'70 Dodge Challenger
  |______|               |______|		340 4-bbl.

----------
Posted by: emory!roadrunner.pictel.com!harling (Dan Harling)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  8 14:30:25 1992
Subject: Re: Rebuilding Ford 289 eng. 
To: hotrod@dixie.com


> Date:  Sun, 7 Jun 92 02:26 EDT
> From:  hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
> 
> 

> -> What can I do with the cylinder
> -> heads to increase performance?

>  Toss them in the nearest ditch, go to the junkyard, and pick up a set
> of '69-'72 351 Windsor heads.  They have much larger ports and valves.
> You will have to use hardened washers under the head bolts since the
> 351 uses half inch bolts.  Moroso and Milodon sell washers.  You'll also
> have to use the 351 intake gaskets due to water jacket differences.  The
> 351 Windsor heads are much cheaper than trying to port the 289 heads and
> fit oversize valves.

>  For a really bad ride, pick up a set of 351C-2V or 400M heads.  They
> have 2.05 intakes, 1.65 exhausts, 1.71 rocker ratio, canted valves, and
> much bigger ports.  I paid $25 for a pair of them yesterday, which I'll
> be putting on a 351W motor.  Then call B&A Ford in Fort Smith, Arkansas,
> at 918-427-7757.  Dan or Gary can fix you up with a special intake for
> the swap (single or dual plane), the proper pushrods, and miscellaneous
> information.  They call the conversion a Street BOSS, and it's basically
> the same as a BOSS 302, except the 2V heads are much more suited to the
> street than the BOSS 302 heads were.


Just note that the water passages on the 289/302/351W are different than that
found on the 351C/351M/400.  You can interchage, but drilling/plugging holes
is necessary.  To install the latter heads on the Windsor block, you need to
plug the hole in the combustion face of the head, and drill a hole in the intake
face of the head.  If you need more info, let me know.


	-- Dan

----------
Posted by: Dan Malek 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun  8 14:45:01 1992
Subject: Re:  Summit phone # ?
To: hotrod@dixie.com

SUMMIT #216-798-9440
580 Kennedy Rd.
Akron, Ohio 44305-4495

***************************************************
Millam E. Tackitt            met@naucse.cse.nau.edu

1967 Cougar XR-7 271/289 4spd/CR
1969 Mustang Mach I 335/390 4spd./WR 9"locker (sold $15,000)
1968 Galaxie XL-GT 345/390 Auto (destroyed in accident 5-20-92)
1968 Cyclone GT *385*/427 3 deuces and a 4spd with a 9"locker
1953 3/4 ton Chevy pickumup truck

Not running... yet:
1968 Cougar 300/390 Auto (sold)
1949 1/2 ton Chevy pickumup truck
***************************************************
and soon i'll be picking up:
1968 Shelby 'R' code Mustang no engine/trans.
cost: the man told me "get it off my property"!!!!
***************************************************

----------
Posted by: emory!naucse.cse.nau.edu!met (Millam Tackitt)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 00:10:44 1992
Subject:  Re: Summit phone # ?
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> Date:       Mon, 8 Jun 92 12:28 EDT
> Subject:    Summit phone # ?
> From:       hotrod@dixie.com (The Hotrod List)
> To:         hotrod@dixie.com
> Reply-to:   hotrod@dixie.com

> Could someone post or email me the phone # and address for Summit
> Racing? I'd like to get their catalog.

=========================================
|  SUMMIT RACING:                       |
|  Order Line        (216)798-9440      |
|  FAX Orders        (216)798-0215      |
|  Tech. Line        (216)798-4272      |
|  Customer Service  (216)798-0500      |
|  Order Status Line (216)798-0846      |
=========================================

>
> Thanks...
> Greg
> jsb@ecl.psu.edu
>
> ----------
> Posted by: GREG GRANVILLE 
>
                    +-----------------------------------+
                    |      Ed Bouvier, Jr.  (Mr. Ed)    |
                    |         Project Management        |
                    |   Wheaton College Physical Plant  |
                    +-----------------------------------+

   ---->  Electronic Mail Address: Bouvier@chase1.wheaton.edu

----------
Posted by: uunet!chase1.wheaton.edu!BOUVIER
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 00:22:15 1992
Subject: Re: ignition questions
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> 
> 
> -> I am currently using Bosh Platinum plugs.  I have seen some ads for
> -> "splitfile" spark plugs.  These plugs cost between $5 and $6 each.
> -> Are these plugs worth the cost in increased performance and mileage??
> 
>  Not always.  They're another variant of the U-groove and multiple
> electrode ideas.  Your spark jumps from a sharp edge or point to the
> center electrode.  The sharper the edge, the easier it is to get the
> spark.  That's why new plugs with sharp edges sometimes make an engine
> run better.
> 
>  Back in the '50s, rodders used to file the electrodes into points.
> This worked, but reduced plug life.  The idea of multiple edges is to
> let you have more sharp points.
> 
>  Only ONE spark will jump.  When the electrode surfaces are worn,
> the arc will draw from the next sharpest, etc, etc.
>                   
> 
> ----------
> Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
>  


In my case, having a Buick V-6 Turbo engine, I would think
the sharp points would be a great place for a "hot" spot, since it would
be tough to dissipate heat from the point.  This would seem to me to 
encourage detonation in my application and hasten wear under high boost
conditions.  I think that if everything was up to snuff, they wouldn't do
much of anything.  That is, if the voltage was adequate ... I would also
think that a high quality ignition source (MSD, DFI, etc.) would "see" very
little difference between the split fire and the conventional design.

Bottom line, my gut feeling is that this is another hyped up product that
may actually work in some marginal conditions, but is basically useless for
most.  Its main function, IMHO, is to seperate people from their money ...
much like the "miracle horsepower in a can" vendors.  Anyone have any hard
data to prove or disprove these things?  I freely admit that I am just
theorizing, and I have a hard time parting with $6-7 a plug (for the Buick
V-6) just to find out they don't work, or worse, degrade my perfomance.
-- 
Ken Mosher                   UUCP:     uunet!sparky!kmosher                  =
Sterling Software IMD        INTERNET: kmosher@sparky.IMD.Sterling.COM       = 
Buick Grand National: The Surgeon General never said anything about smoking  =
                      the competition!!                                      =

----------
Posted by: uunet!imd.sterling.com!Ken_Mosher (Ken Mosher)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 00:50:08 1992
Subject: Re: Water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> First, where is the "best" place to inject the water, water/methonal,
-> or whatever? John mentioned injecting it before the compressor (on a

 You want it as far upstream as possible.  Above the throttle body is
OK, except you might have trouble with icing in cold weather.  Of
course, if the weather is that cold you probably don't need the water
anyway.  

-> that some of you will ask why I'm trying ti water inject an
-> intercooled turbomotor. Well, I really do need more charge cooling, I

 Water has a high 'q' point according to my old chemistry book.  It
absorbs a lot of heat before it finally changes state, ie turns to
steam.

 The use of water/alcohol mix on old airplane engines was probably to
lower the freezing point - it gets *cold* up there - and to improve
vaporization and miscibility with the fuel.  I doubt the alcohol does
anything noticeable for power.

 Actually, for blown engines, you'll always see a power increase if you
go from port injection to injection before the compressor - the fuel
evaporation gives you the same effect as water injection.  Of course
throttle response sucks and backfires can be lots of fun...
                                   

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 00:52:20 1992
Subject: Re: Rebuilding Ford 289 eng.
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> Just note that the water passages on the 289/302/351W are different
-> than that found on the 351C/351M/400.  You can interchage, but
-> drilling/plugging holes

 I forgot to mention that, but the B&A manifold comes with full
instructions.

 BTW, the 351C-2V and 400M heads appear to be identical.  Some 351M
heads are the same, but B&A has a couple of sets with a water jacket
extension hanging down from the top of the port.  They had one cut up -
you can't even stick your finger in the port, which is kinda dumbbell
shaped through the narrow part.  The constriction is thinwall water
jacket, and there isn't a chance in hell of grinding out enough to help.
If you do the Cleveland conversion, make sure you look into the exhaust
ports first.

 The TRW catalog lists the combustion chamber sizes as being slightly
different from model to model, but B&A says they all burette out the
same.
                                  

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 01:09:38 1992
Subject: Re: Water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> What kind of intercooler is it? Have you thought of using a
-> water-spray right onto the intercooler to help keep it cooler? Sounds
-> a lot simpler than water injection...

 I don't have my reference materials handy, but it looks like putting
the water in the intake charge would make most efficient use of it.  No
reason you couldn't do both, though.

 Probably the best way would be to add a booster fan in front of the
intercooler and squirt the water ahead of that; it'd spread the water
out more efficiently than a simple spraybar.
            

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 10:25:57 1992
Subject: Buick 430 and 455
To: hotrod@dixie.com


 I looked at the heads for my 430 and the shop manual I have for the 455. The
shop manual is for the 1972 model year, so there is a 5 year gap. I believe
there are some differences between the 1970-71 and 1972-76 455s; the former
fall within this gap. However, getting to the point about top end lubrication -

- the 430 lifters and pushrods appear to pass oil to the top. However, this
  path only lubricates the pushrod seat.

- there are pressurized oil passages (head gasket has multiple concetric
  bosses around the hole) from the block to the head on the 430. These runs
  feed the rocker shaft, which has capped ends and oil feed holes at each
  rocker pivot site. The weep holes in the rocker appear to be for the valve
  stem contact face (gravity drip feed).

- the 455 (at least by '72) had gone to non-pressurized rocker rails with the 
  lame plastic keepers and steel rockers. All lubrication is via the pushrods.

- the 430 lifters I have mic out the same as the spec 455 lifter diameter 
  (.8420" - .8427"). My suspicion is that the differences lie in the oil 
  metering (430 has little pushrod oil demand and the pushrod-rocker sealing
  may interfere with the bleed expectations of a lifter designed for the 455.

  I have no spec for lifter body length. I suspect there is no difference here.

- There appears to be no exit hole at the top, so the oil in a 430 is basically
  statically pressurized with little flow through the pushrod. The amount of
  glop in the lifters tends to support this.

- From these differences it appears that it might be possible to fit 455 heads
  to a 430. However this would require using 455 lifters and pushrods and 
  blocking off the oil feeds to the head casting. 

- I believe it would be possible to use 430 heads on a 455 (if you're keen on
  10.2:1 compression, 2.00"/1.625" valves and can't find '70 455 heads). To
  make this work you would have to replace the rocker shaft and rockers. An
  aftermarket roller setup, naturally. Naturally. 


----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 10:33:27 1992
Subject: Re: ignition questions
To: hotrod@dixie.com


>In my case, having a Buick V-6 Turbo engine, I would think
[stuff deleted]
>Bottom line, my gut feeling is that this is another hyped up product that
>may actually work in some marginal conditions, but is basically useless for
 
In the case of the Buick turbo V6, a noted tuner of these (Red Arnstrong) was
given a set of these by the manufacturer to document performance gains. I
talked to him at the GS Nationals this year in Bowling Green, KY about them. He
told me that he noticed no appreciable gain in quarter mile performance, but he
did say they did seem to help smooth out the idle a bit. As Ken stated, they
may help in marginal cases. Red's car is anything but marginal. When you open
the hood, the car appears factory stock. But the car runs low 12's at over 110
mph! This is with the stock restrictive air cleaner assembly in place, closed
exhaust, and DOT tires.
I have also heard that they help normally aspirated and/or carb'd cars the
most.

That's my input for what it's worth,

Ron

----------
Posted by: emory!SKYLER.MAVD.HONEYWELL.COM!MELLUM
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 10:43:51 1992
Subject: Re: Water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Actually, due to alcohols oxygen content, it is worth some noticable
power increase. I used to drag race a 13.245 second small block FORD
when I added a water injector at the carburator inlet and injected 
a rather large amount of 50/50 methanol/water mix I GAINED .1 second 
and 3 mph!!! On just water there was only a .2->.3 second gain.
Substituting 100% methanol in your gas tank, with ALL the corresponding
changes in fuel delivery system, will increase your power output a 
documented 20%!!!!!! 
Alcohol is power, if you can afford the price, availablity and above all
the horrendous smell.

***************************************************
Millam E. Tackitt            met@naucse.cse.nau.edu

1967 Cougar XR-7 271/289 4spd/CR
1969 Mustang Mach I 335/390 4spd./WR 9"locker (sold $15,000)
1968 Galaxie XL-GT 345/390 Auto (destroyed in accident 5-20-92)
1968 Cyclone GT *385*/427 3 deuces and a 4spd with a 9"locker
1953 3/4 ton Chevy pickumup truck

Not running... yet:
1968 Cougar 300/390 Auto (sold)
1949 1/2 ton Chevy pickumup truck
***************************************************
and soon i'll be picking up:
1968 Shelby 'R' code Mustang no engine/trans.
cost: the man told me "get it off my property"!!!!
***************************************************

----------
Posted by: emory!naucse.cse.nau.edu!met (Millam Tackitt)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 12:04:51 1992
Subject: Re: Water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com

I don't see how alcohol's oxygen content makes you more power. The way I look
at it, the alcohol's already partially burnt. That says less power to me. I
believe alcohols have less volume and mass energy density than their alkane
counterparts.

Leaving meth/nitrometh dragsters out of the picture, I think the main
"advantage" to alcohol is that it increases the "octane", allowing higher
boost or compression. It is better than water since it does at least burn.
However if you use significant alcohol in your water injection you will not
be mixture-neutral; you will richen things up. Again, this may not be bad
if knock suppression is your goal, but it may not be great at cruise.

----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 13:23:49 1992
Subject: Re: Water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com

The oxygen content in alcohol is not consumed in reacting the alcohol, which
leaves extra oxygen in the later part of the hydro-carbon reaction cycle.
Thus allowing for more complete hydro-carbon reaction and therefore more
energy release from said reaction.
The oxygen inducted into an internal combustion engine, no matter how 
realistically efficient, is consumed before the fuel is completely
reacted!!!!
And yes it is true that you can run higher compression in an alcohol
specific engine, upto and including 16:1!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

***************************************************
Millam E. Tackitt            met@naucse.cse.nau.edu

1967 Cougar XR-7 271/289 4spd/CR
1969 Mustang Mach I 335/390 4spd./WR 9"locker (sold $15,000)
1968 Galaxie XL-GT 345/390 Auto (destroyed in accident 5-20-92)
1968 Cyclone GT *385*/427 3 deuces and a 4spd with a 9"locker
1953 3/4 ton Chevy pickumup truck

Not running... yet:
1968 Cougar 300/390 Auto (sold)
1949 1/2 ton Chevy pickumup truck
***************************************************
and soon i'll be picking up:
1968 Shelby 'R' code Mustang no engine/trans.
cost: the man told me "get it off my property"!!!!
***************************************************

----------
Posted by: emory!naucse.cse.nau.edu!met (Millam Tackitt)
 



From z-car@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 13:28:47 1992
To: z-car@dixie.com
Subject: Re: Shortened Springs


Hello all,
I posted a question about this previously, but my mail system at the
University has been on the fritz.  Since this goes along the lines of
suspensions, does anyone have any experience with strut tower bars?
Can they fix a car's alignment that's semi-permanently out of whack?
(not my fault...car got slammed by the police chief in nearby town)
I have read that you can adjust your alignment some with a front tower
bar.  Thanks to any replies.
--Scott
P.S.  Is it possible to get a Z's unibody frame straightened out?


From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 14:51:13 1992
Subject:  Re: ignition questions
To: hotrod@dixie.com

John,

> Whatever plugs you are using are just fine.  I open the gap as far as I
> can before the arc starts flashing over to the shell.  This VASTLY
> improves idle and low speed response with no degradation at high
> speed even on turbocharged engines.
>
> John

Neat idea! but how do you tell when the arc starts flashing to the
shell?  I assume by grounding the plug to the header manifold and
watch it while the engine is running on the other 7 cylinders,
(that is, after taking a good long leak! :)  ?

Also, is there a way to increase the electronic dwell on a stock
chevy HEI?

And since we're on the subject....  When purchasing a set of
"performance" springs for the timing advance, there are usually 3
sets of colored springs.  Any idea what the colors designate?  I know
each spring is supposed to give you different performance and the
package just says to try each and use your favorite, but....

Thanks very much for the help, I'm still young in the performance
field and love to learn these types of things!


+-----------------------------------------------   O O O o o o o . . .  -+
| Michael Pell           |Internet:               O    =======           |
| Development Center,ADPC|mjpell@adpc.purdue.edu  Y__,_|_|_|_| --++++++--|
| Purdue University      |Pegasus:freh-01/mjpell  |__|_|  P  | | PURDUE ||
| Voice: (317) 494-6119  |Wizard:mpell           {|____|_____|:|________||
| FAX:   (317) 494-6186  |                        /oo-----OO     oo  oo  |
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+

----------
Posted by: "Mike Pell"  
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 16:25:28 1992
Subject: Re: ignition questions
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>> Whatever plugs you are using are just fine.  I open the gap as far as I
>> can before the arc starts flashing over to the shell.  This VASTLY
>> improves idle and low speed response with no degradation at high
>> speed even on turbocharged engines.
>>
>> John
>
>Neat idea! but how do you tell when the arc starts flashing to the
>shell?  I assume by grounding the plug to the header manifold and
>watch it while the engine is running on the other 7 cylinders,
>(that is, after taking a good long leak! :)  ?

Little more complicated than that.  The pressure of compression at the
time of ignition raises the dielectric strength of the air and thus
increases the necessary voltage.  You might remember the old sparkplug
tester/cleaners you used to see in the garages that had a pressure 
chamber that you screwed the plug into and could view the arc under
shop air pressure through a glass window.  I have a homemade chamber
that lets me do the same thing.  I just put shop air on it while
exciting the plug with a neon sign transformer.  My shop air is 175 psi
so that's pretty close to cylinder conditions.  As a practical matter,
if you set the gap to about 4/5ths the distance between the base of 
the center electrode where it emerges from the insulator and the shell,
you're in good shape.

You can verify the setting if you have a storage scope you can operate
in the car (#include Also, is there a way to increase the electronic dwell on a stock
>chevy HEI?

Yes.  Several aftermarket modules are available with increased dwell.
I'm not really into GM hotrodding so perhaps someone else can give you
specifics.  I've seen the beasts advertised in the hotrod magazines.

I did note while thumbing throgh the Summit Catalog that MSD has something
called the "Super HEI kit" that consists of an MS-6a box, a "Blaster II"
coil and an adaptor to connect the coil where the HEI coil used to go
on the distributor.  $174.

>And since we're on the subject....  When purchasing a set of
>"performance" springs for the timing advance, there are usually 3
>sets of colored springs.  Any idea what the colors designate?  I know
>each spring is supposed to give you different performance and the
>package just says to try each and use your favorite, but....

I love that kind of advice.  The only way to know what each combination
does is to curve your distributor with each one attached.  Then you
have to try them to see what you engine likes.  By curving each 
combination, you know what change will occur when you make a change.
To curve the distributor, you either take it to a distributor shop
that has a machine or you build your own.  I'm working on an article
right now for a machine you can build at home for under $200.
(#include std plug for my new magazine).

>Thanks very much for the help, I'm still young in the performance
>field and love to learn these types of things!

Believe me, this is a disease with no known cure.  The only thing that
mitigates the symptoms are frequent large injections of speed.

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 17:26:43 1992
Subject:  Re: ignition questions
To: hotrod@dixie.com

WHooooaaaaa.... gosh, boy that was a wake-me-up-to-the-real-world
answer!  I think I have a long way to go in the ignition arena.

I think for now I may have to stick with the 4/5 distance, however,
I will keep this information for future use!!

I have also been thinking about having the distributor curved, but
almost lost sight of the idea until you mentioned it.

Thank you very much for the help.  I have never talked to someone
quite so knowledgeable in this field!  It is really interesting.

I notice that your return address is from an education institution.
Where might that be??

Also, would you tell me a little more about the magazine you
mentioned?  I would definitately be interested in this too!



> Date:       Tue, 9 Jun 92 16:01 EDT
> Subject:    Re: ignition questions
> From:       hotrod%dixie.com@mathcs.emory.edu (The Hotrod List)
> To:         hotrod@dixie.com
> Reply-to:   hotrod%dixie.com@mathcs.emory.edu

> >> Whatever plugs you are using are just fine.  I open the gap as far as I
> >> can before the arc starts flashing over to the shell.  This VASTLY
> >> improves idle and low speed response with no degradation at high
> >> speed even on turbocharged engines.
> >>
> >> John
> >
> >Neat idea! but how do you tell when the arc starts flashing to the
> >shell?  I assume by grounding the plug to the header manifold and
> >watch it while the engine is running on the other 7 cylinders,
> >(that is, after taking a good long leak! :)  ?
>
> Little more complicated than that.  The pressure of compression at the
> time of ignition raises the dielectric strength of the air and thus
> increases the necessary voltage.  You might remember the old sparkplug
> tester/cleaners you used to see in the garages that had a pressure
> chamber that you screwed the plug into and could view the arc under
> shop air pressure through a glass window.  I have a homemade chamber
> that lets me do the same thing.  I just put shop air on it while
> exciting the plug with a neon sign transformer.  My shop air is 175 psi
> so that's pretty close to cylinder conditions.  As a practical matter,
> if you set the gap to about 4/5ths the distance between the base of
> the center electrode where it emerges from the insulator and the shell,
> you're in good shape.
>
> You can verify the setting if you have a storage scope you can operate
> in the car (#include  peak voltage and the arc sustaining voltage vary directly with compression
> and with plug gap.  At a given engine speed and throttle setting, the
> waveform should be very stable.  If the waveform is jittery and/or the
> voltage changes by several hundred volts on a particular cylinder, you
> can pretty much bet flashover is taking place.  I have a 1000:1 voltage
> divider I use to monitor the actual voltage instead of relying on
> an inductive pickup.
>
> >Also, is there a way to increase the electronic dwell on a stock
> >chevy HEI?
>
> Yes.  Several aftermarket modules are available with increased dwell.
> I'm not really into GM hotrodding so perhaps someone else can give you
> specifics.  I've seen the beasts advertised in the hotrod magazines.
>
> I did note while thumbing throgh the Summit Catalog that MSD has something
> called the "Super HEI kit" that consists of an MS-6a box, a "Blaster II"
> coil and an adaptor to connect the coil where the HEI coil used to go
> on the distributor.  $174.
>
> >And since we're on the subject....  When purchasing a set of
> >"performance" springs for the timing advance, there are usually 3
> >sets of colored springs.  Any idea what the colors designate?  I know
> >each spring is supposed to give you different performance and the
> >package just says to try each and use your favorite, but....
>
> I love that kind of advice.  The only way to know what each combination
> does is to curve your distributor with each one attached.  Then you
> have to try them to see what you engine likes.  By curving each
> combination, you know what change will occur when you make a change.
> To curve the distributor, you either take it to a distributor shop
> that has a machine or you build your own.  I'm working on an article
> right now for a machine you can build at home for under $200.
> (#include std plug for my new magazine).
>
> >Thanks very much for the help, I'm still young in the performance
> >field and love to learn these types of things!
>
> Believe me, this is a disease with no known cure.  The only thing that
> mitigates the symptoms are frequent large injections of speed.
>
> John
>
> ----------
> Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
>
>
>
>
+-----------------------------------------------   O O O o o o o . . .  -+
| Michael Pell           |Internet:               O    =======           |
| Development Center,ADPC|mjpell@adpc.purdue.edu  Y__,_|_|_|_| --++++++--|
| Purdue University      |                        |__|_|  P  | | PURDUE ||
| Voice: (317) 494-6119  |    '69 Chevelle       {|____|_____|:|________||
| FAX:   (317) 494-6186  |  383 cu in 400+ hp     /oo-----OO     oo  oo  |
+------------------------------------------------------------------------+

----------
Posted by: "Mike Pell"  
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun  9 17:49:39 1992
Subject: Re: ignition questions
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> Any recomendations on what coil to use with an MSD system? I have an MSD
>for my 351W, but no coil yet....

Doesn't much matter.  In this application, the coil is simply a step-up
pulse transformer as opposed to Kettering (and electronic variations 
thereof) ignition in which the coil is also the energy storage mechanism.
With the MSD box, a series of sharp 550 volt pulses are applied to
the coil.  The coil only has to transform these pulses to the appropriate
voltage.  Most all coils are 100:1 ratio so the open circuit voltage is
about 55 KV.

I've used conventional coils, the MSD Blaster (a conventional coil with
a fancy label), Accel's superCoil, Mallory's Hyfire coil and even
one of the little motorcycle coils with equal results.  The only
criteria is the coil must be able to handle the heat load.  The motorcycle
coil got hot real fast and is not recommended.  Indeed, MSD sells essentialy
this coil in a rugged case and labels it only for drag racing.  

The other consideration is to make sure your distributor is phased properly.
That is, make sure the rotor tip is over the appropriate output post
when the spark happens.  Important for regular ignition, it is 
vital for the MSD box because the high energy spark can erode the 
terminals if it has to jump far and because the fast rise time 
pulses can punch through the rotor.

The way to look at phasing is to take an old distributor cap and cut 
away all the material below one of the terminals so the rotor is
visible.  Then install the cap, hook a timing light to that lead
and crank the motor.  Observe the rotor while illuminated with the 
timing light.  It will show you almost exactly where the rotor tip
is when the spark fires.  Most lights have somewhere around a degree of
propagation delay so keep that in mind when looking at the tip.
Be sure to look at it over the whole range of the advance mechanism.

If the tip is out of time, such as when more than stock advance is needed,
the easiest way to correct the problem is to drill and tap new holddown 
holes for the magnetic pickup.  It is possible in some distributors to
repin the reluctor star but that's a lot of work.

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 10 11:24:26 1992
Subject: ANY LEAD IMMUNE O2 SENSOR
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> National that I drag race. To get max performance, I use leaded
-> racing fuel. This usually kills the O2 sensor after about 20 runs. In
-> a summer, I'll go through about 3-4 sensors @ $30 a piece. It would
-> be nice to avoid this

 Doesn't the computer go into open loop at full throttle and ignore the
oxygen sensor?  Why not just remove the sensor before you race, then
replace it afterward?

 I dunno about the GN, but the Corvette goes off the oxygen sensor and
onto the internal map at full throttle.  The computer bumps the timing
curve up and depends on the knock sensor to keep from holing pistons.
                                                                                                  

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 10 11:33:56 1992
Subject: Re: Intercoolers (was Re: Water injection)
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>If I remember right you have a Mitsubishi?

Close; Toyota Camry Diesel.

>Diesel trucks often had intercoolers for the Turbo variety ... if you find
>a delivery van (Isuzu, Volvo, GMC, etc) you may find a small enough
>intercooler.

An interesting thought.

>IMHO, pay the money to the aftermarket supplier.  Any of the above solutions
>will depend on your fabrication skills.  I would guess it means being able
>to mandrel bend pipes, fabricate mounting brackets, adapting rubber boots,
>maybe even cutting holes in radiator supports, etc.  If you pick a reliable

This should not be a problem. I just started a second job after hours
in a machine shop and I am learning to wear shirts with a little blue
around the neck. :-).

>aftermarket company, they will have all the details of the installation
>worked out and tested.  Plus you get a warranty and phone support if you
>get stuck.  The junkyard approach may get you a bargain, but (at least in
>my area) an intercooler runs $100-200 easy from the U Pull It places.  Even

I am hoping for $100 or less.

>higher from the places that pull the parts and inventory them.  Also, it
>is very difficult to find an intercooler in good shape, since it seem most
>of the cars I see are hit in the front (HARD!).  Add to this the fact that
>you need to find something late model (probably 88 or later), you may find
>that it is very difficult to find something with the engine compartment
>intact (not burned or crunched).
>

Let me explain my plan. I am getting a new turbo for it to get it running
again and then I want to experiment with intercooling and higher boost.
The current specs are.

Transverse FWD. (I know but it is paid for)
1800cc Turbo Diesel.
10psi max boost.
73bhp
106lb-ft
2700 lb curb weight

The turbo is behind the motor and the intake manifold is on the front
(relative to the car body). A heavy rubber hose connect the turbo to
the manifold (not quite 1 ft of hose).

My plan is to place it directly between the turbo and the manifold on
top of the engine and cut a hole in the hood over top of it. This keeps
the runner short for better "throttle" response. Cooling air would be
supplied by a duct from the chin spoiler (yes it has one). I would do
and after checks for exhaust gas temp. under load and then fiddle with
maximum fuel delivery and boost pressure until I get close to the
original exhaust gas temp.

Well watcha think? I know it isn't a mach 1 or anything but I can't
afford to buy a project and I figure I can learn a lot from this
project.

>Hey, it never hurts to look though! There is such a thing as luck ... Let
>us know how it turns out?

OK.

				mike

----------
Posted by: emory!hamlet.ctd.anl.gov!shaffer
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 10 11:49:40 1992
Subject: Re: Summit Racing 
To: hotrod@dixie.com

I like to deal with JEGS. Great sales people! The prices are a smidge
higher but the shipping is free! A few times when Summit was out of
stock Jegs had it. The catalog doesn't have all kinds of hype in it 
either. Toll free 800-345-4545.
RON

----------
Posted by: emory!tv.tv.tek.com!rons
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 10 13:47:05 1992
Subject: Re: 351 heads
To: hotrod@dixie.com


 I have a set of TFS alloy heads on my (yet to be run) 351W. They are
the most pricy alternative (I think) but very nice. I ported them
mildly and had to use Isky adjustable pushrod guides. If your in
Mountain Veiw you can stop by for a look....

 Milt.....

----------
Posted by: emory!Eng.Sun.COM!Milt.Mallory (Milt Mallory -ESO LANs- )
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 10 15:24:28 1992
Subject: Re: Intercoolers (was Re: Water injection)
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>My plan is to place it directly between the turbo and the manifold on
>top of the engine and cut a hole in the hood over top of it. This keeps
>the runner short for better "throttle" response. Cooling air would be
>supplied by a duct from the chin spoiler (yes it has one). I would do
>and after checks for exhaust gas temp. under load and then fiddle with
>maximum fuel delivery and boost pressure until I get close to the
>original exhaust gas temp.

As long as the engine is port fuel  injected, the manifold volume and
length has virtually no effect on throttle response.  I used to
think it did too and experience with carburated engines will lead 
you to that conclusion.  Then I was talking to someone at Ford Research
who knows about this stuff and mentioned the problem.  He said not
to worry about it and suggested I do the math on pneumatic time constants
to confirm it.  I did and did some experiments involving adding a lot
of volume to the intake (a pony keg, actually :-) of a FI turbo car.
He was right.  What happens in a carburated car is the long manifold 
upsets the mixture and the lag results from this bad mixture having to 
flow out.  Getting rid of the airflow meter if you have one and 
replacing it with a MAP system will remove any residual mixture upset.

Don't worry about intake length.  Worry about placement.  The single 
most important ingredient to getting an intercooler to work right is
getting enough air across it.  Buy the current edition of Hugh 
MacInnes' book "Turbochargers" and read the chapter on the subject.
His opinion is if you have to make a tradeoff, sacrifice radiator cooling
for intercooling.  The thermal mass of the block and coolant cushions 
sudden heat loads.  The intercooler's needs are instantaneous when 
you hit the throttle.

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 10 19:22:09 1992
Subject: 351 heads
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> I notice that most of this head swap discussion refers to the 2V or
-> 400M heads. Is there some disadvantage to using the 4V heads ?

 The 4V ports are too big.  Velocity is low.  Although the peak
airflow can be higher with a low velocity port, overall airflow
tends to be down.  That's why the Cleveland racers used to weld up the
bottoms of the ports or fill them with epoxy.

 The Winston Cup guys use the 2V heads and grind them out as required.
It's easier and more reliable than welding on 4V heads.


-> Where do the aftermarket heads such as the Dart rank in this scheme ?

 They're OK.  Just kinda expensive once you buy all new valves, etc. to
put in them.  A pair of $35 400M heads will flow more air than the
Darts, BUT the 400M heads need a different intake and exhaust.  You'd
likely be changing the intake and exhaust anyway, but if your engine
compartment was right, the 400 heads might not fit.


-> I'm thinking of head swapping on a 351W.

 If you have a later 351W, look for a set of '69-'72 heads with the C9
or D1 casting numbers.  These have larger ports and smaller combustion
chambers than the '74 and later heads.
                                                           

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 11 10:23:16 1992
Subject: Re: 351 heads
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> The 2V heads, if you really want to go this way, will require special
-> headers which will interfere with your power-assist ram. The B&A
-> intakes are very nice pieces and will make the best of the heads.

 Plain old Cleveland headers work, unless your engine compartment is so
tight that the extra .3 inch Windsor deck height will cause trouble.

 I went up to B&A (3 hours from here) to get my intake and tour the
place.  They had four Street BOSS 351W intakes left, a stack of Aussie
closed-chamber 2V heads, and a few sets of pushrods and odd parts.  Gary
said that after the article in Circle Track came out, they sold their
entire inventory in two weeks.  I left a deposit on a set of pistons and
a Track BOSS intake; they'll mail them when they get them in.

 The first 351W block I bought was already worn .055.  I took it back,
and the yard has been dragging their feet over pulling another.  I
finally bought another one elsewhere yesterday (a spare won't hurt).
Short block, one head, intake, starter, and C4 auto for $60.  Not bad,
eh?  I pulled the other head off and noticed #6 piston was turned about
45 degrees from the others.

 Oh, noooo.......

 Pulled the pan.  The #6 rod was GONE.  As in, lying in the bottom of
the pan in pieces.  Apparently it had cracked just above the rod bolts
(which were still securely bolted) and disintegrated.  Ford has been bad
about notching the rods too much for the bolt heads.  The #2 rod nuts
were half unscrewed; I took them the rest of the way off with my
fingers.  #2 rod was in one piece, but was no longer attached to the
piston.  The pin was still pressed in, but the bottom of the piston had
come off.   Visions of cylinder sleeves....

 Got the engine torn down, looked at #2 and #6 cylinders.  The bottom of
the bores are chipped out.  #6 has some scratches, maybe .010 deep.  #2,
whose rod had flailed around, unattched to the piston... appears to be
OK.  The bore is beat to hell, but none of the dents are very deep.
Looks like it would clean up at .030, but even if it doesn't, the only
thing that touches there is the skirt as far as I can tell.  We'll find
out when I put the mike on it later.

 If it passes Magnaflux, I'm gonna use it.

 The second crank throw is about .100 undersize.  No big deal - I
already have a crank.  I can have this crank ground for big block Chevy
rods if I need to use it.
                                                                                                      

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 10 16:48:27 1992
Subject: Re: Intercoolers (was Re: Water injection)
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>As long as the engine is port fuel  injected, the manifold volume and
>length has virtually no effect on throttle response.

I guess I am OK then since a diesel goes one better. The fuel is injected
in each cylinder after full compression (or close to it). :-) Thanks
for the tip. So I guess the question is...is it better to place it
in front of the radiator or on top of the engine with cool air ducted
to it. As I see it the issues are...

1. ambient temp is higher over the engine than in front of the radiator.
2. It seems like there would be more air flow with the unit on top
   of the engine with cold air ducted from the spoiler area. My reasoning
   is that the low pressure over the hood will attempt to pull air
   through while the motion of the car will tend to push it through
   from underneath (via. the duct [viaduct??? :-)]). It also seems
   that the radiator (and semi enclosed engine compartment) would
   restrict flow somewhat with the in front of the radiator mounting.
3. If I mount it in front of the radiator I don't have to chop the
   hood.

Am I all wet here? To quote number 5 "need more input!".

Thanks guys and gals. This is turning out to be a great education.

				mike

----------
Posted by: emory!hamlet.ctd.anl.gov!shaffer
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 11 12:22:09 1992
Subject: Re: Re: Super Shops
To: hotrod@dixie.com

I agree.  You would have to break my arm before I go to Super Shops.
Other than JBA here in San Diego, this area is hurtin for a Traditional
Speed Shop.  Most people who read even a small amount of the available 
technical info available by subscription these days are ahead of the 
crowd at the retail parts outlets.  I have had good luck with alot
of the mail order outfits and prefer to do my business that way unless
pressed.  Besides, their is no competition locally pricewise.
Mike Brattland  Brattlan@nprdc.navy.mil

----------
Posted by: emory!nprdc.navy.mil!brattlan (CDR Michael Brattland)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 11 12:54:23 1992
Subject: Re: Re: Super Shops
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Speedway is a first class outfit both by mail and in person.  They are
also a major street rod parts source too.
Mike Brattland

----------
Posted by: emory!nprdc.navy.mil!brattlan (CDR Michael Brattland)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 11 14:49:29 1992
Subject: Re: Super Shops
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> I guess the real bummer here is that the local speed shop is on the  
> way out, being replaced by the Wal-Mart types which really suck. I  
> used to hang out at a place in Massholechusetts called Performance  
> City.

Too bad you live in the middle of the desert now, back here in MassaTaxUs
there are still a few hole-in-the-wall places around where you can get
exactly the kind of knowledgeable and capable service you mentioned. I
don't know where Performance City is (maybe you could give more details?)
but I've had good results from Forte's Parts Connection, Moody St. Waltham:
they know what you mean, they either have the part or they get it for you,
and so far nothing but the best... phone is 617-647-1530, I am just a satisfied
customer.

If you like air-cooled boxers (who, me?) there are five or six great sources
of speed & power parts as well as machine shop and basic repairs around -
Beetle Bug II in Hudson (they change their name every other day, it seems, but
it's one block north of 62 just after you cross the Hudson line coming from
495), and 4ever4 in Marlowe NH, to name but two.


-- 
---
John R. Lupien
lupienj@hpwarq.hp.com

----------
Posted by: emory!hpwarq.wal.hp.com!lupienj (John Lupien)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun 16 12:50:32 1992
Subject: Re: oil questions 
To: hotrod@dixie.com


>I am looking for some wisdom on oil.  I have a '69 Dodge R/T Charger with
>a 1975 440 engine.  Both the front and rear seals are leaking some, as well
>as the valve guides.  I lost about 2 to 3 quarts this weekend in about 
>500 miles of driving.  I am currently using Penzoil 10W-40, it is time
>for an oil change and I was looking for wisdom on what will suit my needs
>best (mainly cruising, but occasionally taking her out to the track)
>Anyone have any ideas would be the best oil to use?  10W-30, 20W-50, 
>straight 40 weight, synthetic??  any and all suggestions, comments, 
>openions, etc welcome!!
>----------
>Posted by: emory!TRITON.TAMU.EDU!JJP8508
 
2 to 3 quarts in 500 miles, sounds to me like it might be time for a rebuild.
If your not up to that then there are a couple of things you can do to
limp the motor on. First I'd suggest installing a set of umbrella valve
seals. If your not familiar with these they look like an umbrella and
act like one to keep the oil from running down the valve guides. If you
need some hints as to how you install these with out removing the heads
then let me know. As for the main seals, well the only way I know how to
fix that is the *UGLY* method, you've got it, remove the pan and replace
them. If your engine is nearing the mega mile range then I'd suggest
using 20-50w oil, at least durring the summer months. If it gets real
cold during the winter were you are you might want to use a lighter
grade like 10w-40 or a mix of 10w-40 and 20w-50. Also if your near the
mega mile range I can't see something like Slick 50 doing you a lot of
good. Its a bummer that you can't just pour something in the crank case
like radiator stop leak and call it good, or can you? (ya right!)
 ______________________________________________________________________
|           _______________       OLD CHEVYS NEVER DIE... THEY JUST GO |
|         /                 \          F A S T E R !!                  |
|     __/_____________________\__    OLD JAPANESE CARS NEVER DIE...    |
|    '--:---------------------:--`    THEY TURN BACK INTO BEER CANS!!  |
|   / (_)(_)    _______    (_)(_) \                                    |
|  '===========|_______|===========`  MARK JENSEN     (503) 627-3115   |
|  \_______________________________/  TEKTRONIX METROLOGY LAB.         |
|  |\___/O-O\_____________/O-O\___/|  BEAVERTON OREGON   MS. 39-732    |
|  |       |     `---'     |       |      markj@tekig5.pen.tek.com     |
|__|_______|_______________|_______|___________________________________|

----------
Posted by: emory!tekig5.pen.tek.com!markj
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun 16 12:59:17 1992
Subject: Re: oil questions
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Jeff asks about what kind of oil is best for his application, and if
Slick-50 is of any benefit.  I can't really answer the oil question
except to note that my favorite machine shop says that 20W-50 is
much better if you have hydraulic lifters.  I dunno why, that's just
their experience in racing (not street) engines.

I personally know of 2 cases where people have added Slick-50 and
found that their oil seals started to leak and would not stop leaking
when the Slick-50 was subsequently removed.  I tried a similar product
years before Slick-50 was on the market and found NO DIFFERENCE in
gas mileage, operating temperature, or acceleration.  Needless to say,
I am suspicious of claims that Slick-50 provides a noticeable benefit
to the consumer.

Bob Hale                                      ...!ucsd!btree!hale
...!btree!hale@ucsd.edu                       ...!ucsd!btree!hale@uunet.uu.net

----------
Posted by: emory!ucsd.edu!btree!hale (Bob Hale)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun 16 13:30:36 1992
Subject: Re: oil questions
To: hotrod@dixie.com

 If your car has a PCV system check that it is OK. Crankcase pressure can 
force oil out. If no PCV, see if there is a breather cap. You can relieve
some blow-by pressure by putting a filtered/vented breather on the fill 
cap instead of the solid plug or cap. 

 I avoid the various medicated goos. Long on goo, short on medicine. Their
operation depends on thickening the oil (bad for small-passage circulation)
in the case of STP/motor honey, thinning it (bad for general lubrication
qualities) in the case of Gunk ("quiets noisy lifters"), or messing with 
the seals (leak stoppers) typically by softening them. This promotes
further wear and then when your seals dry back out (i.e. if you ever try
to go cold turkey) it leaks even worse.

 Many cars have front seals which can be changed without removing the engine
from the car or the oil pan from the engine. A car with a timing cover with
a one-piece front seal can be done without too much trouble - remove the
accessories and crank pulley and balancer, pull the cover, remove, replace
the seal, etc.. Also a good time to inspect the timing set. 

 Cars with two-piece seals are more of a hassle but may be do-able in-car.
You typically have to drop the pan and may have to also loosen/remove the
front main bearing (or all of them). If this is the case I'd just pull it.
Two-piece rear seals are frequently done in-car to avoid separating the
engine and trans. Still seems like it's better to pull the combo and work
on it standing up.

----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 17 05:53:03 1992
Subject: Re: carbon fiber
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>
>
>-> Smokey Yunich claims in his book that weight in the valvetrain
>-> upstream of the rocker pivot, ie, toward the cam, does not matter. In
>-> absence of evidence to the contrary, I see no reason to argue with
>-> him.
>
> As far as sprung weight, no.  You have to watch what Yunick says very
>carefully sometimes.  In his book he's generally talking about roller
>cammed race motors or disposable NASCAR motors.  (use 'em once and
>rebuild)

You ought to read his book on the subject.  "Smokey's super horsepower
secrets" or something like that.  He spends a lot of time detailing
the research he's done on the subject including high speed photography
of various valvetrains.  Since his thrust in the rest of the book is
building an economical endurance engine, I don't much think he's
talking dispos-a-motor.  

Disclaimer:  Since I fool with motors with overhead cams and lifters
that weigh ounces, I am SWAGing this one.

John

PS:  While I have this message open in the editor :-), to the guy
who has a motor that's leaking quarts of oil to the mile.  You're
describing the tired old motor in my El Camino.  He has no oil
pressure, is knocking a rod and pukes out about a quart every
600 miles or so through the rear main.   Since I'm planning on
dropping something somewhat interesting in this vehicle, the engine
has become an experiment to see what I can do to it.  20W50 knocked
the leak and the rod knock down quite a bit.  90 wt did even more.
Yup, I'm running 90 wt diff fluid in the beast at the moment.
Cranks a bit slow but it actually has oil pressure for a few minutes
while cold :-)

I'd suggest dumping some 20W50 in the thing until you can fix it.
I'd NOT suggest using 90wt if you have any oil pressure at all 
right now.  For a pump and bearings in good condition, the
extra load could break the pump drive shaft.

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 18 14:16:53 1992
Subject: Re:'53 Anniversary Ford Mainline.
To: hotrod@dixie.com


Well finally it happened ! Anita went and bought herself a (potential)
hot rod. 1953 (Anniversary) model Ford Mainline ute. You will probally
only be aware of it as a *Ranchero* since until '58 or '59 the "ute"
(Ozspeak for utility) had not been invented yet outside of Oz. Ford
Aust. actually created the "Coupe utility" in it's Geelong plant in 1934
from a '34 2dr business coupe with a pickup bed behind the cabin...after
a local farmer had asked them for a car he could work around the farm
from and still take his wife to town in (in relative comfort) on
sundays. The first ('58 -'59) Rancheros would be as close as the U.S.
came to what we call a ute. Pretty close too I might add.
							 Anyway it is in
perfect (read*fully restored*) condition but is absolutely stock except
for 15" wheels instead of 16". It is bee*ute*eefull. It is a flathead.
***************************** YUM YUM ********************************
Pardon my enthusiasm. Does anyone out there ( 8-> ) know much about
these babies ? I know quite a bit about fifties fords (my first two cars
were a '56 Mainline Ambulance (much missed) and a '57 Customline sedan)
but never had a flathead before. These are some of the issues that we
will (lovingly) be tackling. ANY imfo will be *much* appreciated.

* Conversion from 6 volt to 12. How hard ? Is it just the
  generator/bulbs/lights/fuses ? Can we find a 6 volt stereo (cassette)?
* F100 pitman arm conversion. We have been told it is a bolt on conv.
  and will reduce steering turns lock to lock from 5.5 to 3.75. Hot shit!
* Rear axle ratios. How much choice do we have ? Later model bolt-in ?
* 50's speed equipment ? Dual or triple 97's, headers, dizzy's...perhaps
  even *Ardun* heads or the like. Will a higher pressure radiator cap
  improve cooling ? I understand these engines like to run about 200
  degrees or so.
* Heater/demister. It doesn't have one. Today was 50 deg. We want one !

************************************************************************
"just a fifties coupe ute with a flathead mill, looks bloody good just
 standin' still. Not ported or relieved nor stroked or bored, but we got
 plans we can just afford. She's our 50's coupe ute, & we know what we
 got"..................... apologies to the Wilson brothers. 8-> <-8
 ************************************************************************

dizzy's...




----------
Posted by: emory!minyos.xx.rmit.OZ.AU!rxkgre (Geof Rey Evans)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 18 15:51:27 1992
Subject: Body Swap
To: hotrod@dixie.com


This is in response to Dave Tartaglia's question re: old pickups on new frames.
Decided to put it up on net in response to Jim Kurien's latest question.

							Stan


Dave,

Probably the most common way to get late model front ends under old trucks is
a sub-frame.  Most guys just chop off the old frame even with the firewall and
slide a Camaro or Firebird front end under it and weld it up.  I wasn't too
keen on having a scabbed on front end, so decided to go the whole frame route.

What I discovered was that the 55-59 wheelbase is 114".  Late model chevy frames
(short wheel base) were 117".  To make it work right, the frame needed to be
sectioned 3".  I have seen some done without taking the 3" out and they look
awful.  Too much space between the bed and cab, and both front and rear wheels
are offset in their respective wheel openings.  The fact that the frame has to
be sectioned is actually a godsend - the availability of short wheel base frames
is very scarce.  Long wheel base (131") frames are plentiful.  The section which
has to be removed is directly behind the cab (to preserve the engine and
transmission mounts, as well as all crossmembers).  There just happens to be
about 21" of beautiful, perfectly straight frame in that area which simplifies
the sectioning.  I had 16" cut out of the frame, leaving a 115" wheel base.  The
extra inch was left in at the suggestion of the shop doing the work (very exper-
ienced) to allow for additional space/inner fender clearance behind the front
wheel/tire in the event that I wanted to make a low rider out of it sometime.

Once the frame is sectioned, start from the backend of the truck.  The bed will
mount perfectly without modification.  Just mark the center of the wheel on a
reference point on the bed, and sit the bed on the new frame while lining up
the mark with the rear axle of the new frame.  The frame rails are exactly the
same width at the rear of the truck which permits the bed to mount without
modification.  The rear cab mounts are removed from the old frame (they're
riveted on), and are placed on the sides of the new frame, drilled and bolted.
I actually measured the distance from the C/L of the rear axle on the old frame
to the rear cab bracket, then duplicated it on the new frame.  Both the old
and new frame are straight as an arrow in that area, so no problems are
encountered with height positioning of the bracket.  Just measure the location
forward of the rear axle, and align with the top edge of the frame.  Rear cab
mounts bolt right up.

Now comes the fun part.  The stock '55 frame basically runs straight from
front to rear.  The '78 frame is straight until it gets about to the center
of the cab, then dips down significantly for the transmission cross support
and engine area.  You have to fabricate front cab mounts.  They are really
quite simple.  Using the spacing between the bed and cab as a guide (remember
that the bed and rear cab mounts are in stock locations) I simply jacked up the
front of the cab until the space at the top of the bed was identical to the
space at the bottom.  That gave me the necessary height required for my mounts.
I used 3" channel iron and built a mount bolts flush to the outer side of the
frame, runs straight up about 5" above the top of the frame, then turns out at
a right angle about 8" to engage the stock front cab mount.  As the mount is
cut and welded at a right angle, the channel iron added a lot of support.  I
added a short gusset just for good measure on the inside of the angle.

Since the front fenders mount directly to the cab, all that is left is the
radiator cross support.  I haven't completed this on mine yet, but have seen
others which have been done.  I plan to bolt the fenders to the cab with the
cross support between them (at the front).  I'll just block/jack up the support
to get the measurement between the top of the frame and the bottom of the 
radiator cross support and fabricate a mount.  What I've seen done before
is a piece of 2" square tubing laid on its side and welded to the top of the
frame.  The mount has to run outboard of the new frame to match up with the
stock mounts on the radiator cross support because the new frame is about 4"
narrower between the rails than the stock '55.

I really don't anticipate too much trouble with the front mount.  I'm doing all
the metal work on the cab now (the front clip is done, piece at a time).  When
I'm done with the cab, I'll work the front mount and let you know.  

The only disadvantage to going the full frame is that the resultant truck will
sit about 2-3" higher than stock.  That can easily be fixed in the rear by
removing 3-4 leaf springs which are not required since this definately won't
be a hauler.  In the front, to do it right, you need to do a drop-spindle.  I
plan to do that to mine later, depending on if I don't like the 'tall' look.
I've seen a couple that were left tall, and they really don't look that
noticable, especially given all the 4-wheel stuff you see around these days.

Hope this helps.

Stan


>From uucp Wed Jun 17 13:11 CDT 1992
>From immacc.prepnet.com!indy Wed Jun 17 13:51:41 EDT 1992 remote from att
Received: from att by att.att.com; Wed, 17 Jun 1992 14:11 EDT
Received: by att.att.com; Wed Jun 17 13:58:23 EDT 1992
Received: by immacc.prepnet.com
	(16.6/16.2) id AA10377; Wed, 17 Jun 92 13:51:43 -0400
From: Dave Tartaglia 
Subject: 55 on a 78
To: sds@ocetca.att.com
Date: Wed, 17 Jun 92 13:51:41 EDT
Full-Name: Dave Tartaglia
Mailer: Elm [revision: 66.25]
Content-Type: text
Content-Length: 649
Status: RO

Stan,
I saw your post about engine colors and noticed your sig about a '55 Chevy
1/2 ton Stepside on a '78 chassis. I have been looking around for a new
old truck. I have wondered about a chassis swap. Is it a bolt-on (ha,ha)
or is major surgery involved?

"American Rodder" did a short piece on bolting a '78 front end to a '53
Chevy pickup. (just suspension, not a frame clip). It seemed almost too
easy! So I wondered if it would work for the 55-59s as well.  Any ideas?

Thanks for your help.
--
Dave Tartaglia    indy@immacc.prepnet.com             === ZZ-|O\- .. _   
Motorsport Video  (800)648-1004  free catalog           =(_)-=======(_)===

----------
Posted by: emory!ocetca.att.com!sds
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun 19 05:45:09 1992
Subject: polyurethane lube.
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> I'm putting together a rear end with a bunch of
-> polyurethane bushings.  I know they squeak.

 Are you sure?

 I've never had polyurethane bushings squeak.  Nylon ones, now...
the ones we made for Monzilla worked well enough, but it sounded like we
had a family of bats living in the trunk.

 If your bushings DO squeak, you're going to have to find some way to
keep the lube on them, or it'll eventually dry out or wash off.  Stuff
doesn't soak into polyurethane at all.
                                                                              

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun 19 06:15:26 1992
Subject: Re: carbon fiber
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> Use a tungsten carbide cutter with 24karat gold plate and use ONLY
-> distilled water for coolant mixing. The chloride in tap water will
-> cause the surface to develop micro-fractures. Something found when
-> machining parts for theSR-71, I d of somewhat less stressful parts.

 We used to use plain old tantalum coated inserts and some nasty thick
lube that looked like congealed 90-wt and smelled like something you'd
scrape out of a septic tank.

 I did some experimenting and found that flooding the part with plain
old detergent and water produced a beautiful finish for most turning and
cutting, Tap Magic for aluminum worked OK for tapping.  Griped the
front office people to no end, until I "accidentally" spayed one of the
engineers with some of the septic gunk.  Funny.  He didn't care for
smelling like a sewer for the rest of the day.

 The parts we were making weren't particularly important, just brackets
and stuff.
      

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun 19 07:27:57 1992
Subject: Short Upper A-arms for Ford
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> I'm trying to pull the tires inwards on my Cougar, I can't find any
-> rims in my style preference with an offset. I would like to find some
-> A-arms and lower control arms that are around 1/2" shorter than what
-> I have.

 The cleanest (but not the cheapest) solution would be to convert to
front discs and modify the hubs to bring the wheels in closer.  You'd
have to adjust the caliper mounting point to compentate.  For 1/2 inch
you shouldn't run into any wheel interference troubles.

 For 1/2 inch, you might also be able to find a different set of tires.
Despite Federal sizing regulations, there are often considerable
differences between two brands of tires in the "same" size.
                                                                                                              

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun 19 14:50:50 1992
Subject: Re: cheap thrills
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>  A friend of mine has had the lust for a Cobra replica for some time.
> We've been talking about narrowing and shortening a Chevelle chassis to
> match an MGB or Spitfire body shell.  The body might have to be
> channeled over the frame rails to sit right, but he doesn't expect to
> find a shell without the floor rotted out anyway.

If you have read any of my posts, you will know that I am attracted to
"hybrid" vehicles. I like both street rods and sports cars. Especially
British cars with American engines for dependability. That way I infuriate
people of both persuations.

Remember that the MGB is unibody construction and the Spitfire  has separate
body and chassis. The MGB body shell is currently being reproduced by
British Motor Heritage in steel from the original tools. (likewise the
MG Midget, and soon Healy and TR6.) It's available in the US.

The Spitfire has a pretty nice chassis to begin with, the GT6 variety
(fastback coupe and 6 cylinder engine) especially. I spent the weekend looking
at one. The hood, uh bonnet, hinges forward for excellent engine access.

Before going to all the trouble of chopping the Chevelle chassis, why not
check out the Spit's frame for possibilities. BTW, in England quite a few kit
cars in England are based on Spitefire/Herald chassis. There are lots of
go-faster bits available for it through sportscar mail order companies

Dave

----------
Posted by: Dave Tartaglia 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun 19 16:46:34 1992
Subject: Re: 1966 Pontiac GTO found, how much?
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>Anyway I plan on taking a detailed look at it tonight, what sort of prices
>should I be looking at?  The only copy of Hemmings I have at work is from
>April 1991, so I don't think that prices are accurate.
>
>Any gotchas?

First of all make sure it's a GTO, if that's really what you want.
So I got out my American car ID numbers book for a look see.
On the body plate attached to the cowl under the hood look for the
style number. These are the GTO only numbers. If the number
is something else so is the car.
ST 66 4207  Sports Coupe
ST 66 4217 Hardtop
ST 66 4267 Convertible

Regular Tempest numbers replace the 42 with a 37.

If I'm right, the book didn't have it listed, the VIN should look
something like this, 242076-------. Note the 4207 is the
same as on the style number. My book didn't have this listed
but it is true for all other Pontiacs for 66 and has it listed
that way for 67.  So checking the style number would be best.

>What engine/tranny should this have?

Here is the engine code for the GTO
CODE      CID     HP     TRANS    CARB
 WV       389   360       SM        3x2
 WW      389   335       SM          4
 WS       389   360       SM        3x2
 WT       389   335       SM          4
 XE        389   335      AUTO         1 bbl (I hope thats a misprint)
 YR        389   360      AUTO      3x2
 YS        389   335      AUTO         1 bbl (I hope thats a misprint)

If I got any of this wrong someone please correct me.


>Miq Millman -- miq@sgi.com or {decwrl,pyramid,att}!sgi!miq  415 390 1041


   Bill Drake   -   bill@ecn.purdue.edu

   47 Ford Coupe////454/AT/3:00//// the "Fat Rat"
   69 Camaro convertible////327/AT/2:73
   73 Camaro LT

----------
Posted by: emory!ecn.purdue.edu!bill
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun 19 23:50:56 1992
Subject: Re: Info Neede
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Tony writes:
A friend of mine has a 69 Chevelle with a 396. The problem is he keeps on
burning his automatic trans. out. 

What kind of trans is he running?  It's most likely a Powerglide, T350,
or T400.  If it's a T400 and he's cooking it then something must be
drastically wrong because the T400 is near bulletproof.  The others
aren't so good.

A T400 only needs a couple of things to be right: the center support
should have a steel ring between it and the case, the clutch pistons
should be cast (not sheet metal), and the direct clutch drum should
use a 34 tooth sprag, not a roller clutch.  It's a good idea to
use a late model center support with the steel sleeve.  The end play
of the rear unit should be kept to a minimum; some of the trans builders
replace the washers with Torrington bearings and run zero end play.
Front unit end play isn't very critical; just keep it to factory specs.

A high stall converter can generate a LOT of heat.  If he's got one
of these then he needs a transmission cooler; even if he doesn't
then a cooler is a good idea.  Driving technique is also important
with a high stall converter; you don't want the converter to operate
in the torque multiplication mode for very much time.

Bob Hale                                      ...!ucsd!btree!hale
...!btree!hale@ucsd.edu                       ...!ucsd!btree!hale@uunet.uu.net


----------
Posted by: emory!ucsd.edu!btree!hale (Bob Hale)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat Jun 20 12:33:28 1992
Subject: Info Neede
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> A friend of mine has a 69 Chevelle with a 396. The problem is he
-> keeps on burning his automatic trans. out.

 What's happening?  Fried bands?  Clutch packs?

 The usual problem is slow shifting, caused by slush-O-matic passenger
car valve bodies.  Does he have a shift kit?  How about a high-stall
convertor?  They run significantly hotter than normal ones.
How about a Line-Loc?  Those abuse an automatic quite a bit.
          

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat Jun 20 12:35:18 1992
Subject: Re: carbon fiber
To: hotrod@dixie.com



-> Most engineers don't respond well to spaying - the bad smell sounds
-> secondary.

 Y'all get a lot of mileage out of one li'l ol typo, eh?  

 Actually, spaying would have been a good idea.  I intensely dislike
people looking over my shoulder, particularly when (a), they have no
idea what they're doing and (b) they have no idea what I'm doing either.

 I learned more engineering in the two years I worked in the machine
shop than in all the time I spent with the books.  And I sincerely hope
I never encounter anyone who had to build some of my early design
efforts - they were "by the book", but the "book" is full of fecal
matter in most cases.

 You put your average garden-variety BA engineer in front of a turret
lathe or vertical mill for a few months, and it'll take some of the "I
made an A on the test, so I must be right" out of him.

 The bad side to doing precision machine work is, you sincerely miss
having access to all those neat tools.  Heck, I miss simply having
access to proper size, sharp drill bits and taps.
                        

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat Jun 20 12:35:32 1992
Subject: Re: cheap thrills
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> an 62-64 AH Sprite(new body style) and swapped in a Ford in line Six
-> (believe it was a 170ci Falcon motor), modified it big time, built a

 Migawd.  That sounds like a nightmare swap!  The little Morris engine
barely fits in a '64 Sprite - I rebuilt a couple of those once.

 I've seen a couple of 289-powered Sprites, but not with the hood up
where I could see how much surgery was done.
                                 

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sat Jun 20 12:50:21 1992
Subject: Re: cheap thrills
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> Before going to all the trouble of chopping the Chevelle chassis, why
-> not check out the Spit's frame for possibilities. BTW, in England
-> quite a few kit cars in England are based on Spitefire/Herald
-> chassis. There are lots of go-faster bits available for it through
-> sportscar mail order companies

 I already did one Spitfire swap - a 400 Chevy and Powerglide.  I had to
notch the battery box and opposite firewall side to clear the valve
covers, widen the frame rails to clear the Powerglide, and molded a new
trans tunnel cover from fiberglass cloth over paper-mache.  It all fit
OK, but the engine was a plain old stock 2-barrel 400, plain old stock
Powerglide, and Richard kept the original 13-inch wheels and rear end.

 For a GT type touring car and a mild small block, the Spitfire front
suspension and most of the chassis would be OK.  But for a seriously
powerful motor, I don't think it would hold up.

 John doesn't particularly want a Spitfire; he just wants something to
cover the chassis with, and a junk Spit bodyshell is cheaper than any
Cobra kit body, plus it already has lights, etc.
                                                                               

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun 22 11:24:24 1992
Subject: Re:  polyurethane lube.
To: hotrod@dixie.com


  On the mustang mailing list a lot of people complained about 
  sqeaky poly bushings.  Several people suggested using Aqua-Lube,
  some sort of marine lubricant which doesn't wash off:

I made sure the lower shock pivots and all rubber parts were well
greased with Aqua-Lube before installation.  This waterproof grease is
greenish and has the consistency (and stickiness) of used chewing gum
--but it is the only grease to use on suspension bits, because IT WON'T
WASH OFF.  (Of anything -- wear your grubbiest grubbies to do this
work!)  Greasing anything that might move not only prevents wear, but
allows the suspension to move freely as the designers intended,
improving both ride and control, and it stops squeaking on bumps too.

  I'm pretty sure people on the list used this with poly bushings,
  but you might want to check with the manufacturer/seller before
  you try it.

----------
Posted by: emory!rdrc.rpi.edu!jkurien (James Kurien)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun 22 15:48:26 1992
Subject: water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com


 I finally got around to trying water injection on the Yamaha.  I used a
small plastic bottle tucked under the side cover, one line coming from
the carb plenum, and one line going to the inlet runner after the air
cleaner.  Made sure the bottle was lower than the end of the outlet hose
to prevent siphoning, filled it with tap water, and went for a ride.  I
expected to need to calibrate the water flow, but I didn't expect the
.100 diameter orifice to be *too* far wrong.

 WRONG.  I can see John laughing...

 I made it barely a half mile before the entire pint of water went.  The
turbo doesn't develop enough boost to show on the guage until 4500 RPM;
the engine wouldn't rev over 4000.  The massive water flow disloged some
gick in a couple of the cylinders and fouled two plugs.  I limped home
on the remaining two cylinders and stared at the bike for a while.

 Duh... DUMB guy.  I remove the bottle and lines and refilled the
bottle.  Standing in the kitchen, I blew gently on the pressure line.
Water shot across the room.

  The pressurized bottle type of water injection works on *pressure*.
Pressure is dependent on *area*.  The .1 psi or so I blew was multiplied
many times by the area of the surface of the water in the bottle, and
squirted FAR MORE water than I had figured.  Duh...

  I'll definitely need some type of metering system.  I remember seeing
some inline needle valve rigs for adjusting air flow for aquarium
aerators; if I can find one I'll put it in and try it.

  It'd take one heckuva washer pump to keep up with the volume you get
from a pressurized tank.
                           

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun 22 16:48:19 1992
Subject: Re: water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> I finally got around to trying water injection on the Yamaha.  I used a
>small plastic bottle tucked under the side cover, one line coming from
>the carb plenum, and one line going to the inlet runner after the air
>cleaner.  Made sure the bottle was lower than the end of the outlet hose
>to prevent siphoning, filled it with tap water, and went for a ride.  I
>expected to need to calibrate the water flow, but I didn't expect the
>.100 diameter orifice to be *too* far wrong.
>
> WRONG.  I can see John laughing...

:-)

>  The pressurized bottle type of water injection works on *pressure*.
>Pressure is dependent on *area*.  The .1 psi or so I blew was multiplied
>many times by the area of the surface of the water in the bottle, and
>squirted FAR MORE water than I had figured.  Duh...

Still 0.1 psi on the orfice.  The force on the bottom of the jar is
proportional to the area but not the PSI.  That orfice was just 
flat too big :-)

>  I'll definitely need some type of metering system.  I remember seeing
>some inline needle valve rigs for adjusting air flow for aquarium
>aerators; if I can find one I'll put it in and try it.

Even better, thread a piece of brass or whatever to accept Holly jets.  
The setup in my Z uses a #50 jet.  That's a LOT of water.  If a
Holly jet is too big, consider a Mikuni jet.  I forget what those threads
are, probably about 5 mm coarse.

>  It'd take one heckuva washer pump to keep up with the volume you get
>from a pressurized tank.

Yup.

Speaking of turbocharging, I've been meaning to post this.  Recently
picked up the latest revision of Hugh MacInnes's "Turbochargers".
In the section on lubrication, he discusses low mount turbos and 
recommends a couple of scavenging pumps.  One is from Martin Schneider 
Designed Systems, 9063 West Washington Rd., Culver City, CA 90230
213 559 0020. This is a real neat looking little motor driven pump.
He also lists a couple of brands of belt driven scavenging pumps
but you're probably not interested in that.

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun 23 00:03:20 1992
Subject: Re:  polyurethane lube.
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> --but it is the only grease to use on suspension bits, because IT
-> WON'T WASH OFF.  (Of anything -- wear your grubbiest grubbies to do
-> this work!)

 Sounds like the old Green Death military grease.  It was rated for
amphibious vehicles, and it was downright narsty.  But it worked.
    

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun 23 11:49:20 1992
Subject: Re:  Transmission swap.
To: hotrod@dixie.com

I think the TH200-4R would be cheaper and much easier to fit into your '67
Firebird.  I'm unsure of this, but I think that it is very difficult to find
a TH700R4 with the BOP bellhousing pattern.  I just put a TH700R4 in my '81
Cutlass (Chevy 305).  I had to slightly bend the cooling lines, move back and
lower the crossmember, and shorten the driveshaft (was a TH350).  In my 68'
Firebird, I swapped e 2-speed for a TH400 and had to get a new crossmember
and different driveshaft (length and yolk), but it was pretty easy.  If you
put the TH700R4 in a non-computer car, make sure that the torque converter
will lock up when in 4th gear.

If you figure this one out, please let us know how it went.  I would like to do this
to my Firebird, too.

Wynand DePuy
   wdepuy@chmsr.isye.gatech.edu

----------
Posted by: emory!chmsr.isye.gatech.edu!wdepuy (Wynand Crawford Depuy)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun 23 14:50:55 1992
Subject: Re: Re:  Transmission swap.
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Funny you should mention this TH700R4 swap as my close friend heris swapping the 
4spd in his bitchen prostreet 55 chevy to TH700R4.  He is running a built
350 with 4.11 gears, hates shifting and wants the overdrive.  San Diego
Superchargers out in Santee, Ca is going the swap and dealing with just
that problem.  He mentioned that when the swap is complete, he is going
to have to shift manually into 4th gear.  Everything will work normally
through 3rd but he will manually have to shift it to fourth.  Personaly,
I would cut my right arm off before I canned that 4spd but  everyone
has their preferences.  If you want the number for San Diego Superchargers
e-mail me and I 'll provide it.Mike Brattland
Brattlan@nprdc.navy.mil

----------
Posted by: emory!nprdc.navy.mil!brattlan (CDR Michael Brattland)
 



From scholz@osf.org Tue Jun 23 14:56:59 1992
To: nick@uc780.umd.edu
Cc: bmw@cabot.balltown.cma.com
Subject: Re: replacement seats for BMW318i
Encoding: 42 TEXT, 5 TEXT SIGNATURE

> I need to purchase a new seat for my 1985 318i.  It appears I have two
> choices (dealer wanted over $1000)...
> 
> 1) Recaro.  Good name, big line of seats, everything from competition to
>    a mild sport seat.  Expensive.  They do sell something called Recaro
>    Turbo "A lower priced alternative built on the same quality frame
>    as the Recaro seat" $459.
> 
> 2) Flofit. Looks like they have only one model. and it looks ALOT like
>    the Recaro.  Last price I had was $399 each or two for $699. 2 yr
>    warranty.
> 
> I am not interested in the competition level seats, I dont race and I doubt
> that I would fit comfortably in them (I have wide shoulders and a stocky
> build).  I need a replacement seat that offers good support so I can drive
> all day w/o body parts falling asleep.  Both companies offer the seat for
> my car in the material (cloth) and color (black) I want.

Nick,

I purchased a Recaro Turbo about a year ago for my 2002tii.  I am
extremely pleased with the seat for it's value and comfort.  I looked
around a lot, and ended up with this seat mostly because it had a
decent price and was all I needed.  The seat is a little narrower than
the Flofit and other Recaros (I don't remember the specs but I have
comparison charts at home).  It fits me just perfectly and I'm
comfortable all day (and it works great at the track, too).  I have
about a 35-36" waist, 5'10".  

The only fault I've found with this seat is the cloth is a little
"cheesy".  It's that material that hang-nails catch on easily, if you
know what I mean.  It seems durable, though.  Also, the insignia says
"TURBO" instead of "RECARO", but it's black, so it's not very
noticable.

As a replacement seat, I think it's great if you're not terribly
concerned with appearance.  I paid about $450 with the mounting bracket
(bracket is about $100 of that), free shipping, from NE Auto
Accessories, Waterbury, CT (Dave).  They are very helpful and
knowledgable about Recaro seats.

Carl

_______________________________________________________________________________
Carl S. Scholz                           Open Software Foundation
scholz@osf.org OR uunet!osf.org!scholz   Cambridge, MA   (617) 621-8996
"Them that takes cakes which the Parsee-man bakes makes dreadful mistakes." -RK
 [Disclaimer: just me yapping, not my employer]

From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun 23 16:50:33 1992
Subject: Re: water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> Even better, thread a piece of brass or whatever to accept Holly
-> jets. The setup in my Z uses a #50 jet.  That's a LOT of water.  If a

 Er... nope.  Not at eight bucks a pair, local price.  I'd rather use
some sort of adjustable orifice.

 Best as I can tell, the turbo actually starts developing boost
somewhere around 60mph; the bike uses a reed valve in the airbox to
bypass the compressor when off-boost, and I get the surgies just before
the boost guage picks up around 65mph.  Since this is in normal cruise
zone, I'd like to find a pressure valve of some sort to keep the air
from pressurizing the tank below, oh, 3psi or so.  I'd bet someone's
emission control package has a doodad of that sort, but I don't know how
I'd find it.
                                                                 

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun 23 17:30:37 1992
Subject: Re: water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>-> Even better, thread a piece of brass or whatever to accept Holly
>-> jets. The setup in my Z uses a #50 jet.  That's a LOT of water.  If a
>
> Er... nope.  Not at eight bucks a pair, local price.  I'd rather use
>some sort of adjustable orifice.

How much!?!?!?!  Can I sell 'em a truckload?  I'd probably be willing
to dig a few approrpiate sizes from my collection and sell 'em for oh,
a buck apiece.

> Best as I can tell, the turbo actually starts developing boost
>somewhere around 60mph; the bike uses a reed valve in the airbox to
>bypass the compressor when off-boost, and I get the surgies just before
>the boost guage picks up around 65mph.  

You will want to hold off on the injection until right before knock
starts.  I've previously described a holdoff valve from a B-29 bomber
deicer I have used.  I've also made them from 90 degree 1/4" industrial
instrumentation plug valves.  You could buy a brass Swagelock Whitey valve
for $60 but I would not want to.  I see 'em frequently surplus.  
Just cut the stem behind the plug, trim some stem for clearance,
braze or silver solder a small washer just under the packing for a spring
to rest on and insert a spring between this shoulder and the plug.  The 
remainder of the stem serves as a spring guide.  Flow comes from 
the axial port and exits the radial one.  The water must build enough
pressure to overcome the spring before flow starts.  The knob is now
a setpoint adjustment.   Another method is a checkvalve equipped with 
a larger spring.  The disadvantage of that is you have to disassemble
the thing to adjust it.  Since water injection is needed earlier in
hot weather, it's a good idea to have the adjustment available.

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Tue Jun 23 18:25:40 1992
Subject: Re: water injection 
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Holley jets should cost about $3.50 - $4.00 per pair. Used to be $2.
Ron

----------
Posted by: emory!tv.tv.tek.com!rons
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 24 00:55:47 1992
Subject: Re: water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>$8 a pop for jets? Yow. $3.95 last time I bought some - a couple months ago.
>You could try a length of small tubing and get your resistance from length
>instead of just orifice. Cut or extend to tune over some range. 
>
>Sounds like you want a backwards power valve. float needle-n-seat with a
>soft spring, maybe an adjustment screw/keeper? 

Small point.  If you want to tune in a methodical manner with repeatable
results, something adjustable and repeatable.  Particularly in the 
area of flow metering, carburator jets are very useful because they
are calibrated in terms of FLOW instead of orfice diameter.

>If you leave the bottle pressurized, won't it keep dribbling excess water
>until the pressure bleeds down?

I missed that point the first go-round.  The bottle must communicate 
freely with the intake manifold.  Otherwise the delivery won't match
the pressure curve.  There are two schools of thought.  One (mine)
is that the bottle should be connected to the manifold with a relatively
large diameter tube.  The bottle must be arranged so water cannot 
slosh back into the tube.  A baffle arrangement is useful.  The other
school of thought is typified by the old Crown system.  There is a 
tube from the pressurized manifold to the bottle but with a checkvalve 
in it.  Another tube with an orfice runs from the top of the bottle to
a non-pressurized part of the manifold, typically in the air cleaner.
A third tube contains an orfice and injects the water.  The idea is
the air orfice can control the rise and fall of the water pressure
and minimize how much water can be sloshed if that ever happens.
One area where this system may be good is in blow-through throttle 
applications.  The pressure delay will cause water to continue to be
injected for awhile after the throttle is closed.  Closing the throttle
causes the compressed air to heat from compressor surge.  This added  heat
can cause trailing throttle detonation and the extra water can 
address this.  For my suck-through applications, I found the Crown system
to be excessivly complicated, particularly regarding tuning.

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 24 00:58:13 1992
Subject: Re: Plug codes
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>Anyone know how to decode spark plug heat range codes for
>the major manufacturers?
>
>In the dim recesses of my mind, I seem to recall that the
>plugs I normally use (BP6ES, by I think Champion) are
>coded in such a way that the temperature of the heat 
>range is directly proportional to the number in the string.
>That is, a BP7ES would be one range hotter, while a BP5ES
>would be one range cooler.  Izzat so, or do I have it sdrawkcab?

I used to have the charts between Champion and NGK memorized.
NGK numbers ascend for colder plugs and Champion descend.
That BP6ES is an NGK number and would be equivalent to,
oh, probably an N-11Y Champion (strictly from foggy memory.)
Man, I hope I got that right :-)

Both vendors have cross reference charts available for the 
asking.  My experience has been that NGKs are broader in heat 
range and more resistant to fouling than Champions.  Not enough
experience with any other brand to comment.  Other than Bosch
Platinums (sic) with are fecal matter.

>Racers, of course, typically run one range cooler because 
>it allows (or allowed) dialing in a skoosh more spark advance.
>The cooler plugs would dissipate heat better, thereby helping
>avoid some of the knock problems that came about with lots of
>spark advance and also helped move a tiny bit of the combustion
>temperature into the head more quickly than the hotter plugs,
>at some expense in a tendency to foul.  

More a matter of load profile than spark advance.  If you slog around
at 2000 rpm in traffic, you run hotter plugs than if you live 
at 7000 rpm.  If you've got an oiler and don't plan on trying to 
break the motor, several heat ranges hotter is safe.  If it's 
really fouling, try one of the no-foul plug adaptors.  They work
but they'll burn a hole through a plug in a healthy cylinder.


>Actually, with modern ignition systems, mass airflow sensors,
>knock detection algorithms and the rest, I wouldn't be surprised
>to learn that tweaking the plugs' heat range doesn't get you
>much of anything any more.  But the cars in question are from
>1965 and 1967, so vintage advice will be right at home.

So put an MSD box on the thing and forget about it :-)

73 John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 24 14:51:40 1992
Subject: Re: Plug codes 
To: hotrod@dixie.com


>With AC spark plugs the numbers increase with the temperature of the
>plug - that is, a 43 is a cool plug while a 44 is nominal and a 45
>is a hot plug.  The only place I've seen 46s is in lawnmower engines.
>----------                                         ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>Posted by: emory!ucsd.edu!btree!hale (Bob Hale)
 
...Aaaah yes, the lawn mower saga continues...
Funny you should mention a lawnmower spark plug. I've always used an old
plug from my Camaro 307 in my delapidated  hoped up (water pipe header)
Sears finest piece of shit mower. Only problem that I have to deal with
is the electrode getting in the way of one of the valves. It doesn't
seem to wana run to well with the tip smashed down. Oh but yes, it does
screem with that carb wired wide open with no filter to restrict that
hungry mill of it's diet of fresh air!

----------
Posted by: emory!tekig5.pen.tek.com!markj
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 24 15:49:54 1992
Subject: Lawnmowers from Hell
To: hotrod@dixie.com


>...Aaaah yes, the lawn mower saga continues...

Indeed.

Did you know you can build up the cam with brass brazing rod and regrind
it to your own specs?  Or that the inner valve spring from an old 
Honda street bike (who knows what model - junque box farming.) 
works just fine for "high rpm" running?  Or that the engine will run
to better than 7000 rpm.  For a few moments :-)  Or that with the blade
and flywheel removed and the ignition running total loss from a 
battery, the thing will tach like an Indy car?  Or that nitro will
work until the studs pull out of the head (aluminum block)?

I once built a top fuel self-propelled mower using pretty much all these
techniques.  A motorcycle battery was mounted up front for wheelie control :-)
A quick pass with an acetylene torch opened the front of the deck up so 
it became the sythe from hell.  No flywheel, 30 mm motorcycle carb feeding
alky/nitro (20% or thereabouts)  waterpipe header with a HUGE megaphone.
Megaphones were big back then.  The thing would do about 10 mph.  Through
anything.  I used to turn it loose on the wooded field next door.  Just
let 'er wade in.  Stuff flew 30 feet in the air.   The explosion was
even more spectacular.  never did find all the pieces.  :-)

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 24 17:49:17 1992
Subject: Re: Lawnmowers from Hell 
To: hotrod@dixie.com


>>...Aaaah yes, the lawn mower saga continues...
>Indeed.

        Part of amusing story deleted, hell if your like me you probably
	read it several times just so you could believe it.

>I used to turn it loose on the wooded field next door.  Just
>let 'er wade in.  Stuff flew 30 feet in the air.   The explosion was
>even more spectacular.  never did find all the pieces.  :-)
>John
>----------
>Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
                 ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Who woulda guessed?

question for you John, what do you do for entertainment around your
place, sounds kinda boring to me, hell who wants to watch a lawn mower
do 7 grand through thick brush while huvering inches off the ground for
the air flow from the blade thats nearly ready to launch into orbit?
This doesn't even take into account the gnarly mushroom cloud that
probably followed the retiremnt of that poor abused B+S motor that tried
sooooooo hard to hold together!

----------
Posted by: emory!tekig5.pen.tek.com!markj
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Wed Jun 24 18:25:57 1992
Subject: Re: Lawnmowers from Hell
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>question for you John, what do you do for entertainment around your
>place, sounds kinda boring to me, hell who wants to watch a lawn mower
>do 7 grand through thick brush while huvering inches off the ground for
>the air flow from the blade thats nearly ready to launch into orbit?
>This doesn't even take into account the gnarly mushroom cloud that
>probably followed the retiremnt of that poor abused B+S motor that tried
>sooooooo hard to hold together!

Well we did later clear that field, build a bunker and declare it 
Cape Canaveral North :-)  Even fired some liquid fuel (red funing nitric
acid and kerosene) engines.

You outta seen the Gravely tractor from Hell we built to clear our
first yard.  We bought a HUD repo house whose yard had reverted to woods.
A friend had an old Gravely that did not run which was donated to the effort.
After welding the wheels on to replace the rusted off nuts, the hotrodding
began.  A little port work, homemade manifold, 32 mm Mikuni carb, 
header and megaphone and a bit more compression on the old side valve
flathead.  And after the first attempt at starting it, a hopped up 
starter motor :-)  Fuel was 20% nitro in methanol.  IN the blade 
arena, the front third of the blade housing fell to the acetylene torch.
About 5 lbs of steel was welded to the blade for a bit more inertia.

This lot contained mostly bramble with blackberry thorns and
trees up to about three inches in diameter.  Procedure was to
don a set of duck  canvass ironworker's coveralls and then a
second pair, some GI boots, goggles, a gas mask and ear plugs. 
Crank that sucker, set the throttle to bellow, trip the drive
clutch and let the thing wade into the mess.  Dodging the
falling trees was the worst part.  Dodging the thing when it
bounced up in the air was a close second.  When it broke through
the other  side and just before it ate the neighboor's dog, rush
up and pull the  clutch.  I cleared that lot in about 8 hours.
My wife still carries a picture in her wallet of my operating that 
thing :-)

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 00:26:42 1992
Subject: Re: Oil filters
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> a business decision most likely.  I've noticed the same thing on the
-> FL-1 Ford type that also fits my Z engines.  Datsun adopted a shorter

 WHAT?!?!

 You're running a Ford filter on a Datsun?

 I run Datsun L18 filters on my Fords, because they don't have the
stinking 5psi popoff valve (all oil gets filtered) and they have an
anti-drainback valve which keeps oil in the filter when the engine is
stopped, so it can built oil pressure faster on startup.

 I haven't bought a Ford-type filter in years.
                                               

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 13:28:36 1992
Subject: 53 Ford Mainline (ute).
To: hotrod@dixie.com


>From rxkgre Sat Jun 20 11:02:34 1992
Received: by minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au 
Date: Sat, 20 Jun 92 11:02:29 EST
From: rxkgre (Geof Rey Evans)
Message-Id: <9206200102.482@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au>
To: rxkgre
Subject: post failed
Status: RO

Subject: 53 Ford Mainline (Anniversary) ute.
Summary: flatheads rule
Keywords: cool



*** deet deet deet *** newsflash
*** latest on the Oz ute story ***

Took the new baby for a shakedown run today...got to determine what
will need doing first (apart from the speed equipment 8->...) and 
while the body and chassis are in immaculate condition, trim and
detailing too...the (brand new...1000 miles) engine didn't show a lot
of urge. I know it will be tight but not that tight ! A major tune up
will be done this weekend. The clutch shudders on take up from rest so 
a new one goes in or a different gearbox too if the right option ( that
means cheap & easy 8->..) presents itself. The old (bakelight) steering
wheel broke off in my hands (interesting !) so a new one too is due. We
are after a 14 - 15 inch *woodrim* wheel (not original) with no dish
(ie. *flat*) but this is gonna be a tough baby to find. The steering
felt vague and the whole plot was a little mushy on the road although it
has new kingpins fitted...perhaps someone could tell me if balljoints
(which I am familiar with) were THAT big a leap over kingpins ? Does
anybody out there in hot rod land know how to easily improve the on the
road feel...steering, handling, brakes of these era beasts ? Maybe how
to even get the best outa Henry's Flathead. I am a Y-block man from way
back but just a novice with this baby. How (if ???) to make a kingpin
front end drive...ah...you know, *good* !!! Sway bars, shocks, bushes ?
Anyway..enough of this pennies from heaven..let those lakes pipes roar !



  ___________________________________________________________________  
|| Geof Evans                 | DOMAIN: rxxgre@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au  ||
|| Melbourne,Australia 3000   | Tel: +61 3 663 3663		     ||
||       If they *really* wanna know...tell 'em God was drunk.       ||
||___________________________________________________________________||

			


A ute: NEAT!  I have seen 'em and they make great hot rods. A few enter-
prising Americans have brought them back from trips to Oz. Just put on a
set of custom wheels and everyone here thinks you've spent the last 3 years
doing custom body work!

As for the 6 to 12 conversion, you will also want to wire a voltage drop to
the gauges. Or better still, get a whole new wiring harness and fuse panel.
Ron Francis Wire Works here in Pennsylvania makes an excellent product. He
advertises in all the US street rodding magazines.(Street Rodder, Street Rod
Action, and American Rodder to name three). If you can't get any of those at
your local newsagent, email me and I'll get you some more detailed info.

As for the flathead, assuming that it is the same as the US version (BIG
assumption) lots of stuff is available new. Offenhauser, Edelbrock, Speedway
Motors, Patrick's Antique (for Fenton headers), all sell speed equipment for
flatheads. There is even a Ford C4-to-flathead trans adaptor.  Again, email
me for details if not available locally.

Good luck and happy motoring!
--
Dave Tartaglia    indy@immacc.prepnet.com             === ZZ-|O\- .. _   
Motorsport Video  (215)269-2059  free catalog           =(_)-=======(_)===

----------
Posted by: Dave Tartaglia 
 




----------
Posted by: emory!minyos.xx.rmit.OZ.AU!rxkgre (Geof Rey Evans)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 13:35:43 1992
Subject: Re: Plugs
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> I don't really have anything against Champion per se, but their quality
>control stinks.

And has for 20 years, unfortunately.

> I realize many people have run nothing but Champions for years and
>never had a lick of trouble; bear in mind all the rejects have to go
>somewhere, and evidently they box 'em up and send 'em to Little Rock.

They send some of 'em to Tennessee too.  You've heard the old racer's
maxim "Never start a race on new plugs"?  The guy who invented that was
thinking about Champion.  My favorite has become NGK because the heat
range seems to be the broadest for a given heat number.

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 13:39:35 1992
Subject: Re: Lawnmowers from Hell
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>  Now I'm enjoying this thread as much as anyone.  What I want is
>more techie details.  I have a 3.5hp B&S powered Craftsman mower
>that I bought used and on it's way to the boneyard.  I figured
>fooling around with the motor would be a worthwhile screwy project.
>
>  So what's this about homemade manifolds?  I think I have access
>to an old Keihin carb...

Trivial, my friend.  Just get a hunk of 1/4" thick steel plate, whittle 
out a manifold flange that will mount up to the engine (use the old one
as a model), weld on some appropriately sized thin wall conduit and
mount the carb with heater or radiator hose, assuming it is spigot-
mounted.  I whittling tool is generally a combination of acetylene
torch and die grinder with appropriate carbide burrs.  

The engine will also greatly (no shit!) benefit from some porting.
Unshrouding the valve stem and under the bowl will pay off.  Be
careful about breaking through to the crankcase.  Since this is a
grenade motor, a bit of MetalSet or equiv epoxee is good enough to
fix any fubar.

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 13:51:25 1992
Subject: Re: Lawnmowers from Hell
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> place, sounds kinda boring to me, hell who wants to watch a lawn
-> mower do 7 grand through thick brush while huvering inches off the
-> ground for the air flow from the blade thats nearly ready to launch
-> into orbit?

 Actually, the British sell "hover-mowers" which don't have wheels; they
use the blade to provide an air cushion like a hovercraft.  A friend of
mine told me they'd be a bitch to mow sideways on a hill, except they
don't work.  You wind up dragging it around the yard and it gnaws on the
grass a bit.

 In our next thrilling installment, John will mount a 180-horse Evinrude
V6 atop his trusty Lawn-Boy, with a variable pitch Hamilton Standard
prop with a sharpened leading edge...
                                                                                                                   

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 14:50:22 1992
Subject: Re: Lawnmowers from Hell
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Did anyone cover using a bench grinder to remove about .030-.050 from the 
heel of the cam lobes to increase lift and change the duration figures?
OLD Harley trick that.
***************************************************************
Millam E. Tackitt            met@naucse.cse.nau.edu

1967 Cougar XR-7 271/289 4spd/CR 4spd
1968 Cyclone GT *385*/427 3 deuces and a 4spd with a 9"locker
1953 3/4 ton Chevy pickumup truck

Not running... yet:
1968 Galaxie XL-GT 345/390 Auto (now deemed repairable)0
1949 1/2 ton Chevy pickumup truck
***************************************************************

----------
Posted by: emory!naucse.cse.nau.edu!met (Millam Tackitt)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 14:56:46 1992
Subject: No head gasket wanted
To: hotrod@dixie.com

I want to increase the compression on one of my small block engines.
the easiest method under consideration is to do away with the head 
gaskets.
I am thinking about using some stainless steel wire rings and some sort
of sealer for the water ports and oil returns. Crank the heads
down and run it, this isn't a longevity exersize as I am building 
another engine for this car.
I think the stainless rings, .010-.012 wire in a loop with the ends 
fused will be good, but the sealer is stumping me. The changed 
dimensional interfaces are within tolerance, as far as manifold/head
and so forth.
John, Dave, have either of you ever tried this or know something about
it?

***************************************************************
Millam E. Tackitt            met@naucse.cse.nau.edu

1967 Cougar XR-7 271/289 4spd/CR 4spd
1968 Cyclone GT *385*/427 3 deuces and a 4spd with a 9"locker
1953 3/4 ton Chevy pickumup truck

Not running... yet:
1968 Galaxie XL-GT 345/390 Auto (now deemed repairable)0
1949 1/2 ton Chevy pickumup truck
***************************************************************

----------
Posted by: emory!naucse.cse.nau.edu!met (Millam Tackitt)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 15:00:40 1992
Subject: Re: Lawnmowers from Hell
To: hotrod@dixie.com

    Date: Thu, 25 Jun 1992 08:46 EDT
    From: hotrod@Dixie.COM (The Hotrod List)


    -> place, sounds kinda boring to me, hell who wants to watch a lawn
    -> mower do 7 grand through thick brush while huvering inches off the
    -> ground for the air flow from the blade thats nearly ready to launch
    -> into orbit?

     Actually, the British sell "hover-mowers" which don't have wheels; they
    use the blade to provide an air cushion like a hovercraft.  A friend of
    mine told me they'd be a bitch to mow sideways on a hill, except they
    don't work.  You wind up dragging it around the yard and it gnaws on the
    grass a bit.

No, No, No! Those aren't for lawn mowing. If you think about the
configuration of the blades you see that the cutting edge would be at
the top edge of the blades.  And besides, the same thing that holds the
mower up is what holds the grass down. Wouldn't work at all.

Actually they're designed for a popular british pastime "Field Painting"

     In our next thrilling installment, John will mount a 180-horse Evinrude
    V6 atop his trusty Lawn-Boy, with a variable pitch Hamilton Standard
    prop with a sharpened leading edge...
                                                                                                                   
Now, that _would_ work.

    ----------
    Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 


bruce
miller@cam.nist.gov

----------
Posted by: Bruce R. Miller 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 15:06:47 1992
Subject: Re: Lawnmowers from Hell
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>  Actually, the British sell "hover-mowers" which don't have wheels; they
> use the blade to provide an air cushion like a hovercraft.  A friend of
> 
Reminds me of the time a group of radio control model airplane enthusiasts
did a demo at Yankee stadium before a game several years ago.  One of them
had a "flying lawnmower" which worked on the same principle. Unfortunately,
he lost control and it turned into a flying "peoplemower."  Nasty business!
End of show... 
--
Dave Tartaglia    indy@immacc.prepnet.com             === ZZ-|O\- .. _   
Motorsport Video  (800)648-1004  free catalog           =(_)-=======(_)===

----------
Posted by: Dave Tartaglia 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 16:36:11 1992
Subject: Re: No head gasket wanted 
To: hotrod@dixie.com

I believe if that you go through the calculations for CR, varying
the head gasket thickness has very little affect. On my 454, .010"
was good for about .2 CR increase or decrease. 
RON 

----------
Posted by: emory!tv.tv.tek.com!rons
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 17:32:08 1992
Subject: Re: Re:  No head gasket wanted
To: hotrod@dixie.com

With no gasket what about expansion and contraction? Making my own guess,
it would seem that you might be asking the crack your heads rightoff, if
of course you could actually seal them without a gasket.  What about a 
thinner gasket?Mike Brattland
Brattlan@nprdc.navy.mil

----------
Posted by: emory!nprdc.navy.mil!brattlan (CDR Michael Brattland)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 17:45:34 1992
Subject: Re: Ugly Aluminum 
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Dave Tartaglia asks:

    I have a buddy who is restoring an old motorcycle.  The aluminum (alloy?)
    hand brake grips and engine cases are grey and nasty. Any good ideas on how
    to clean, polish, buff etc.?  Ditto for some old Offenhauser finned valve
    covers?  Has anyone tried the Eastwood kit?  

Depends on how bad things are.  If they're just covered with a little surface
corrosion, and if they were polished to begin with (as were most of the brake
grips I can remember), the neatest stuff is Simichrome by Happich.  It's a
jewelry polish but it works wonders on aluminum.  I've used it on alloy wheels,
windshield frames, carburetors, and the like.  It does require some elbow
grease, but as I always say, elbow grease and the owner's sweat are the two
magic solvents, they can fix anything from the paint job to the powerplant.

If the surface has become pitted, he'll want to flatten it back out.  For
that, the best thing is to stick to the tried and true method of successively
finer grades of sandpaper.  A Dremel will be a great addition if there are
lots of little nooks and crannies.

For serious metal polishing -- like back when my wife made jewelry and I
made knives -- you want a couple of buffing and grinding wheels and a 
selection of grinding compounds.  Be sure to take each step in the process
before you go to the next one; you can waste a lot of time by trying to
go directly from 120 grit paper to white polishing compound -- all you'll
do is end up with bright scratches.  

As I seem to remember -- and I haven't done this in, oh, ten years -- once
you get the surface smooth with sandpaper or a grinding disc you start in
on the polishing compounds.  First comes terra cotta, which is just that,
abrasive clay.  That smooths out the high spots.  Then it's green polishing
compound, followed by white, and jeweler's rouge as the last step.  (As I
said, I think that was the sequence; you know, if there's a jewelry class
or a really good metal shop class at your local community college, it'd
probably be worth talking to the instructor or maybe even signing up for
the class.)

A nicely polished piece of metal, done by the owner, is a great addition
to any hot-rod, even if it's just the family car to which you've put a
little home-made brightwork somewhere.  And on an old bike, well, it'd
turn *my* head, and I fall off the blasted things.

--Scott

----------
Posted by: Scott Fisher 
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 18:42:15 1992
Subject: Re: No head gasket wanted
To: hotrod@dixie.com

If I go from .042 to .005 my compression will go from 9.21 to 10.26,
definitely worth the trouble.
I think that I remember back around 1980~ FORD did a number with no head
gasket, just a sealer. Kain't remember if it worked or even if I'm right.
***************************************************************
Millam E. Tackitt            met@naucse.cse.nau.edu

1967 Cougar XR-7 271/289 4spd/CR 4spd
1968 Cyclone GT *385*/427 3 deuces and a 4spd with a 9"locker
1953 3/4 ton Chevy pickumup truck

Not running... yet:
1968 Galaxie XL-GT 345/390 Auto (now deemed repairable)0
1949 1/2 ton Chevy pickumup truck
***************************************************************

----------
Posted by: emory!naucse.cse.nau.edu!met (Millam Tackitt)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 22:44:12 1992
Subject: Re: 426
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> requirements, I'd like to see how a Hemi Viper stands up to their
-> V-10 monster.  It kind of makes me wonder why they bothered to design

 Not to start a Viper flame, but I never understood the V10 thing
either.  Chrysler keeps telling people the V10 is a derivative of a
truck motor, only there's never been any mention of such a critter in
any SAE papers from Chrysler.  A V10 is impossible to fully balance
without auxiliary shafts - two more cylinders and they could have had a
12 in perfect balance.  A V8 with a 90 degree crank isn't balanced
either, but the couples aren't as bad as a V10.

 I'd have been a lot more interested had Chrysler announced the Viper
with the Hemi or even the 440 Wedge, which they still sell for marine
applications.  After all, Chevrolet managed to slide the 454 through
smog last year.

 I'd have been perfectly happy with, say, an aluminum Wedge with
distributorless ignition, mass airflow port injection, and some nice
stainless steel headers...
                                                                                                         

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Thu Jun 25 22:45:39 1992
Subject: Re: No head gasket wanted
To: hotrod@dixie.com

>> I want to increase the compression on one of my small block engines.
>> the easiest method under consideration is to do away with the head 
>> gaskets.
>> John, Dave, have either of you ever tried this or know something about
>> it?
>> 
>You've got me on that one!

Me too.  I tried just the opposite once.  I needed to drop the compression
significantly on a high boost turbocharged Z engine.  I fabricated an
aluminum head spacer about 0.080" thick to the pattern of a head gasket.
Many hours on the milling machine.  The plan was to O-ring the spacer
on both sides and use the combination of extremely flat surfaces and 
some magic goop to seal the water and oil passages.  Never worked.
The thermal expansion difference was too much to deal with between the 
iron block and aluminum.  I tried dead soft copper too and that 
similarly failed.  You have any idea how long it takes to mill a 
head gasket from copper? :-(  I guess Felpro is right when they refer
to gaskets as "sealing systems."

Magic goops tried included RTV, Loc-tite form-a-gasket, Permatex aviation
seal, some high-zoot radiation resistant nuclear grade sealant used in
nuclear plants and containing lots of powdered nickel, silver paint (one
of the longer lasting ones.) and probably some stuff I can't remember.

I'd just mill the head and use the Felpro wire sealing gasket (someone
pop out a part number :-) and have a stone cold reliable setup rather 
than "innovating" and having it repeatedly failing.

John

----------
Posted by: jgd (John De Armond)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun 26 05:20:06 1992
Subject: Ugly Aluminum (fwd)
To: hotrod@dixie.com

> 
> I have a buddy who is restoring an old motorcycle.  The aluminum (alloy?)
> hand brake grips and engine cases are grey and nasty. Any good ideas on how
> to clean, polish, buff etc.?  Ditto for some old Offenhauser finned valve
> covers?  Has anyone tried the Eastwood kit?  (Actually the Eastwood store is
> on my way home from work!)  Thanks.
> --
> Dave Tartaglia    indy@immacc.prepnet.com             === ZZ-|O\- .. _   
> Motorsport Video  (800)648-1004  free catalog           =(_)-=======(_)===
> 
***> Well you could try the old oven cleaner trick. Give the part(s) a
     real good clean and then spray 'em with oven cleaner. The one that
     says NOT to use on aluminium. Leave 'em for 10-15 mins. and then
     wash 'em *real* good. They won't come out all shiny...actually go a
     dark grey colour (matt) but will look brand new like they just left
     the factory. You can then get 'em polished at an alloy polishers if
     you like but I think the dark matt finish looks bitchin' and it's
     cheap 'n' easy too.

  ___________________________________________________________________  
|| Geof Evans                 | DOMAIN: rxkgre@minyos.xx.rmit.oz.au  ||
|| Melbourne,Australia 3000   | Tel: +61 3 663 3663		     ||
||       If they *really* wanna know...tell 'em God was drunk.       ||
||___________________________________________________________________||

			

----------
Posted by: emory!minyos.xx.rmit.OZ.AU!rxkgre (Geof Rey Evans)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun 26 05:20:11 1992
Subject: Re: No head gasket wanted
To: hotrod@dixie.com

I called a buddy who is twin-turboing his 429 cobra for a truck motor, Cain't
wait to go for a ride. He said that Ak Miller cut an O-ring groove around each
compression chamber and recommended using Aluminum paint to seal the head, NO
head gasket. Very low static compression pistons 7.7:1!!!!!
What the hell, I think that I will try it. Just spending all my time working
on my cars and sending resumes out anyway. :( :( :( :(
I'll let you guys know what happens.
***************************************************************
Millam E. Tackitt            met@naucse.cse.nau.edu

1967 Cougar XR-7 271/289 4spd/CR 4spd
1968 Cyclone GT *385*/427 3 deuces and a 4spd with a 9"locker
1953 3/4 ton Chevy pickumup truck

Not running... yet:
1968 Galaxie XL-GT 345/390 Auto (now deemed repairable)0
1949 1/2 ton Chevy pickumup truck
***************************************************************

----------
Posted by: emory!naucse.cse.nau.edu!met (Millam Tackitt)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun 26 10:26:26 1992
Subject: Re:  Lifter noise
To: hotrod@dixie.com

 Are the CC lifters advertised as "variable-duration", ala Rhoads? The variable
duration types have a reputation for noise/clatter. 

 Another possibility is some sort of dynamic problem with valvetrain alignment.
Like pushrods not exactly in line and making noise as they seat into the rocker
or something. This only gets likely if there is nonstandard stuff done to the
head, like moving the valve guides over to allow oversize valves. With a stud-
type rocker setup there's the potential for side play that may allow the 
pushrods to scrub the side of their passageways. This is increased when you
use larger diameter (which most high-perf pushrods are) rods. Do you use 
a set of aftermarket rod guides to locate the top end of the rod or is it
just held by the rocker cup? 

 Also, is the noise uniform or just in one or two areas? If it's a uniform
ticking at 4X-8X engine speed I'd look for a component thing - probably the
lifters bleeding too far down. If it's 1/2-2X engine RPM Ids look for a
problem isolated to a single or small number of cylinders, like a narrow
lifter passage that's getting scrubbed. If you have your old pushrods you
could look at them for signs of this - you said the problem was there before,
right?

----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun 26 10:32:18 1992
Subject: Re: No head gasket wanted
To: hotrod@dixie.com

 If you're shaved as far as you can go, (I take it that's to the point of
valve-piston interference) will you be able to take the additional loss of
clearance?

 A new set of domed-n-dished pistons will take you higher than you want to
go in CR.

 You could also look for a set of older small-chamber heads like off a '60s
high performance model. >10:1 wasn't uncommon up to '70.

----------
Posted by: emory!mlb.semi.harris.com!jws (James W. Swonger)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Fri Jun 26 17:20:37 1992
Subject: No head gasket wanted
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> I am thinking about using some stainless steel wire rings and some
-> sort of sealer for the water ports and oil returns. Crank the heads
-> down and run it, this isn't a longevity exersize as I am building

 That's called "dry decking", and BOSS 429 engines did it, using a
combination of wire compression rings and rubber O-rings.  You sometimes
see it on high-boost turbo engines.

 O-ringing the chambers is no big deal, but cutting the grooves for the
water rings would be a pain.  I've never assembled such a motor, but it
looks like head R&R with the engine in the car would be a pain in the
tail.
                                                                                         

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun Jun 28 02:13:05 1992
Subject: Lifter noise
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> I've got a problem with my big block Chevy. The valve train is way
-> too loud.
....
-> Cam and lifters are Comp Cams 280H.

 That's a fast acting cam.  I used one in a 350 and it chattered a lot
too.  It's probably dropping the valve down on the seat a lot faster
than the old cam.

 If you've recently installed headers, you can sometimes hear a lot more
cam noise than before.
                                                                   

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Sun Jun 28 02:22:27 1992
Subject: Re: water injection
To: hotrod@dixie.com


-> Say Dave, the only place that I know uses 1/4-24 and 5/16-24 threads
-> is Harley-Davidson of old, pre-1986 I think.

 Back when I worked at AGL Lasers, we used all kinds of bastard threads,
mainly because their "engineers" were nitwits.  1/4-40, 5/16-32, and
some truly bizarre metrics which had to be special ordered.  I think
they had a phobia against having any two holes having the same thread.

 Thank Baud they at least popped for die sets and taps; I'd have hated
to cut some of those threads on a lathe.
                                                       

----------
Posted by: emory!chaos.lrk.ar.us!dave.williams (Dave Williams)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun 29 09:24:22 1992
Subject: Re:  Lifter noise
To: hotrod@dixie.com

On the heads, I'm assuming you have screw studs for this answer.  We just
assembled a small-block with a problem like this, but it could apply here.
The engine has new Dart II heads on it, and they used screw in studs, the
ones without the wrench fitting on the bottom.  Well, two of them snapped
right off the bat, so we called the shop and they said they'd send us two
more right away, and told us regular screw-in's would be fine.  So, not
thinking, we just installed them, and off we went.  Everything was fine,
except it wouldn't stop ticking.  It turns out that when the shop machined
the heads, they didn't cut the stud bosses down  for regular screw-in
studs, and the rocker arms were now hitting the wrench fitting at the
bottom of the studs under load.  Not much, and we didn't notice until
we completely tore the top end down to figure it out, 'cause we couldn't
see any wear with the rockers on.  It seemed fine cold, but that was 'cause
we didn't drive it until it was warm.  Anyway, just a thought...

-- Steve

----------
Posted by: emory!gte.com!stm0 (Steven McClure)
 



From hotrod@Dixie.Com Mon Jun 29 16:25:48 1992
Subject: Re: Lifter noise 
To: hotrod@dixie.com

Dave, you may have hit the nail on the head. My engine builder/advisor
said essentially the same thing. The 280H is an agressive profile. And
they simply make noise. In order to control the valve train I used Isky
springs with 125#'s on the seat and 350#s open. This may also be contributing
to the problem. Comp cams springs will allow valve float at 5800 RPM.
Big blocks use pushrod guide plates. I gave them a carefull checkout this
weekend and some of them allow quite a bit of side to side motion. So I 
will try a new set of these as well.
I ddon't remember if I said or not but the exhaust guides are basically gone after only ten thousand miles or so. Another result of the agressive profile.
I don't think the k-liners are all that great of a guide repair method
although the intake guides were fine.
It really makes me wonder how Comp cams can sell this as a street cam
when it is so hard on parts and hard to control. It DOES make great 
horsepower but the cost may not be worth it!
RON

----------
Posted by: emory!tv.tv.tek.com!rons